Warning

 

Close

Confirm Action

Are you sure you wish to do this?

Confirm Cancel
BCM
User Panel

Posted: 3/17/2015 6:23:54 PM EDT
I see reviews for both and honestly both look great!  I am interested in the standard pressure loads only............my local shops all have alot of the 124 load, but no 147......would you guys feel underpowered with the 124? Silly question I know but it seems like the 147 is popular and dont want to jump on the 124 if there is a good reason not to.


Also.....im assuming the 124 is going to be a lighter kicking load than the 147 am I correct?  Should I jump on the 124 or hold off?
Link Posted: 3/17/2015 6:37:43 PM EDT
[#1]
The answers to all your questions are here
Link Posted: 3/17/2015 7:06:51 PM EDT
[#2]
looking for answers from the hive........read it, still looking to hear opinions
Link Posted: 3/17/2015 7:18:43 PM EDT
[#3]
I prefer the 147 most brands in short barrel gun. My full size I use either one.
Link Posted: 3/17/2015 7:36:59 PM EDT
[#4]
Will be shot from an HK VP9 with 4 in battel
Link Posted: 3/17/2015 7:39:05 PM EDT
[#5]
I'm not a ballistics expert.  I see the same reviews you probably saw.  I have fired both P9HST1 (124gr) and P9HST2 (147gr) from three platforms, S&W M&P Shield (3.1 inch barrel), S&W M&P Full Size (4.25 inch barrel) and my home built AR-9 SBR (4.5 inch barrel).  From a felt recoil perspective I have a hard time telling the difference.  If anything it seems that P9HST2 feels just a bit lighter which is opposite from what you were thinking.

From all the reviews, it seems like HST bullets expand reliably even at lower velocities than specified in ballistic gel (including through 4 layers of denim).  I think this is really good for short barrel weapons (less than 3.5 inches).  It seems that P9HST1 does not expand as big as P9HST2 but penetrates a little deeper.  I personally think penetration is important as long as it doesn't over penetrate.  So for my Shield, my carry ammo is P9HST1.  I would not feel uncomfortable carrying P9HST2 either.  The reason I buy P9HST2 is because my SBR will be suppressed so I want to have subsonic ammo in a personal/home defense weapon.  P9HST2 is pretty hard to find at reasonable prices so I don't keep a lot on hand, but I do keep a decent supply of the P9HST1 (700 - 1000 rounds) on hand.

Either appears to be very effective based on the tests, so I would not worry about which one you carry.  Good shot placement is the key factor, and both shoots pretty much the same at short self-defense distances. To me, I really don't see or feel a difference in shooting dynamics.  This is just my personal opinion.  Like I said, I am no expert.
Link Posted: 3/17/2015 7:46:23 PM EDT
[#6]
Exactly the type of response im looking for thanks.........i would love to hear from others as well
Link Posted: 3/17/2015 9:24:15 PM EDT
[#7]
I have not shot the 147g, but I've put over 200 rounds of 124g through a G19 and approximately 100 rounds through a CZ PCR—all Federal HST.  Not a single round failed to fire and the recoil was very manageable.  I've fired 147g Winchester Train and Defend rounds through those same pistols and the difference in felt recoil is negligible, but if I had to choose which had less recoil it would be the 147g.
Link Posted: 3/17/2015 10:53:29 PM EDT
[#8]
I carry 124 HST.
Link Posted: 3/17/2015 11:19:03 PM EDT
[#9]
I prefer the 147gr but use the 124gr in shorter barrels. Either is alright with me really. I have +P in both too, but I do not like the unnecessary extra recoil, so I keep that stuff in the spare mags usually.
Link Posted: 3/18/2015 1:49:07 AM EDT
[#10]
147 gr will have a lighter felt recoil.


And better expansion/penetration.
Link Posted: 3/18/2015 7:04:54 AM EDT
[#11]
Take a look at Shootingthebull410 9mm Ammo Quest videos (applicable to short barrel pistols ~3 inch barrels)

P9HST1 124 grain
P9HST2 147 grain

P9HST1 through denim: Average expansion = 0.483 inches, Average penetration = 15.3 inches (including the one that hit the table)
P9HST2 through denim: Average expansion = 0.525 inches, Average penetration = 13.3 inches

Out of a longer barrel weapon, the results are likely to be different as the velocities will be higher.  I would expect that expansion may occur sooner, and the average would be bigger expansion.  Penetration with faster and bigger expansion may be actually a little less, but if you look at tnoutdoors9 tests out of a Glock 19 (4 inch barrel), the results are pretty similar.  Since these tests use the FBI and IWBA testing criteria, this is the best info we have.  I have not seen much forensic data from actual shootings, but I think overall handguns are not very good people stoppers, overall, compared to say a 7.62/.308 rifle.  I still cling to the hope that having effective handgun ammo and practice, practice, practice, will keep me alive if ever confronted with an attacker.
Link Posted: 3/18/2015 8:48:21 AM EDT
[#12]
While I do not run the HST I still use 147 standard pressure everything.  124 is fine also either will do damn near the same just 124 would be lowest weight I would spend money on to carry.
Link Posted: 3/19/2015 2:38:13 AM EDT
[#13]
I use P9HST1, it's easier to find locally.



In addition, I would run either one confidently however I have heard from many sources my carry gun does not do great with 147s
Link Posted: 3/19/2015 3:37:25 PM EDT
[#14]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Exactly the type of response im looking for thanks.........i would love to hear from others as well
View Quote


I carry the VP9 also (great gun, isn't it?) and I keep it loaded with 147 grain Gold Dot ammo. Not the same ammo you're asking about, but similar enough. To me the difference in recoil between 124 & 147 grain 9mm ammo is negligible. I've shot both weights of that ammo in my Sig P228, Glock 19, Glock 17, and VP9. That includes 124 grain +P Gold Dot ammo as well. I chose the 147 grain load simply for penetration.
Link Posted: 3/27/2015 4:06:21 AM EDT
[#15]
I carry the 147gr HST is my Shield9, M&P9c, and M&P9.  Just tends to be hard to find.

I don't feel much difference in recoil.
Link Posted: 3/27/2015 4:25:14 AM EDT
[#16]
I read here. The 147gr standard pressure has similar ballistics to the 124gr+p so that's what I went with.



It's been a pain in the ass to find and haven't shot much of it.
Link Posted: 3/27/2015 7:04:16 AM EDT
[#17]
If you are sold on 9mm, that's cool.  But consider the ballistics of the 357 Sig.  The 125 grain HST is propelled about 1350 fps out of a 4 inch barrel.  It does about 200 fps better than the +p 124 grain 9mm.

The velocity helps with barrier penetration and many Highway Patrols/State Police agencies have gone to this cartridge.  Either is a great choice, but you should at least consider the 357.
Link Posted: 3/27/2015 11:33:31 AM EDT
[#18]
The factory data shows 124g underpenetrates.  Doc Roberts shows the 124g penetrates sufficiently (and one of his tests the 147g failed to penetrate).  I think there is some evidence (and would have to pour over the data for types of guns used etc) that in short barrels the 124g does well since it may not have enough velocity build up to over expand, so it will actually penetrate farther at slower velocities.

Basically, either one would be fine but the 147g is slightly better and I would say if you can find it, use that (give yourself every advantage you can).  If you can't find it, be happy with 124g.

Doc Roberts data:


Factory Data:

Close Join Our Mail List to Stay Up To Date! Win a FREE Membership!

Sign up for the ARFCOM weekly newsletter and be entered to win a free ARFCOM membership. One new winner* is announced every week!

You will receive an email every Friday morning featuring the latest chatter from the hottest topics, breaking news surrounding legislation, as well as exclusive deals only available to ARFCOM email subscribers.


By signing up you agree to our User Agreement. *Must have a registered ARFCOM account to win.
Top Top