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Posted: 3/12/2017 8:06:03 PM EDT
[#1]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Locking block issue. It persists even after you grind down the safety lever a smidge. And yes, that's the fix. Takes about 400-500 smacks to fix. Every Glock I've ever met has the problem, handbuilt or storebought. Every store bought glock you have "met" has had a fail to return to battery problem? |
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Posted: 3/12/2017 9:06:30 PM EDT
[#2]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Every store bought glock you have "met" has had a fail to return to battery problem? Yup. 20, 21, 43, and a handful of 22s and 23s. |
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Posted: 3/12/2017 9:57:07 PM EDT
[#3]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Every store bought glock you have "met" has had a fail to return to battery problem? That left me scratching my head as well. |
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Posted: 3/12/2017 10:09:40 PM EDT
[#4]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
That left me scratching my head as well. Allow me to rephrase and be more specific. EVERY Glock I've ever met has failed the spring test, which results in FTRTB if the trigger remains depressed as the slide travels forward. And some, like my 20, and the handful of 22s I've built, have FTRTB just as a matter of course. |
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Posted: 3/12/2017 10:42:39 PM EDT
[#5]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Allow me to rephrase and be more specific. EVERY Glock I've ever met has failed the spring test, which results in FTRTB if the trigger remains depressed as the slide travels forward. And some, like my 20, and the handful of 22s I've built, have FTRTB just as a matter of course. Are you talking about this test?:  Recoil spring test Glock If you've run into 20 that have failed that test, they must have all had really worn out recoil springs. I don't want to get into the details here but my sample size is quite a bit more than 20, both brand new and used. Most Glock 22's that need recoil spring replacement will pass this test for thousands of rounds past the point where the spring has reached it's fully functional point. Happy shooting |
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Posted: 3/12/2017 11:13:26 PM EDT
[#6]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Are you talking about this test?:  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UK-5Fw3yjcM
If you've run into 20 that have failed that test, they must have all had really worn out recoil springs. I don't want to get into the details here but my sample size is quite a bit more than 20, both brand new and used. Most Glock 22's that need recoil spring replacement will pass this test for thousands of rounds past the point where the spring has reached it's fully functional point. Happy shooting My 20 was new, and I replaced the RSA assembly too, didn't fix it. That's when I learned the spring test. I stumbled across the "bash the back of the slide forward" trick when researching a fix for all 3 of the 22s I built with new slides, barrels, and RSAs. In addition to occurring in every Glock I've handled, it seems to be a debilitating problem in a lot of Spectres. |
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Posted: 3/13/2017 10:03:23 AM EDT
[#7]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Maybe swap out the trigger block. I found those are a sore spot for this gun. Then perform the FTRTB fix described in posts above. thanks. I read those but I didn't realize it was the same issue. This is my first "Glockish" pistol. I was worried there may be something off in the geometry between the slide rails and the trigger. I'll make the modifications as described then try again. |
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Posted: 3/13/2017 4:33:10 PM EDT
[#8]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Allow me to rephrase and be more specific. EVERY Glock I've ever met has failed the spring test, which results in FTRTB if the trigger remains depressed as the slide travels forward. And some, like my 20, and the handful of 22s I've built, have FTRTB just as a matter of course. Ive been issued 4 Glocks, I own 16, and Ive trained probably close to 500 people (most of which had glocks). The only time ive ever seen the fail to return to battery problem with factory glocks was people limp wristing, and its almost all the glock 22. The 80% lower glocks are a whole different animal and mine also had this issue initially. I solved my issue with the crdit card shim and fine tuning the filing of the rear rails. I would caution against the bash the back of the slide fix on factory glocks. |
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Posted: 3/13/2017 6:31:16 PM EDT
[#9]
I am going to finish one of the compact frames this week and am wondering about holsters.
From what I've read the trigger guard is the main issue in holster compatibility with glocks, if I have a TLR-3 mounted on my specter compact frame, what are the odds it would fit into a holster designed for a g19 with TLR-3? Maybe somebody with a light and compatible holster could check? |
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Posted: 3/13/2017 7:25:30 PM EDT
[#10]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
My 20 was new, and I replaced the RSA assembly too, didn't fix it. That's when I learned the spring test. I stumbled across the "bash the back of the slide forward" trick when researching a fix for all 3 of the 22s I built with new slides, barrels, and RSAs. In addition to occurring in every Glock I've handled, it seems to be a debilitating problem in a lot of Spectres. So let me make sure I understand...you were responsible for 20 brand new Glocks....you observed a repeated malfunction issue in all 20...you weren't a Glock armorer as noted by your "That's when I learned the spring test." ... Instead of contacting Glock for warranty support you replaced all 20 recoil spring assembles on 20 brand new guns...that still apparently didn't fix the issue....instead of contacting Glock you went with the improvised solution of "bash the back of the slide forward" on three Glock 22 pistols that you "built". Respectfully bud, your story just doesn't add up. Without going into detail, I have been responsible for 300 Glocks in the last 2 years, half of them brand new. You don't know what you are talking about or you received an incredibly large batch of bad Glocks and you had no understanding of how to work with your regional Glock rep to resolve the issue. All Glocks ship with a bedding lube on the frame rails and slide. You put around 50 to 100 rounds through the gun to polish the surfaces during break in and the gun is ready to rock. If you encountered any issues beyond sight adjustment after that first 50 rounds on a batch of 20 Glocks, you should have been on the phone with Glock. |
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Posted: 3/13/2017 8:12:56 PM EDT
[#11]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
So let me make sure I understand...you were responsible for 20 brand new Glocks....you observed a repeated malfunction issue in all 20...you weren't a Glock armorer as noted by your "That's when I learned the spring test." ... Instead of contacting Glock for warranty support you replaced all 20 recoil spring assembles on 20 brand new guns...that still apparently didn't fix the issue....instead of contacting Glock you went with the improvised solution of "bash the back of the slide forward" on three Glock 22 pistols that you "built". Respectfully bud, your story just doesn't add up. Without going into detail, I have been responsible for 300 Glocks in the last 2 years, half of them brand new. You don't know what you are talking about or you received an incredibly large batch of bad Glocks and you had no understanding of how to work with your regional Glock rep to resolve the issue. All Glocks ship with a bedding lube on the frame rails and slide. You put around 50 to 100 rounds through the gun to polish the surfaces during break in and the gun is ready to rock. If you encountered any issues beyond sight adjustment after that first 50 rounds on a batch of 20 Glocks, you should have been on the phone with Glock. My Glock 20. I wish I had 20 Glocks. Sorry if that wasn't clear. It FTRTB, as did a 21, and the Spectre 22s I built. My dads 43 and all of the new and used 22s and 23s (I'm only interested in 40SW and above so I don't bother with 9mm) I've handled all fail the spring test. |
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Posted: 3/13/2017 10:00:50 PM EDT
[#12]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
My Glock 20. I wish I had 20 Glocks. Sorry if that wasn't clear. It FTRTB, as did a 21, and the Spectre 22s I built. My dads 43 and all of the new and used 22s and 23s (I'm only interested in 40SW and above so I don't bother with 9mm) I've handled all fail the spring test. Might I suggest that you are performing the test incorrectly? I've seen several Glock 22's and 17's with over 10,000 rounds manage to pass the spring test despite the obvious feel that the spring is worn out. Glock Armorer schools are open to the public. If you are as interested in Glocks as your post indicate, then attending one would be worth every cent you pay for the experience. It's a full day of technical data mixed with hands on practicals and one of the better armorer manuals out there included in the price. |
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Posted: 3/13/2017 10:33:48 PM EDT
[#13]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Might I suggest that you are performing the test incorrectly? I've seen several Glock 22's and 17's with over 10,000 rounds manage to pass the spring test despite the obvious feel that the spring is worn out. Glock Armorer schools are open to the public. If you are as interested in Glocks as your post indicate, then attending one would be worth every cent you pay for the experience. It's a full day of technical data mixed with hands on practicals and one of the better armorer manuals out there included in the price. Way ahead of you. Trying to find a time and place, they don't seem to like to host near me. The local gunsmith has a Glock armorer on staff who professes to vehemently hates Glocks, and my long term goal is to try to get on their staff, if even part time. The test is to hold down the trigger and slowly return the slide to battery while holding the gun vertical. Release just short of battery, and if it doesn't close, there's an issue? It's not just a spring issue, I've run across multiple trigger parts that will induce it as well. My 20 and 21 are kinda sorta reliable despite failing the spring test, but any trigger parts - even Glock - that didn't come originally with the gun will turn it into a bolt action. The Spectres initially fail the spring test and FTRTB with any new or used RSA, and that doesn't seem to be trigger part dependent. It's quite perplexing. |
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Posted: 3/14/2017 2:13:38 AM EDT
[#14]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Way ahead of you. Trying to find a time and place, they don't seem to like to host near me. The local gunsmith has a Glock armorer on staff who professes to vehemently hates Glocks, and my long term goal is to try to get on their staff, if even part time. The test is to hold down the trigger and slowly return the slide to battery while holding the gun vertical. Release just short of battery, and if it doesn't close, there's an issue? It's not just a spring issue, I've run across multiple trigger parts that will induce it as well. My 20 and 21 are kinda sorta reliable despite failing the spring test, but any trigger parts - even Glock - that didn't come originally with the gun will turn it into a bolt action. The Spectres initially fail the spring test and FTRTB with any new or used RSA, and that doesn't seem to be trigger part dependent. It's quite perplexing. What does kinda sorta reliable mean? From the sounds of everything you have posted you issue is not the guns, its limp wristing. |
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Posted: 3/14/2017 7:04:41 AM EDT
[#15]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
The test is to hold down the trigger and slowly return the slide to battery while holding the gun vertical. Release just short of battery, and if it doesn't close, there's an issue? . Quote HistoryQuoted:
The test is to hold down the trigger and slowly return the slide to battery while holding the gun vertical. Release just short of battery, and if it doesn't close, there's an issue? . Watch the video I posted. You are missing a few steps and the test doesn't finish in the vertical position....and it's designed to be done after the initial 50-100 round break in shooting. Quoted:
It's not just a spring issue, I've run across multiple trigger parts that will induce it as well. My 20 and 21 are kinda sorta reliable despite failing the spring test, but any trigger parts - even Glock - that didn't come originally with the gun will turn it into a bolt action. ....It's quite perplexing. 
Just stop here bud...if you are having issues after installing Glock factory parts, it's because you have no clue what you are doing. Get in an Armorer school or find a better armorer than the one you report as hating Glocks. |
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Posted: 3/14/2017 7:43:09 AM EDT
[#16]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
What does kinda sorta reliable mean? From the sounds of everything you have posted you issue is not the guns, its limp wristing. Quote HistoryQuoted:
What does kinda sorta reliable mean? From the sounds of everything you have posted you issue is not the guns, its limp wristing. Unless everyone I take to the range and the range/gunshop employees are also limp wristing, I don't think that's the issue. Quoted:
Watch the video I posted. You are missing a few steps and the test doesn't finish in the vertical position....and it's designed to be done after the initial 50-100 round break in shooting. That's the video I watched months ago. I'm being brief cuz I'm on mobile. My 20 and 21 failed that new and after several hundred rounds. Quoted:
Just stop here bud...if you are having issues after installing Glock factory parts, it's because you have no clue what you are doing. Get in an Armorer school or find a better armorer than the one you report as hating Glocks. |
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Posted: 3/14/2017 9:53:52 AM EDT
[#17]
well, back to the problem at hand, and my take of whats causing it.
Again, I'm not a GLOCK guy, not a gun smith, but I do repair German cars for a living so I'm pretty good with complex mechanical problems. so here's the take of a lowly mechanic. Something is slightly off in the geometry of the trigger on the P80 lower. its not irreparable but it is problematic. what I determined to be the case is the nub that unlocks the firing pin safety is too high inrelation to the slide, its causing the nub to drag with the trigger pulled, this causes all sorts of short stroke issues mostly because it catches when the slide begains to move, reducing the cycling energy. it also drags and prevents it from returning to full battery, because it needs all the additional forward energy it can get due to the GLOCK system of partially engaging the striker, there is some additional tension required at the same time the pistol locks. Here's my proof. 
now one of the things that keyed me into this was the ability for the pistol to fire flawlessly when weight was taken off the slide. when I fired it sideways it functioned without issue. so in the shop I removed the striker/spring and left only the extractor and safety, I pushed DOWN on the slide while I had the trigger pulled and it did not allow the slide to move rearward smoothly, even with no barrel installed it still stuck the same. so I added more of my favorite pistol lube (copper paste) and tried again, looking to see where the copper paste had been pushed aside. the firing pin safety disengagement nub (don't know actual term) was stuck. the fix as many posted is to it the back of the slide with it slightly out of battery and the trigger held down is probably only damaging the slide or bending the trigger bar slightly so that it no longer comes into contact. I'm going to re angle and polish the nub so it no longer drags. we'll see how it works but thats what I think is causing the FTRTB issue. |
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Posted: 3/14/2017 10:34:02 AM EDT
[#18]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
well, back to the problem at hand, and my take of whats causing it. Again, I'm not a GLOCK guy, not a gun smith, but I do repair German cars for a living so I'm pretty good with complex mechanical problems. so here's the take of a lowly mechanic. Something is slightly off in the geometry of the trigger on the P80 lower. its not irreparable but it is problematic. what I determined to be the case is the nub that unlocks the firing pin safety is too high inrelation to the slide, its causing the nub to drag with the trigger pulled, this causes all sorts of short stroke issues mostly because it catches when the slide begains to move, reducing the cycling energy. it also drags and prevents it from returning to full battery, because it needs all the additional forward energy it can get due to the GLOCK system of partially engaging the striker, there is some additional tension required at the same time the pistol locks. Here's my proof. http://i143.photobucket.com/albums/r141/acalles1/IMG_20170314_073019646_zpswkrvhabu.jpg http://i143.photobucket.com/albums/r141/acalles1/IMG_20170314_073027395_zpszexvofcp.jpg now one of the things that keyed me into this was the ability for the pistol to fire flawlessly when weight was taken off the slide. when I fired it sideways it functioned without issue. so in the shop I removed the striker/spring and left only the extractor and safety, I pushed DOWN on the slide while I had the trigger pulled and it did not allow the slide to move rearward smoothly, even with no barrel installed it still stuck the same. so I added more of my favorite pistol lube (copper paste) and tried again, looking to see where the copper paste had been pushed aside. the firing pin safety disengagement nub (don't know actual term) was stuck. the fix as many posted is to it the back of the slide with it slightly out of battery and the trigger held down is probably only damaging the slide or bending the trigger bar slightly so that it no longer comes into contact. I'm going to re angle and polish the nub so it no longer drags. we'll see how it works but thats what I think is causing the FTRTB issue. Its a cheap part so it can't hurt to modify, but I don't think that's your issue. As stated, I encountered FTRTB on all three of mine, and for the first two I chased modifying the safety tab, as it was obviously scarring my plunger. I think I even ruined one trigger bar grinding it down too far trying to get it to work right. I do think the geometry is off on their frame, maybe a hole is a bit high on the jig or something, but I've never fixed the issue solely by grinding down, polishing, and reangling the safety tab. Maybe try a more rounded plunger too? I still think FTRTB is a locking issue |
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Posted: 3/14/2017 10:43:44 AM EDT
[#19]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Unless everyone I take to the range and the range/gunshop employees are also limp wristing, I don't think that's the issue. That's the video I watched months ago. I'm being brief cuz I'm on mobile. My 20 and 21 failed that new and after several hundred rounds. I said long-term. I'm definitely not qualified now or at any time in the near future. I want to learn and get certified. Working on finding some options to do that. Having taught hundreds of people I would say that limp wristing is the issue. You are saying the Glock, the most widely used duty gun in law enforcement, has a product wide mechanical issue that makes the gun fail on a regular basis. Several of us are telling you it does not. If it did, law enforcement would not use it. You are looking for fixes in the wrong area (internet videos and forums). Take wangerstangs (I'm sure I messed up the spelling) advice and go to a glock armorer class and invest some money in a gun handgun class like Thunder Ranch. This is an example of how you probably got caught in this loop. People are asking for advice on a handgun they don't have a lot of knowledge about and people are giving advice that also don't have a lot of knowledge on the same hand gun. |
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Posted: 3/14/2017 1:36:23 PM EDT
[#20]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Its a cheap part so it can't hurt to modify, but I don't think that's your issue. As stated, I encountered FTRTB on all three of mine, and for the first two I chased modifying the safety tab, as it was obviously scarring my plunger. I think I even ruined one trigger bar grinding it down too far trying to get it to work right. I do think the geometry is off on their frame, maybe a hole is a bit high on the jig or something, but I've never fixed the issue solely by grinding down, polishing, and reangling the safety tab. Maybe try a more rounded plunger too? I still think FTRTB is a locking issue I had a bit of free time today so I performed the modification. It now passes the "worn spring test" and functions much more smoothly, I can also apply hand strength pressure to the slide with the trigger depressed and it functions smoothly with no further drag. I won't be able to test fire till saturday at best but based on the tests I can do in the shop that could clearly impede function in the way I was seeing I have no doubts this fixed the issue. 15 minuets and a few files, just enough for the nub to clear the slide with maybe .010 rather then solid contact and it seems fixed. I will report back after I'm able to test fire. |
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Posted: 3/14/2017 1:45:04 PM EDT
[#21]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I had a bit of free time today so I performed the modification. It now passes the "worn spring test" and functions much more smoothly, I can also apply hand strength pressure to the slide with the trigger depressed and it functions smoothly with no further drag. I won't be able to test fire till saturday at best but based on the tests I can do in the shop that could clearly impede function in the way I was seeing I have no doubts this fixed the issue. 15 minuets and a few files, just enough for the nub to clear the slide with maybe .010 rather then solid contact and it seems fixed. I will report back after I'm able to test fire. Interesting! Would you mind posting a pic so I can see the way the safety tab looks after the mod? I'm curious about how far you took it down. Thanks in advance. 
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Posted: 3/14/2017 4:59:05 PM EDT
[#22]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Interesting! Would you mind posting a pic so I can see the way the safety tab looks after the mod? I'm curious about how far you took it down. Thanks in advance. sure, when I get a bit of time I'll try with better light... but a simple explanation would be to take off JUST enough for it to clear the side. there is no reason for it to contact the slide in any way so just enough to clear and prevent it from dragging on the slide and catching on the breech block and firing pin safety hole. I have a feeling with the way these are built its no one solid amount to remove, it would have to be done by hand for each gun. The old days of hand finishing the tumblers on door locks to match worn old key's is finally paying off! EDIT. here's what the nub looks like now. I tried my best to preserve the factory angles, I just took them down so it clears the slide. 
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Posted: 3/15/2017 9:59:23 PM EDT
[#23]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
well, back to the problem at hand, and my take of whats causing it. Again, I'm not a GLOCK guy, not a gun smith, but I do repair German cars for a living so I'm pretty good with complex mechanical problems. so here's the take of a lowly mechanic. Something is slightly off in the geometry of the trigger on the P80 lower. its not irreparable but it is problematic. what I determined to be the case is the nub that unlocks the firing pin safety is too high inrelation to the slide, its causing the nub to drag with the trigger pulled, this causes all sorts of short stroke issues mostly because it catches when the slide begains to move, reducing the cycling energy. it also drags and prevents it from returning to full battery, because it needs all the additional forward energy it can get due to the GLOCK system of partially engaging the striker, there is some additional tension required at the same time the pistol locks. Here's my proof. http://i143.photobucket.com/albums/r141/acalles1/IMG_20170314_073019646_zpswkrvhabu.jpg http://i143.photobucket.com/albums/r141/acalles1/IMG_20170314_073027395_zpszexvofcp.jpg now one of the things that keyed me into this was the ability for the pistol to fire flawlessly when weight was taken off the slide. when I fired it sideways it functioned without issue. so in the shop I removed the striker/spring and left only the extractor and safety, I pushed DOWN on the slide while I had the trigger pulled and it did not allow the slide to move rearward smoothly, even with no barrel installed it still stuck the same. so I added more of my favorite pistol lube (copper paste) and tried again, looking to see where the copper paste had been pushed aside. the firing pin safety disengagement nub (don't know actual term) was stuck. the fix as many posted is to it the back of the slide with it slightly out of battery and the trigger held down is probably only damaging the slide or bending the trigger bar slightly so that it no longer comes into contact. I'm going to re angle and polish the nub so it no longer drags. we'll see how it works but thats what I think is causing the FTRTB issue. This^ and the locking block/barrel contact are the only (2) probable mechanical reasons for this FTRTB that I can see. There just isn't much else that can cause this IMO... |
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Posted: 3/19/2017 1:26:40 AM EDT
[#24]
My PF940C build (Glock 19 factory parts except for slide parts kit is Lone Wolf) is giving my brass to the face about every 3rd or 4th round.
I did not realize how erratic the ejection was until I let a friend fire this pistol while I watched. Some ejected to the right, some to the back, some just lobbed out and fell straight down, and few even ejected to the left! What? Craziest ejection I've ever seen. I've been reading the recent BTF thread but still not sure what direction to go. I might go ahead with the Apex extractor or maybe I should just put a couple hundred more rounds through it and see what happens. |
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Posted: 3/19/2017 11:10:42 AM EDT
[#25]
Compact build. Very easy to do and turned out great
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Posted: 3/19/2017 9:32:14 PM EDT
[#26]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
This^ and the locking block/barrel contact are the only (2) probable mechanical reasons for this FTRTB that I can see. There just isn't much else that can cause this IMO... Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
well, back to the problem at hand, and my take of whats causing it. Again, I'm not a GLOCK guy, not a gun smith, but I do repair German cars for a living so I'm pretty good with complex mechanical problems. so here's the take of a lowly mechanic. Something is slightly off in the geometry of the trigger on the P80 lower. its not irreparable but it is problematic. what I determined to be the case is the nub that unlocks the firing pin safety is too high inrelation to the slide, its causing the nub to drag with the trigger pulled, this causes all sorts of short stroke issues mostly because it catches when the slide begains to move, reducing the cycling energy. it also drags and prevents it from returning to full battery, because it needs all the additional forward energy it can get due to the GLOCK system of partially engaging the striker, there is some additional tension required at the same time the pistol locks. Here's my proof. http://i143.photobucket.com/albums/r141/acalles1/IMG_20170314_073019646_zpswkrvhabu.jpg http://i143.photobucket.com/albums/r141/acalles1/IMG_20170314_073027395_zpszexvofcp.jpg now one of the things that keyed me into this was the ability for the pistol to fire flawlessly when weight was taken off the slide. when I fired it sideways it functioned without issue. so in the shop I removed the striker/spring and left only the extractor and safety, I pushed DOWN on the slide while I had the trigger pulled and it did not allow the slide to move rearward smoothly, even with no barrel installed it still stuck the same. so I added more of my favorite pistol lube (copper paste) and tried again, looking to see where the copper paste had been pushed aside. the firing pin safety disengagement nub (don't know actual term) was stuck. the fix as many posted is to it the back of the slide with it slightly out of battery and the trigger held down is probably only damaging the slide or bending the trigger bar slightly so that it no longer comes into contact. I'm going to re angle and polish the nub so it no longer drags. we'll see how it works but thats what I think is causing the FTRTB issue. This^ and the locking block/barrel contact are the only (2) probable mechanical reasons for this FTRTB that I can see. There just isn't much else that can cause this IMO... That being said, a few new problems. I knew it would shoot low with suppressor sights, I just didnt think it would be a foot+ low. Wtf? Also as stated above, ejection pattern is pretty bad... mostly my forehead. |
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Posted: 3/24/2017 1:52:53 PM EDT
[#27]
Thank you @AgeOne. That also fixed the issue with mine. I also noticed that when I dry fire with [an empty] magazine in, the trigger pull is MUCH nicer as well, so that provides some upward pressure on the slide components a bit as well.
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Posted: 3/24/2017 8:17:55 PM EDT
[#28]
glad to help.
it seems the geometry of everything is just a bit.. off with the jig I think mostly. I did all the drilling/ rough cut stuff on the drill press. I thought there might be some issues with jig because the frame didn't seem to fit perfectly in it. I'm hoping in future versions they will get it sorted out. |
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Posted: 3/24/2017 8:20:41 PM EDT
[#29]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Compact build. Very easy to do and turned out great http://i251.photobucket.com/albums/gg296/IlliniFlight25/Glock%2019%20002_zpsrwuum2jd.jpg http://i251.photobucket.com/albums/gg296/IlliniFlight25/Glock%2019%20001_zpshyhqiz3s.jpg I don't have a Gen 3 slide - only a gen 2 so I don't know if that has any impact on this...yanking the slide back and it hangs; a firm tap and it'll slingshot back into battery. It took a solid half hour of trying to rack the slide to get it to that point... Edit - tried it with and without the sear/trigger in place - no real appreciable difference, though without the sear housing forcing the rails out it wasn't as sticky. Still stuck, but a lot easier to move it. |
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Posted: 3/24/2017 10:08:40 PM EDT
[#30]
Yes, I tried a Gen 2 slide before my Gen 3 came in and it was insanely tight as well. In my case, the rear rails weren't an issue at all. I confirmed this by pulling the locking block out of the frame and just running the slide on the block rails by hand. It was smooth for the first part but would hang up when it got near the front of the slide. The slight difference in tolerances from front to back of the slide is what made it get stuck.
A few more observations: Even my Gen 3 was a little tight at the front of the slide but it broke in after some lube and a number of full speed racks/releases. On mine, the problem occurs because of the width of the locking block rails in relation to the slide (rather than the vertical height). The width problem is actually a lot worse when it's not in the frame because the frame squeezes the rails just enough to make a difference. I threw on some G17 and G22 Gen 3 slides on the locking block rails just to check and they were smooth as butter--so there's definitely some variation even within the same Gen. These results were surprising to me because I thought it might be a height issue--but in my case that was less of an issue than the rail width and slide width variation. Your problem may be completely different but maybe these observations can help others who experience some binding. |
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Posted: 3/25/2017 6:45:30 AM EDT
[#31]
This is excellent info - thank you very much!
I'll be ordering a Gen 3 slide when funds and etc permit it...sadly since I only really have a sample size of one, I won't be able to tell if it's a kit or slide issue until I get some more slides in 
my Gen 4 slides won't fit on it as the front of the slide is too big due to the new RSA, and my G17L slide, while it fits, isn't really great for testing on anyway... |
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Posted: 3/25/2017 10:34:46 AM EDT
[#32]
Anyone know why they discontinued the full size? LWD is sold out and Midway is selling down to 0.
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Posted: 3/25/2017 10:51:15 AM EDT
[#33]
Disassembled and reassembled the frame a few times, tweaked a couple of things, and now the slide, while sticky still, at least no longer needs a wack to get it to return to battery when the slide is fully retracted; yay!
Except now that the slide cycles like it should, I've noticed on occasion it won't reset the trigger...seems to happen regardless of if I'm holding it to the rear or not. It's probably my ancient early 90s G2 slide and innards, but still...weird. And for shiggles, I finished off my other %80 frame and tried the slide on that, and same stiff action, so I'm sure it's my slide at this point
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Posted: 3/25/2017 3:59:54 PM EDT
[#34]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Anyone know why they discontinued the full size? LWD is sold out and Midway is selling down to 0. I think we're all expecting them to discontinue it and release one with similar milling to the Compact, but as far as I know that hasn't happened yet. |
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Posted: 3/25/2017 7:12:35 PM EDT
[#35]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Where did you see that it was discontinued? I think we're all expecting them to discontinue it and release one with similar milling to the Compact, but as far as I know that hasn't happened yet. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Anyone know why they discontinued the full size? LWD is sold out and Midway is selling down to 0. I think we're all expecting them to discontinue it and release one with similar milling to the Compact, but as far as I know that hasn't happened yet. |
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Posted: 3/25/2017 8:07:25 PM EDT
[#36]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Well the stock is being sold down with no replenishment everywhere. LWD doesn't even sell the full size anymore and midway says when they're out, they're out. The P80 website also shows them being out of stock, and last I checked it was only the compact that was dealer exclusive. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Anyone know why they discontinued the full size? LWD is sold out and Midway is selling down to 0. I think we're all expecting them to discontinue it and release one with similar milling to the Compact, but as far as I know that hasn't happened yet. |
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Posted: 3/25/2017 8:22:40 PM EDT
[#37]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Would that explain why Brownells is blowing them out for $70? Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Anyone know why they discontinued the full size? LWD is sold out and Midway is selling down to 0. I think we're all expecting them to discontinue it and release one with similar milling to the Compact, but as far as I know that hasn't happened yet. |
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Posted: 3/25/2017 8:49:41 PM EDT
[#38]
my slide was extremely tight so I filed down the rear rails a bit, and that helped. I noticed when I put the slide on the front rails it had to dip down just slightly once it started on the rear rails.
so I ran my fingers across the front rails and I noticed the plastic tabs at the very front of the rails seemed just a tad high, so I took a knife and ran it along the front rails going from the rear of the gun forward and took just the tip of the tab off, that seemed to help more than anything. I ran 50 rounds of blazer through it today, first two shots hung up but after that it shoots with no problems. this is with a slide from one source tactical, my oem Glock slide worked ok as well. the one source tactical slide would not even go on the rear rails at first, I put about 300 rounds through it with the oem slide and then took those tabs off, now the one source slide goes on and glides as normal, when I pull the slide back and let it go forward slowly it gets hung up, with maybe half an inch of the barrel sticking out of slide, if that makes any sense, I can just bump the back of the slide and it will pop forward. M2D EDIT; I decided since I had a factory glock lower and an advantage arms 22 kit on it for years I would just swap the uppers, and it worked out great, so now I have a beater 22 again and I took the one source tactical upper and put it on the G19 frame. I have another G23 frame coming that I will convert over to G19 for my other upper. finally it all worked out. |
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Posted: 3/27/2017 5:13:34 PM EDT
[#39]
Picked up a compact version a couple of weeks ago. Initial impression was positive. Grip texture was nice, the knuckle cut and lack of rear strap hump felt great, and there is an accelerator/speed cut/wedge already in place on both sides. BTW, a Pearce grip plug was very loose when I tried it. Loose enough that it might even fall out under recoil. Not a big issue, just something I tried really quickly as it was on my desk in front of me at the moment. Any sort of free time has been elusive for me, so it was going to be a week or so before I had a chance to work on it. Turns out that the front locking block/rail unit that came with mine was broken. One side/arm snapped off right at the bridge. I sent an email to P80 on a sunday night explaining, and got a return email asking for shipping address for a replacement the next morning. It was shipped out the same day and arrived in 2 days. Great service and response time from P80. Ordered the MidwayUSA parts kit and had that in hand within a few days as well. I am still not sure what I want to do for a slide, either a factory set up or something aftermarket. For time being, I am just going to swap my G19.3 stock slide on as needed.
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Posted: 3/27/2017 5:14:19 PM EDT
[#40]
The build:
I don't have a mill or drill press, only hand drills and a dremel. Ended up not even using the hand drill (more on that later). Watching videos and reading around, figured I would likely do just fine removing most of the tab material with the dremel. Also picked up a small set of needle files from HF to help finish. Also no vise, so I grabbed a short ~6" bar clamp and spring clamp as well. Put the frame in the jig, and clamped it to the edge of the workbench. Using one of the small high speed type of cutting bits, I removed most of the tab material for the front rails. This went really quickly, just have to be careful that the bit does not grab and start chewing into a surface it is not supposed to. After that I used a large flat file to finish what was left. Pretty quickly the file was now cutting into the jig outside of the rail area, but the tabs were still sticking up some from the rest of the frame. Removed the frame from the jig, and began to use one of the small needle files to get it even with the rest of the frame. Took a while trying to go slow and be careful, plus the file would load up with plastic easily. A quick hit from a wire wheel bit in the dremel would clean the file right up. Next was a bit of wet sanding with some finer sandpaper, 620 maybe, and a bit of WD40. I heard about that from one of the videos, Lenny Magill/GlockStore IIRC. This produced a nice finish, not as smooth as the rest of the frame, but definitely even with it. |
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Posted: 3/27/2017 5:14:55 PM EDT
[#41]
The build, part 2:
On the front RSA seat part, I again used a high speed cutting bit for most of it, followed by a small grinding/sanding bit. This part of the frame is molded with a line so you can easily see the area you are supposed to remove. There were a couple little spots that could have used a bit more removal but looked more cosmetic to me, and I could come back to remove more if needed. Moving on to the pin holes, I realized both of my hand drills were not around, having been left at my mom's house that I am doing some work on. I really wanted to keep working on this, but also didn't want to deal with going over there. A bit of pondering and looking, and the M3 bit looked about the same size as dremel bit shanks. Sure enough, it fit right in. Carefully using the dremel, I drilled the M3 holes easily. The larger M4 bit was slightly too large to fit the dremel, but I noticed a tap handle was sized right to work. Again using the dremel and M3 bit, I carefully drilled pilot holes for the M4 bit. After that I was able to finish them with the M4 bit and tap handle easily. Voila, M4 holes. A little bit of clean up/trimming with an exacto and the frame appeared finished. |
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Posted: 3/27/2017 5:15:40 PM EDT
[#42]
The build, part 3:
The front locking block/rail went in using the supplied pin, along with the rear rail unit. The parts kit from MidwayUSA wasn't in at this point, and I didn't feel like stripping the slide lock and spring from my factory gun. Swapped the factory slide assembly onto the P80, and it seemed to move pretty easily. There felt to be a tiny bit of binding at times, if I were to apply twisting or lateral pressure to the slide while running it. I wanted the rest of the parts in place before I started to diagnose anything more at this point. Once the parts kit came in, I started to get them all installed. One nice touch with the parts kit is that it comes with a few factory upgrade bits, such as extended slide release, mag release, and G17 smooth trigger. Since my factory G19 still had the grooved trigger, I swapped that for the smooth one from the parts kit and used the older grooved one on the P80. The rest of the parts went in easily, but the pins were pretty tight, needing a bit of persuading with a small hammer. Putting the factory slide on, it seemed to cycle pretty smoothly. Full rack and release resulted in complete RTB, very solid feeling. Riding the slide closed, it felt a bit slow or dragging for maybe the last 1/3 of the way, but would still RTB. |
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Posted: 3/27/2017 5:16:29 PM EDT
[#43]
The build, part 4:
In one of the Lenny Magill/GlockStore videos, he said that they had similar issues and used a stone to take down the rails a bit. I don't have a flat stone, just driveway gravel, so I used a polishing stone and wheel on the dremel and cleaned up both the front and rear rails a bit. Nothing much, just put a good shine on them. While doing this, I noticed that the area right in front of the front locking block/rail unit, where the RSA goes, were a bit tall and wide. Again using a needle file, I worked this down to be flush with the front locking block/rail. With this done and the slide back on it felt a bit better, but still had a slight drag when near the end of RTB. I decided to proceed with some live fire tests first, rather than chase the issue further not knowing if it mattered or not. |
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Posted: 3/27/2017 5:17:44 PM EDT
[#44]
At the range:
Swapped the slide from the factory G19 onto the P80. Using Blazer Brass, I loaded one mag with one round, and 2 mags with 3 rounds each. Popped the mag in, closed the slide and fired. Being just a single round, the slide locked back on the empty mag perfectly. Grinning, I changed mags and fired 3 rounds perfectly, and again finished with the slide locked back. And again. Proceeded to load a full 15 round mag, and it all cycled perfectly. Went through 50 rounds, no issues at all. Took a break from this for a bit and shot another gun, then came back to it. This time I loaded up 2 10 round mags, a 15 round factory mag, plus 15 rounds in a Magpul G17 full size mag for a total of 50. This time it was some Magtech. First mag I grabbed was a 10 rounder. Trying to seat it on a closed slide was tough, took a couple of good smacks. Pulling on the slide was really difficult, almost like it was locked up in some other fashion. Removed the mag, and the slide moved fine. Reseated the same mag, and again the slide was not moving. This was a brand new CA 10 round mag that I ordered along with the parts kit from MidwayUSA, so the spring was likely still very strong. Swapped the mag for a factory 15 round one, and it seated easier. Slide was still tight to move, but better than before and I could fully rack it. Began firing, and part way through I had a failure to eject/stovepipe. Next round had already started to chamber. Pulled the slide just enough to shake out the empty and let it go. It went most of the way but not quite full RTB. Slightest little push on the rear of the slide got it to fully RTB. Finished that mag without any issues and moved on to others. The CA 10 round mags seated fine with the slide locked open. I had one more failure to eject/stovepipe with one of these mags and fixed it the same way. Zero issues with the Magpul G17 mag. Again, all empty mags locked the slide back. |
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Posted: 3/27/2017 5:18:58 PM EDT
[#45]
Final thoughts:
The FTE stoppages could have been because I was messing with my grip, and been a limp wrist issue. Or it could be from the Magtech ammo being weak and not cycling the slide as fast as it should be. I will keep at it to see if I can track down if it is one of these or something else causing this. Overall I am very impressed. Stupid simple to finish, even with just the dremel and files. 100 rounds through total, with 2 failure to eject/stovepipes that may have been caused by the shooter limp wristing and/or weak ammo. A huge thanks to all here who have posted their own work and issues, as it was not just a help but inspiration to me. |
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Posted: 3/27/2017 10:09:16 PM EDT
[#46]
finally got my build together. but I am having some major issues with the slide. It wont rack and I believe its binding up in multiple places. I removed some polymer in front of the locking block and that seemed to help (as another poster). I have to force it to move, but dont want to start removing material in many places hoping that will solve the issue. Anyone have any pointers to where to start? I cant see any clear area, or can feel where, it is just overall too tight.
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Posted: 3/27/2017 10:56:41 PM EDT
[#47]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
finally got my build together. but I am having some major issues with the slide. It wont rack and I believe its binding up in multiple places. I removed some polymer in front of the locking block and that seemed to help (as another poster). I have to force it to move, but dont want to start removing material in many places hoping that will solve the issue. Anyone have any pointers to where to start? I cant see any clear area, or can feel where, it is just overall too tight. http://i123.photobucket.com/albums/o296/skd_88/7A9EB828-9095-43A4-8C76-58DA60CAE9AB_zpsiut4sfrb.jpg  Failed To Load Title |
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Posted: 3/27/2017 10:57:54 PM EDT
[#48]
Very happy with my 23L build
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Posted: 3/27/2017 11:02:30 PM EDT
[#49]
Cambo, great write up, thanks. You'll do well here, a belated welcome to ARFCOM.
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Posted: 3/28/2017 12:05:04 AM EDT
[#50]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
finally got my build together. but I am having some major issues with the slide. It wont rack and I believe its binding up in multiple places. I removed some polymer in front of the locking block and that seemed to help (as another poster). I have to force it to move, but dont want to start removing material in many places hoping that will solve the issue. Anyone have any pointers to where to start? I cant see any clear area, or can feel where, it is just overall too tight. http://i123.photobucket.com/albums/o296/skd_88/7A9EB828-9095-43A4-8C76-58DA60CAE9AB_zpsiut4sfrb.jpg Then try the slide on the rear rails only while it's in the frame (this takes the front rails out of the equation). Then try it with both sets of rails in place but without the trigger bar assembly in it. Finally, try it with the trigger bar in the frame. This would be the third possible bind point if you eliminate the two above. Also try racking with trigger depressed and not to see if there is a great difference in the resistance. |
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