I get that, but again, no country chromed their bolts and/or carriers. Your Zastava bolt/bolt carrier was simply left in the white.

Ahh... I see what you're saying now - Maybe it was made of some type of stainless steel or just polished, but it was definitely not blued or dark colored like most I've seen, and it definitely had a milled receiver. I just wish the US made one like it, because it was a damn fine shooter, that Yugo AK...

Why should we care about defeating communism in China?  IDGAF what the  do in their own land.

Warning issued for the derogatory term for Chinese.  Squelch this nonsense or you'll find yourself taking a vacation from this technical forum - dalesimpson

Ah yes racist white faggots like you with such a superiority complex but true communists with the same skin color as you are in the highest levels of American government, media, the education system, brainwashing and pussifying the next generation of nutless muricans.

And you need not be calling anyone that. - dalesimpson

Not sure what you're talking big for, Sacramento is more communist than Beijing is!

In any event, I presume being anti-communist is the basis for not wanting to buy anything made in China. If there are other reasons, feel free to share. Preferably without racist verbiage.

Damn.... Really???? Chicom AKs are no good?

They aren't even imported now.. Top tier AK these days..Still can get them new-in-the-box..

I would take a polytech or a Norinco new in the box over any Arsenal made these days hands down..

Tools and other stuff nowadays? There, you are correct....

Reading comprehension.  Please point out where you came to the conclusion that I said they are no good?
I said I personally don't buy anything made in China if avoidable.  I never knocked the quality/collectability.

Reading comprehension.. By your statement.."avoid buying" = "no good" on planet earth..

Obviously, you have never handled a PolyTech .. or a Clayco or any of the other "golden years" edition of pre-ban euphoria

Of all aks I bought in the last 10 years, for the quality and price point the Bulgarian SLR 107 series are the best except for that paint finish lol

Arsenal.

posts like this crack me up. Even "back in the day" when Chicom shit was everywhere and cheap, no one thought it was the best. It was the cheapest, and they were abused the hell out of. I'd go to the range and there would be 50+ people just shooting dirt rapid fire. Ammo was cheap, the rifles were cheap, the mags were cheap. Everyone considered them throw away guns. Now they're this mysterious made from gold AK all of a sudden. There's better out there, and Arsenal is a 100 times (at least) better than the Chinese rifle. That being said, it is a well built AK, and I doubt it will fail you.

I've never shot a chicom AK, but there does seem to be a pattern with AKs where a guns quality mysteriously increases in the general consciousness of gun people once it's no longer imported. The harder to find the better the gun, at least that's how it seems sometimes. One thing that has seemed to stay consistent is the public's opinion of the Bulgarian stuff. I got an SLR-95 back in the 90s and it was considered one of the better AKs being imported at the time, and people seem to still like the 95 and the subsequent offerings from them.

100 times better?? OK... Your opinion and that is fine although I respectfully disagree.

Owned a Clayco, 84S and a 56S.. and had a Bulgarian milled SLR-96 converted to US compliance. Comparing the Bulgarian to the Chinese? The Bulgy came from the Arsenal, Bulgaria factory and had the crappiest paint job that just wore off easily .. Trigger was pure garbage and the sites canted. Chicom weapons? Clayco was perfect.. Great trigger and shot awesome. Finish was excellent since it was real bluing. Sites only needed slight windage adjustments and it was slick as hell as far as manufacturing.. Same report from the other two chicom rifles.

My takeaway from this experience? Chicom..  

Back in the early 80s when there was a hunger for "assault rifles" and the ChiCom guns made their way into the US, they were a hit because they were so cheap.. THAT WAS THE SELLING POINT .. It was that or paying way more for an SP1 AR (and other manufacturers) that wasn't as "exotic" compared to the AK47..  I wanted a Steyr Daimler Punch- imported  Egyptian Misr AKM but they dried up.. Valmets were out of my price range

I remember it well when a friend of mine had his and we were looking at it.. I remember the ridiculously cheap prices for the Norinco AKs and SKS's and the only complaints we had were about the wood looking cheap and the tooling marks on the weapon.. plus the fact that they were so short. Other than that, we loved them.. Chrome-lined barrel? It had it! ..We were very happy with what we got for what we paid.. Stunned, in fact. Dumped tonnes of ammo thru them and had zero failures and they shot as good as you would want for a weapon that was a 300 yard gun.

One pal of mine was crazy proud of his Valmet M76 tube-stocked folder.. I would of killed for one of those..I was green with envy.

You like Arsenal USA products.. That's cool. I like them also.. but I would rather have a chicom gun.. Just my choice

even if chicom AKs were total garbage (and I'm not saying that they are), you can't have a 'real' AKMSU without a chinese type 56 receiver. The AKMSU is so flipping awesome that all the rest of the chicom AKs get extra cool points by extension.

things progress and get improved over time. What is an Arsenal AK? Well it's the current "gold standard" for the Russian military, or a 100 series rifle. I know I still like things from the past too, but I try to be objective about it.

I too enjoyed all my cheap
Chinese rifles over the years, but for a majority of the collectors out there "back in the day", the Russian AK was the Holy Grail of AKs. We have (or had) them now. They have all the modern features that the collector wants. There was a time when you couldn't build one for near the cost of what Arsenal was selling them for. They are also a correct version thereof. 

I don't want to toot my own horn here, but I've owned at least 1 AK of every variation that was imported into the US at 1 time or another. Never was rich, so no, I don't still have them. Wish I did, but if wishes were steak, we'd all be eating horses. I say, as a collector, that the 100 series rifles that Arsenal puts out is better than anything that has ever come onto the market, IMO. Galils and Valmets are up there too.

I do not think the Chinese AKs are junk, but they aren't a super AK, as I already stated. Great trigger groups? Yup. Thicker receiver? Yup. Built well? Yup. Will they last? Yup again.


Does it know if it's an AK-47 or an AKM?



nope. It's a tad confused.

Let's discuss the finish now since you brought that up. I have no idea where you live, but down here in the South, blued firearms rust. They rust if you just think about them rusting. Keeping a blued rifle from rusting isn't hard, but it does require some work. Now that shitty Arsenal finish, yea, I've seen it. I've seen the photos of peoples rifles who couldn't read and sprayed harsh chemicals on their rifles instead of just taking the time to use a little elbow grease to clean their rifles. I can honestly say, not once has any of the paint run on any of my Arsenal rifles. Bonus, if it does theirs parkerizing under it!

So in conclusion to my mini rant that is a rebuttal to your mini rant which was due to my initial mini rant, you can continue to think that your Chicom rifles are awesome, and I will continue to think they are functional yet obsolete.

Shoot on my friend!

For me the term gold standard is ambiguous

If you mean something like a Colt that was a military issue rifle, and still available, the list gets short really quickly.

Most of the AKM pattern rifles like the Maadi in 7.62 are rare, except for WASRs. The SLR107 is a fantastic rifle but is not really gold standard since it's not an AKM pattern, and no one uses a 7.62 with that design as their primary military rifle. It's also not actually an AK100 series rifle either so it doesn't match the SGL21, though it is very close. Are the details between the SLR107 and SGL21 just splitting hairs? I dunno, but I don't recall a military using the SLR107 even though it is produced at a military factory in Bulgaria


The SGL21 is essentially a semi auto version of the AK103 fielded by Venezuela, but while being a gold standard rifle it's also not an AKM




Maybe I am being too technical in my interpretation of the term but comparing an AK to a Colt and being available now is a tough combo in the 7.62 world. Now if you jump off to 5.45 the list actually opens up quite a bit and it's much easier to find something on the gold standard list



Z

I guess I wasn't being too clear, I meant the 5.45 rifles when I said "correct version"

I don't want you guys thinking I'm bashing the Chinese AK. It's a good rifle, just hasn't always been held in such high esteem that it seems to enjoy today. Perhaps it's  like a fine wine that has gotten better with time.

Nictra - Funny you mentioned the ChiCom's "identity problem" .. I agree. All it is is an AK47 .. I hear people call it an AKM on here and I roll my eyes..

I think they are like a fine wine now that I think of it.. My groups shrank to a point as the round count ran up.The actions smoothed out also. They acquired a very nice patina from handling them. The 56S I had for 26 years.. Miss that girl.

I am in the Adirondacks in NY.. I still had to keep an eye on them for rust but it wasn't as bad as when I first got the 56S new... That damn thing needed your attention .. I think the bluing salts were still working their way out (??) Still had to keep the oil to her for good care

In the white means it has no finish at all.

Makhail Kalashnikov himself would disagree with that, citing the Bulgarian AKs being the best of all the "other" countries that make the AK.
But you love Chinese AKs, and that's fine.

Arsenal SLR-107FR

Isn't the SLR107FR currently in use by the army of Venezuela? I thought I remember reading about how Arsenal got a contract for a large number of them from that country (full auto of course).

I have one and it's my most accurate AK. 10-shot group 4 MOA with irons. Now if I could just figure out how to mount my silencer to it...

No.  AK103

I prefer a custom build from Definitive Arms. My DAKM 4150 has yielded me .97 MOA at 100 yards with Hornady SST's. Granted I was shooting from a bench rest with a scope. But still, it just goes to show the accuracy potential. Standing, unsupported, I can make consistent head shots on my metal silhouette target with it. I've talked with the owner several times and always take away knowledge from the conversation. That guy is into the metallurgy and mechanics of the rifle and has a deep love and respect for the weapons that he builds. And no, I don't work for, nor am I affiliated in any way with that company. I can just appreciate the high quality of their workmanship.

It's all lies. No one outside of the Eastern Bloc can possibly figure out how to build AKs. Not enough experience or institutional knowledge. At least that's what hacks on the internet keep saying.

I saw a SLR104FR in a gun store yesterday. I'm surprised it hasn't sold yet.

LOL, China is possibly the most capitalist country in the world...   America has been playing slow pitch capitalism since the 1930s.  And let me tell you, that may not be a bad thing compared to the Chinese alternative.

Arsenal's are great for a classic AK. 

IWI Galil Ace's are great for a modern AK. 

If you have the money and want a classic collector AK, then go Chinese Polytech Legend 

I also really enjoy the classic old school pre-ban IMI Galil 

Their gov is very very involved with their economy...more so than real balls to the wall capitalists would tolerate, but we agree that "it's working" in any case. Just a question of degree.

I agree with this 100%.

Can anyone think of a reason NOT to get a VEPR FM-AK47-11?

Wasr-10 . Seriously they are the best bang for your buck . AKOU has just surpassed 10,000 rounds with his . Let's see how far the 6920 can go .

Saiga & The Arsenal Saiga Conversions...

Made IN THE F'ing RUSSIAN AK FACTORY...

Don't know how you top that if you want Quality AKM...

Arsenal

The kind of discussion is slowly going down the funnel of "What's available for purchase". Choose wisely and purchase it at the best price you can get it.

yeah, honestly the import AK market is pretty sad these days. Very limited number of countries bringing guns in, and very limited options in types of guns (RPK variants etc.). The contrast is especially stark compared to the AR world, where competition has motivated manufacturers to continually push the horizons of the market until at this point anything you could ever want or even dream of can be done with an AR with off the shelf parts from many different sources. I know the import market for AKs never has been 'perfect', there's really not a golden age for it, but each year recently it seems like it gets worse as more places stop making them, or they get banned, or there's an embargo, or product lines 'narrow', or whatever.

I've got a WASR on the way from Classic. And I've got another WASR at a different source entirely. It's an older model. Not ancient. But it appeared to be one that accepts the single stack mags. Comes with a can full of mags, so I'm in for the novelty factor.

At this point seems that whatever you can get is the standard.


Everyone is out of stock of everything.

Might want to look at Atlantic Firearms.

In the AK market, whatever is considered crap today is fondly remembered 5 years from now as being the good stuff...

Not counting the pre-1989 days, I think the years following the expiration of the 1994 AWB were the best days for AKs.   Probably 2005 till 2008 with Obama getting elected.

Unnecessarily heavy.

You asked.

Good input. Lots of people talk them up. Just curious.

this sadly 

Probably gone by now, however, which store? I would like to add another 104 to the safe.

this is interedasting. The price of $ 2,200 does not include the standard AK side rail. If you want it- its extra.

Not so sure about that. I've had a Valmet, Galil, and a Polytech Legend. My SAM7SF is right there. When prices went crazy for the former, I cashed out. The Arsenal is a keeper, unless the prices double or triple someday.

I remember just 8-9 years ago when the Romanian WASR 10 was considered low end. Misaligned scope rails,trigger slap and overall appearance didn't help things. How things have changed for the WASR but also changed for the overall AK market in bad ways as well.