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Posted: 11/21/2015 9:13:48 AM EDT
[#1]
No issue with the finish, my only complaint was the front sight was canted. Nothing extreme, but unacceptable on a $1k AK.
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Posted: 11/21/2015 9:20:55 AM EDT
[#2]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
No issue with the finish, my only complaint was the front sight was canted. Nothing extreme, but unacceptable on a $1k AK. +1. The finish on mine is OK. |
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Posted: 11/21/2015 9:33:05 AM EDT
[#3]
Quoted:
Hi all, I've been in the AK game for a while now and needless to say this isn't going to be my first AK. I have never owned an Arsenal. I keep hearing about the finish coming off if you sneeze too hard on it. Seriously though I use Hoppes on all my rifles and have never had a problem with it damaging any finishes. Is something like Hoppes going to ruin the finish on a $1000 rifle? If so, thats completely unacceptable and I wouldn't consider buying one. I can't seem to find any pics of damage to your rifles...a lot of Arsenal hate...but no pics. Not saying any of the complaints with Arsenal are untrue; I have no first hand experience with them. The finish on the SLR-107's is among the best you'll find on an AK. Paint over park to be exact...I've gotten Hoppes on mine before, no sweat, and IMO the Arsenal finish is the best outside of Yugos/Serbs. Anyone who bitches about the SLR-107 finish either doesn't have one or is being a snob. Also, the only complaints usually came from SLR-104 owners, as the finish on those IS slightly different (I believe they're not parked to be exact). If this doesn't get the point across I don't know what will... Also, if you're that concerned, just refinish the rifle with engine enamel or any other type of cheap high heat spray paint if necessary. The finish on AK's really isn't something to worry about at all unless you're adverse to DIY.     
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Posted: 11/21/2015 11:46:45 AM EDT
[#4]
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i just got mine.i think it is really nice! |
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Posted: 11/21/2015 12:34:18 PM EDT
[#5]
The finish thing is greatly overblown, generally those that have never owned one. I have multiple Arsenal riles with no issues, just clean with the recommended cleaner CLP.
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Posted: 11/21/2015 12:38:52 PM EDT
[#6]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
The finish thing is greatly overblown, generally those that have never owned one. I have multiple Arsenal riles with no issues, just clean with the recommended cleaner CLP. +1 I have two 107's - a 2008 vintage and a 2014. Both have held up well to CLP and Hoppes, and Ballistol. No appreciable wear at all. |
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Posted: 11/21/2015 2:41:23 PM EDT
[#7]
The finish is milspec, meaning it's parkerrized and then has a type of black engine paint on top.
The issue is that people are used to having firearm finishes that are just parkerized or something like Cerakote that is impervious to a wider range of cleaners and solvents. For example, if you were to use alcohol on the outside to try and degrease or clean residue for whatever reason, the black outer paint will start melting away and smearing. It is this reason why people dog the finish, because they don't realize that it's just normal high temperature paint on the outside and they use cleaners or solvents that will eat it up and ruin the finish. What people don't seem to also understand is that these rifles are parkerized underneath so they complain about the crappy finish not realizing that the guns are actually double protected. |
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Posted: 11/21/2015 3:15:00 PM EDT
[#8]
The finish is weak compared to other options (like ceracoat, gunkote, etc). It won't stand up to many solvents, so it is best to test new products in an inconspicuous area before going crazy with it. There is a reason Arsenal recommends you don't use anything but CLP.
I just use CLP on my SLR104UR, no issues. I've used hoppes on the barrel. I was being careful to not get it anywhere but the bore.. didn't have any problems. After I cut the barrel to SBR it, I took the part I cut off and gave it a harsh finish test... sprayed it with brake cleaner. The finish literally just washed away like it was nothing. There was park under it. I've read the same happens with products like Birchwood Caseys Gunscrubber. If you are the type of guy who has to make things spotlessly clean and uses harsh solvents... proceed with caution. Some guys go overboard with cleaning products. |
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Posted: 11/21/2015 5:44:45 PM EDT
[#9]
Apparently there is a vocal group out there that put great effort into advertising that they can't read and lack the understanding of what chemicals remove paint. Don't like paint over park? Stop whining and don't buy it. Get a WASR. It really is that simple.
Those that do buy. Follow recommendations and you will be fine. I've noticed nothing. Nada. If somehow I stumble into a vat of brake cleaner with my 107 slung, well I'll get Cerakoted then. No biggie. |
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Posted: 11/21/2015 6:01:46 PM EDT
[#10]
Just keep the acetone off the finish or you will have squid ink everywhere.
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Posted: 11/21/2015 6:08:44 PM EDT
[#11]
I use CLP on mine, no problems and the finish is pretty tough as far as I'm concerned.
Still looks great. 
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Posted: 11/21/2015 6:26:24 PM EDT
[#12]
As already mentioned, if you use many spray solvents, the finish could come right off. Brake cleaner especially will wash it off like nothing. I don't bother with that stuff on AKs any longer, and anything stronger than CLP is pretty much a waste. Most of my AKs just see a bore snake with CLP, and a brass brush to the muzzle every year or so - carbon WILL build up to an obscene amount underneath the muzzle brake.
If you are worried about finish wear from casual use.. Well, it will happen eventually, and it will just end up looking like a real AK should. |
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Posted: 11/22/2015 2:39:32 AM EDT
[#13]
As an Arsenal 106 owner I'm disappointed that the company didn't/doesn't use a better final finish product on a $1K gun. Using Gunkote or Cerakote instead of K-Mart Krylon on a $1K gun should be automatic.
Mine has some idiosycracies that shouldn't occur on a $1K gun but they're tolerable. They are nice AKs, but I likely won't buy another since there are a couple better alternatives.. |
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Posted: 11/22/2015 9:40:30 AM EDT
[#14]
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Posted: 11/22/2015 3:46:31 PM EDT
[#15]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
As an Arsenal 106 owner I'm disappointed that the company didn't/doesn't use a better final finish product on a $1K gun. Using Gunkote or Cerakote instead of K-Mart Krylon on a $1K gun should be automatic. Mine has some idiosycracies that shouldn't occur on a $1K gun but they're tolerable. They are nice AKs, but I likely won't buy another since there are a couple better alternatives.. Could you elaborate on the idiosyncrasies? Just curious. Any pics of the finish problems? Regarding AKs approaching 1k, it's pretty normal these days. With WASRs pushing $600 and US crap AKs going for $8-900, I have no problem putting up $900-1000 for the Arsenal. Maybe my next one will be a POS but so far they are one of the only ones I haven't had to send in for warranty work or even worse, a complete exchange. The problems usually get resolved but it's a pain. |
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Posted: 11/22/2015 11:31:47 PM EDT
[#16]
my 107fr is my 5th Arsenal and it had a slight blemish in the paint right above where the grip and trigger guard meet but other than this the finish is perfect just like my others.
I use CLP and don't have any issues with it harming the finish |
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Posted: 11/23/2015 12:08:50 AM EDT
[#17]
I've posted this photo years ago, and others have posted similar photos of damaged finish from other cleaning products, both here and on other AK forums. Its old news. I first tested a little on the compensator, as I had several replacement brakes available at the time. Glad I tested first!
As an owner of at least one model of every number series that Arsenal Inc. has offered all the way back to my first Arsenal (SA-93 in the 1990's), I would hardly consider myself an Arsenal basher. I shared my info so others wouldn't find out the hard way. Very mild cleaners (CLP) are what I use on these. 
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Posted: 11/23/2015 9:41:16 PM EDT
[#18]
The finish is pure crap. I don't think there's anything worse than the finishes used by Arsenal.
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Posted: 11/23/2015 10:31:19 PM EDT
[#19]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
The finish is pure crap. I don't think there's anything worse than the finishes used by Arsenal. You never owned a Maadi then. |
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Posted: 11/23/2015 11:11:39 PM EDT
[#20]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
You never owned a Maadi then. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
The finish is pure crap. I don't think there's anything worse than the finishes used by Arsenal. You never owned a Maadi then. I bought nine of those back when they were $229.00. I had to return five because of the recall. A long time ago that was, and I don't recall the finish on them any worse than the Arsenal's. |
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Posted: 11/24/2015 2:40:23 AM EDT
[#21]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
The finish is pure crap. I don't think there's anything worse than the finishes used by Arsenal. Buying 9 Maadis sure as heck is worse. 
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Posted: 11/24/2015 6:14:31 AM EDT
[#22]
I really don't understand some people...
We're discussing the best factory made AK on the market, that comes packed with more features than the competition, is competitively priced considering the features, and is as "mil-spec" as it gets in the AK world. These particular guns are currently popular in hotspots and warzones around the world and carry a pretty solid rep...but for some reason we're sitting here having a silly debate about the painted on finish fading after coming into contact with chemicals and solvents that are already known to affect painted finishes. 
I mean...you guys do realize that the finish on Russian guns is even worse, as it's paint only (super thin at layer at that)...no park right? Romanian guns are parked only...crappily at that in most cases. Mine needed to be refinished out the box it looked so bad. Yugo guns are blued, and probably arguably "look" the nicest, but there's so many compromises and tradeoffs you have to accept for Yugo guns just to get that nice shiny blue job... Currently your only other mainstream options are American made AK's, or build kit/custom guns. Relatively speaking, the SLR-107 finish is still among the best you can get. |
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Posted: 11/24/2015 6:25:51 AM EDT
[#23]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
You never owned a Maadi then. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
The finish is pure crap. I don't think there's anything worse than the finishes used by Arsenal. You never owned a Maadi then. I remember them from the early 80's before the ban; they truly were Russian knock-offs a la Romys in the fit/finish dept. Anything CHICOM looked nicer, while Mitchell Yugos and Kassner Hunkies looked even better. |
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Posted: 11/24/2015 10:02:28 AM EDT
[#24]
The paint one the Arsenal is fine, its done well, it looks good, it doesn't hold up to super harsh solvents, but it is parked underneath which is really all a gun needs.
Compared to a Saiga, the Arsenal finish is spectacular. Compared to my In Range custom AK, which is Moly over park, its not as nice. |
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Posted: 11/24/2015 10:25:44 AM EDT
[#25]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I remember them from the early 80's before the ban; they truly were Russian knock-offs a la Romys in the fit/finish dept. Anything CHICOM looked nicer, while Mitchell Yugos and Kassner Hunkies looked even better. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
The finish is pure crap. I don't think there's anything worse than the finishes used by Arsenal. You never owned a Maadi then. I remember them from the early 80's before the ban; they truly were Russian knock-offs a la Romys in the fit/finish dept. Anything CHICOM looked nicer, while Mitchell Yugos and Kassner Hunkies looked even better. you mean like these 
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Posted: 11/24/2015 7:25:45 PM EDT
[#26]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Yugo guns are blued, and probably arguably "look" the nicest, but there's so many compromises and tradeoffs you have to accept for Yugo guns just to get that nice shiny blue job... Such as? Something other than weight? Isn't a runny finish and merely-average quality control a compromise or a trade off you have to accept for an Arsenal? 
Arsenals do come with a lot of features and are competitively priced when you factor in all those features, but that's all fluff to someone who doesn't want or need them. None of that makes it "the best" factory built AK out there. But I digress....... |
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Posted: 11/25/2015 5:49:46 AM EDT
[#27]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Such as? Something other than weight? Isn't a runny finish and merely-average quality control a compromise or a trade off you have to accept for an Arsenal?
Arsenals do come with a lot of features and are competitively priced when you factor in all those features, but that's all fluff to someone who doesn't want or need them. None of that makes it "the best" factory built AK out there. But I digress....... Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Yugo guns are blued, and probably arguably "look" the nicest, but there's so many compromises and tradeoffs you have to accept for Yugo guns just to get that nice shiny blue job... Such as? Something other than weight? Isn't a runny finish and merely-average quality control a compromise or a trade off you have to accept for an Arsenal?
Arsenals do come with a lot of features and are competitively priced when you factor in all those features, but that's all fluff to someone who doesn't want or need them. None of that makes it "the best" factory built AK out there. But I digress....... The supposed "runny finish" you claim Arsenals have certainly hasn't affected me or quite a few other people...only a vocal minority that fails to understand that for all their supposed beef with Arsenal for having a "runny finish", many other Combloc factory made AK's have a similar finish that will also potentially fade as well if certain chemicals are used on it. The finish is still "mil-spec" for what it's worth, but apparently not good enough for some. For someone to choose a Yugo/Serb gun over an Arsenal because of the finish alone yes...they are losing out on a bit just to have something that arguably looks prettier. The weight absolutely is a trade off, and a rather annoying and pointless one at that. The extra pork the Yugos carry is pretty needless IMO because they don't really excel at anything better than any other AK to warrant it now do they? Lack of chrome lining, proprietary parts, goofy stock comb...all while still having average quality control as well. Good to great looking guns yes, but considering all current AK Market offerings, both factory built imports and US made AK's, the Arsenal is still the "gold standard" so to speak. As far as "the best"...highly subjective, but a pretty sound argument can be made that it is. |
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Posted: 11/25/2015 10:40:11 AM EDT
[#28]
gold standard? Colt vs the world all over !
arsenals are what they are. just another AK although nicely equipped, but I don't believe id call them the gold standard. they to me are rather the "Volvo" standard. Good and flashy, but in the shop a lot. Just reviewing current discussions on this site you find canted sights, canted handguard retainer, finish issues, http://www.ar15.com/forums/t_4_76/154467_Rubbing_alcohol_vs__Arsenal_paint___.html |
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Posted: 11/25/2015 1:47:12 PM EDT
[#29]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
gold standard? Colt vs the world all over !
arsenals are what they are. just another AK although nicely equipped, but I don't believe id call them the gold standard. they to me are rather the "Volvo" standard. Good and flashy, but in the shop a lot. Just reviewing current discussions on this site you find canted sights, canted handguard retainer, finish issues, http://www.ar15.com/forums/t_4_76/154467_Rubbing_alcohol_vs__Arsenal_paint___.html Not quite...because it's not like Colt could ever claim features it has which the competition doesn't. Arsenal can, because no other AK on the market comes stock with a factory left side folder, 74 style brake, etc...and there's just certain features and style AK's that if you want them, Arsenal is the only game in town. There's nothing really a Colt has that can distinguish itself from any other AR outside of the logo. Ultimately Arsenals are just nicely equipped AK's yeah...but compared to other AK offerings that's worth the premium in this current market. Pretty much all ak's from all manufacturers are known to come with canted sights and other minor issues from time to time, so that's not really a big deal because if you own enough AK's from various manufacturers, you'll definitely run into it eventually. |
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Posted: 11/26/2015 1:31:39 AM EDT
[#30]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
The supposed "runny finish" you claim Arsenals have certainly hasn't affected me or quite a few other people...only a vocal minority that fails to understand that for all their supposed beef with Arsenal for having a "runny finish", many other Combloc factory made AK's have a similar finish that will also potentially fade as well if certain chemicals are used on it. The finish is still "mil-spec" for what it's worth, but apparently not good enough for some. For someone to choose a Yugo/Serb gun over an Arsenal because of the finish alone yes...they are losing out on a bit just to have something that arguably looks prettier. The weight absolutely is a trade off, and a rather annoying and pointless one at that. The extra pork the Yugos carry is pretty needless IMO because they don't really excel at anything better than any other AK to warrant it now do they? Lack of chrome lining, proprietary parts, goofy stock comb...all while still having average quality control as well. Good to great looking guns yes, but considering all current AK Market offerings, both factory built imports and US made AK's, the Arsenal is still the "gold standard" so to speak. As far as "the best"...highly subjective, but a pretty sound argument can be made that it is. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Yugo guns are blued, and probably arguably "look" the nicest, but there's so many compromises and tradeoffs you have to accept for Yugo guns just to get that nice shiny blue job... Such as? Something other than weight? Isn't a runny finish and merely-average quality control a compromise or a trade off you have to accept for an Arsenal?
Arsenals do come with a lot of features and are competitively priced when you factor in all those features, but that's all fluff to someone who doesn't want or need them. None of that makes it "the best" factory built AK out there. But I digress....... The supposed "runny finish" you claim Arsenals have certainly hasn't affected me or quite a few other people...only a vocal minority that fails to understand that for all their supposed beef with Arsenal for having a "runny finish", many other Combloc factory made AK's have a similar finish that will also potentially fade as well if certain chemicals are used on it. The finish is still "mil-spec" for what it's worth, but apparently not good enough for some. For someone to choose a Yugo/Serb gun over an Arsenal because of the finish alone yes...they are losing out on a bit just to have something that arguably looks prettier. The weight absolutely is a trade off, and a rather annoying and pointless one at that. The extra pork the Yugos carry is pretty needless IMO because they don't really excel at anything better than any other AK to warrant it now do they? Lack of chrome lining, proprietary parts, goofy stock comb...all while still having average quality control as well. Good to great looking guns yes, but considering all current AK Market offerings, both factory built imports and US made AK's, the Arsenal is still the "gold standard" so to speak. As far as "the best"...highly subjective, but a pretty sound argument can be made that it is. Weight, lack of chrome lining, proprietary parts, "goofy" comb on the stock.....these are all characteristics of the M70 design. The M70 wasn't designed to be an AKM, it was designed to meet the requirements of the JNA. In that role it performs quite well. One could just as easily point to the Arsenal's rear trunnion and pencil barrel as being trade-offs that detract from the rifles utility. Perspective changes everything...."horses for courses" and all that. |
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Posted: 11/26/2015 11:43:18 AM EDT
[#31]
I bought an arsenal slr107-34 earlier this year. My second ak. I received it with a bent receiver. I could barely get a magazine in the the rifle. I had to pay shipping to send it back for warrant. They sent me a new rifle back. It has a canted sight but shoot decent. I chalked it as better than what had so I'll stick with it. Can't say I would recommend them after my experience though. Not for a $1K AK.
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Posted: 11/26/2015 7:13:08 PM EDT
[#32]
"Gold standard" = Polytech Legend
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Posted: 11/27/2015 9:43:07 AM EDT
[#33]
Finish on an Arsenal AK is cosmetically fine, it's the finish itself that is shit. It is an alcohol-based lacquer and washes right off with alcohol or any cleaner with alcohol in it. Or Acetone, MEK, xylene, etc.
I refinish guns for a living, so I get a lot of exposure to the "toughness" of different finishes. Arsenal is the worst paint type production finish I've ever seen on a gun. Krylon is much more durable. I wouldn't get so upset over it, if it was just lacquer thinner and MEK that stripped it. Those are relatively harsh. But rubbing alcohol? Give me a break! This isn't 1950. There are plenty of quality finishes that look the same and are far more resistant to common solvents. There is simply no excuse to still use such a primitive paint. That being said, the 104/107 is still the only AK I recommend, and I own 5 of them. Its pluses far outweigh the minuses of the finish and their shit customer service. And I get plenty of people paying me to refinish their Arsenals with my paint-over park - which you can soak in MEK or acetone and it won't come off. Same finish I use as a subcontractor for the HK repair department. So actually, I have a financial incentive in them continuing to use their shitty finish. But in principle, it disgusts me. To this day, the toughest finish I've ever stripped was on a Chicom Dragonov. |
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