I.O AKM247C - AR15.COM

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Posted: 6/20/2015 7:18:25 PM EDT

I traded an EAA Witness 10mm pistol for a new I.O AKM247C earlier this week. I wasn't really looking to get an I.O AK based on past issues reported on internet boards, but for some reason, decided to do the trade. First off, the wood furniture on this rifle is much nicer than what I expected, as is the overall finish. In addition, the trigger is just as good as the WASR-10 I recently purchased with the Century RAK-1 trigger installed.

I took the rifle to the range yesterday after work and fired 300 rds of Tula 122 grain FMJ and had zero issues. It was hitting about two inches low, right out of the box and after adjusting the front sight, had it zeroed at 25 meters. I used a combination of Korean steel, Bulgarian surplus, Tapco Intrafuse and Magpul PMAG magazines and they all functioned perfectly as well, with tight lockup, side to side and front to rear in the magazine well. I will be installing a Magpul Zhukov stock, Ultimak rail and a Vortex Sparc red dot next week.

Posted: 6/20/2015 8:20:37 PM EDT

[#1]

I wasn't really looking to get an I.O AK based on past issues reported on internet boards, but for some reason, decided to do the trade.

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Is this the same principle of when you were a kid and your parents said "don't do it"... and you did it just because ?

Posted: 6/20/2015 8:39:00 PM EDT

[#2]

Good luck, that is all the advice i have to offer

Posted: 6/20/2015 8:54:20 PM EDT

[#3]

See if it can eat a case of ammo without falling apart before you waste your time on the Magpul stuff IMO

Posted: 6/20/2015 9:20:15 PM EDT

[#4]

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See if it can eat a case of ammo without falling apart before you waste your time on the Magpul stuff IMO

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This. OP, I hope you know how to build AK's because those things have a horrible rep. Good luck with it. Post back after 500 rounds.

Posted: 6/21/2015 2:55:59 PM EDT

[#5]

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This. OP, I hope you know how to build AK's because those things have a horrible rep. Good luck with it. Post back after 500 rounds.

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See if it can eat a case of ammo without falling apart before you waste your time on the Magpul stuff IMO

This. OP, I hope you know how to build AK's because those things have a horrible rep. Good luck with it. Post back after 500 rounds.

I know they have a shitty past, but look at what I traded for it

. If this rifle turns out to be a POS, I'll return it for repair and then trade it off. I figure with the resale value of an older round top slide EAA Witness, I didn't do too bad

.

Posted: 6/21/2015 4:29:58 PM EDT

[#6]

If it was an EAA 9mm it would've been a poor trade.. 10mm, yeah I can see that.

Hopefully this new IO is better than their old ones. There was a review up here a while back, it looked great on the surface but there was some questionable stuff going on with regard to riveting.

Posted: 6/22/2015 12:16:00 PM EDT

[#7]

Keep your eyes on the trunnion rivets. If the rear trunion is still rock solid after 1500 rnds or so, and you weren't fond of a 10mm pistol, your trade was GTG.

. The two IO's I saw last year looked really good externally. Short of improper receiver heat treat, You can fix just about everything else.

Posted: 6/22/2015 12:43:10 PM EDT

[#8]

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Keep your eyes on the trunnion rivets. If the rear trunion is still rock solid after 1500 rnds or so, and you weren't fond of a 10mm pistol, your trade was GTG.

. The two IO's I saw last year looked really good externally. Short of improper receiver heat treat, You can fix just about everything else.

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I will. If it has issues, I will send it back for repair and then trade it off. I also have a Glock 29, I just didn't care for the Witness so much.

Posted: 6/22/2015 1:24:06 PM EDT

[#9]

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I will. If it has issues, I will send it back for repair and then trade it off. I also have a Glock 29, I just didn't care for the Witness so much.

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Keep your eyes on the trunnion rivets. If the rear trunion is still rock solid after 1500 rnds or so, and you weren't fond of a 10mm pistol, your trade was GTG.

. The two IO's I saw last year looked really good externally. Short of improper receiver heat treat, You can fix just about everything else.

I will. If it has issues, I will send it back for repair and then trade it off. I also have a Glock 29, I just didn't care for the Witness so much.

One thing to check is if your rifle has the new bolt carrier with the chamfered front edge that prevents it from jumping the rails when the recoil buffer is removed. Images of this are at the end of my review linked below. If you do not have this part, I would suggest reaching out to I.O. and asking for one of the new ones.

Next, yank the recoil buffer. I found that it actually made the action feel sluggish because it was not allowing the carrier to make a full recoil stroke. A properly built AK SHOULD function fine without the buffer.

Lastly, if you've ever fired another AKM style rifle you will notice that the AKM247 has a much harsher recoil impulse. This is because I.O. decided to go big with the gas port. To address this, I would pick up a Wolff XP recoil spring.

These were just a few issues I had with the example I tested. While I.O. has cleaned up their act somewhat, the rifle still falls short compared to WASRs and other similarly priced AKs.

Review with photos: http://modernrifleman.net/2015/05/24/inter-ordnance-akm247-review/

Posted: 6/22/2015 1:51:07 PM EDT

[#10]

Thanks. Mine does not have the newer bolt carrier and I will contact I.O to try and get one. I already ordered a Wolff recoil spring last week as well. As far as recoil, I couldn't tell much difference between this rifle and my new WASR-10, but it definitely throws brass a bit further in comparison.

Posted: 6/22/2015 2:04:32 PM EDT

[#11]

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Thanks. Mine does not have the newer bolt carrier and I will contact I.O to try and get one. I already ordered a Wolff recoil spring last week as well. As far as recoil, I couldn't tell much difference between this rifle and my new WASR-10, but it definitely throws brass a bit further in comparison.

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I'm glad to hear that it shoots similarly to your WASR. I shot mine net to my Saiga (AKM configuration) and found the Russian rifle to be noticeably more pleasant.

The Wolff spring may negate the need for a new carrier as it is longer and remains so when fully compressed. Even so, I would try to get one of the new ones.

Posted: 6/22/2015 2:13:15 PM EDT

[#12]

I just sent an email to them. I suspect I will need to return the original to them in order to get a replacement?

Posted: 6/22/2015 2:17:17 PM EDT

[#13]

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I just sent an email to them. I suspect I will need to return the original to them in order to get a replacement?

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I'm not sure to be honest. They sent me a new one and let me keep the old, but I was working with Atlantic on the review. You might try to verify that you truly need it by pulling the buffer and seeing if the action locks up when cycled. Mine did.

Posted: 6/22/2015 2:26:02 PM EDT

[#14]

If the buffer is not installed, the bolt carrier does pop off the rails.

Posted: 6/22/2015 2:27:18 PM EDT

[#15]

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If the buffer is not installed, the bolt carrier does pop off the rails.

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Good to know. I'd ask for a swap. The firearm is noticeably smoother without the buffer.

Posted: 6/22/2015 3:29:34 PM EDT

[#16]

That was fast. Already received a reply email requesting serial number and that it would be covered under warranty. I will see what happens.

Posted: 6/22/2015 4:18:08 PM EDT

[#17]

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That was fast. Already received a reply email requesting serial number and that it would be covered under warranty. I will see what happens.

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Good. The AKs may have some pitfalls, but I.O. seems to have improved their customer service by leaps and bounds. They were quick to acknowledge the issue when I called it out to them and my understanding is that the carriers will be properly machined moving forward.

Posted: 6/23/2015 11:22:52 AM EDT

[#18]

I emailed my serial number to I.O last night and received a reply this morning that they are shipping an updated bolt carrier to me free of charge. No forms and no hassles. I received and installed the Wolff recoil spring yesterday as well.

Posted: 7/27/2015 7:23:44 PM EDT

[#19]

You know I get pretty tired of all the bashing, when the Poly Techs were available everything else was crap, when the Yugo's came out the Romanians were crap, now that the I.O. is out the Romanian is the greatest thing around. Everyone cannot afford a top of the line AK, if you are happy with your purchase and it functions well that's all that matters, a lot of the nay sayers probably have never owned a I.O. Yea they had their problems and I still think the gas ports are too large and don't like the recoil buffer but that can be overcome. What matters is if you are happy.

Posted: 7/27/2015 7:26:30 PM EDT

[#20]

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You know I get pretty tired of all the bashing, when the Poly Techs were available everything else was crap, when the Yugo's came out the Romanians were crap, now that the I.O. is out the Romanian is the greatest thing around. Everyone cannot afford a top of the line AK, if you are happy with your purchase and it functions well that's all that matters, a lot of the nay sayers probably have never owned a I.O. Yea they had their problems and I still think the gas ports are too large and don't like the recoil buffer but that can be overcome. What matters is if you are happy.

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Except all the other rifles you mentioned have a pretty good reputation and IO is known to be crap.

Posted: 7/27/2015 7:54:20 PM EDT

[#21]

You sir are missing the point.

Posted: 7/27/2015 7:59:42 PM EDT

[#22]

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You sir are missing the point.

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no, he gets the point

io has a reputation for a reason

Posted: 7/27/2015 8:12:46 PM EDT

[#23]

No point having a battle of wits with someone that has no ammunition.

Posted: 7/27/2015 8:23:22 PM EDT

[#24]

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No point having a battle of wits with someone that has no ammunition.

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please explain to us fools why it is a good idea to buy a rifle known for quality issues, poor head space, out of spec parts, and rivets that make kalashnikov hang his head in shame?

did you lose your job when they moved to florida?

Posted: 7/27/2015 8:34:39 PM EDT

[#25]

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No point having a battle of wits with someone that has no ammunition.

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With all respect, I think "a battle of wits" oversells the dispute by quite a margin.

I'll agree with you that people are often critical of things with which they have no experience, but in this case I think there is evidence to support some of the criticism.

You say that some people cannot afford a high end rifle and I agree with that as well, but the WASRs you referred to are by no means high end, nor are they much more expensive than an AKM247. Compared to the wood-stocked AKM247C, the WASR carries a mere $30-40 premium.

Furthermore, there are clear reasons I would choose the WASR over an AKM247C:

1. The AKM247 is overgassed to a degree that I have not experienced with other AKs
2. Many (Most?) AKM247s will not function without the recoil buffer
3. The AKM247 bolt carrier is cast
4. The AKM247 barrel trunnion is cast

Some WASRs do indeed have issues, but as a whole they represent the closest example of an arsenal-built (little "a") AKM currently available. They've been shown to last tens of thousands of rounds without issue.

Meanwhile, I've seen two blown trunnions on AKM247s recently. This by no means is an indication that all are problematic, but blown trunnions are not common with AKs.

I've spent time with the AKM 247 and while it wasn't as bad as many have said, it also did not compare well to other entry-level AKs. If the rifle were priced at $399, I might feel differently. As it stands, I'd spend the extra $30 for the Romanian rifle.

Posted: 7/27/2015 11:18:10 PM EDT

[#26]

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please explain to us fools why it is a good idea to buy a rifle known for quality issues, poor head space, out of spec parts, and rivets that make kalashnikov hang his head in shame?

did you lose your job when they moved to florida?

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Quoted:

Quoted:

No point having a battle of wits with someone that has no ammunition.

please explain to us fools why it is a good idea to buy a rifle known for quality issues, poor head space, out of spec parts, and rivets that make kalashnikov hang his head in shame?

did you lose your job when they moved to florida?

Both of you remember this is a Technical Forum, not GD. No more insults unless you want some personal attention you won't like. From the Conduct Code;

SPECIFIC TO THE TECH FORUMS

The tech forums (Ar15,AK47,Handgun,Armory,Training,Outdoors) are more "formal" and actions permitted in the GD forum aren't permitted there. These forums are there to share information and as a result, trolling, heated arguments,insulting others,etc won't be ignored.

dryflash3

Posted: 7/28/2015 1:58:15 AM EDT

[#27]

Okay, I fired another 200 rds through this IO on Wednesday afternoon. After getting a feel for the Century RAK-1 trigger in my new WASR 10, I installed one in the IO. The trigger swap eliminated nearly all of the clunky feel of the bolt carrier and the trigger pull is much better. I had zero issues on this second trip to the range and so far, the rivets look as they did when I got it. I just received my Zhukov stock, MOE grip and Ultimak rail and installed it and a spare Vortex SPARC red dot this evening. I hope to go to the range again this weekend and put more rounds through it and zero the red dot as well. I'll see how it does over time.

Posted: 7/31/2015 8:37:49 PM EDT

[#28]

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I know they have a shitty past, but look at what I traded for it. If this rifle turns out to be a POS, I'll return it for repair and then trade it off. I figure with the resale value of an older round top slide EAA Witness, I didn't do too bad.

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He said I'll return it for repair then sell it I heard they have a lifetime warranty but if you try to use it they give the run around if you try to use that warranty let us know how it goes

Posted: 7/31/2015 9:00:51 PM EDT

[#29]

Hopefully, I won't have to find out

Posted: 8/24/2015 7:28:55 AM EDT

[#30]

So how did your 247 do? Pics?

I received a 247T as a gift and after 600 rounds it's doing great. I do have the carrier issue as you explained and will be calling I.O. for a replacement carrier.

Posted: 8/24/2015 12:22:42 PM EDT

[#31]

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So how did your 247 do? Pics?

I received a 247T as a gift and after 600 rounds it's doing great. I do have the carrier issue as you explained and will be calling I.O. for a replacement carrier.

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Actually, it has had no malfunctions yet. I received the updated carrier and installed it, but it slips off the rails as well. The rails are just short enough that use of the recoil buffer is mandatory

. I'll post photos as soon as I get time.

Posted: 8/24/2015 4:50:18 PM EDT

[#32]

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Actually, it has had no malfunctions yet. I received the updated carrier and installed it, but it slips off the rails as well. The rails are just short enough that use of the recoil buffer is mandatory

. I'll post photos as soon as I get time.

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Quoted:
So how did your 247 do? Pics?

I received a 247T as a gift and after 600 rounds it's doing great. I do have the carrier issue as you explained and will be calling I.O. for a replacement carrier.

Actually, it has had no malfunctions yet. I received the updated carrier and installed it, but it slips off the rails as well. The rails are just short enough that use of the recoil buffer is mandatory

. I'll post photos as soon as I get time.

Yeah, they fell a bit short but at least they eat ammo and go bang with some decent accuracy.

Posted: 8/24/2015 4:58:08 PM EDT

[#33]

So the receiver is out of spec too? Great.

Maybe you could double check with a standard carrier and make sure that the carrier rail sections are not also too short - the receiver may actually be in spec if this is the case, and you could just use a surplus (Polish, Romanian, etc.) carrier.

Posted: 8/24/2015 5:31:08 PM EDT

[#34]

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So the receiver is out of spec too? Great.

Maybe you could double check with a standard carrier and make sure that the carrier rail sections are not also too short - the receiver may actually be in spec if this is the case, and you could just use a surplus (Polish, Romanian, etc.) carrier.

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I actually did this with the gun I reviewed. The carriers from my AES-10B and Saiga (without bolt installed) did not jump the rails (or more accurately, returned to the rails) when cycled. This was actually how I diagnosed the problem. The issue was alleviated by a properly machined carrier, but that clearly is not the case for all examples.

Posted: 8/24/2015 5:37:46 PM EDT

[#35]

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So the receiver is out of spec too? Great.

Maybe you could double check with a standard carrier and make sure that the carrier rail sections are not also too short - the receiver may actually be in spec if this is the case, and you could just use a surplus (Polish, Romanian, etc.) carrier.

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My 2014 WASR-10 carrier slips off the rails when installed in the I.O AK. Not quite as easily as with the IO carrier, but it does still slip off. If they had made the rails just a hair longer, it wouldn't be an issue

.

Posted: 8/26/2015 4:30:09 PM EDT

[#36]

I put another 375 rounds through mine and no issues. The rail hand guard is junk and I'll change it out with a Magpul Vukov. The rails get HOT! Sheesh, I had to put a vert grip on it due to the heat. I tested the carrier issue and mine does it as well without that buffer. With the buffer, no problems. That said, I am pleased with the rifle. She eats everything I give her and feeds from several different types of mags.