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Page AR-15 » Troubleshooting
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Posted: 1/27/2015 12:56:03 AM EDT
Maybe this is a bit of paranoia, but I just had a first range trip my recent SBR build w/all premium parts; those relevant to the question are: DD 10.3” barrel; DD M16 BCG; V7 titanium gas block; Noveske pistol gas tube; PWS Enhanced Carbine H2 Buffer; Phase 5 carbine spring; VLTOR buffer tube.  Yes, I headspaced it the upper.
I was shooting Gemtech subsonic 187 gr. polymer tip w/a 7.62 Saker suppressor.  Function was flawless, but the brass was obviously not coming out perpendicular to the barrel, as it was lightly marking up the deflector.  Because I built the setup which was specifically created to run this round suppressed, I was surprised by this apparent over gassing, even if slight, and because of that, I didn’t go through with my plan to shoot subsonic unsuppressed, and supersonic both suppressed and unsuppressed.
So the obvious questions:  Try a different brand of ammo, maybe a heavier grain sub, and see what happens before doing anything else?  Go as far as supersonic suppressed just to see what happens?  Or not?  And if I do determine I’m over gassed, can I likely fix it by going to a different spring, or the JP one-piece spring and buffer assembly, or will I have to go the adjustable gas block route?  I’d like to avoid replacing a $70 titanium gas block if I can avoid it, though.  If it's not over gassing, wut the heck is it?
I will say that the ammo didn’t seem to be of particularly high quality, but then again, it’s gotten good reviews online.  It had more blowback due to the gas issue, which covered me with the powder, which was not only the biggest chunks of powder I’d ever seen come out of a fired round, but smelled like they used a different propellant than I’ve ever smelled before (no ammonia odor at all, yet stronger).  And I couldn’t fire more than several rounds without my eyes watering to the point the target became blurry, even at 25 yards with a scope on 10 power.  
Moreover, the inside of the gun, especially the bcg and buffer, were covered with these white chunks, unlike any propellant I’ve seen.  Some was in the barrel and the suppressor, but most of it was on the opposite end, somewhere aft of the gas tube exit.  

In chrome you can right click on the images and open in a new tab, but don't know why they're not displaying properly.

Links:https://www.flickr.com/photos/snarkvol/16190690430/in/photostream/
https://www.flickr.com/photos/snarkvol/15758071113/in/photostream/
https://www.flickr.com/photos/snarkvol/16376349761/in/photostream/
https://www.flickr.com/photos/snarkvol/16378072215/in/photostream/
Link Posted: 1/27/2015 4:54:36 AM EDT
[#1]
Quoted:
Maybe this is a bit of paranoia,<snip>  Function was flawless, but the brass was obviously not coming out perpendicular to the barrel <snip>
View Quote


I don't know what perpendicular to the barrel means, but as long as it was coming out of the gun and the weapon was otherwise flawless (to quote you)...it's fine.
Link Posted: 1/27/2015 8:20:50 AM EDT
[#2]
My understanding has always been that a properly gassed gun will spit its brass out at a 90 degree angle to the barrel.  But whether or not the brass bouncing off the deflector is anything to worry about is only one of the two issues here.  The second is the white chunks of powder all in the gun, as shown in the pics in the links.  What the bleep is that stuff?  Does anyone here reload?  If so, do you know of any propellant that has a white appearance when un-burned? It just about has to be unburned propellant, it seems (and all of the 300 BLK  round is supposed to be burned up in a 9" barrel, I thought).

With all that crud coming back into the chamber and BCG, it did run flawlessly, b/c it was wet, but I can't imagine it would have for much longer.

Oh, well, I suppose I'll clean her out, try another brand of subs, and see what happens suppressed, run it for a couple rounds unsuppressed, and do the same for a couple rounds each suppressed and un-suppressed with supersonic loads.  At least I'll have more data, and be able to isolate sub vs. supersonic and the Gemtech vs. other types of ammo.  Can't imagine just a few rounds will hurt the gun, even if it is over gassed.  
Link Posted: 1/27/2015 11:27:22 AM EDT
[#3]
The strange un/burned powder might be cause to try different ammo, but I wouldn't troubleshoot anything based on ejection pattern alone...it it's ejecting, it's fine.
Link Posted: 1/27/2015 1:09:38 PM EDT
[#4]
Link Posted: 1/27/2015 1:43:00 PM EDT
[#5]
Thanks so much for the detailed response, Dano523!  

If we were talking about 5.56 SBRs, I knew most of what you posted, but I thought, at least, that the 300BLK round was specifically designed to burn all its powder in a 9" barrel, and to do so suppressed, as long as you shoot subsonic.  At least, that's supposed to be AAC's story.  Of course, it's possible that some folks making ammo might not care about perfection with regard to the exact combination mentioned (SBR, suppressed, subsonic), but I would think surely Gemtech would, being a suppressor company.  To be fair, they say it's for running suppressed, but they don't say it's for an SBR, so I'll try a couple of other loads and report back.  

I know from their perspective, the bottom line is that the rifle ran fine, and probably would keep going as long as you prevented letting the powder dry it out.  The good news is ithe powder's pretty easy to clean, it's so large, and there's not as much carbon in these loads as basic 5.56 in a 16" bbl.  Maybe that's the trade-off.
Link Posted: 1/27/2015 9:05:09 PM EDT
[#6]
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