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Posted: 5/14/2017 10:44:34 AM EDT
[#1]
I know of nobody that wraps the threads.
I coat the inside of receiver nose with the same red moly grease as I do the threads. Eta: think I misinterpreted the original question. Was thinking assembly. 
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Posted: 5/14/2017 10:45:05 AM EDT
[#2]
Thinking about the melting point of teflon tape.
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Posted: 5/14/2017 10:51:20 AM EDT
[#3]
Are you just thinking about lubricating the inside of the upper while using the lapping tool? If so, use any quality oil so the shaft of the lapping tool will turn easily.
And what is it you are trying to do with the teflon tape? The lapping tool won't have any impact on the upper's threads. I wouldn't even consider using teflon tape for a build. Teflon tape is intended to fill voids between threads in plumbing applications. Assembly grease is intended to allow you to apply smooth, consistent torque to the barrel nut. Those are two very different applications with NO overlap. |
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Posted: 5/14/2017 2:19:08 PM EDT
[#4]
OP Q. #2
Many moly greases (and others) have Teflon in them. Teflon is the slickest (slippery) substance known. Like wet ice on wet ice. Teflon is not intended to "fill gaps" in threaded joints, The threads on the receiver and barrel nut are running threads, not tapered threads. Teflon paste would apply easier. Although Teflon PTFE has excellent lube and anti-seize properties, I recommend using moly grease for several reasons. #1 reason being it's cost prohibitive. -CB ETA: Teflon is currently marketed as a sealant. This is a change from past marketing. |
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Posted: 5/14/2017 3:49:35 PM EDT
[#5]
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Posted: 5/14/2017 9:39:54 PM EDT
[#6]
LOL. I should have phrased it a bit better. I am talking about the lapping process! I want to protect the threads from getting any compound on them, keeping them clean, so they don't get lapping compound in them. I.E - less mess to clean up.
For more home plumbing jobs I use "plumbers dope," anyways :D I would NEVER use teflon tape to install a barrel nut - I just want to protect the threads/keep them clean - was asking if you guys thought that was a good idea or if you had a better one. |
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Posted: 5/14/2017 9:44:15 PM EDT
[#7]
Then yeah, tape of any sort should keep the threads clean during the lapping process.
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Posted: 5/14/2017 10:07:09 PM EDT
[#8]
There is no reason to use anything on the threads while you do the lapping, if you get lapping compound on them, they just warm water and dish soap to wash them off.
I mill all of my own lowers and when I am done, I put them in the dishwasher and run them through the cycle to clean up any oil and grime. |
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Posted: 5/14/2017 10:45:44 PM EDT
[#9]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
There is no reason to use anything on the threads while you do the lapping, if you get lapping compound on them, they just warm water and dish soap to wash them off. I mill all of my own lowers and when I am done, I put them in the dishwasher and run them through the cycle to clean up any oil and grime. 
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Posted: 5/14/2017 11:47:22 PM EDT
[#10]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
You know they sell parts washers, right Dave? 
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Posted: 5/15/2017 1:14:15 AM EDT
[#11]
Quote HistoryHi,
Teflon or PTFE is polytetraflouroethelene. The tape is commonly used as a threaded pipe joint lubricant. Rectorseal #100 Teflon paste comes to mind as expensive. It costs about $20.00 for 4 oz. wholesale. The cost of rolls of tape vary by size and quantity purchased. Usually 1.00 to 5.00 a roll retail. |
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Posted: 5/15/2017 10:47:34 AM EDT
[#12]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Yup, sure do, I have one in the garage, but I have found running in the dish washer to be just as effective and it gets run at the same time as we are doing other things, I make sure there is no metal shards on the lower and then run it, works great. I also use the same oven for baking parts as we use for cooking, my wife is more than used to me after 30+ years of odd ball projects.. |
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Posted: 5/16/2017 5:38:19 AM EDT
[#13]
If you really felt the need to protect the threads, then Teflon plumbing tape would work without the worry of leaving any adhesive residue behind.
I see the logic you're using. Electrical tape would conform to the odd shape of the threads, but tends to leave adhesive behind when removed. Meanwhile masking tape doesn't leave adhesive residue, but would probably leave gaps where compound would get through, due to the shape of the threads. However, as others have noted, the common practice is to simply rinse the compound away. I just use a spray degreaser, myself. |
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Posted: 5/16/2017 1:35:35 PM EDT
[#14]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
OP Q. #2 Many moly greases (and others) have Teflon in them. Teflon is the slickest (slippery) substance known. Like wet ice on wet ice. Teflon is not intended to "fill gaps" in threaded joints, The threads on the receiver and barrel nut are running threads, not tapered threads. Teflon paste would apply easier. Although Teflon PTFE has excellent lube and anti-seize properties, I recommend using moly grease for several reasons. #1 reason being it's cost prohibitive. -CB ETA: Teflon is currently marketed as a sealant. This is a change from past marketing. PTFE can become extremely toxic at higher degrees. I would stay away from it in your cooking or weapons. Best anti seize I've ever used is 0.5 microns tungsten disulfide (ws2) powder. A little goes a long way too Than shit is the future. It sticks to your weapons and doesn't run off like Teflon. |
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Posted: 5/16/2017 4:17:15 PM EDT
[#15]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Yup, sure do, I have one in the garage, but I have found running in the dish washer to be just as effective and it gets run at the same time as we are doing other things, I make sure there is no metal shards on the lower and then run it, works great. I also use the same oven for baking parts as we use for cooking, my wife is more than used to me after 30+ years of odd ball projects.. FWIW I think teflon tape would be harder to get out of the threads than the filings. |
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Posted: 5/16/2017 4:25:27 PM EDT
[#16]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Thinking about the melting point of teflon tape. |
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Posted: 5/17/2017 2:02:12 PM EDT
[#17]
Well I got the took and I was surprised how soupy the compound was 600 grit Brownells. Wrapped the threads in the Teflon tape and lapped by hand. Came out nice and the tape was the solution, no crap in the threads. I will say though, my barrel has alot of play in it when fitted to the receiver, it was that way to start with. Everything looks more flush now.
I am abandoning the receiver though, too much slop. I bought a slightly undersized blem from BCM and will have it cerekoted and then I will install. I want to give accuracy the best chance it has got me. I will Lap the BCM before I take it to have it coated. Thanks guys so much. |
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Posted: 5/17/2017 2:56:06 PM EDT
[#18]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Well I got the took and I was surprised how soupy the compound was 600 grit Brownells. Wrapped the threads in the Teflon tape and lapped by hand. Came out nice and the tape was the solution, no crap in the threads. I will say though, my barrel has alot of play in it when fitted to the receiver, it was that way to start with. Everything looks more flush now. I am abandoning the receiver though, too much slop. I bought a slightly undersized blem from BCM and will have it cerekoted and then I will install. I want to give accuracy the best chance it has got me. I will Lap the BCM before I take it to have it coated. Thanks guys so much. Never tried it myself. |
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Posted: 5/17/2017 3:16:09 PM EDT
[#19]
There was a thread one here in the build it section one of the members was showing how to bed a barrel using thin stock metal to tighten things up.
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Posted: 5/17/2017 6:04:14 PM EDT
[#20]
I think I may have run across some of those - wish I would have saved them. How would blue loctite handle the heat transference I wonder? I am not a huge fan of putting loctite on it, but I am willing to experiment. I did the build YEARS ago when I did not know about the slop, and how properly fitting receivers exists and they do for a reason. I was rocking a titanium blue upper and lower and quad rail
 Since then I got rid of the 16in 556 eBay barrel, the quad rail, and now I am going to drop the upper as well - it might go another build who knows.
My lower is the titanium blue though, and the BCM upper has t-marks on it which I hate btw and it says it is blem anyway. I am trying to decide what would look the coolest with the titanium blue lower, and upper in graphite black or sniper gray - all suggestions taken :) |
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Posted: 5/17/2017 6:21:39 PM EDT
[#21]
STL-8
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Posted: 5/17/2017 6:24:10 PM EDT
[#22]
I had a machine shop that was recommended on this site do the lapping on my upper receiver. $10 an upper was more than fair and there is zero slop between the barrel and upper. I firmly believe that tool is crap and there are too many variables that aren't taken into account when using it.
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Posted: 5/17/2017 6:49:14 PM EDT
[#23]
I tend to agree, I got in contact with this person and they said they would do a batch for 10 bucks, wanted to send one but I guess that's not enough volume to make it work his time - I totally get that. I may send my uppers off and have them done by him. I was supposed to send them in last week but I ran into an issue with the bank (stolen card), and didn't have enough cash on hand to do this. I already have a couple of uppers out being coated but that doesn't mean they cannot be lapped after the coating either. I might have to wait a few weeks to get everything back to send it off to him. I need about 4 done. The others I am a little afraid to send through the mail, I have a very nice one from ascend armory and my vltor one took some saving to get my hands on towards the end and I don't want to let it go.
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Posted: 5/18/2017 2:32:30 PM EDT
[#24]
So I ended up going with a different color and decided to ditch the Anderson blue titanium lower, just have to strip it now. I took my blem BCM upper and Blem Spikes "punisher," lower and am having them coated - they fit very well together. I went with a color they called "sig green." Not sure if that is a custom color they mix or what, but it looks like a graishy green. I think, a tacticool look military style. I think I might do my pistol build outta the blue titanium upper and lower and bed the barrel with some loctite and metal like you guys talk about.
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Posted: 5/18/2017 2:34:32 PM EDT
[#25]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I had a machine shop that was recommended on this site do the lapping on my upper receiver. $10 an upper was more than fair and there is zero slop between the barrel and upper. I firmly believe that tool is crap and there are too many variables that aren't taken into account when using it. |
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Posted: 5/18/2017 10:13:55 PM EDT
[#26]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I use Aeroshell 33ms when I install barrels, that should cover me? Not sure on this one. |
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Posted: 5/19/2017 6:25:11 AM EDT
[#27]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Aeroshell 33MS will "cover you." It complies with the standard called for in the TM; you can't go wrong with it. Just remember that it doesn't take much - I apply a very small amount and spread it around. If you use too much, you'll just have to clean up the excess that squeezes out around the barrel nut. |
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Posted: 5/19/2017 7:28:42 PM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Will that cover the exposed aluminum from having the receivers lapped, or should I hit the exposed aluminum with a paint pen? I don't want anything to corrode together. Grease isn't there for corrosion prevention - it's there to spread the forces applied to the upper's threads, so that the barrel nut clamps the barrel flange evenly against the upper. It will block oxygen from reaching any of the parts, but that's not its job. |
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Posted: 5/20/2017 9:22:40 AM EDT
[#29]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
By the time the lapping compound is completely cleaned off of any bare aluminum, it will have formed a molecule-thick (or so) layer of aluminum oxide which very effectively blocks oxygen from getting to the rest of the aluminum. Aluminum corrosion is very different from iron/steel corrosion. Grease isn't there for corrosion prevention - it's there to spread the forces applied to the upper's threads, so that the barrel nut clamps the barrel flange evenly against the upper. It will block oxygen from reaching any of the parts, but that's not its job. |
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Posted: 5/23/2017 3:21:56 PM EDT
[#30]
Okay,
Got the email yesterday that my uppers were done and on their way back. He said he trued the faces on all 4 of them, they were between .003-.006 off I believe. I will be excited to see if it makes a difference. As soon as my others are done being coated I will send them off as well, just two of them. What is scary is that these were from companies like BCM and Aero. |
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Posted: 5/23/2017 7:58:12 PM EDT
[#31]
I'd be interested in learning if the faces of your uppers were off axis, had ripples, or just some high and low spots. Since most uppers are milled on CNC equipment, an error like those your machinist reported would indicate problems with blank setup if they were off axis, and problems with tooling if they were the other issues.
Off axis problems would cause really distinct barrel alignment issues, while ripples (or milling marks, etc.) might wind up essentially cancelling each other out. High spots are a PITA, but a few low spots wouldn't be nearly as much of a problem. |
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Posted: 5/24/2017 8:29:22 AM EDT
[#32]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I'd be interested in learning if the faces of your uppers were off axis, had ripples, or just some high and low spots. Since most uppers are milled on CNC equipment, an error like those your machinist reported would indicate problems with blank setup if they were off axis, and problems with tooling if they were the other issues. Off axis problems would cause really distinct barrel alignment issues, while ripples (or milling marks, etc.) might wind up essentially cancelling each other out. High spots are a PITA, but a few low spots wouldn't be nearly as much of a problem. |
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Posted: 5/25/2017 8:54:50 PM EDT
[#33]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
From the way he explained it to me I believe it is just some high and low spots. I do not believe it is an off-axis issue he corrects. |
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Posted: 5/27/2017 4:46:22 PM EDT
[#34]
I am very satisfied with the service - sent the other two off I needed done.
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Posted: 5/27/2017 4:47:25 PM EDT
[#35]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
STL-8 |
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Posted: 5/27/2017 4:48:33 PM EDT
[#36]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I had a machine shop that was recommended on this site do the lapping on my upper receiver. $10 an upper was more than fair and there is zero slop between the barrel and upper. I firmly believe that tool is crap and there are too many variables that aren't taken into account when using it. |
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Posted: 5/27/2017 5:10:54 PM EDT
[#37]
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Posted: 5/27/2017 5:23:13 PM EDT
[#38]
I plan on hitting the exposed aluminum with a paint pen or aluminum black. Thanks for the links! I have not read the threads yet, but I use Aeroshell 33ms...hope that's not an issue.
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Posted: 5/27/2017 11:01:37 PM EDT
[#39]
AeroShell 33MS is not an issue, nor is corrosion when using it on barrel nuts.
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Posted: 5/28/2017 6:47:21 PM EDT
[#40]
So can I just leave the aluminum exposed from the truing of the receiver or do I need to hit it with a paint pen or aluminum black - I don't want any corrosion. It seems some are split on this.
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Posted: 5/28/2017 8:46:33 PM EDT
[#41]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
So can I just leave the aluminum exposed from the truing of the receiver or do I need to hit it with a paint pen or aluminum black - I don't want any corrosion. It seems some are split on this. There is no "maybe" about this. The only reason to hit bare aluminum with paint or aluminum-black is to tone it down. Bare aluminum turns slightly dull and it goes no farther. The issues people freak out about with barrel nuts come from a poor understanding of galvanic corrosion. This happens when dissimilar metals (aluminum and steel, for example) are held in close contact with an electrolyte that facilitates an electrochemical reaction. Lithium-based greases don't do that, and AeroShell 33MS is lithium-based. If you were using a cheap axle grease that was 20% graphite, and there was a whole lot of exposed aluminum AND you assembled the thing in a rainstorm (actually IN the rain), you might have some problems. |
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Posted: 5/31/2017 1:16:49 PM EDT
[#42]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
If you apply the AeroShell to the threads of the upper, the face WILL get covered with grease. There is no reason to worry about it. Further, since a) aluminum oxide forms an impervious layer that stops oxygen from getting past it to "fresh" aluminum and b) the grease will prevent any electrolytic action, there will be ZERO chance of galvanic (or any other type of) corrosion. There is no "maybe" about this. The only reason to hit bare aluminum with paint or aluminum-black is to tone it down. Bare aluminum turns slightly dull and it goes no farther. The issues people freak out about with barrel nuts come from a poor understanding of galvanic corrosion. This happens when dissimilar metals (aluminum and steel, for example) are held in close contact with an electrolyte that facilitates an electrochemical reaction. Lithium-based greases don't do that, and AeroShell 33MS is lithium-based. If you were using a cheap axle grease that was 20% graphite, and there was a whole lot of exposed aluminum AND you assembled the thing in a rainstorm (actually IN the rain), you might have some problems. |
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Posted: 5/31/2017 8:12:09 PM EDT
[#43]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Thank you for this clear, concise, and direct answer to my question about this. This EXACTLY what I was looking for. Information like this should be a sticky. Thank you again.
Sincerely, I'm glad I could help. |
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