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Posted: 3/5/2017 4:20:17 PM EDT
[#1]
Not using a barrel vise may snap the barrel pin. It all depends on how tight it is and if there is rockset or some thread lock on there.
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Posted: 3/5/2017 4:28:47 PM EDT
[#2]
Bbl blocks would be correct.
That being said, I change them all the time without. If it is way torqued or has a locking agent on it, wait. As stated above, too much torque in either direction, you risk shearing the index pin in the extension or upper receiver damage. |
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Posted: 3/5/2017 4:37:36 PM EDT
[#3]
Thank you guys... I'm gonna wait for sure...
Cheers! |
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Posted: 3/5/2017 4:43:46 PM EDT
[#4]
Would not be my first choice in trying to get a barrel off!
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Posted: 3/5/2017 5:41:23 PM EDT
[#5]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Would not be my first choice in trying to get a barrel off! Nobody wanting to remove a barrel here Dave. 
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Posted: 3/6/2017 11:58:21 AM EDT
[#6]
I used a couple chunks of wood and a big c-clamp to hold a barrel to a table and change a muzzle device years ago. Not pretty or efficient but it worked. A few builds since and I have accumulated the tools and fixtures to make the job easier.
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Posted: 3/6/2017 12:58:05 PM EDT
[#7]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Nobody wanting to remove a barrel here Dave. Exactly Tig! 
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Posted: 3/10/2017 2:35:54 AM EDT
[#8]
Quoted:
All I have is an Intrafuse AR15 wrench... No vise... Installing a Lantac Dragon... Is there a possibility of twisting or loosening the barrel? Can I put the complete upper on a soft dining room chair and sit on it, using the wrench... To be safe, I'm asking before doing it... It's a 7.5" Adams Arms EVO pistol, with only the flash hider extending past the handguard... No barrel showing.... If I need to use a vise, I'll have to wait a couple more days, but I would be so happy if I could do it myself, today... Thanks... I see you are in Florida. Send me an IM. If you live close enough to me I can help you out with it. I've built many rifles over the years. |
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Posted: 3/10/2017 3:06:19 AM EDT
[#9]
A Bev Block is also a worth while investment. Just saying.
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Posted: 3/11/2017 7:27:58 AM EDT
[#10]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I see you are in Florida. Send me an IM. If you live close enough to me I can help you out with it. I've built many rifles over the years. This. 
Never be a "sledgehammer mechanic". |
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Posted: 3/11/2017 8:17:55 AM EDT
[#11]
i've actually snapped an upper receiver once trying to torque things off without the proper receiver vise.
do it right the first time and you'll never want to cut corners again. |
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Posted: 3/11/2017 11:56:25 AM EDT
[#12]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
i've actually snapped an upper receiver once trying to torque things off without the proper receiver vise. do it right the first time and you'll never want to cut corners again. It's never happened, but that has been a fear of mine. I've seen plenty of cracked receivers over the years. DPMS makes a slick side upper with nonstandard countours that doesn't fit into a standard AR upper receiver vise block. The only way to torque a barrel is to use something like the Geissele "reaction rod." The problem is when you want to use that upper for a 9mm build. There are no locking lugs for a reaction rod to mesh with, therefore it's difficult to torque the barrel properly. |
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Posted: 3/11/2017 12:29:24 PM EDT
[#13]
I probabaly should but I never us a vice to change muzzle devices. All of mine have crush washers though. They come right off.
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Posted: 3/11/2017 12:35:02 PM EDT
[#14]
I'm guessing mine was put on with some type of loctite. I have a vice and it's got a crush washer and it won't budge. Any suggestions? Heat? Trying to take it off to put an adjustable gas block on.
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Posted: 3/11/2017 12:48:47 PM EDT
[#15]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I'm guessing mine was put on with some type of loctite. I have a vice and it's got a crush washer and it won't budge. Any suggestions? Heat? Trying to take it off to put an adjustable gas block on. Lightly heating it should do the trick. |
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Posted: 3/11/2017 1:24:05 PM EDT
[#16]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I'm guessing mine was put on with some type of loctite. I have a vice and it's got a crush washer and it won't budge. Any suggestions? Heat? Trying to take it off to put an adjustable gas block on. Make sure it is not pinned, I Have seen some really good pin jobs this last year that you would not even suspect. |
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Posted: 3/11/2017 1:33:04 PM EDT
[#17]
Thanks I'll try some heat and check again for a pin in a bit
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Posted: 3/11/2017 1:34:40 PM EDT
[#18]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Make sure it is not pinned, I Have seen some really good pin jobs this last year that you would not even suspect. This^^^ A friend of mine dropped a Ban era Bushmaster off that had the pinned "IZZY" brake, I knew it was pinned, I knew the position of the pins and still couldn't see them. |
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Posted: 3/11/2017 2:16:14 PM EDT
[#19]
Ok got it off with a little more muscle and a tighter vise grip. Had to cut the crush washer off though cuz even with a vise grip I couldn't get it off without buggering up the threads. I have a basic muzzle break that doesn't appear to need to be timed. Do I even need the crush washer?
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Posted: 3/11/2017 2:54:03 PM EDT
[#20]
Crush washer good
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Posted: 3/11/2017 2:56:48 PM EDT
[#21]
You will some kind of washer because of the way the barrel is threaded with the shoulder, crush washer is the least expensive, of course you can use peel washers as well, but I just stick with normal ole' crush washers.
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Posted: 3/11/2017 3:19:50 PM EDT
[#22]
7.5 pistol with a brake
Pepper Angus |
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Posted: 3/11/2017 7:56:35 PM EDT
[#23]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
It's never happened, but that has been a fear of mine. I've seen plenty of cracked receivers over the years. DPMS makes a slick side upper with nonstandard countours that doesn't fit into a standard AR upper receiver vise block. The only way to torque a barrel is to use something like the Geissele "reaction rod." The problem is when you want to use that upper for a 9mm build. There are no locking lugs for a reaction rod to mesh with, therefore it's difficult to torque the barrel properly. DPMS makes a nylon/polymer upper receiver vise block called "The Claw". Won't that work? Price is around $37 from MidwayUSA |
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Posted: 3/11/2017 8:18:25 PM EDT
[#24]
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Posted: 3/12/2017 4:08:01 PM EDT
[#25]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
DPMS makes a nylon/polymer upper receiver vice block called "The Claw". Won't that work? Price is fifty bux. Yep, the Claw would have worked great. I was going to make one but I managed to do the job without. That being said, I should go ahead and just order the DPMS model. |
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Posted: 3/12/2017 10:46:10 PM EDT
[#26]
Midway sells The Claw for significantly less than DPMS.
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Posted: 3/12/2017 11:12:19 PM EDT
[#27]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Midway sells The Claw for significantly less than DPMS. Yep, I just discovered that myself. Thank you. |
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Posted: 3/13/2017 9:30:11 AM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
DPMS makes a nylon/polymer upper receiver vise block called "The Claw". Won't that work? Price is around $37 from MidwayUSA 
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Posted: 3/13/2017 11:06:43 AM EDT
[#29]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
For those who are following this discussion, the question is how to remove a very tight muzzle device without damaging anything. You do not want to grip the receiver with a Claw or receiver block and then crank on a muzzle device. That's how you risk shearing off the locator pin on the barrel extension. Instead, you want to grip an exposed portion of the barrel with wooden blocks in a vise, or perhaps with a heavy duty C-clamp and a sturdy table top. Factory made ARs typically have their MDs affixed gorilla tight, perhaps even with hi-temp threadlocker or Rocksett. Ideally, MDs are affixed with a jam nut or a crush washer and tightened only as much as necessary to time or to keep it from coming loose. Also, its a good idea to remove the MD every few hundred rounds to clean the accumulated fouling off the muzzle crown. Neglecting this leads to corrosion for sure, ask me how I know. - CW I don't disagree with anything you've said except where you suggest routinely removing the muzzle device. My experience with muzzle corrosion is different from yours. I've noted heavy carbon buildup, but never any corrosion. And since you are supposed to replace the crush washer every time you reinstall the muzzle device you must use a different type of washer, or go through a LOT of crush washers. Also, I would like to mention that If I were clean the muzzle every few hundred rounds that muzzle device would be coming off once a week, or more.. With modern, clean burning ammo, and routine barrel cleaning, I have never had an issue with muzzle corrosion. I own many ARs that have thousands of rounds downrange. I have occasionally swapped out muzzle devices to try out a new muzzle brake, or flash hider and, as I mentioned, the only thing I've ever seen is carbon buildup on a couple of devices. Not all of them have that and it is a self limiting issue - in other words, once the buildup reaches a certain point it stops. If you are a fanatic about a perfectly clean museum grade rifle then feel free to take the time to remove the MD and scrape it off, but it's doesn't hurt my rifle performance. The correct torque for an A2 FH with a crush washer is 15-20 ft/lbs. This is just a nicely snugged up level of torque. There's no need to get it any tighter than this. |
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Posted: 3/13/2017 11:13:29 AM EDT
[#30]
I've changed a muzzle device without a vice once and it was a colossal pain in the dick,
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Posted: 3/13/2017 12:50:37 PM EDT
[#31]
Bbl blocks to remove it.
Only remove it to change it. No other reason, imo. |
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Posted: 3/13/2017 7:35:11 PM EDT
[#32]
I don't see how you are going to do it without a vice and without messing something up but I'm sure it has been done.
I have aluminum barrel blocks with the neoprene type liners to hold the barrels but I have been using the item below and it works very well and you don't have to worry about removing the gas tube because they clear. I wipe down the area on the barrel where it will be in the vice blocks with alcohol and have not had a barrel slip/ rotate yet. I have not come across any real stubborn muzzle devices though. PlastiXrevolution V-Groove Vise Blocks |
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Posted: 3/14/2017 1:07:03 PM EDT
[#33]
Magpul BEV block will change bbls, flash hiders, flip it over and it's a magazine vice block for only $46+/-. I've tried them all and can't say enough about the BEV block. Their wrench is nice too but spendy.
The DPMS claw sucks, people crack receivers with that thing. On the cheap wood bbl blocks or the derlin ones off ebay will work. |
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Posted: 3/15/2017 8:14:46 AM EDT
[#34]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
...snip...The DPMS claw sucks, people crack receivers with that thing. On the cheap wood bbl blocks or the derlin ones off ebay will work. In those cases where I'm attaching/removing a barrel nut that involves indexing of the gas tube and more than usual torque may be required, I mount the Claw and receiver sideways in the vise so its gripped at the top and bottom of the assembly. - CW |
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Posted: 3/15/2017 9:36:14 PM EDT
[#35]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Magpul BEV block will change bbls, flash hiders, flip it over and it's a magazine vice block for only $46+/-. I've tried them all and can't say enough about the BEV block. Their wrench is nice too but spendy. The DPMS claw sucks, people crack receivers with that thing. On the cheap wood bbl blocks or the derlin ones off ebay will work. I just broke down and purchased a BEV Block to go with my "spendy" wrench.
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Posted: 3/15/2017 10:16:05 PM EDT
[#36]
I removed several of mine without a vice, no problem. But installing a new muzzle device absolutely required a vice. I didn't buy any special tools to install it, I just wrapped the barrel in thick newspaper and cranked it tight in the vice to stabilize it, then used a 3/4" wrench.
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Posted: 3/17/2017 5:13:57 AM EDT
[#37]
You could try Blaster penetrating oil. I used it to get out a front sight/gas block retaining pin that wouldn't budge not matter how hard I hit it. Squirted some Blaster on the pin, let it sit for a couple of hours, couple of hits with the hammer and the pin dropped out.
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Posted: 3/17/2017 8:07:11 AM EDT
[#38]
A vise with barrel vise jaws is the right way.
A lot of people have been able to do it without a vise. However I see the occasional post where someone did not know when to stop trying and get the proper tools. |
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Posted: 3/17/2017 9:17:06 AM EDT
[#39]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
A vise with barrel vise jaws is the right way. A lot of people have been able to do it without a vise. However I see the occasional post where someone did not know when to stop trying and get the proper tools. I never heard back from the OP. I guess he didn't need help. |
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Posted: 3/17/2017 11:02:15 AM EDT
[#40]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
In my opinion, a vice with a device that meshes with the barrel locking lugs is the right way. Such as the so-called reaction rod that Geissele makes. If that's not available then the barrel vise is also perfectly fine, just not as easily used and risks marring the barrel finish. I never heard back from the OP. I guess he didn't need help. |
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Posted: 3/17/2017 11:02:49 AM EDT
[#41]
Quoted:
All I have is an Intrafuse AR15 wrench... No vise... Installing a Lantac Dragon... Is there a possibility of twisting or loosening the barrel? Can I put the complete upper on a soft dining room chair and sit on it, using the wrench... To be safe, I'm asking before doing it... It's a 7.5" Adams Arms EVO pistol, with only the flash hider extending past the handguard... No barrel showing.... If I need to use a vise, I'll have to wait a couple more days, but I would be so happy if I could do it myself, today... Thanks... Better be safe than sorry. With that said, I was in a gun store the other day and the owner was demonstrating a silencer. He grabbed a big crescent wrench, had someone hold the gun, and made a quick swap. |
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Posted: 3/17/2017 2:03:36 PM EDT
[#42]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
A reaction rod would help those with handguards that cover almost the entire barrel (no room for wood blocks). However, even that puts some stress on the engagement between the barrel and barrel extension, especially when removing a factory installed MD that is gorilla tight with high-temp threadlocker. - CW |
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Posted: 3/17/2017 2:17:14 PM EDT
[#43]
I've done it plenty of times without a barrel block, but I never had a muzzle device that had loctite or rockset, and I use crush washers.
The correct method is to use a barrel block in a vise and I would suggest that if you're fighting loctite, a gorilla that installed it, or need to torque it down to a correct spec for something important like a suppressor mount. |
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