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Posted: 4/17/2015 5:22:24 PM EDT
[#1]
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q11mziNfzmc
so i just saw this and am in shock. wish i had seen it earlier. anyone else do it this way? |
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Posted: 4/17/2015 5:28:42 PM EDT
[#2]
I've always had good luck squeezing roll pins in with a set of vice grips. I don't generally punch them in unless I have to. I have a set of medium sized vice grips with one jaw taped up so it doesn't scratch whatever its against (receiver, gas block, etc.) I usually try squeezing one end of the roll pin with another, smaller set of pliers to make it easier to start in the hole. Get it lined up and seated with a light tap then squeeze with the vice grips.
Ensure your gas tube stays lined up and doesn't roll a little causing the hole for the pin to become misaligned. As far as removing the damaged one, pull it out if you can, or punch from the other side. |
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Posted: 4/17/2015 5:47:02 PM EDT
[#3]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I've always had good luck squeezing roll pins in with a set of vice grips. I don't generally punch them in unless I have to. I have a set of medium sized vice grips with one jaw taped up so it doesn't scratch whatever its against (receiver, gas block, etc.) I usually try squeezing one end of the roll pin with another, smaller set of pliers to make it easier to start in the hole. Get it lined up and seated with a light tap then squeeze with the vice grips. Ensure your gas tube stays lined up and doesn't roll a little causing the hole for the pin to become misaligned. As far as removing the damaged one, pull it out if you can, or punch from the other side. Thanks i'll try getting a small punch to get it started tomorrow, then try pulling it out the rest of the way. any idea where to buy more pins though? this is the one I purchased Radical Firearms Low Profile Gas Block w/ Set Screws .750 I can't find anywhere that they sell them where the shipping isn't more than the item... (this might push me over the edge...just buy something that is worth the price in shipping and add a dozen of the damn pins in there too) |
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Posted: 4/17/2015 5:57:02 PM EDT
[#4]
Unfortunately I don't have any extra gas tube roll pins or i would mail you a couple. Maybe someone will come along that does. I know there has to be a website that sells individual small parts and ships them cheaply, I just don't know of any, sorry.
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Posted: 4/17/2015 6:06:39 PM EDT
[#5]
Thanks though. If i end up having to order from somewhere, i'll just stock up, and can divvy out as needed on here as a "thank you" for essentially building my rifle for me (with all the hang ups i've had already)
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Posted: 4/17/2015 6:32:42 PM EDT
[#6]
If you have an Ace Hardware or True Value near by they typically have bins with small stuff like roll pins.
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Posted: 4/17/2015 6:57:25 PM EDT
[#7]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I've always had good luck squeezing roll pins in with a set of vice grips. I don't generally punch them in unless I have to. I have a set of medium sized vice grips with one jaw taped up so it doesn't scratch whatever its against (receiver, gas block, etc.) I usually try squeezing one end of the roll pin with another, smaller set of pliers to make it easier to start in the hole. Get it lined up and seated with a light tap then squeeze with the vice grips. Ensure your gas tube stays lined up and doesn't roll a little causing the hole for the pin to become misaligned. As far as removing the damaged one, pull it out if you can, or punch from the other side. ^^^^this^^^^ and try a coiled roll pin they go in easier than the split pin. http://www.ebay.com/itm/12-Gas-Tube-Mil-Spec-PREMIUM-HARDENED-SPIROL-SS-COILED-ROLL-PINS-made-in-USA-/161658320439 |
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Posted: 4/17/2015 8:42:03 PM EDT
[#8]
I like to put the roll pin in a drill chuck. Get it turning and use a file to put a "SMALL" taper to it. I have a couple of small piece s of wood nailed together to make a jig to hold it still. I have also seen people use a vise to hold it steady.
Tiny bit of oil at the gas block hole and then smack it in with just a few swings of a small hammer. |
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Posted: 4/17/2015 11:21:34 PM EDT
[#9]
2 things I have found out that helps, go to your local home improvement store and get a cheap 5/64" drill bit. I think I paid 2 bucks for a two pack. I run it through after putting the gas tube in and before installing the pin.
To hold the gas block, I have a 2x4 with a "V" channel cut into it that cradles the block. Just my 2 cents. JBL |
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Posted: 4/17/2015 11:50:03 PM EDT
[#10]
I used a small strip of duct tape rolled around the pin and the tip of the punch to hold it in place to get it started. It was my first build and this method was surprisingly easy for a first timer.
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Posted: 4/18/2015 3:05:50 AM EDT
[#11]
When I was pounding in a "type A" grooved steel dowel pin to secure my BRT gas block to a Radical Firearms melonited barrel, I bent a brass punch. I switched to a steel punch and it sent that sucker home. Sometimes the material (steel) of the punch is not properly matched to the task (such as what I did). If the brass fails, turn to the steel.
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Posted: 4/18/2015 9:42:50 AM EDT
[#12]
<iframe width="480" height="360" src="http://s1377.photobucket.com/user/zovath/embed/slideshow/"></iframe>
pic added (maybe?) |
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Posted: 4/18/2015 9:46:35 AM EDT
[#13]
Couldn't get the picture to imbed (as usual) but either way
it is obviously smashed on one side, looks like it didn't make it all the way through the block though. I have spare parts on order, so once they arrive i'll punch it out and use the vise-grip to try to put it in. but I can only assume that if I were to use this, it would fail at some point? Not sure how else I could get it aligned though. I took a tiny allen wrench and made sure it was through as i was knocking it in. ohh well. hopefully next round goes better. |
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Posted: 4/18/2015 10:18:11 AM EDT
[#14]
Looks like gas tube rotated a bit while you were installing the pin. Did you have the gas block on the barrel at the time or were you trying to install the tube in the block off the barrel?
I could see the gas tube not staying aligned if it were the latter. I just pinch the end of the pin with a needle nose pliers, hold in place with same and tap with brass hammer to get started. I then finish install with a punch. The gas tube is installed while GB is on barrel, barrel installed in upper, upper held in vice with whatever device you choose. If you need a new roll pin, of whatever type you choose, look to Ace. They have them. .078 (5/64) x 3/8 work just fine although I think the proper size is something like .081 x .312. Ace carries the split pin type, the most common type that I have seen in kits. |
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Posted: 4/18/2015 10:35:21 AM EDT
[#15]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Looks like gas tube rotated a bit while you were installing the pin. Did you have the gas block on the barrel at the time or were you trying to install the tube in the block off the barrel? I could see the gas tube not staying aligned if it were the latter. I just pinch the end of the pin with a needle nose pliers, hold in place with same and tap with brass hammer to get started. I then finish install with a punch. The gas tube is installed while GB is on barrel, barrel installed in upper, upper held in vice with whatever device you choose. If you need a new roll pin, of whatever type you choose, look to Ace. They have them. .078 (5/64) x 3/8 work just fine although I think the proper size is something like .081 x .312. Ace carries the split pin type, the most common type that I have seen in kits. awesome man. So I had the gas block on the barrel, but the barrel was not mounted yet, so the tube didn't get lined up anywhere...thus the rotation. Just to clarify, for this and future builds, I should install the barrel on the upper, line up the barrel nut properly etc. Then slide the gas block and tube into place. Tighten the block onto the barrel, then try to put the pin in? Assuming i purchased the correct gas tube length for the barrel, are there any other considerations as far as how its placed in? |
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Posted: 4/18/2015 10:52:07 AM EDT
[#16]
I use these for starting all my pins. They work great. Apply a little oil to each pin before tapping them in. Pick up a new gas tube pin and a spare to use to as a "punch" to tap the fubar'ed pin out from the opposite side. Should work just fine. Using a small brass hammer for these pins works best in my experience.
ETA: I always get the gas block and tube lined up then tighten down the set screw on the gas block to hold everything in place before tapping the lubed pin in place. All this is done with the upper secured in my upper vise block. Never had an issue. |
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Posted: 4/18/2015 11:42:21 AM EDT
[#17]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
awesome man. So I had the gas block on the barrel, but the barrel was not mounted yet, so the tube didn't get lined up anywhere...thus the rotation. Just to clarify, for this and future builds, I should install the barrel on the upper, line up the barrel nut properly etc. Then slide the gas block and tube into place. Tighten the block onto the barrel, then try to put the pin in? Assuming i purchased the correct gas tube length for the barrel, are there any other considerations as far as how its placed in? My order of assembly, assuming standard flat top upper: Forward assist Ejection port cover Barrel, (Delta ring pack, if applicable) barrel nut with gas tube aligned and BN torqued to spec Gas tube inserted into upper Gas block aligned and at least one set screw tightened (if you have that kind of GB Make sure the gas block is on correctly. Some low profile blocks have the tube hole open on both ends and they can be installed backwards. Slide gas tube into gas block and confirm that roll pin hole is aligned, install pin Remove from vice block and use barrel clamp for: Muzzle device Handguards, may have to reinstall in vice block It is easy to align the gas tube/block/barrel nut by eye. Although the one thing I do use calipers for is to confirm the gas port on the barrel and the gas port on the block are the correct measurement for placement. Some blocks or barrels are configured to have the spacing for a handguard cap between the gas block and the shoulder (correct term?) on the barrel. I had a block once that was just manufactured wrong and wouldn't line up at all. |
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Posted: 4/19/2015 8:31:16 AM EDT
[#18]
Windham Weaponry is having FREE shipping on ALL orders till the end of the month.
Time to stock up on all spare parts where shipping cost is an issue. Get 1/16 inch roll pins at a hardware store and you can cut them to length if necessary. Always have multiple spares of springs, pins and detents etc.... |
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Posted: 4/19/2015 2:59:19 PM EDT
[#19]
If you'll IM me your address I'll put a couple of 5/64x5/16 and 1/16x1/4 coil spring pins in the mail for you. I have found both sizes used in different gas blocks.
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Posted: 5/6/2015 10:33:13 AM EDT
[#20]
So i smashed it AGAIN!!!
I had a second build going on, I used those kelpex whatever pliers to just compress it in and it worked wonders on the other setup. When I got replacement roll pins for this first build, I knocked out the 1st mess up last night, then tried 4 more times without avail. I get about 1 mm left then it just stops. I tried finishing it with the pliers, I went back to the punch set. Nada. It is mounted on the barrel, tightened down, tried entering the pin from both sides and same thing. Did I mess up the gas block that first time maybe? After I disassembled everything, the hole where the pin goes through doesn't look pretty, but again I tried from both sides and got the same depth. I'd post another pic, but it honestly looks Just like the other pics i posted. So short of buying another gas block and trying that, any thoughts? Can I just leave it like it is? ...................Rabble Rabble Rabble |
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Posted: 5/6/2015 11:02:01 AM EDT
[#21]
This is what I use But instead of trying to tap the end of the roll pins like you'd typically do, pick the largest punch where the roll pin will slide over the pin. The small punch works great for the tiny gas tube roll pins. Slip the roll pin on the punch pin and then put it in the hole & drive it place. No smashed fingers, no needle nose pliers, no alignment issues. If you want that last "perfectly centered" little tap, use a roll pin punch to bump it that last little bit.
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Posted: 5/6/2015 11:19:45 AM EDT
[#22]
I used this set and it worked well.
http://www.squirreldaddy.com/Gas-Block-Tube-Roll-Pin-Punch-Set-078-dia-p/sd20-221.htm |
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Posted: 5/6/2015 11:30:42 AM EDT
[#23]
OP....your screen name is spot on.
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Posted: 5/6/2015 6:52:02 PM EDT
[#24]
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Posted: 5/6/2015 8:46:23 PM EDT
[#25]
It seems like that tool specifically gets things started on the punch? I get it all the way through where the gas tube is, but just not completely inside the block.
let me know if i'm misunderstanding this. Ohh and I gave it another try this afternoon....broke one of my punches....i'm just on a roll this week. |
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Posted: 5/6/2015 9:07:59 PM EDT
[#26]
I'm interested in this topic as well. I just finished a build and had the same problem. Thing is, I'd smashed in enough of the roll pin that it held the gas tube in place. So, I left it that way.
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Posted: 5/7/2015 3:44:27 AM EDT
[#27]
I use a (1/2" dia or 9/16" dia) brass & nylon jeweler's hammer to assemble my receivers. I get roll pins started by tapping them into place using the hammer (brass side) before finishing installing them using the roll pin punch and hammer. Also, lubricate the roll pins before installing them to cut down the metal to metal friction caused by the press fit of the roll pin.
I also will push the 5/64 punch through the gas block or front sight base and gas tube before inserting the roll pin to remove any burrs that may have been left behind after machining the part(s). Lastly, after inserting the gas tube into the gas block or fsb, use another punch to hold everything in alignment while the roll pin is installed. As the pin goes through, it'll push the punch holding everything in alignment out. 
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Posted: 5/7/2015 2:38:29 PM EDT
[#28]
I have an AR how-to book that recommends using the appropriate size drill bit to "hand ream" pin holes before putting the pins in. I always thought to myself, "that's crazy talk. Old fogies."
I recently built a Spike's (I swear, the ONLY mfg I've ever had issues with) upper with a Spike's barrel and factory pinned gas block. Neither the gas tube pin nor the block pin would go in for love or money. I figured, maybe the ancients were on to something. I took drill bits of the appropriate size, ran them through the holes, and amazingly enough, the pins seated no problem. The CRAZY thing is that each drill bit took off some metal, I mean I had a few shavings, and the pins were STILL tight. I think it's a combination of many factors: Roll pins are mostly garbage and vary widely in thickness A good set of roll pin starters and punches is a must A good hard backstop of the right shape is a MUST (otherwise the force doesn't transfer properly) The hole diameters vary quite a bit as well, and surely don't account for the thickness added by phosphate or NiB or whatever For me, once again, the wisdom of the ancients proved most valuable. Darn it.  -Stooxie |
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Posted: 5/7/2015 2:51:45 PM EDT
[#29]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
It seems like that tool specifically gets things started on the punch? I get it all the way through where the gas tube is, but just not completely inside the block. let me know if i'm misunderstanding this. Ohh and I gave it another try this afternoon....broke one of my punches....i'm just on a roll this week. The tool starts the roll pin and leaves around an 1/8" to be driven into the gas block/tube. It doesn't mar the end of the roll pin (which wouldn't let it go completely through the hole) while getting it started. |
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Posted: 5/7/2015 3:21:45 PM EDT
[#30]
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Posted: 5/7/2015 10:14:27 PM EDT
[#31]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Thanks i'll try getting a small punch to get it started tomorrow, then try pulling it out the rest of the way. any idea where to buy more pins though? this is the one I purchased Radical Firearms Low Profile Gas Block w/ Set Screws .750 I can't find anywhere that they sell them where the shipping isn't more than the item... (this might push me over the edge...just buy something that is worth the price in shipping and add a dozen of the damn pins in there too) Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: I've always had good luck squeezing roll pins in with a set of vice grips. I don't generally punch them in unless I have to. I have a set of medium sized vice grips with one jaw taped up so it doesn't scratch whatever its against (receiver, gas block, etc.) I usually try squeezing one end of the roll pin with another, smaller set of pliers to make it easier to start in the hole. Get it lined up and seated with a light tap then squeeze with the vice grips. Ensure your gas tube stays lined up and doesn't roll a little causing the hole for the pin to become misaligned. As far as removing the damaged one, pull it out if you can, or punch from the other side. Thanks i'll try getting a small punch to get it started tomorrow, then try pulling it out the rest of the way. any idea where to buy more pins though? this is the one I purchased Radical Firearms Low Profile Gas Block w/ Set Screws .750 I can't find anywhere that they sell them where the shipping isn't more than the item... (this might push me over the edge...just buy something that is worth the price in shipping and add a dozen of the damn pins in there too) Ace is the place.Should be 1/16 dia x 3/8 long |
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Posted: 5/7/2015 10:17:20 PM EDT
[#32]
Damn I didn't know so many people had issues with them.
I just take the larger end of my punch, and using pliers to hold the pin in the correct location, tap it to get it going. Once it's about half way in I use the punch normally and finish it off. |
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Posted: 5/8/2015 2:19:22 AM EDT
[#33]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Should be 1/16 dia x 3/8 long The diameter of the gas tube roll pin is 5/64". |
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Posted: 5/8/2015 7:39:18 PM EDT
[#34]
Fastenal, for all your pin needs. I can just about bet you there is one withing 20 miles of you right now.
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Posted: 5/8/2015 8:47:09 PM EDT
[#35]
After failures with roll pin punches, I now use a small Vice Grip with tape on the jaws, Kroil on the roll pin. I squeeze it in in small increments. I also tape off the gas block. The last one I did took all of about 5 minutes or less and was perfect.
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Posted: 5/12/2015 4:39:41 PM EDT
[#36]
So on my third concurrent build (i feel like its a disease, once you buy the tools you just have to keep using them...) I got in the gas block today, tube etc.... under 5 minutes and the pin was perfectly in place.
On the one that keeps jacking up, It must be that either the pins I have are the wrong size, or the hole is not clean through... so at least I succesfully got 2/3 with the 3rd inserted good enough. 
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Posted: 5/12/2015 6:25:23 PM EDT
[#37]
5/64" roll pin starter and then a 5/64" roll pin punch I what I've been using.
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Posted: 5/12/2015 7:02:01 PM EDT
[#38]
There are some gas blocks out there that use 1/16th pins instead of the standard 5/64ths - ones with a picatinny rail on top I have seen, maybe others. Sometimes a particular pin or pin hole can have a little bit of a burr and make things difficult, it doesn't take much with pins that small. I also generally put a small amount of grease on pins which will make assembly much easier, along with future disassembly.
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Posted: 5/12/2015 8:13:01 PM EDT
[#39]
So maybe get a different gas block?
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Posted: 5/12/2015 9:26:35 PM EDT
[#40]
yeah i'll probably end up ordering another block. If i can't get a good pin set by the time it arrives it gets swapped.
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Posted: 5/12/2015 9:50:55 PM EDT
[#41]
That one of them cheap gas blocks? My Red Barn one needed the hole drilled out to size.
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Posted: 5/12/2015 10:01:40 PM EDT
[#42]
Brownell's should have everything you need for future projects (pins, holder punches, starter punches, gas block holder, etc.)
FWIW, I always test fit the gas block and mark the alignment of the port first. Then, I slide the gas block off the barrel and install the gas tube on the bench. It's much easier to manipulate and hold in proper alignment when installing the roll pin that way. |
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Posted: 5/12/2015 10:36:05 PM EDT
[#43]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
It seems like that tool specifically gets things started on the punch? I get it all the way through where the gas tube is, but just not completely inside the block. let me know if i'm misunderstanding this. Ohh and I gave it another try this afternoon....broke one of my punches....i'm just on a roll this week. 
Make sure holes are aligned and Sand down the pin and lubricate the snot out of it |
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Posted: 5/13/2015 10:47:42 AM EDT
[#44]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Make sure holes are aligned and Sand down the pin and lubricate the snot out of it Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
It seems like that tool specifically gets things started on the punch? I get it all the way through where the gas tube is, but just not completely inside the block. let me know if i'm misunderstanding this. Ohh and I gave it another try this afternoon....broke one of my punches....i'm just on a roll this week.
Make sure holes are aligned and Sand down the pin and lubricate the snot out of it Thats what I did for years. Then I made a prototype roll pin starter and tried it out and asked myself why I didn't do that years ago. As long as the pin and hole are in spec. |
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Posted: 5/13/2015 6:03:19 PM EDT
[#45]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Thats what I did for years. Then I made a prototype roll pin starter and tried it out and asked myself why I didn't do that years ago. As long as the pin and hole are in spec. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
It seems like that tool specifically gets things started on the punch? I get it all the way through where the gas tube is, but just not completely inside the block. let me know if i'm misunderstanding this. Ohh and I gave it another try this afternoon....broke one of my punches....i'm just on a roll this week.
Make sure holes are aligned and Sand down the pin and lubricate the snot out of it Thats what I did for years. Then I made a prototype roll pin starter and tried it out and asked myself why I didn't do that years ago. As long as the pin and hole are in spec. If I wasn't a broke mofo I'd definitely pick one of those up. I've had my fair share of mushroomed out roll pins that's for damn sure. |
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Posted: 5/13/2015 6:09:47 PM EDT
[#46]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
If I wasn't a broke mofo I'd definitely pick one of those up. I've had my fair share of mushroomed out roll pins that's for damn sure. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
It seems like that tool specifically gets things started on the punch? I get it all the way through where the gas tube is, but just not completely inside the block. let me know if i'm misunderstanding this. Ohh and I gave it another try this afternoon....broke one of my punches....i'm just on a roll this week.
Make sure holes are aligned and Sand down the pin and lubricate the snot out of it Thats what I did for years. Then I made a prototype roll pin starter and tried it out and asked myself why I didn't do that years ago. As long as the pin and hole are in spec. If I wasn't a broke mofo I'd definitely pick one of those up. I've had my fair share of mushroomed out roll pins that's for damn sure. Just need a #41 (for a 3/32" pin) and #45 drill (for a 5/64 pin) drill and some 1/4 round stock. Plus a few tools if you make your own. I sell them for $5 on my site but am out of stock, need to get on it and make some. |
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