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Posted: 4/25/2013 12:16:16 PM EST
I live in Connecticut and am getting hassled by companies that do hard coat anodizing saying I must go through an FFL to get my 80% lower treated. FFl's won't touch it here even if I have it anodized before the finish machining. I guess I can machine it, media blast it and cerecoat or durocoat it, but does anyone have alternatives?
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Posted: 4/25/2013 12:59:36 PM EST
[Last Edit: 4/25/2013 1:01:07 PM EST by Sc0tt]
i anodize using the vaderspade bucket 'o acid/battery charger method. it works GREAT. i do it at my shop though----the wife would shit if i did it at home

http://www.tacticalmachining.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=10&t=11

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Posted: 4/25/2013 1:09:52 PM EST
As I understand it, there are two processes, cold anodizing (hard anodizing, stage III) and room temp anodizing (stage II) which I can do myself but it doesn't harden the outer layer of the lower receiver.I guess I can cerocoat or durocoat to accomplish the same results. Maybe i will have it media blasted and see if that company will recommend a hard anodizer.
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Posted: 4/25/2013 4:00:15 PM EST
US Anodizing is often recommended
The name Victor is usally attached.
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Posted: 4/26/2013 12:21:23 AM EST
They are probably refusing to accept it because they have no way of entering it in their log books of firearms they have taken into their possession.
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Posted: 4/26/2013 1:39:16 AM EST
Have you finished it or is it still 80%? If it's still 80% then you should just be able to ship it to a company out of state.
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Posted: 4/26/2013 4:05:22 AM EST
Originally Posted By hail2thevict0r:
Have you finished it or is it still 80%? If it's still 80% then you should just be able to ship it to a company out of state.


No, it's still in the 80% state. If I were able to get it anodized before milling, are there any suggestions for treating the fire control pocket after it is milled?

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Posted: 4/26/2013 5:11:59 AM EST
[Last Edit: 4/26/2013 5:17:35 AM EST by iNeXile556]

Originally Posted By AR15BUFF:
I live in Connecticut and am getting hassled by companies that do hard coat anodizing saying I must go through an FFL to get my 80% lower treated. FFl's won't touch it here even if I have it anodized before the finish machining. I guess I can machine it, media blast it and cerecoat or durocoat it, but does anyone have alternatives?

Because the process of anodizing the lower is considered, by the ATF, as a part of the manufacturing process the anodizing company must have a FFL to do it. That is why your local companies are refusing to do it. They're not hassling you, they're just not willing to commit a felony for you. Do you blame them?

You can ship it directly to a FFL that specializes in anodizing, and they can ship it directly back to you when they are done. US Anodizing, as previously suggested, is the company of choice by many, and for good reason.
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Posted: 4/26/2013 6:20:14 AM EST
Originally Posted By iNeXile556:

Originally Posted By AR15BUFF:
I live in Connecticut and am getting hassled by companies that do hard coat anodizing saying I must go through an FFL to get my 80% lower treated. FFl's won't touch it here even if I have it anodized before the finish machining. I guess I can machine it, media blast it and cerecoat or durocoat it, but does anyone have alternatives?

Because the process of anodizing the lower is considered, by the ATF, as a part of the manufacturing process the anodizing company must have a FFL to do it. That is why your local companies are refusing to do it. They're not hassling you, they're just not willing to commit a felony for you. Do you blame them?

You can ship it directly to a FFL that specializes in anodizing, and they can ship it directly back to you when they are done. US Anodizing, as previously suggested, is the company of choice by many, and for good reason.

Thank you for your post, and no I do not blame the companies I talked to for not accepting the work. I blame our politicians in CT. for that. I have contacted U.S. Anodizing by email and am awaiting their reply.

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Posted: 4/26/2013 6:32:11 AM EST
[Last Edit: 4/26/2013 6:32:29 AM EST by Mach]
How much of a difference does anodizing make in durability compared to duracoat?

If you send it to US Anodzing it gets logged in their book and now there is a record of it right?
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Posted: 4/26/2013 8:24:07 AM EST
Ifs it's a 80% lower, send it to John Thomas .
He does a lot of custom work for the retro crown on arfcom.
He has a great rep, great service and communication .
He has a hand in all my projects.
Jntmjt@yahoo.com, he has a add in the gunsmithig section
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Posted: 4/26/2013 8:26:48 AM EST
Originally Posted By Mach:
How much of a difference does anodizing make in durability compared to duracoat?

If you send it to US Anodzing it gets logged in their book and now there is a record of it right?


Anodizing is tough stuff, much more durable than duracoat, which is essentially
Paint.

I don't believe us Anadizing would log anything in as a 80%
Lower is technically not a firearm. But I could be wrong
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Posted: 4/26/2013 12:52:35 PM EST

Originally Posted By AR15BUFF:
Originally Posted By iNeXile556:

Originally Posted By AR15BUFF:
I live in Connecticut and am getting hassled by companies that do hard coat anodizing saying I must go through an FFL to get my 80% lower treated. FFl's won't touch it here even if I have it anodized before the finish machining. I guess I can machine it, media blast it and cerecoat or durocoat it, but does anyone have alternatives?

Because the process of anodizing the lower is considered, by the ATF, as a part of the manufacturing process the anodizing company must have a FFL to do it. That is why your local companies are refusing to do it. They're not hassling you, they're just not willing to commit a felony for you. Do you blame them?

You can ship it directly to a FFL that specializes in anodizing, and they can ship it directly back to you when they are done. US Anodizing, as previously suggested, is the company of choice by many, and for good reason.

Thank you for your post, and no I do not blame the companies I talked to for not accepting the work. I blame our politicians in CT. for that. I have contacted U.S. Anodizing by email and am awaiting their reply.

Actually what I posted is a Federal thing. If your planning on anodizing it before you mill it there is no federal reason why any anodizing company can't do it. Could be a CT thing, I don't know. Either way I would wait until it is finished before hard coating it to get the hardness created by the process. If you go the other way, Birchwood Casey Aluminum Black will finish the the raw surfaces.

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Posted: 4/26/2013 7:11:45 PM EST
I used victor to ano 11 receivers when we did a group build. They were finished machined and he had to send them back through an ffl. The guy I had them sent back to never opened the box to log them. He just gave them back to me.
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Posted: 4/26/2013 8:49:04 PM EST
Originally Posted By iNeXile556:

Originally Posted By AR15BUFF:
I live in Connecticut and am getting hassled by companies that do hard coat anodizing saying I must go through an FFL to get my 80% lower treated. FFl's won't touch it here even if I have it anodized before the finish machining. I guess I can machine it, media blast it and cerecoat or durocoat it, but does anyone have alternatives?

Because the process of anodizing the lower is considered, by the ATF, as a part of the manufacturing process the anodizing company must have a FFL to do it. That is why your local companies are refusing to do it. They're not hassling you, they're just not willing to commit a felony for you. Do you blame them?

You can ship it directly to a FFL that specializes in anodizing, and they can ship it directly back to you when they are done. US Anodizing, as previously suggested, is the company of choice by many, and for good reason.

Will US Anodizing ship to and from CT? I legally own the AR15 lower, but I don't want to run into any bullshit if I have to ship it out of state.
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Posted: 4/27/2013 12:40:40 AM EST
Does anodizing for hardness influence the fire control pin holes or are we just talking about dings and dents not function.

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Posted: 4/27/2013 8:59:26 AM EST
Originally Posted By AR15BUFF:
Originally Posted By iNeXile556:

Originally Posted By AR15BUFF:
I live in Connecticut and am getting hassled by companies that do hard coat anodizing saying I must go through an FFL to get my 80% lower treated. FFl's won't touch it here even if I have it anodized before the finish machining. I guess I can machine it, media blast it and cerecoat or durocoat it, but does anyone have alternatives?

Because the process of anodizing the lower is considered, by the ATF, as a part of the manufacturing process the anodizing company must have a FFL to do it. That is why your local companies are refusing to do it. They're not hassling you, they're just not willing to commit a felony for you. Do you blame them?

You can ship it directly to a FFL that specializes in anodizing, and they can ship it directly back to you when they are done. US Anodizing, as previously suggested, is the company of choice by many, and for good reason.

Thank you for your post, and no I do not blame the companies I talked to for not accepting the work. I blame our politicians in CT. for that. I have contacted U.S. Anodizing by email and am awaiting their reply.

Let us know what response you get. If they are GTG I will probably go with them for my lower. Otherwise, I may just have to use black duracoat.
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Posted: 4/27/2013 9:26:42 AM EST
Originally Posted By WolfTrack:
US Anodizing is often recommended
The name Victor is usally attached.


This. I agree that the local folks are shying away because they are not licensed manufacturers, and rightly so. Nobody wants to get into a hassle with ATF about this sort of thing. On the other hand, US Anodizing is a 07/02 SOT and can do your finishing and return the lower directly to you. They just refinished my SBR lower for me - absolutely perfect, by the way. If you email them from their web site, Victor will be the one replying to you. It cost me $100 plus shipping back and forth, and it took about 2 weeks.
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Posted: 4/27/2013 9:30:23 AM EST
Originally Posted By HalfTheBattle:
Originally Posted By iNeXile556:

Originally Posted By AR15BUFF:
I live in Connecticut and am getting hassled by companies that do hard coat anodizing saying I must go through an FFL to get my 80% lower treated. FFl's won't touch it here even if I have it anodized before the finish machining. I guess I can machine it, media blast it and cerecoat or durocoat it, but does anyone have alternatives?

Because the process of anodizing the lower is considered, by the ATF, as a part of the manufacturing process the anodizing company must have a FFL to do it. That is why your local companies are refusing to do it. They're not hassling you, they're just not willing to commit a felony for you. Do you blame them?

You can ship it directly to a FFL that specializes in anodizing, and they can ship it directly back to you when they are done. US Anodizing, as previously suggested, is the company of choice by many, and for good reason.

Will US Anodizing ship to and from CT? I legally own the AR15 lower, but I don't want to run into any bullshit if I have to ship it out of state.


I am waiting to find out. I emailed Victor on Friday afternoon.

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Posted: 4/27/2013 9:34:35 AM EST
Originally Posted By Mach:
Does anodizing for hardness influence the fire control pin holes or are we just talking about dings and dents not function.



Anodizing is like a paint job on a car. It will not cover imperfections in the aluminum surface. There will be a build up on the part from 0.0004 or so. Not sure of the high end of the build up, but someone smarter than I am can probably tell you that.

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Posted: 4/27/2013 9:36:54 AM EST
Originally Posted By HalfTheBattle:
Originally Posted By AR15BUFF:
Originally Posted By iNeXile556:

Originally Posted By AR15BUFF:
I live in Connecticut and am getting hassled by companies that do hard coat anodizing saying I must go through an FFL to get my 80% lower treated. FFl's won't touch it here even if I have it anodized before the finish machining. I guess I can machine it, media blast it and cerecoat or durocoat it, but does anyone have alternatives?

Because the process of anodizing the lower is considered, by the ATF, as a part of the manufacturing process the anodizing company must have a FFL to do it. That is why your local companies are refusing to do it. They're not hassling you, they're just not willing to commit a felony for you. Do you blame them?

You can ship it directly to a FFL that specializes in anodizing, and they can ship it directly back to you when they are done. US Anodizing, as previously suggested, is the company of choice by many, and for good reason.

Thank you for your post, and no I do not blame the companies I talked to for not accepting the work. I blame our politicians in CT. for that. I have contacted U.S. Anodizing by email and am awaiting their reply.

Let us know what response you get. If they are GTG I will probably go with them for my lower. Otherwise, I may just have to use black duracoat.


Will do.

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Posted: 4/27/2013 10:09:09 AM EST
Originally Posted By GHPorter:
Originally Posted By WolfTrack:
US Anodizing is often recommended
The name Victor is usally attached.


This. I agree that the local folks are shying away because they are not licensed manufacturers, and rightly so. Nobody wants to get into a hassle with ATF about this sort of thing. On the other hand, US Anodizing is a 07/02 SOT and can do your finishing and return the lower directly to you. They just refinished my SBR lower for me - absolutely perfect, by the way. If you email them from their web site, Victor will be the one replying to you. It cost me $100 plus shipping back and forth, and it took about 2 weeks.


So, they don't need a serial number or other identifying markings to take possession and return to you? So they can coat and ship back a milled and completed receiver with no serial number on it? If this is the case, it would certainly be worth the $100 to me to have the whole things anodized inside and out after completing an 80% lower than have to anodize before and then figure out what to do the interior with.
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Posted: 4/27/2013 11:16:28 AM EST
The one thing that confused me was the pricing. Is it $100 if your lower is already anodized and needs to be stripped, and $50 if your lower is already bare? $50 sounds like a great price, although if it's $100 then I may as well buy the chemicals and do it myself. (My lower is bare alluminum)
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Posted: 4/27/2013 12:25:16 PM EST
Originally Posted By danthemanx07:
Originally Posted By GHPorter:
Originally Posted By WolfTrack:
US Anodizing is often recommended
The name Victor is usally attached.


This. I agree that the local folks are shying away because they are not licensed manufacturers, and rightly so. Nobody wants to get into a hassle with ATF about this sort of thing. On the other hand, US Anodizing is a 07/02 SOT and can do your finishing and return the lower directly to you. They just refinished my SBR lower for me - absolutely perfect, by the way. If you email them from their web site, Victor will be the one replying to you. It cost me $100 plus shipping back and forth, and it took about 2 weeks.


So, they don't need a serial number or other identifying markings to take possession and return to you? So they can coat and ship back a milled and completed receiver with no serial number on it? If this is the case, it would certainly be worth the $100 to me to have the whole things anodized inside and out after completing an 80% lower than have to anodize before and then figure out what to do the interior with.

I do not have authoritative evidence that this is true. But since US Anodizing is a licensed manufacturer, THEY would be the ones to ask this question. My SBR lower already had serial number, engraving, etc. on it, so I didn't even ask about home-machined lower issues,
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Posted: 4/27/2013 12:28:07 PM EST
Originally Posted By GHPorter:
Originally Posted By danthemanx07:
Originally Posted By GHPorter:
Originally Posted By WolfTrack:
US Anodizing is often recommended
The name Victor is usally attached.


This. I agree that the local folks are shying away because they are not licensed manufacturers, and rightly so. Nobody wants to get into a hassle with ATF about this sort of thing. On the other hand, US Anodizing is a 07/02 SOT and can do your finishing and return the lower directly to you. They just refinished my SBR lower for me - absolutely perfect, by the way. If you email them from their web site, Victor will be the one replying to you. It cost me $100 plus shipping back and forth, and it took about 2 weeks.


So, they don't need a serial number or other identifying markings to take possession and return to you? So they can coat and ship back a milled and completed receiver with no serial number on it? If this is the case, it would certainly be worth the $100 to me to have the whole things anodized inside and out after completing an 80% lower than have to anodize before and then figure out what to do the interior with.

I do not have authoritative evidence that this is true. But since US Anodizing is a licensed manufacturer, THEY would be the ones to ask this question. My SBR lower already had serial number, engraving, etc. on it, so I didn't even ask about home-machined lower issues,


Certainly plan on asking them when the time comes. Just thought you might have had to address this issue since the thread targeted 80% lowers.
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Posted: 4/27/2013 12:55:51 PM EST
Originally Posted By danthemanx07:
Certainly plan on asking them when the time comes. Just thought you might have had to address this issue since the thread targeted 80% lowers.
Nope, I was just chiming in on how good a job Victor and his crew did for me, and their qualifications for the OP's project.

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Posted: 4/27/2013 12:57:01 PM EST
Originally Posted By GHPorter:
Originally Posted By danthemanx07:
Certainly plan on asking them when the time comes. Just thought you might have had to address this issue since the thread targeted 80% lowers.
Nope, I was just chiming in on how good a job Victor and his crew did for me, and their qualifications for the OP's project.



Thanks for the recommendation. Will look into them.
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Posted: 4/27/2013 3:07:45 PM EST
Originally Posted By Trimdad:
Originally Posted By Mach:
How much of a difference does anodizing make in durability compared to duracoat?

If you send it to US Anodzing it gets logged in their book and now there is a record of it right?


Anodizing is tough stuff, much more durable than duracoat, which is essentially
Paint.

I don't believe us Anadizing would log anything in as a 80%
Lower is technically not a firearm. But I could be wrong


This is correct. An 80% lower is just a fancy paper weight.
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Posted: 4/29/2013 7:26:11 AM EST
I just received an email from Victor at U.S. Anodizing. He said I have to have letters or numbers stamped or engraved somewhere on the lower receiver. If it's not marked they cannot identify it while the receiver is in their shop. It is no problem sending them a completed 80% lower. So, I am GTG.
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Posted: 4/29/2013 8:53:35 AM EST
That is a deal killer for me.
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Posted: 4/29/2013 8:54:42 AM EST
Originally Posted By Mach:
That is a deal killer for me.


Agreed.
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Posted: 4/29/2013 11:39:10 AM EST
Not necessarily if you place the identification in the proper location.
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Posted: 4/29/2013 2:26:59 PM EST
Originally Posted By danthemanx07:
Originally Posted By Mach:
That is a deal killer for me.


Agreed.


Why?
"--you can't conquer a free man; the most you can do is kill him."
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Posted: 4/29/2013 2:47:20 PM EST
Originally Posted By AR15BUFF:
Not necessarily if you place the identification in the proper location.


Please explain.
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Posted: 4/30/2013 4:20:32 PM EST
Originally Posted By AR15BUFF:
I just received an email from Victor at U.S. Anodizing. He said I have to have letters or numbers stamped or engraved somewhere on the lower receiver. If it's not marked they cannot identify it while the receiver is in their shop. It is no problem sending them a completed 80% lower. So, I am GTG.


Good to know! I will probably go with them. I was going to engrave my serial number and other stuff before I anodize my lower anyway.
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Posted: 4/30/2013 6:03:13 PM EST
Although as it is perfectly legal to make a firearm for your own use, using a licensed business to perform any part of the manufacturing (which anodizing is) requires the licensee to make it accordingly as per Title 18, United States Code (U.S.C.) Section 923(i) and 27 Code of Federal Regulations ( ), Section 478.92.

The licensed business may get a variance from the ATF to adopt the existing manufactures markings in lieu of adding his own. This is very common, such as LMT machining lowers for another company (lets just say PSA). The lower is marked with the PSA marking instead of the true manufacturer, LMT. LMT now sends the lowers to the anodizing shop who also must have a variance or add his manufacturing information to the lower. As you can see this could be a very crowded billboard if everyone had to add their mark.
Now if you, the unlicensed maker does not engrave any ID on the lower what is the licensed anodizing shop going to get a variance on?

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