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Posted: 6/26/2017 11:49:51 PM EDT
[#1]
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I received mine and fired it up. The reti le isnt going to play well with my astigmatism. 
Too bad. I really wanted to like it. Put it on the EE. I don't want to wait in line for one and then end up having to return it. |
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Posted: 6/26/2017 11:53:53 PM EDT
[#2]
what is the issue with an astigmatism ? I don't want to wait in line and then end up sending it back if it is not friendly to an astigmatism
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Posted: 6/26/2017 11:55:59 PM EDT
[#3]
What is the issue with an astigmatism ? I don't want to wait in line and then up sending it back because it is not astigmatism friendly
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Posted: 6/27/2017 12:05:53 AM EDT
[#4]
Im not so sure all astigmatism is the same or of varying degrees. Why i say that is some people with astigmatism can use one sight, while another finds it unusable. The reticle blooms. I would have rathered looked at one first, before purchasing. But for me the reticle is near unusable. I had the same issue with the eotech exps models as well. Corrective lenses seems to help. But i can still see wothout glasses. But i cant use that optic without them.
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Posted: 6/27/2017 12:11:02 AM EDT
[#5]
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I wonder if any of the blooming issues are caused by using polycarbonate windows or any of the coatings. As to the debris, no it doesn't affect function but these should be assembled in clean rooms to avoid contamination. Mine keeps getting more specks on the inside of the windows. That can only mean there is more debris sealed inside and moving around. Again doesn't affect function but not great quality control either. I also do worry about the durability of using polycarbonate with scratch resistant coatings. Will they eventually degrade and look less transparent. |
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Posted: 6/27/2017 7:28:43 AM EDT
[#6]
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The only advantage polycarbonate has over glass is the impact/ breaking. Quote HistoryQuoted:
The only advantage polycarbonate has over glass is the impact/ breaking. Quoted:
As with any lower cost optic, it's always the lens that makes it low cost. Certainly for the span these have to cover, suitably impact-resistant glass could be found, no? Had I not already decided, plastic lenses probably would've tipped me over. The decreased scratch/abrasion resistance of plastic lenses is exacerbated by such materials' propensity to pick up a charge and grab dust out of the air like a magnet. That dust isn't "soft," as many people mistakenly believe. It's actually often brutally abrasive. You go to wipe it off, and you get micro-scratches. Do that enough times, and... Quoted:
The reticle is crisp and clear when you have it in the "perfect" brightness setting. However, as some people have mentioned, if you transition to lower light, even outside like aiming somewhere in the shade or a darker background, the setting now becomes too high and you have ghost (and blooming depending on the brightness setting). How could a product designed for the purpose this one was have gone through as much testing as this one allegedly did and still hit the supply chain with such a glaring operational misfeature? Quoted:
To those that say there is debris/dust in them. Yes, mine has just a tad and even what appears to be a quarter of someone's eyelash (not joking). 
I was kind of disregarding the "dust & debris" reports, before. No offence to the earlier posters, but, it just seemed so unlikely to be there at all, much less to the degree they were stating. But, this is now the third? fourth? such report. This is simply inexcusable in a product of this nature. What the actual frack, Vortex?!?! Quoted:
What is the issue that you are experiencing with having astigmatisms ? I too have issues and have ALWAYs had problems finding something I could use successfully. It's worse with a Sig Romeo 4 RDS, and much worse with a Trijicon MRO. But, others with astig have had different experiences with those same optics, so... Quoted:
I don't want to wait in line for one and then end up having to return it. Good luck. |
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Posted: 6/27/2017 8:26:40 AM EDT
[#7]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
And, of course... Yes: The cost. Certainly for the span these have to cover, suitably impact-resistant glass could be found, no? Had I not already decided, plastic lenses probably would've tipped me over. The decreased scratch/abrasion resistance of plastic lenses is exacerbated by such materials' propensity to pick up a charge and grab dust out of the air like a magnet. That dust isn't "soft," as many people mistakenly believe. It's actually often brutally abrasive. You go to wipe it off, and you get micro-scratches. Do that enough times, and... <Maxwell Smart>Just as I suspected!</Maxwell Smart> How could a product designed for the purpose this one was have gone through as much testing as this one allegedly did and still hit the supply chain with such a glaring operational misfeature? Yikes! https://www.LinxNet.com/misc/smilies/yikes.gif I was kind of disregarding the "dust & debris" reports, before. No offence to the earlier posters, but, it just seemed so unlikely to be there at all, much less to the degree they were stating. But, this is now the third? fourth? such report. This is simply inexcusable in a product of this nature. What the actual frack, Vortex?!?! One imagines it's the typical "starring" of the reticle. I had it a bit with my EOTech. It's recent, for me. I received the 512.A65 in 2014 and did not notice it. Two years later: There it was. Confirmed with my last eye exam I now have mild astigmatism. (Not enough to warrant corrective surgery, according to the doc. "Yeah, but, you're not tying to use red dot optics, doc," I replied.) It's worse with a Sig Romeo 4 RDS, and much worse with a Trijicon MRO. But, others with astig have had different experiences with those same optics, so... Unfortunately, actually looking through one will be the only way to know :( Good luck. The price point is a hard argument to buy as well. Eotech uses a glass front. They use a laminated back....so not exactly sure what that is but you can get an exsp2 new for under $500. This isn't a precision ground lens, its a flat window. So how much could glass increase the price? I do worry about the long term durability of the Windows. The housing is great. I actually love the shape. The rated battery life is very good for a holo site. The mount is solid. No user data yet omniscience's holding zero over time and thermal drift. I wish they had gone with side buttons. But my real complaints are the polycarbonate windows, debris inside, and the unforgiving transitioning to different light without blooming and multiple reticles (not talking bright daylight to dark room either) I'm not sure what I want to do. I almost went back to an Eotech before the vortex. Now sure whether I want to keep the vortex and hope for the best or go back to an Eotech where at least I know what the issues are and according to their documentation some of those have been minimized (still doesn't sit well with me to give Eotech my business) |
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Posted: 6/27/2017 8:35:01 AM EDT
[#8]
As far as the debris go, that isn't something that should be happening. I know that we inspect these 100% and they don't go out that way, so if it is happening after the fact, we need to investigate why and get it corrected. Of course, if people have debris and aren't happy about it please contact our customer care so we can get it taken care of.
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Posted: 6/27/2017 9:07:35 AM EDT
[#9]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
As far as the debris go, that isn't something that should be happening. I know that we inspect these 100% and they don't go out that way, so if it is happening after the fact, we need to investigate why and get it corrected. Of course, if people have debris and aren't happy about it please contact our customer care so we can get it taken care of. |
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Posted: 6/27/2017 9:20:53 AM EDT
[#10]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
As far as the debris go, that isn't something that should be happening. I know that we inspect these 100% and they don't go out that way, so if it is happening after the fact, we need to investigate why and get it corrected. Of course, if people have debris and aren't happy about it please contact our customer care so we can get it taken care of. |
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Posted: 6/27/2017 9:44:46 AM EDT
[#11]
I can help clear up how a holographic sight works. The sight works by recording an image in a special material. The image is recorded using a reference and object beam. By definition of holography, the object beam can be reconstructed by just the reference beam.
There are no prisms or lenses. Only a hologram with a fringe pattern recorded into it. The fringe pattern is simply the interference between the object beam and reference beam. In other words, if I dropped one rock on each side of a pond, the waves would interfere in the middle of the pond. If I recorded the interference, I could drop one rock and create the waves of the other rock. Holography is pretty cool! The speckle from laser light, e[i][j]Theta, is caused by the aperture of your eye. You will notice an increase in speckle as your pupil gets smaller. This is true for any laser light. |
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Posted: 6/27/2017 9:56:17 AM EDT
[#12]
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I did contact support and Vortex swapped me for a new one 2 times, paying for overnight shipping both ways each time. Support has been way above and beyond. But the debris was there on all three. I think part of the problem is that they may not see it on the lens initially if its in the optic cavity. It may be attracted to the lenses over time due to static. That's what I am seeing anyway. Can send me your contact info via PM so I can look into this further with customer care? Thanks. |
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Posted: 6/27/2017 2:39:06 PM EDT
[#13]
This isn't really news, but Vortex may have the best customer service in the industry. They sent me an RMA tag for overnight return shipping, which wasn't necessary and pricey. However, it communicates to me that they take issue resolution very seriously.
Another poster mentioned perhaps the polycarbonate lenses and or coatings are a contributing factor to the ghost/multiple reticle issue. I had a similar thought but would need an SME to verify. There seems to be other concerns as to the polycarbonate lens in terms of how long and to what extent they will stay scratch resistant. I would be interested in glass option where this concern is no longer a concern. Right now my main issue is simply the light sensitivity in which the optic produces multiple reticles. Aesthetically its just simply annoying. Hopefully they can find a solution to this issue. |
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Posted: 6/27/2017 9:52:44 PM EDT
[#14]
I really wanted this one to be a grand slam, but based on what im reading, ill be keeping my T2 and seeing how the GEN 2 of these pan out in a year or so like I stated a few pages back.
Debris inside, a reticle that you have to constantly change the brightness on transitioning to different targets in the same environment, and a lens made of something a dude that works in the plastics industry says you shouldnt expose to too much sunlight............yea no thanks for now |
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Posted: 6/27/2017 10:34:49 PM EDT
[#15]
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Posted: 6/27/2017 10:50:43 PM EDT
[#16]
Eotechs that blue / tinted?
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Posted: 6/27/2017 10:53:19 PM EDT
[#17]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Eotechs that blue / tinted? |
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Posted: 6/27/2017 11:03:36 PM EDT
[#18]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Eotechs that blue / tinted? |
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Posted: 6/27/2017 11:30:17 PM EDT
[#19]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Eotechs that blue / tinted? |
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Posted: 6/28/2017 2:20:37 PM EDT
[#20]
Finally got to hit the range today. I have to say I love Eotech's but with the buy back, It was hard to resist sending them back. So I did and it left me missing the speed of the reticle. I just shoot that reticle much faster than a red dot... So I waited to find a replacement and was following this thread anxiously. My local dealer got a few in last week and he called to say mine was in. They had 2 or 3 left as of the other day. If I had the cash I would pick up some more after today. Anyway. Its a little bigger than I expected but its not HUUUGE but does feel like you could beat somebody with it.
Setup. Super easy. Mounting. Love the mount. Glass/Poly. Mine was crystal clear outdoors. It does appear indoor or when looking through the camera lens to have a bluish tint but I can tell you outside it looks pretty damn clear to me, and when looking through it indoors ie CQB I did not notice it. I also smacked it around on a phone book to see if I could get something to flake around. Nothing on mine. Reticle. I love it. Tried it out on two guns and absolutely love it. Still have to figure out what the perfect zero is. But with a rough zero. I could put the triangle on the chest and get good hits on steel, and the dot at 100. Overall I'm not an operator, I don't have a ton of money to blow, and I know should it die or fail, Unlike Eotech Vortex will fix it or replace it for me and I'm not out 500.00 Im happy as a pig playing in $hit. edit. Had a couple of PM's about where I got it shop is 
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Posted: 6/28/2017 3:18:05 PM EDT
[#21]
I had three on order which arrived today. I will echo what others have said, there is a slight blue tint to the optic when indoors but outdoors it's fine. I can however absolutely confirm massive reticle bloom which I don't recall having with my XPS2-0. I turned it on indoors in a moderately lit environment. Set the illumination for the room (not too bright, not too dim). Walked outside into the bright Texas sunshine and the reticle was completely washed out and gone. Turned up the illumination so it worked outside (not too bright / dim) then walked back inside to the room. MASSIVE bloom with multiple reticles in the darker room. Could I still see through it? Sure. Once I reduced illumination, it was fine again.
For me the decision tree on keeping them is pretty simple. Pros of Eotech - no reticle bloom and reticle illumination that seems to work across multiple light environments, 2 oz lighter, glass vs plastic (not sure on this one) Cons of Eotech - reticle fade / failure (happened with several sights), terrible battery life, potential for zero shift Pros of Vortex - better quality sight (my impression), better customer service, hopefully better long term accuracy (no zero shift) Cons of Vortex - 2 oz heavier (wont notice it), reticle bloom requiring more adjustment As an amateur, I'll take having to tweak illumination level occasionally over worrying if the reticle still works or if I need to re-zero after the sight sits unused for several months. I'm sure Vortex is looking at this (and any need for increased scratch resistance). Maybe in Gen 2. Maybe they'll have a trade-up program too based on serial number or something. P.S. -- It works fine with the Eotech 3x magnifier too. |
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Posted: 6/28/2017 3:22:15 PM EDT
[#22]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Finally got to hit the range today. I have to say I love Eotech's but with the buy back, It was hard to resist sending them back. So I did and it left me missing the speed of the reticle. I just shoot that reticle much faster than a red dot... So I waited to find a replacement and was following this thread anxiously. My local dealer got a few in last week and he called to say mine was in. They had 2 or 3 left as of the other day. If I had the cash I would pick up some more after today. Anyway. Its a little bigger than I expected but its not HUUUGE but does feel like you could beat somebody with it. Setup. Super easy. Mounting. Love the mount. Glass/Poly. Mine was crystal clear outdoors. It does appear indoor or when looking through the camera lens to have a bluish tint but I can tell you outside it looks pretty damn clear to me, and when looking through it indoors ie CQB I did not notice it. I also smacked it around on a phone book to see if I could get something to flake around. Nothing on mine. Reticle. I love it. Tried it out on two guns and absolutely love it. Still have to figure out what the perfect zero is. But with a rough zero. I could put the triangle on the chest and get good hits on steel, and the dot at 100. Overall I'm not an operator, I don't have a ton of money to blow, and I know should it die or fail, Unlike Eotech Vortex will fix it or replace it for me and I'm not out 500.00 Im happy as a pig playing in $hit. edit. Had a couple of PM's about where I got it shop is http://i190.photobucket.com/albums/z302/rescueswimmer1/IMG_20170628_130200_zpsx1sf4a2f.jpg  And if you have a video of you smacking it with a phonebook, that would be amusing!
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Posted: 6/28/2017 4:21:50 PM EDT
[#23]
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That right there is what I like about Vortex. If there is an issue, they take care of it. That's why I went out on a limb and preordered this product. They're warranty and service is so good, it forced others to do the same. (Bushnell, for example, and now Primary Arms on some of their optics.) This is typical if companies nowadays. Design something. Find out deep deep in development it's got serious issues. Sell it anyway and act shocked when the very first people get it and instantly see it. Maintain ignorance and quietly come out with a second gen down the road. When will people learn? Don't buy first gen shit. Let the company fix it instead of using buyers as beta testers. |
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Posted: 6/28/2017 7:05:00 PM EDT
[#24]
I placed my order in January, called Vortex and was told another 3-5 months wait. Not gonna lie, was a little disappointed. Especially since people are going retail direct and getting them. Is what it is.
Hopefully it's worth the wait. |
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Posted: 6/29/2017 7:42:29 AM EDT
[#25]
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I placed my order in January, called Vortex and was told another 3-5 months wait. Not gonna lie, was a little disappointed. Especially since people are going retail direct and getting them. Is what it is. Hopefully it's worth the wait. |
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Posted: 6/29/2017 9:06:52 AM EDT
[#26]
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I'd rather have a product with a limited warranty that I probably won't need than a lifetime warranty that I know I will. This is typical if companies nowadays. Design something. Find out deep deep in development it's got serious issues. Sell it anyway and act shocked when the very first people get it and instantly see it. Maintain ignorance and quietly come out with a second gen down the road. When will people learn? Don't buy first gen shit. Let the company fix it instead of using buyers as beta testers. Today, my MRO sits on my Tavor and is the best red dot sight I've ever owned. I don't see the blue tint, and I don't see the distortion. What I do see is an exceptionally wide field of view and a sight that can get on target more quickly than anything I've shot outside of an Eotech. I'll judge this sight when I get my hands on it, but I've learned that some people wil find the tiniest things wrong with anything. Some, I'm convinced, love to stir up shit among early adopters. If this thing turns out to be a turd, I'll return it and get another MRO. Simple as that. I don't know what the big damned deal is. If you can't afford it, do what you are doing, and don't play the game, or wait until you think it is safe to play. Patience is a virtue. As for me, I don't mind a little risk. The reward might just be great, as in the case of my MRO. I'll also state again, I've never had an issue with a Vortex sight. Even my two cheapest, the original Sparc, are still running like new, even after abuse. Come on, Vortex, please ship a shit load of these to Optics Planet. I want to get this thing mounted up and put some rounds down range! |
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Posted: 6/29/2017 9:18:17 AM EDT
[#27]
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http://i134.photobucket.com/albums/q84/junior200414/Vortex%20UH-1/D674986A-9501-41C8-8394-C728E18F3207.jpg http://i134.photobucket.com/albums/q84/junior200414/Vortex%20UH-1/18CAF812-DFF1-415C-94BA-AA035F77D5A8.jpg http://i134.photobucket.com/albums/q84/junior200414/Vortex%20UH-1/3992A378-08B0-4067-BEA3-CDA902368E83.jpg http://i134.photobucket.com/albums/q84/junior200414/Vortex%20UH-1/99F2AABC-622C-4866-98C0-73717D5B4AD3.jpg  My H-1 in a Scalarworks mount is dead sexy although the small tube is a little annoying...
That's right, this is arfcom; I should buy one of these and just build another rifle for the optic that doesn't get used on my SBR... That solves everything!!!
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Posted: 6/29/2017 11:26:22 AM EDT
[#28]
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When I bought the Trijicon MRO when they first came out, lots of people were pointing out percieved problems and said the same kinds of things. I read about blue tint, distortion, and there was all kinds of triggered snowlfakes claiming the sky was falling. Today, my MRO sits on my Tavor and is the best red dot sight I've ever owned. I don't see the blue tint, and I don't see the distortion. What I do see is an exceptionally wide field of view and a sight that can get on target more quickly than anything I've shot outside of an Eotech. I'll judge this sight when I get my hands on it, but I've learned that some people wil find the tiniest things wrong with anything. Some, I'm convinced, love to stir up shit among early adopters. If this thing turns out to be a turd, I'll return it and get another MRO. Simple as that. I don't know what the big damned deal is. If you can't afford it, do what you are doing, and don't play the game, or wait until you think it is safe to play. Patience is a virtue. As for me, I don't mind a little risk. The reward might just be great, as in the case of my MRO. I'll also state again, I've never had an issue with a Vortex sight. Even my two cheapest, the original Sparc, are still running like new, even after abuse. Come on, Vortex, please ship a shit load of these to Optics Planet. I want to get this thing mounted up and put some rounds down range! |
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Posted: 6/29/2017 12:05:39 PM EDT
[#29]
So here is a question I've been wondering. This vs an Eotech. Which is more "combat ready?" No not for my purposes, but hypothetically. Eotechs have been used in actual combat for years...and even given their latest debacle I believe some still are. Of course that caveat of their debacle is a knock on their "combat readiness." Supposedly they have improved them and their latest documentation points to their latest published POI shifts in temp extremes being better. Then their is the vortex which is too new to have seen combat. We can only guess based on what we know. It's certainly build tough. I don't know about the Poly windows or the reticle being sensitive to light changes.
Which one would you trust your life to knowing what you know today? |
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Posted: 6/29/2017 2:27:37 PM EDT
[#30]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
So here is a question I've been wondering. This vs an Eotech. Which is more "combat ready?" No not for my purposes, but hypothetically. Eotechs have been used in actual combat for years...and even given their latest debacle I believe some still are. Of course that caveat of their debacle is a knock on their "combat readiness." Supposedly they have improved them and their latest documentation points to their latest published POI shifts in temp extremes being better. Then their is the vortex which is too new to have seen combat. We can only guess based on what we know. It's certainly build tough. I don't know about the Poly windows or the reticle being sensitive to light changes. Which one would you trust your life to knowing what you know today? |
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Posted: 6/29/2017 2:32:43 PM EDT
[#31]
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Today? EoTech, not even up for discussion. 5-10 years from now? I'd put my money on Vortex once this thing has been fielded and updated as needed / or maybe not needed. Vortex has updated all of their optics as needed in the past to bring a better product to market, I would't think they'd change that mentality with this optic. The " HU-3 " may end up being the EoTech / bearded tier 1 holo optic of the future, we will have to wait and see but I'm sure needed revisions will be made and built upon in the future. |
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Posted: 6/29/2017 2:43:45 PM EDT
[#32]
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I tend to agree with you. 5-10 years is a while to wait though while trying to decide what to keep on my rifle today. Be nice if there was a trade up program!  A revision doesn't mean the first version was a turd, the company just found a way to make the product even better. For now I'll be keeping my EoTechs but in a couple years, who knows? I don't play sides when it comes to optic companies, I like what works be it Acogs / LPVs / or red dots.
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Posted: 6/29/2017 2:46:34 PM EDT
[#33]
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Think of it like this, guys using the T1 would probably love to have a T2 but know the T1 gets the job done A revision doesn't mean the first version was a turd, the company just found a way to make the product even better. For now I'll be keeping my EoTechs but in a couple years, who knows? I don't play sides when it comes to optic companies, I like what works be it Acogs / LPVs / or red dots. |
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Posted: 6/29/2017 2:53:48 PM EDT
[#34]
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True. I'd probably feel better about my vortex if they had used glass for durability sake. I can deal with the reticle issues. |
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Posted: 6/29/2017 3:16:38 PM EDT
[#35]
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I wonder if any of the blooming issues are caused by using polycarbonate windows or any of the coatings. As to the debris, no it doesn't affect function but these should be assembled in clean rooms to avoid contamination. Mine keeps getting more specks on the inside of the windows. That can only mean there is more debris sealed inside and moving around. Again doesn't affect function but not great quality control either. I also do worry about the durability of using polycarbonate with scratch resistant coatings. Will they eventually degrade and look less transparent.  That would upset me.
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Posted: 6/29/2017 3:28:56 PM EDT
[#36]
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Shouldn't be having crap inside the sight for $500 That would upset me. |
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Posted: 6/29/2017 4:27:13 PM EDT
[#37]
If Vortex used glass instead of poly but the price increased to $700-$800 would people still buy it or complain that it's too expensive for a holo sight?
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Posted: 6/29/2017 4:33:44 PM EDT
[#38]
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If Vortex used glass instead of poly but the price increased to $700-$800 would people still buy it or complain that it's too expensive for a holo sight? |
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Posted: 6/29/2017 6:10:10 PM EDT
[#39]
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I don't see how it would cost that much more. It's a flat window, not a precision ground magnifying optic. Eotech manages to do it without being $700-$800. |
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Posted: 6/29/2017 6:43:45 PM EDT
[#40]
I do think to a certain extent that this product is a proof of concept of things to come for Vortex on the red dot sight line, a holographic sight(huge void in industry right now) with a unique layout, with unique features(micro usb charging port), forward thinking reticle, higher performance levels(1200hrs for a holosight is pretty fantastic), all brought stateside with the exception of one part afaik. I could definitely see a future where there is a smaller/lighter format UH-1 being sold.
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Posted: 6/29/2017 7:12:02 PM EDT
[#41]
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Still, I imagine it's one of: Cost-effective, shatter-proof, abrasion-resistant: Pick two. That being said give me glass or laminated glass anyday. Laminated glass is shatter proof scratch resistant and really shouldn't cost too much to implement for small flat windows. |
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Posted: 6/29/2017 9:24:57 PM EDT
[#42]
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What I do see is an exceptionally wide field of view |
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Posted: 6/29/2017 9:25:56 PM EDT
[#43]
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My H-1 in a Scalarworks mount is dead sexy although the small tube is a little annoying... |
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Posted: 6/29/2017 10:27:32 PM EDT
[#44]
Shipped for Cabela's today. I'm impressed.
You can get multiple reticles if you turn the brightness up way too bright. I pointed the reticle at my super bright led shop light, adjusted brightness appropriately, and then turned out all the lights and only a single reticle is visible. If I turn it up higher than necessary and then turn the lights off I will get multiple reticles, but they aren't that bright. Personally it is a non issue for me. I will try to do some range time tomorrow. So far the fit and finish is top notch. No dust inside the housing to speak of. 
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Posted: 6/30/2017 7:12:51 AM EDT
[#45]
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You can't pick two of those because two are poly. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Still, I imagine it's one of: Cost-effective, shatter-proof, abrasion-resistant: Pick two. Polycarbonate: Economical Shatter-proof glass (suitable for optics): Expensive Where "shatter-proof" is like "water-proof": What's really meant is "highly shatter-resistant." (Think car windows, cell phone screens, watch crystals, as opposed to regular residential windows, water glasses, etc.) E.g.: As VortexSam noted: Sapphire glass is highly shatter-resistant, but, quite expensive. |
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Posted: 6/30/2017 7:55:56 AM EDT
[#46]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Non-shatter-proof glass: Economical Polycarbonate: Economical Shatter-proof glass (suitable for optics): Expensive Where "shatter-proof" is like "water-proof": What's really meant is "highly shatter-resistant." (Think car windows, cell phone screens, watch crystals, as opposed to regular residential windows, water glasses, etc.) E.g.: As VortexSam noted: Sapphire glass is highly shatter-resistant, but, quite expensive. |
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Posted: 6/30/2017 10:11:34 AM EDT
[#47]
I'd agree with that, there have been plenty of durable/rugged optics that have not had to use sapphire glass.
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Posted: 6/30/2017 10:43:39 AM EDT
[#48]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I don't think laminated glass is as expensive as you are making it out to be in the sizes we're talking. They could compromise as eotech does and put glass in the front and laminated glass in the back closest to your eye. I do not believe that adds another $100 to the cost. While laminated glass may protect your eyes, it won't help in preserving the viability of the optic. |
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Posted: 6/30/2017 11:22:08 AM EDT
[#49]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I never said anything about "laminated glass." I wrote "shatter-proof." Laminated glass isn't any more shatter-proof than non-laminated. It's just more likely to remain intact when it shatters. While laminated glass may protect your eyes, it won't help in preserving the viability of the optic. I don't know what you're trying to prove here. Poly is inferior to glass, laminated or otherwise. I'd prefer glass or laminated glass and I don't think it would make the optic cost $700+. But even if it cost $600 I'd be willing to pay that for the vortex if they were also able to resolve the multiple reticle issue and it proves to be otherwise durable/hold zero/minimal thermal drift....ect. I don't think there is much else to say here. |
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Posted: 7/1/2017 9:07:27 AM EDT
[#50]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I don't know what you're trying to prove here. Quote HistoryQuoted:
I don't know what you're trying to prove here. Economical Shatter-proof Abrasion-resistant Pick two. You cannot have all three. If you want it to be economical it cannot be both shatter-proof and abrasion-resistant. It can only be one or the other. Simply laminating glass with a layer of something that will prevent it from dispersing when it shatters does not make it shatter-proof. It simply makes it safety glass. Non-shatter-proof means one wrong hit and the optic is possibly rendered instantly unusable. Non-abrasion-resistant means the optic will likely be rendered increasingly less usable over time. Vortex opted for the latter. The fact that you and I disagree with their decision doesn't make it wrong, but, merely that would not have been our decision. Only time will tell if their decision was the right one. As an aside: Safety glass is not ultimately safe. Anybody who's ever seen safety glass take a hit and shatter can attest to that. Quoted:
Poly is inferior to glass, laminated or otherwise. Mind you: I agree. I would have preferred glass, as well. To the point that, had I not already decided to take a pass, this might well have decided me to. (I seriously dislike plastic lenses in any application.) But, again: Only time will tell whether of not they've made the best decision for their product. Now I'm done with this line of discussion. |
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