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Page AR-15 » Optics, Mounts, and Sights
AR Sponsor: bravocompany
Posted: 11/15/2015 10:49:58 PM EDT
Right now I have several ARs and I have recently started to reload for them.  I'm trying to shoot for accuracy to develop accurate loads, but the only optics I have for the rifles are red dots (Aimpoint and PA).  These are not the best for finding out what my rifles and loads can do as the 2 MOA dots completely cover small targets at 100 yards (the furthest range I have access to currently).  So, with that in mind, I'm looking for a decent scope to swap between various ARs to help develop loads.  I just want something with decent glass, forgiving eye relief, and repeatable turret adjustments.  Anything beyond that is gravy.  Looking for1x-6x, 3x-9x, 4x12 or something in that vicinity  I don't really care whether it is MOA or MIL.  I'm also in the middle of putting together a precision AR and this scope will likely end up at home on that rifle once load development is complete on the other guns.  I normally look to PA for budget when it comes to optics, but their scopes seem to have a whole lot more negative reviews than their red dots.  I have looked at Vortex and Bushnell as well.  The Vortex warranty has me leaning in that direction...but I would rather have a decent scope where I never need a warranty than a POS that is constantly being replaced.

Link Posted: 11/15/2015 10:55:14 PM EDT
[#1]
I would consider a used SWFA super sniper in your price range.



The cheapest scope I really like is the Weaver 2-10x36 on clearance at Natchez for $399. Magnification is a little on the low side for what you want though. I did shoot these groups at 107 yards with mine last week.


Link Posted: 11/15/2015 11:38:33 PM EDT
[#2]
I have a Nikon Prostaff 4-12 with mil-dot reticle on my AR 10. I have been very satisfied with it. IIRC I paid around $180 for it. Great deal and very reliable product.
Link Posted: 11/16/2015 12:18:26 AM EDT
[#3]
Weaver Grand Slam Tactical



One of the best bangs for the buck, Mil/Mil, great glass, repeatable, made in Japan.
Link Posted: 11/16/2015 12:25:17 AM EDT
[#4]
This Nikon p-223 looks interesting.  Any thoughts?  Nikon P-223
Link Posted: 11/16/2015 12:35:55 AM EDT
[#5]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
This Nikon p-223 looks interesting.  Any thoughts?  Nikon P-223
View Quote


Somebody can correct me if I'm wrong but I think the P-series is a "tacticalized" Pro-Staff.  I would think they would be fairly decent.  The Weaver above will have much better glass though.
Link Posted: 11/16/2015 12:39:12 AM EDT
[#6]
Good question OP.

I am in the same spot myself.

Looking at a Nikon M223 3-12 from NAtchez   for like $279
Primary Arms 4-14
Weaver Tactical

All under $300
Link Posted: 11/16/2015 9:17:56 AM EDT
[#7]
Weaver Grand Slam Tactical from MidwayUSA at $299.  There is no better under $300 midpower tactical scope.  Bright, clear, sharp Japanese optic with accurate repeatable turrets.  MRAD system with .1 mil per click, 5 mil per rotation adjustments and mil dot reticle.
Link Posted: 11/16/2015 9:53:41 AM EDT
[#8]
I use a vortex diamondback hp 4-16. very crisp clean optics, even in low light. I have one on my dams g2 sass. right around $330 but well worth it, and the warranty is un-matched.
Link Posted: 11/16/2015 10:01:38 AM EDT
[#9]
Check out the Leupold AR Mod 1 1.5 X 4.

A little more than your budget, but has been a solid scope for me so far.
Link Posted: 11/16/2015 10:58:50 AM EDT
[#10]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
This Nikon p-223 looks interesting.  Any thoughts?  Nikon P-223
View Quote


FO.  It's a great scope.  Glass is very bright and clear.  Spring-loaded turrets make setting for zero a breeze.  Shooting out to 300yds is no problem.  
If you shop around, they can be found for around $130 on sale.
Link Posted: 11/16/2015 7:48:29 PM EDT
[#11]
I'm really liking the look of the Weaver Grand Slam, though the Nikon P-223 is really tempting at approximately half the price.  How much difference in optical clarity, turret adjustment/repeatability are we looking at here?
Link Posted: 11/16/2015 8:02:42 PM EDT
[#12]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
I'm really liking the look of the Weaver Grand Slam, though the Nikon P-223 is really tempting at approximately half the price.  How much difference in optical clarity, turret adjustment/repeatability are we looking at here?
View Quote


About $150 worth.  Seriously.

That Nikon is good in it's class.  Probably would serve you well.

But the Weaver punches above it's weight.

ETA:  To really make it a fair fight you would have to compare the M223 to the Weaver.  And even then I would still give the edge to Weaver because I'm not a fan of Nikon's ballistic reticles.  YMMV.
Link Posted: 11/17/2015 7:18:40 AM EDT
[#13]
Just an FYI, I came across the vortex strike eagle for $267.  Not a bad scope for under 300

http://www.slickguns.com/product/new-vortex-1-6x24mm-strike-eagle-waterproof-scope-26399-after-coupon-sk1677-members-only

Link Posted: 11/17/2015 11:59:36 AM EDT
[#15]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Just an FYI, I came across the vortex strike eagle for $267.  Not a bad scope for under 300

http://www.slickguns.com/product/new-vortex-1-6x24mm-strike-eagle-waterproof-scope-26399-after-coupon-sk1677-members-only

View Quote

Looks almost exactly like my buddies Millet 1-6

Nice scopes not so great for paper punching for groups if the OP is after that
Link Posted: 11/17/2015 12:44:29 PM EDT
[#16]
Quoted:
Right now I have several ARs and I have recently started to reload for them.  I'm trying to shoot for accuracy to develop accurate loads, but the only optics I have for the rifles are red dots (Aimpoint and PA).  These are not the best for finding out what my rifles and loads can do as the 2 MOA dots completely cover small targets at 100 yards (the furthest range I have access to currently).  So, with that in mind, I'm looking for a decent scope to swap between various ARs to help develop loads.  I just want something with decent glass, forgiving eye relief, and repeatable turret adjustments.  Anything beyond that is gravy.  Looking for1x-6x, 3x-9x, 4x12 or something in that vicinity  I don't really care whether it is MOA or MIL.  I'm also in the middle of putting together a precision AR and this scope will likely end up at home on that rifle once load development is complete on the other guns.  I normally look to PA for budget when it comes to optics, but their scopes seem to have a whole lot more negative reviews than their red dots.  I have looked at Vortex and Bushnell as well.  The Vortex warranty has me leaning in that direction...but I would rather have a decent scope where I never need a warranty than a POS that is constantly being replaced.

View Quote


For a budget scope used primarily for load development, look no further:  SWFA SS 10x42 Mil-Quad

Better yet, wait until they go on sale during Black Friday next week.
Link Posted: 11/17/2015 2:29:30 PM EDT
[#17]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Weaver Grand Slam Tactical from MidwayUSA at $299.  There is no better under $300 midpower tactical scope.  Bright, clear, sharp Japanese optic with accurate repeatable turrets.  MRAD system with .1 mil per click, 5 mil per rotation adjustments and mil dot reticle.
View Quote


You're gonna be real hard pressed to find anything better for the role you have in mind in your price range than this.
Link Posted: 11/17/2015 4:19:04 PM EDT
[#18]
Say one could get a dead on a Weaver Grand Slam tactical  3-10 for $299 or a Nikon M223 3-12 for $279

Are they about even as far as quality?
Link Posted: 11/24/2015 12:28:34 AM EDT
[#19]
What is the word on Leatherwood Hi-Lux scopes?  I'm seeing a 4-16x44 on Sportsman's Guide for $90.  Are they decent for what I would be looking at?
Link Posted: 11/24/2015 1:11:55 AM EDT
[#20]
Get a Primary Arms 4-14x44 FFP. They have a Mildot or ACSS reticle, click turrets you can zero, and First Focal Plane. Great scope for the $$$$. I have one on my .308, holds zero, very clear.
Link Posted: 11/24/2015 1:46:09 AM EDT
[#21]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Weaver Grand Slam Tactical from MidwayUSA at $299.  There is no better under $300 midpower tactical scope.  Bright, clear, sharp Japanese optic with accurate repeatable turrets.  MRAD system with .1 mil per click, 5 mil per rotation adjustments and mil dot reticle.
View Quote

This. Best bargain there is in a magnified optic, IMO.
Link Posted: 11/25/2015 1:44:16 AM EDT
[#22]
Just to throw another idea into the mix...

Redfield Revolution 4-12. Made in OR by Leupold. Typically sells for about $240, with your choice of reticles...

http://www.opticsplanet.com/redfield-revolution-4-12x40mm-riflescope-matte-finish-4-plex-accu-range-reticle.html
Link Posted: 11/25/2015 4:53:12 PM EDT
[#23]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Say one could get a dead on a Weaver Grand Slam tactical  3-10 for $299 or a Nikon M223 3-12 for $279

Are they about even as far as quality?
View Quote


There are two issues with the Nikon.

First let me say that I have several Nikon Monarch (the M tactical scope uses Monarch 3 glass) scopes and like them.  I do not like their proprietary BDC reticles, however.  They are a series of open circles down the lower half of the vertical cross-hair.  There are no subtensions for wind hold off.  Either that or you get the Nikoplex with no hold over points at all.  Check that $279 scope to make sure what reticle you have.  Those circles are somewhat arbitrarily set to sort of correspond to certain loads and Nikon has a software program you can run to more closely approximate them.  But the turrets are in MOA, which will not correspond with what you are seeing in the reticle.

Second, I really do think that the Weaver has glass at least as good and probably a bit better than the M series (Monarch 3 equivalent) scopes.  It is a close call.  I've not compared them side-by-side.  And the Monarch is a pig at 20 ounces weight, compared to 16.5 for the Weaver, just to get 12x rather than 10x on the top end.

But, I think that you will really like having matching turrets and reticle.  Having the standard mildot reticle on a tactical scope with turrets that match is a big plus.   Add to that the good repeatability of the turrets and glass that compares to many scopes at least 50% more costly, and the scale tips in favor of the Weaver GST.  Just one opinion.
Link Posted: 11/26/2015 1:28:29 PM EDT
[#24]
Just an FYI.  I ended up buying a Nikon m223 with BDC...for $129 from Cabelas.  Get some while the getting is good!
Link Posted: 11/26/2015 1:53:09 PM EDT
[#25]

Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:


Weaver Grand Slam Tactical



http://media.midwayusa.com/productimages/120x90/Primary/598/598484.jpg



One of the best bangs for the buck, Mil/Mil, great glass, repeatable, made in Japan.
View Quote
THIS



 
Link Posted: 11/26/2015 10:12:51 PM EDT
[#26]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Just an FYI.  I ended up buying a Nikon m223 with BDC...for $129 from Cabelas.  Get some while the getting is good!
View Quote


Are you sure? Link, please.
Link Posted: 11/26/2015 10:34:55 PM EDT
[#27]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:


Are you sure? Link, please.
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Quoted:
Just an FYI.  I ended up buying a Nikon m223 with BDC...for $129 from Cabelas.  Get some while the getting is good!


Are you sure? Link, please.


I think it is done. It isnt on their site anymore.
Link Posted: 11/26/2015 11:17:08 PM EDT
[#28]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:


I think it is done. It isnt on their site anymore.
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Just an FYI.  I ended up buying a Nikon m223 with BDC...for $129 from Cabelas.  Get some while the getting is good!


Are you sure? Link, please.


I think it is done. It isnt on their site anymore.

That price had to be a mistake. I am betting Cabalas cancels the orders
Link Posted: 11/27/2015 10:50:33 AM EDT
[#29]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:

That price had to be a mistake. I am betting Cabalas cancels the orders
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Just an FYI.  I ended up buying a Nikon m223 with BDC...for $129 from Cabelas.  Get some while the getting is good!


Are you sure? Link, please.


I think it is done. It isnt on their site anymore.

That price had to be a mistake. I am betting Cabalas cancels the orders

Yes they just canceled my order for the m223...

Guess I'll get the p223
Link Posted: 11/27/2015 10:51:29 AM EDT
[#30]
Is the vortex diamondback hp g2g on an AR?
Link Posted: 11/27/2015 11:33:07 AM EDT
[#31]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:

Yes they just canceled my order for the m223...

Guess I'll get the p223
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Just an FYI.  I ended up buying a Nikon m223 with BDC...for $129 from Cabelas.  Get some while the getting is good!


Are you sure? Link, please.


I think it is done. It isnt on their site anymore.

That price had to be a mistake. I am betting Cabalas cancels the orders

Yes they just canceled my order for the m223...

Guess I'll get the p223


How do you know they cancelled?
Link Posted: 11/27/2015 11:48:20 AM EDT
[#32]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:

Yes they just canceled my order for the m223...

Guess I'll get the p223
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Just an FYI.  I ended up buying a Nikon m223 with BDC...for $129 from Cabelas.  Get some while the getting is good!


Are you sure? Link, please.


I think it is done. It isnt on their site anymore.

That price had to be a mistake. I am betting Cabalas cancels the orders

Yes they just canceled my order for the m223...

Guess I'll get the p223



You really should move away from mismatched 1/4 MOA turrets and the hokey thick BDC reticle.  You can get serious about tactical shooting on a budget with superior glass with the Weaver GST.  Please listen to those of us who have spent some time behind that scope.  It is an insanely good $299 scope.
Link Posted: 11/27/2015 12:13:05 PM EDT
[#33]
Vortex Diamondback is a good budget glass on AR. I think they were made in Philippines (not China).  I have a 1.75-5 Diamondback on my 18" SPR.

 
 
Link Posted: 11/27/2015 1:06:55 PM EDT
[#34]


Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
You really should move away from mismatched 1/4 MOA turrets and the hokey thick BDC reticle.  You can get serious about tactical shooting on a budget with superior glass with the Weaver GST.  Please listen to those of us who have spent some time behind that scope.  It is an insanely good $299 scope.


View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:





Quoted:




Quoted:




Quoted:




Quoted:
Are you sure? Link, please.






I think it is done. It isnt on their site anymore.



That price had to be a mistake. I am betting Cabalas cancels the orders



Yes they just canceled my order for the m223...





Guess I'll get the p223

You really should move away from mismatched 1/4 MOA turrets and the hokey thick BDC reticle.  You can get serious about tactical shooting on a budget with superior glass with the Weaver GST.  Please listen to those of us who have spent some time behind that scope.  It is an insanely good $299 scope.


I agree.  BDC reticles are fine for something like a low power 1-4 or 1-6 that you'll be using to hit man-sized targets out to 500 yards or so, but for real precision shooting you need to know your dope and either hold over with a standardized Mil or MOA reticle or (preferably) dial for elevation. Mismatched turrets/reticles make that very difficult.





I would either go with the Weaver or a fixed SWFA scope.  Either one is a very good budget precision optic.





 
Link Posted: 12/15/2015 6:26:59 PM EDT
[#35]
I have tried many different scope brands in the past and kind of started being a scope snob. Only Luepold or Zeiss. I am getting an SWFA SS 6x42 30mm Mil-Dot  and their SWFA S.S.A.L.T. 30mm Scope Mount for my PA-10 just to try it out. Not sure if I should have gotten the 10X but most of my shooting going to be under 200 yards anyway and most likely in the trees so 6x should be fine. I know the glass and light transmission will not be up to my Luepolds or Zeiss but the objective lense isn't 50mm either. Based on reviews of the SWFA scope sturdiness and reliability not to mention the price point I had to give it a try. Worse case scenario it replaces the POS BSA I have on my Ruger 10/22.
Link Posted: 12/18/2015 12:49:10 AM EDT
[#36]
IF you can squeeze out a bit more, Cabelas is clearancing out the Vortex Viper PST 2.5-10x32 moa scopes for $350, normally $5-600.  Absolutely screaming deal and you get free shipping right now.

They had the 2.5-10x44 illuminated for $250 but that deal sold out in a few minutes.
Page AR-15 » Optics, Mounts, and Sights
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