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AR Sponsor: bravocompany
Posted: 4/18/2015 8:15:48 PM EDT
today during 3-gun, i noticed something I'd never thought I'd see. a small, 2mm (at most) crack on the rear of the feedlip. This mag has maybe 20K through it (2009 production) and has been beat to hell and royally abused.

I should probably retire the old girl, but honestly, it's a testament to how well these mags are built.

Has anyone had mags that developed cracks?
Link Posted: 4/18/2015 9:11:37 PM EDT
[#1]
Yup.  The back of the spine at the feed lips is the common fail point.  However, more often than not, they continue to function.  I think you've got your $12 out of it.
Link Posted: 4/19/2015 12:06:29 AM EDT
[#2]
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Quoted:
Yup.  The back of the spine at the feed lips is the common fail point.  However, more often than not, they continue to function.  I think you've got your $12 out of it.
View Quote



I can probably still use it. Looks like the crack has been there for a long time actually. I may run into feed issues down the road but by then I'll know it's time to put it to bed.
Link Posted: 4/19/2015 12:28:28 AM EDT
[#3]
Dont they have a life time replacement?
Link Posted: 4/19/2015 12:44:55 AM EDT
[#4]
Mine-  " />

Mine-  
" />

Also mine-

" />

I still buy and use Magpul stuff, but needless to say, I'm not as big a fan as most here.
Link Posted: 4/19/2015 12:48:39 AM EDT
[#5]
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Quoted:
Dont they have a life time replacement?
View Quote


It would be absurd if they did.
Link Posted: 4/19/2015 12:58:36 AM EDT
[#6]
Link Posted: 4/19/2015 11:33:39 AM EDT
[#7]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History


sheesh. what's the issues in the 2nd pic? i cannot quite see.

I've never had a problem with magpul stuff except the occasional mag that wont drop free because its a bit dirty.
Link Posted: 4/19/2015 11:59:46 AM EDT
[#8]
Link Posted: 4/19/2015 1:47:08 PM EDT
[#9]
The first crack i found was on my 09 gen2 mag, then i saw another on the rear of a gen2 mag with the 14 stamp on it. That mag maybe has 2K through it thus far, but it's a training mag so oftentimes finds itself being dropped in mud, water and slapped around like a redheaded step child.

09 Trainer #5


14 Trainer #1 (kinda hard to see since it's a camera phone pic)

Link Posted: 4/19/2015 5:11:45 PM EDT
[#10]
Link Posted: 4/20/2015 11:02:14 PM EDT
[#11]
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Quoted:


M3s and Black M2s (Made with M3 material) no longer have the failure point in that area. It is directed down the center spine almost always now.
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Quoted:
Quoted:
The first crack i found was on my 09 gen2 mag, then i saw another on the rear of a gen2 mag with the 14 stamp on it. That mag maybe has 2K through it thus far, but it's a training mag so oftentimes finds itself being dropped in mud, water and slapped around like a redheaded step child.

09 Trainer #5
<a href="http://s554.photobucket.com/user/fohshizzle/media/images/2490E54C-6C11-4C10-A0FD-EDBA35EDA6B6_zpsi9ccipuf.jpg.html" target="_blank">http://i554.photobucket.com/albums/jj411/fohshizzle/images/2490E54C-6C11-4C10-A0FD-EDBA35EDA6B6_zpsi9ccipuf.jpg</a>

14 Trainer #1 (kinda hard to see since it's a camera phone pic)

<a href="http://s554.photobucket.com/user/fohshizzle/media/images/A223E6E3-17E1-4D0D-B75D-768CFFC0D3A7_zpsyyekshts.jpg.html" target="_blank">http://i554.photobucket.com/albums/jj411/fohshizzle/images/A223E6E3-17E1-4D0D-B75D-768CFFC0D3A7_zpsyyekshts.jpg</a>


M3s and Black M2s (Made with M3 material) no longer have the failure point in that area. It is directed down the center spine almost always now.


I have yet to have a center spine crack. I think I will keep using these mags until they fail.
Link Posted: 4/22/2015 12:07:40 AM EDT
[#12]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:


A quick run through your photos.

The crack on the back of your magazine is where the PMag is engineered to break under impact loads. Some earlier MRev colored magazines could break at the feed lips causing a malfunction so we design impact loads to be forced down the back spine. Both the current M2 (MOE) and M3 PMags use updated material that survives impacts several times more than the magazine pictured so this issue is far less common. That said even in this condition the magazine as pictured would still hold rounds and still would function normally as opposed to a USGI magazine subjected to the same impact forces.

PMag M3 vs USGI (HK 416 Full Auto Test with high Speed Video)

On the second photo you show the inside a PMag LR (308-7.62x51) that has small indentations from certain 308 rounds sliding forward and impacting the front surface of the magazine. In military testing of the PMag LR this issue was noted and it was found that the impacts did not affect function of the M110 (SR25) in the 1000s of rounds tested . As a single PMag LR magazine had a service life in excess of the weapon systems barrel, it was deemed a non issue.

The third photo shows the problem is being in a growing business for over 15 years. The products shown (the M93 stock and early MIAD grip) are from almost a decade ago. At the time we were using an of the shelf polymer used in ski bindings. This material had a very high tensile strength but fell short in impact testing. We stopped using this back in 2005-2006 and moved to a new propriety compound which became the basis of the polymer that was used on the original PMag. This new polymer was the basis for the current material used in the M3 so in short we have long surpassed several times the material used in the original M93.
View Quote View All Quotes
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Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:


A quick run through your photos.

The crack on the back of your magazine is where the PMag is engineered to break under impact loads. Some earlier MRev colored magazines could break at the feed lips causing a malfunction so we design impact loads to be forced down the back spine. Both the current M2 (MOE) and M3 PMags use updated material that survives impacts several times more than the magazine pictured so this issue is far less common. That said even in this condition the magazine as pictured would still hold rounds and still would function normally as opposed to a USGI magazine subjected to the same impact forces.

PMag M3 vs USGI (HK 416 Full Auto Test with high Speed Video)

On the second photo you show the inside a PMag LR (308-7.62x51) that has small indentations from certain 308 rounds sliding forward and impacting the front surface of the magazine. In military testing of the PMag LR this issue was noted and it was found that the impacts did not affect function of the M110 (SR25) in the 1000s of rounds tested . As a single PMag LR magazine had a service life in excess of the weapon systems barrel, it was deemed a non issue.

The third photo shows the problem is being in a growing business for over 15 years. The products shown (the M93 stock and early MIAD grip) are from almost a decade ago. At the time we were using an of the shelf polymer used in ski bindings. This material had a very high tensile strength but fell short in impact testing. We stopped using this back in 2005-2006 and moved to a new propriety compound which became the basis of the polymer that was used on the original PMag. This new polymer was the basis for the current material used in the M3 so in short we have long surpassed several times the material used in the original M93.


Very insightful. Thank you.



Link Posted: 4/22/2015 10:17:30 PM EDT
[#13]
I
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:


A quick run through your photos.

The crack on the back of your magazine is where the PMag is engineered to break under impact loads. Some earlier MRev colored magazines could break at the feed lips causing a malfunction so we design impact loads to be forced down the back spine. Both the current M2 (MOE) and M3 PMags use updated material that survives impacts several times more than the magazine pictured so this issue is far less common. That said even in this condition the magazine as pictured would still hold rounds and still would function normally as opposed to a USGI magazine subjected to the same impact forces.

PMag M3 vs USGI (HK 416 Full Auto Test with high Speed Video)

On the second photo you show the inside a PMag LR (308-7.62x51) that has small indentations from certain 308 rounds sliding forward and impacting the front surface of the magazine. In military testing of the PMag LR this issue was noted and it was found that the impacts did not affect function of the M110 (SR25) in the 1000s of rounds tested . As a single PMag LR magazine had a service life in excess of the weapon systems barrel, it was deemed a non issue.

The third photo shows the problem is being in a growing business for over 15 years. The products shown (the M93 stock and early MIAD grip) are from almost a decade ago. At the time we were using an of the shelf polymer used in ski bindings. This material had a very high tensile strength but fell short in impact testing. We stopped using this back in 2005-2006 and moved to a new propriety compound which became the basis of the polymer that was used on the original PMag. This new polymer was the basis for the current material used in the M3 so in short we have long surpassed several times the material used in the original M93.
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:


A quick run through your photos.

The crack on the back of your magazine is where the PMag is engineered to break under impact loads. Some earlier MRev colored magazines could break at the feed lips causing a malfunction so we design impact loads to be forced down the back spine. Both the current M2 (MOE) and M3 PMags use updated material that survives impacts several times more than the magazine pictured so this issue is far less common. That said even in this condition the magazine as pictured would still hold rounds and still would function normally as opposed to a USGI magazine subjected to the same impact forces.

PMag M3 vs USGI (HK 416 Full Auto Test with high Speed Video)

On the second photo you show the inside a PMag LR (308-7.62x51) that has small indentations from certain 308 rounds sliding forward and impacting the front surface of the magazine. In military testing of the PMag LR this issue was noted and it was found that the impacts did not affect function of the M110 (SR25) in the 1000s of rounds tested . As a single PMag LR magazine had a service life in excess of the weapon systems barrel, it was deemed a non issue.

The third photo shows the problem is being in a growing business for over 15 years. The products shown (the M93 stock and early MIAD grip) are from almost a decade ago. At the time we were using an of the shelf polymer used in ski bindings. This material had a very high tensile strength but fell short in impact testing. We stopped using this back in 2005-2006 and moved to a new propriety compound which became the basis of the polymer that was used on the original PMag. This new polymer was the basis for the current material used in the M3 so in short we have long surpassed several times the material used in the original M93.


Wow..... It's refreshing when a business actually tells the truth instead of covering things up. Awesome information Magpul :)
Link Posted: 4/25/2015 10:24:40 AM EDT
[#14]
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Quoted:


It would be absurd if they did.
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Quoted:
Quoted:
Dont they have a life time replacement?


It would be absurd if they did.


Why is that???

ETS has a lifetime warrantee............
Link Posted: 4/25/2015 10:28:17 AM EDT
[#15]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
I

Wow..... It's refreshing when a business actually tells the truth instead of covering things up. Awesome information Magpul :)
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
I
Quoted:


A quick run through your photos.

The crack on the back of your magazine is where the PMag is engineered to break under impact loads. Some earlier MRev colored magazines could break at the feed lips causing a malfunction so we design impact loads to be forced down the back spine. Both the current M2 (MOE) and M3 PMags use updated material that survives impacts several times more than the magazine pictured so this issue is far less common. That said even in this condition the magazine as pictured would still hold rounds and still would function normally as opposed to a USGI magazine subjected to the same impact forces.

PMag M3 vs USGI (HK 416 Full Auto Test with high Speed Video)

On the second photo you show the inside a PMag LR (308-7.62x51) that has small indentations from certain 308 rounds sliding forward and impacting the front surface of the magazine. In military testing of the PMag LR this issue was noted and it was found that the impacts did not affect function of the M110 (SR25) in the 1000s of rounds tested . As a single PMag LR magazine had a service life in excess of the weapon systems barrel, it was deemed a non issue.

The third photo shows the problem is being in a growing business for over 15 years. The products shown (the M93 stock and early MIAD grip) are from almost a decade ago. At the time we were using an of the shelf polymer used in ski bindings. This material had a very high tensile strength but fell short in impact testing. We stopped using this back in 2005-2006 and moved to a new propriety compound which became the basis of the polymer that was used on the original PMag. This new polymer was the basis for the current material used in the M3 so in short we have long surpassed several times the material used in the original M93.


Wow..... It's refreshing when a business actually tells the truth instead of covering things up. Awesome information Magpul :)


I agree. thanks for the reply Magpul.
Link Posted: 4/25/2015 11:22:18 AM EDT
[#16]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:


Why is that???

ETS has a lifetime warrantee............
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Dont they have a life time replacement?


It would be absurd if they did.


Why is that???

ETS has a lifetime warrantee............


You mean the company that just came on the scene late last year? Note that I have some of their mags but a lifetime warranty from a company that might not be around in a year doesn't mean much to me. If they get a decade under their belts and still have lifetime warranty, rock on but right now if seems more of a tactic to sell mags (not to mention I don't even know if they do have a lifetime warranty)
Link Posted: 4/25/2015 11:26:56 AM EDT
[#17]

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Quoted:
You mean the company that just came on the scene late last year? Note that I have some of their mags but a lifetime warranty from a company that might not be around in a year doesn't mean much to me. If they get a decade under their belts and still have lifetime warranty, rock on but right now if seems more of a tactic to sell mags (not to mention I don't even know if they do have a lifetime warranty)
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Quoted:



Quoted:


Quoted:


Quoted:

Dont they have a life time replacement?




It would be absurd if they did.




Why is that???



ETS has a lifetime warrantee............




You mean the company that just came on the scene late last year? Note that I have some of their mags but a lifetime warranty from a company that might not be around in a year doesn't mean much to me. If they get a decade under their belts and still have lifetime warranty, rock on but right now if seems more of a tactic to sell mags (not to mention I don't even know if they do have a lifetime warranty)
A lifetime warranty on magazines is a dumb idea.

 



Magazines are consumables. Use them up and throw them away.
Link Posted: 4/25/2015 11:46:39 AM EDT
[#18]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
A lifetime warranty on magazines is a dumb idea.  

Magazines are consumables. Use them up and throw them away.
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Dont they have a life time replacement?


It would be absurd if they did.


Why is that???

ETS has a lifetime warrantee............


You mean the company that just came on the scene late last year? Note that I have some of their mags but a lifetime warranty from a company that might not be around in a year doesn't mean much to me. If they get a decade under their belts and still have lifetime warranty, rock on but right now if seems more of a tactic to sell mags (not to mention I don't even know if they do have a lifetime warranty)
A lifetime warranty on magazines is a dumb idea.  

Magazines are consumables. Use them up and throw them away.

This, it's a $10 mag. I think you got your money's worth out of it.
Link Posted: 4/25/2015 12:27:01 PM EDT
[#19]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:


Why is that???

ETS has a lifetime warrantee............
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Dont they have a life time replacement?


It would be absurd if they did.


Why is that???

ETS has a lifetime warrantee............

USA brand magazines had a "Lifetime" warranty. They sold a LOT of product based on that, too.

A stated L/W opens a company up to either abuse through a liberal policy, OR they have to shield themselves with legalese that can piss off customers.
A reputation for taking care of your customers is far more valuable.
Link Posted: 4/25/2015 1:06:31 PM EDT
[#20]
Link Posted: 4/25/2015 1:11:34 PM EDT
[#21]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
A lifetime warranty on magazines is a dumb idea.  

Magazines are consumables. Use them up and throw them away.
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Dont they have a life time replacement?


It would be absurd if they did.


Why is that???

ETS has a lifetime warrantee............


You mean the company that just came on the scene late last year? Note that I have some of their mags but a lifetime warranty from a company that might not be around in a year doesn't mean much to me. If they get a decade under their belts and still have lifetime warranty, rock on but right now if seems more of a tactic to sell mags (not to mention I don't even know if they do have a lifetime warranty)
A lifetime warranty on magazines is a dumb idea.  

Magazines are consumables. Use them up and throw them away.


Buy from Brownells. Return for refund if they fail.
Link Posted: 4/25/2015 3:37:16 PM EDT
[#22]
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Quoted:
Hello Guys,
I saw you all talking about our warranty so I thought I would pop in. The reason we offer a lifetime warranty on our AR mags is because we know (through lots of testing) that our mags are the toughest AR mags on the market. We know that even with extremely hard use they are going to easily hold up over the long haul. This warranty is not a sales tactic, it is us having supreme confidence in a product that we have now spent over 2 years designing, developing, and testing.

As we have said many times before, we hope in the long run to be able to change the way you all view AR mags. When they are as tough as ours, there is no reason to have to think of them as disposable. I don't want to highjack this thread, I just wanted you guys to know where we are coming from with regards to our warranty.

And for what it's worth, in the last year of selling AR mags we have not had to replace a single mag because of breaking, cracking, or any other kind of damage.
View Quote


just checked out your website. they are quite colorful!
Link Posted: 4/26/2015 12:52:19 AM EDT
[#23]

Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:


You mean the company that just came on the scene late last year? Note that I have some of their mags but a lifetime warranty from a company that might not be around in a year doesn't mean much to me. If they get a decade under their belts and still have lifetime warranty, rock on but right now if seems more of a tactic to sell mags (not to mention I don't even know if they do have a lifetime warranty)
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Dont they have a life time replacement?


It would be absurd if they did.


Why is that???

ETS has a lifetime warrantee............


You mean the company that just came on the scene late last year? Note that I have some of their mags but a lifetime warranty from a company that might not be around in a year doesn't mean much to me. If they get a decade under their belts and still have lifetime warranty, rock on but right now if seems more of a tactic to sell mags (not to mention I don't even know if they do have a lifetime warranty)


Better not buy COLT then.   COLT HEADED FOR BANKRUPTCY?

Who's to say what companies are going to be around in a year or what laws are going to be in place next year?

I am going to check out ETS with as much faith & confidence in a sub $25 product as I can muster.  

But, I just bought a box full of 42rd ProMags from CDNN.  If there is another ban or mass shooting I will at least make my money back then...


~Will
Link Posted: 4/26/2015 11:39:12 AM EDT
[#24]

Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:



You mean the company that just came on the scene late last year? Note that I have some of their mags but a lifetime warranty from a company that might not be around in a year doesn't mean much to me. If they get a decade under their belts and still have lifetime warranty, rock on but right now if seems more of a tactic to sell mags (not to mention I don't even know if they do have a lifetime warranty)
View Quote




If you are concerned about a magazine breaking, buy three of them. If you shoot enough that you are wearing out mags, then you're shooting $20,000 worth of ammo a year, and you can afford to buy a few $12 mags.




No need to get all elitist and over think something as simple as magazines.




Find a brand you like, buy a bunch. If you don't like them, sell them and buy a different brand.



Link Posted: 4/26/2015 1:45:53 PM EDT
[#25]
Its a good reason to have a mix of magazines, polymer & metals be it aluminum or steel.

I have used several different types of plastic / polymer mags from  Israeli Orlite, P mags in both calibers , Thermold which I think is Zytel material and "other".
Of all of them the only failure I had was a split weld on two of the Thermold mags during -10 F temps. The mags still functioned but cracked on the weld seam in the rear.

That being said I just ordered 6 more Pmags in .308 and I am waiting to see how Brownell's metal mags look once release to grab a 1/2 dozen.
Link Posted: 4/26/2015 4:15:19 PM EDT
[#26]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
...rock on but right now if seems more of a tactic to sell mags (not to mention I don't even know if they do have a lifetime warranty)
View Quote


Like nobody has ever used the tech forums to try to sell magazines, right.

Actually what is more likely is they have so much confidence in their product from testing that they think the benefit of having a lifetime warrante outweighs the amount of magazines they will have to replace.  Seems to work with Serars/Craftsman tools...............

BTW, they do have a lifetime warrante, I think they are the first and only magazine with it.  Time will tell how it works out...............
Link Posted: 4/26/2015 5:23:11 PM EDT
[#27]
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