self defense 308 ammo?

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[ARCHIVED THREAD] - self defense 308 ammo? (Page 1 of 2)

Posted: 6/22/2016 3:55:35 PM EDT

let's not get into what caliber is best for home SD, i just want facts/opinions on 308 rounds as applied to defending ones castle from armed marauders and how each will perform on soft targets.

the 308 rounds i have on my short list are;

fusion 150gr
TNB1 SOST 130gr
hornady TAP 155gr

i know SOST will come out the other side without fail, but will it incapacitate as well as a TAP or a soft point? seems like its a "jack of all trades, master of none" round but that doesnt bother me since you never know if you have to punch through a wall to end a battle or have a car coming at you.

Posted: 6/22/2016 4:27:08 PM EDT

[#1]

I generally use 1 round for my ar10tc.

168 gr Winchester ballistic silver tip.

Hunting or home defense. Going to really give the receiver a bad day.

Txl

Posted: 6/22/2016 5:38:50 PM EDT

[#2]

Any of those three will serve you well.
Make your choice on other factors; such as accuracy, availability, or price.

Posted: 6/22/2016 5:47:50 PM EDT

[#3]

Quote History

Quoted:
Any of those three will serve you well.
Make your choice on other factors; such as accuracy, availability, or price.

View Quote

thats pretty much what i thought. i like the price and availability of the fusion but wonder about the effectiveness compared to TAP and SOST. i was lucky enough to pick up 200 rounds of SOST before it became like Hen's Teeth.

TAP red box is another great round but spotty on supply, although the FPD seems readily available.

Posted: 6/22/2016 6:12:49 PM EDT

[#4]

Ive been rocking the 150gr whornady. Im zeroed on 150gr so they are good for hunting and HD. ((Allthough Id probably never shoot anyone with my Scar17 just because Id be out $3k+

))

Posted: 6/22/2016 10:18:22 PM EDT

[#5]

MK319

Posted: 6/23/2016 9:54:57 AM EDT

[#6]

I've always felt that about any .308 round is going to be effective. Some may expand more rapidly, some may penetrate more, but all of them will be effect.

FWIW, All my mags are loaded with ZA, Port, Hirt, RG, etc 147 grn ball and I don't fret a bit about it. YMMV

Posted: 6/23/2016 10:52:27 AM EDT

[#7]

Any of those will work. Fusion is probably goung to be the easiest to get.

Posted: 6/23/2016 9:35:00 PM EDT

[#8]

Pretty much the only .308 I keep on the shelf for targets hogs or I guess if I ever grabbed my .308 for defensive scenario, is Brown Bear 140gr Soft Point.

Posted: 6/24/2016 5:31:54 PM EDT

[#9]

I vote for accuracy in your rifle above the other factors. Any of the ones you listed will work well.

Posted: 6/24/2016 6:07:27 PM EDT

[#10]

ZQI M80 ball.

Posted: 6/24/2016 6:15:04 PM EDT

[#11]

Fusion MSR, bonded bullet and with great expansion, optimized for 16-20" barrels.

Posted: 6/24/2016 6:22:30 PM EDT

[#12]

147 grain FMJ Hirtenberger Surplus Ammo 1970s Vintage because that's what I have. Took a hog with it a few months ago. Quartering away neck shot. Ran about 16" and came out the jaw sideways. Hog collapsed immediately. Pretty much anything in .308 is going to be devastating in a SD use I wouldn't get too hung up on it. If I had to pick one I'd probably go up to Walmart and pick up some old fashioned Remington Core Loc SP.

Posted: 6/24/2016 8:45:57 PM EDT

[#13]

Yeah, GI ball ammo will get it done in the .308 or 30.06. Big bullet, all the penetration/bone breaking power you'll ever need.

In these calibers even soft point will shoot through the target and keep going.

Posted: 6/25/2016 2:13:23 PM EDT

[#14]

Any of those will be more than sufficient, honestly the .308 against soft targets it wont matter as much the round used as 5.56

Posted: 6/27/2016 12:39:30 PM EDT

[#15]

Quote History

Quoted:
Any of those will be more than sufficient, honestly the .308 against soft targets it wont matter as much the round used as 5.56

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thats pretty much the reason i wanted to stay away from fmj and use something that will dump more energy before exiting and the hornady tap stuff with its plastic tips might help do that and the mk319 but i do understand the core will pass through like butter and the nose blows off.

some guy here on arfcom that was a military trigger puller and claimed to have been in the middle east wars made a great sounding case for using 308 as a CQB rifle. no need to worry about under performing bullet with that! obviously it has its down side but what doesnt right?

thanks for all the posts.

Posted: 6/29/2016 8:10:50 AM EDT

[#16]

M61 if you want really good penetration

Posted: 6/29/2016 12:51:59 PM EDT

[#17]

Quote History

Quoted:
M61 if you want really good penetration

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well thats kind of a stupid comment. who uses AP for self defense?

i dont recall this thread going in the direction of shooting through steel.

Posted: 6/29/2016 4:18:44 PM EDT

[#18]

Hornady American Whitetail has dropped every deer I've shot, and shoots accurate enough.

I would imagine it performs equally as well in HD / SD.

Posted: 6/29/2016 4:47:34 PM EDT

[#19]

From experience hunting 4 legged animals. Remington Core lokt works very well, but I avoid it and federal soft point because the blunt soft bullet tip has issues feeding in AR308 and scarH rifles. I have also had the Remington Core lokt bullets get set back into the case and cause weird pressure problems.

For hunting in AZ I now use the Winchester power point ammo which is a soft point, but very rounded. Plus Winchester has a much more solid crimp on the bullet then Remington and federal.

Otherwise, any ball ammo will work against any problems very very well.

Posted: 6/29/2016 9:32:17 PM EDT

[#20]

I hunt with handloaded 165 gr Hornady btsp and I have never had a feeding issue with it in my armalite AR-10. It is devasting on deer and has always delivered complete pass throughs. I also have a 130 gr Barnes ttsx load that shoots very well but have no results on fur yet. Any 30 Cal is devasting if put in the right place.

Posted: 6/30/2016 10:04:22 AM EDT

[#21]

Quote History

Quoted:

well thats kind of a stupid comment. who uses AP for self defense?

i dont recall this thread going in the direction of shooting through steel.

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Quoted:

Quoted:
M61 if you want really good penetration

well thats kind of a stupid comment. who uses AP for self defense?

i dont recall this thread going in the direction of shooting through steel.

Well my AR10 isn't my go to rifle but I keep a mag of M61 loaded just incase. it doesn't hurt to have a few rounds laying around, never know when you need to penetrate a hard object. Also they aren't just for shooting steel, they are good for brick, wood, soil, auto glass, etc...

With that said I still think a round like MK319 is best as it gives you both penetration and expansion.

Posted: 7/1/2016 1:25:24 PM EDT

[#22]

Quote History

Quoted:

Well my AR10 isn't my go to rifle but I keep a mag of M61 loaded just incase. it doesn't hurt to have a few rounds laying around, never know when you need to penetrate a hard object. Also they aren't just for shooting steel, they are good for brick, wood, soil, auto glass, etc...

With that said I still think a round like MK319 is best as it gives you both penetration and expansion.

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Quoted:

Quoted:
M61 if you want really good penetration

well thats kind of a stupid comment. who uses AP for self defense?

i dont recall this thread going in the direction of shooting through steel.

Well my AR10 isn't my go to rifle but I keep a mag of M61 loaded just incase. it doesn't hurt to have a few rounds laying around, never know when you need to penetrate a hard object. Also they aren't just for shooting steel, they are good for brick, wood, soil, auto glass, etc...

With that said I still think a round like MK319 is best as it gives you both penetration and expansion.

now there is an answer i caN embrace. i agree that shooting through barriers is a very real possibility in a SHTF scenario for a civi. ya just never know. that is partially my reason for using mk319, jack of all trades, master of none. just too bad its not available anymore. glad i picked up 200 when i did. i would imagine m61 is even harder to find.

Posted: 7/1/2016 5:48:47 PM EDT

[#23]

155 amax/tap

Posted: 7/1/2016 5:53:42 PM EDT

[#24]

Quote History

Quoted:
155 amax/tap

<a href="http://s42.photobucket.com/user/taylorwso/media/CNStarget.jpg.html" target="_blank">http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e303/taylorwso/CNStarget.jpg</a>

<a href="http://s42.photobucket.com/user/taylorwso/media/308_TAP_comparison.jpg.html" target="_blank">http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e303/taylorwso/308_TAP_comparison.jpg</a>

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as long as the bad guy will stand still for the shot....lol

Posted: 7/1/2016 6:45:23 PM EDT

[#25]

Quote History

Quoted:

as long as the bad guy will stand still for the shot....lol

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Quoted:

Quoted:
155 amax/tap

<a href="http://s42.photobucket.com/user/taylorwso/media/CNStarget.jpg.html" target="_blank">http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e303/taylorwso/CNStarget.jpg</a>

<a href="http://s42.photobucket.com/user/taylorwso/media/308_TAP_comparison.jpg.html" target="_blank">http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e303/taylorwso/308_TAP_comparison.jpg</a>

as long as the bad guy will stand still for the shot....lol

or youre good enought to make one.

Im sure the same overlay through the chest will be just as impressive

Posted: 7/3/2016 12:08:03 AM EDT

[#26]

I've always been partial to the 155 AMAX load. Any basic deer hunting ammo would likely work just as well though.

Posted: 7/4/2016 12:50:01 AM EDT

[#27]

Just curious but when you said th MK 319 isn't available anymore do you mean it's difficult to find or they're not making it anymore? I have about 300 rounds left and if they're not making it anymore I want to stock up another coup,e hundred.

Posted: 7/4/2016 10:37:55 AM EDT

[#28]

Quote History

Quoted:
Just curious but when you said th MK 319 isn't available anymore do you mean it's difficult to find or they're not making it anymore? I have about 300 rounds left and if they're not making it anymore I want to stock up another coup,e hundred.

View Quote

not sure about if they are still makin it or not but i havent been able to find anymore the past year. i have about as much as you and am not shooting it recreationally, just sitting on it for rainy day. its like have an insurance policy. you might not ever use it but if you do, you'll be glad you had it.

i wonder about the 5.56 version mk318 as well. its still available but with the new version being made for the troops, i questio. whether or not we'll see the original, let alone the new stuff.

Posted: 7/4/2016 5:50:37 PM EDT

[#29]

Quote History

Quoted:
155 AMAX load.

View Quote

This. Unless you specifically need a barrier penetrating load, the 155 AMAX TAP load has superlative terminal effects.

Posted: 7/4/2016 11:47:44 PM EDT

[#30]

Same here. If I need to rezero I try to use as little as possible. There's a lot for sale on EE in case you're interested.

Posted: 7/4/2016 11:57:35 PM EDT

[#31]

You guys crack me up
Who is going to use a .308 for home defense?
Have you ever touched off a handgun round without hearing protection indoors? How loud do you think a .308 would be?
Use PISTOLS for home defense
If you live in a rural setting then great have a rifle handy, but inside a home the pistol or riot gun is king
And if you do shoot at a soft target with a .308 it will kill it dead, weather its a .50 cent FMJ or a $1.50 match grade HP
Jeesh go shoot one and you can tell it kills stuff dead without much effort.

Posted: 7/5/2016 12:39:02 AM EDT

[#32]

Nobody said the use of these rounds were to be inside. Other than that, it's a good round and just an option that we are discussing. But thanks for your input on the topic.

Posted: 7/5/2016 12:44:26 AM EDT

[#33]

Quote History

Quoted:
You guys crack me up
Who is going to use a .308 for home defense?
Have you ever touched off a handgun round without hearing protection indoors? How loud do you think a .308 would be?
Use PISTOLS for home defense
If you live in a rural setting then great have a rifle handy, but inside a home the pistol or riot gun is king
And if you do shoot at a soft target with a .308 it will kill it dead, weather its a .50 cent FMJ or a $1.50 match grade HP
Jeesh go shoot one and you can tell it kills stuff dead without much effort.

View Quote

308 holes make invisible souls. talk about a one shot stop, obviously bullet placement is key but a 308 is one hell of a CQB round and i've touched of plenty of shit without ear plugs and ya know what hurts me the most, 9mm.

Posted: 7/5/2016 1:46:55 AM EDT

[#34]

Quote History

Quoted:
You guys crack me up
Who is going to use a .308 for home defense?
Have you ever touched off a handgun round without hearing protection indoors? How loud do you think a .308 would be?
Use PISTOLS for home defense
If you live in a rural setting then great have a rifle handy, but inside a home the pistol or riot gun is king
And if you do shoot at a soft target with a .308 it will kill it dead, weather its a .50 cent FMJ or a $1.50 match grade HP
Jeesh go shoot one and you can tell it kills stuff dead without much effort.

View Quote

That's so much bad info in one post...thought I was in the GD for a moment. Please keep that crap out of the tech forums.

Posted: 7/5/2016 3:39:13 AM EDT

[#35]

Quote History

Quoted:
Nobody said the use of these rounds were to be inside. Other than that, it's a good round and just an option that we are discussing. But thanks for your input on the topic.

View Quote

Don't listen to his input, he's 100% wrong.

This is a good read:

https://pistol-forum.com/showthread.php?4345-LE-308-Loads

Posted: 7/5/2016 6:12:11 AM EDT

[#36]

Delete

Posted: 7/5/2016 6:18:33 AM EDT

[#37]

Quote History

Quoted:

Hornady American Whitetail has dropped every deer I've shot, and shoots accurate enough.

I would imagine it performs equally as well in HD / SD.

View Quote

Glad to hear that, I got a stupid when PSA was selling 300 win and 7mm Remington for 15,17$ box.

Posted: 7/5/2016 9:52:19 AM EDT

[#38]

Quote History

Quoted:

Don't listen to his input, he's 100% wrong.

This is a good read:

https://pistol-forum.com/showthread.php?4345-LE-308-Loads

View Quote View All Quotes

View All Quotes

Quote History

Quoted:

Quoted:
Nobody said the use of these rounds were to be inside. Other than that, it's a good round and just an option that we are discussing. But thanks for your input on the topic.

Don't listen to his input, he's 100% wrong.

This is a good read:

https://pistol-forum.com/showthread.php?4345-LE-308-Loads

i just love Doc's postings. such a professional.

Posted: 7/5/2016 11:27:49 AM EDT

[#39]

Most anything at or above 130gr, open-tip, plastic tip, hollow point, OTM, softpoint anything will be excellent on soft human sized targets.

155gr tipped projectiles sound like a good choice in semiauto 308s.

Posted: 7/5/2016 11:38:01 AM EDT

[#40]

Quote History

Quoted:

Use PISTOLS for home defense

Jeesh go shoot one and you can tell it kills stuff dead without much effort.

View Quote

thats retarded

do you even suppress???

Posted: 7/5/2016 11:48:32 AM EDT

[#41]

I keep mine loaded with 168gr TAP

Posted: 7/6/2016 7:35:07 AM EDT

[#42]

Quote History

Quoted:
You guys crack me up
Who is going to use a .308 for home defense?
Have you ever touched off a handgun round without hearing protection indoors? How loud do you think a .308 would be?
Use PISTOLS for home defense
If you live in a rural setting then great have a rifle handy, but inside a home the pistol or riot gun is king
And if you do shoot at a soft target with a .308 it will kill it dead, weather its a .50 cent FMJ or a $1.50 match grade HP
Jeesh go shoot one and you can tell it kills stuff dead without much effort.

View Quote

I am not opposed to .308 for home defense . A .308 is not going to magically dead someone . It still takes shot placement . If I shoot you in the toe a .308 does not dead you . A pistol is a compromise at best you are talking 20 -25% of the muzzle energy of a rifle . A riot gun is great if birds attack . . The only suggestion missing was to rack the slide . Please think before posting . Remember a deer and a person are pretty comparable in size

Also any of the hunting loads should be great for self defense . I have killed a lot of deer with Hornady 165 grain spire points and all drop dead very quickly . The Remington Cor-Loct loads tend to be not very accurate compared to a lot of others . I pulled a few of these and bullet weights varied a good bit

Posted: 7/9/2016 9:28:21 PM EDT

[#43]

My GII likes PPU 180g soft points so that's what I have on hand. That it is cheap is really nice.

Posted: 7/9/2016 11:25:01 PM EDT

[#44]

Quote History

Quoted:

Especially with no neighbors...

I am not opposed to .308 for home defense . A .308 is not going to magically dead someone . It still takes shot placement . If I shoot you in the toe a .308 does not dead you . A pistol is a compromise at best you are talking 20 -25% of the muzzle energy of a rifle . A riot gun is great if birds attack . . The only suggestion missing was to rack the slide . Please think before posting . Remember a deer and a person are pretty comparable in size

Also any of the hunting loads should be great for self defense . I have killed a lot of deer with Hornady 165 grain spire points and all drop dead very quickly . The Remington Cor-Loct loads tend to be not very accurate compared to a lot of others . I pulled a few of these and bullet weights varied a good bit

View Quote View All Quotes

View All Quotes

Quote History

Quoted:

Quoted:
You guys crack me up
Who is going to use a .308 for home defense?
Have you ever touched off a handgun round without hearing protection indoors? How loud do you think a .308 would be?
Use PISTOLS for home defense
If you live in a rural setting then great have a rifle handy, but inside a home the pistol or riot gun is king
And if you do shoot at a soft target with a .308 it will kill it dead, weather its a .50 cent FMJ or a $1.50 match grade HP
Jeesh go shoot one and you can tell it kills stuff dead without much effort.

Especially with no neighbors...

I am not opposed to .308 for home defense . A .308 is not going to magically dead someone . It still takes shot placement . If I shoot you in the toe a .308 does not dead you . A pistol is a compromise at best you are talking 20 -25% of the muzzle energy of a rifle . A riot gun is great if birds attack . . The only suggestion missing was to rack the slide . Please think before posting . Remember a deer and a person are pretty comparable in size

Also any of the hunting loads should be great for self defense . I have killed a lot of deer with Hornady 165 grain spire points and all drop dead very quickly . The Remington Cor-Loct loads tend to be not very accurate compared to a lot of others . I pulled a few of these and bullet weights varied a good bit

Posted: 7/10/2016 8:36:24 PM EDT

[#45]

Quote History

Quoted:

not sure about if they are still makin it or not but i havent been able to find anymore the past year. i have about as much as you and am not shooting it recreationally, just sitting on it for rainy day. its like have an insurance policy. you might not ever use it but if you do, you'll be glad you had it.

i wonder about the 5.56 version mk318 as well. its still available but with the new version being made for the troops, i questio. whether or not we'll see the original, let alone the new stuff.

View Quote View All Quotes

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Quote History

Quoted:

Quoted:
Just curious but when you said th MK 319 isn't available anymore do you mean it's difficult to find or they're not making it anymore? I have about 300 rounds left and if they're not making it anymore I want to stock up another coup,e hundred.

not sure about if they are still makin it or not but i havent been able to find anymore the past year. i have about as much as you and am not shooting it recreationally, just sitting on it for rainy day. its like have an insurance policy. you might not ever use it but if you do, you'll be glad you had it.

i wonder about the 5.56 version mk318 as well. its still available but with the new version being made for the troops, i questio. whether or not we'll see the original, let alone the new stuff.

It was a production overrun, kind of a one-time deal. Military is going with the M855a1/ M80a1 unleaded rounds. What projectiles Midway got was what was left over after Federal ran through the powder for the rounds.

Posted: 7/10/2016 10:02:55 PM EDT

[#46]

Quote History

Quoted:

I am not opposed to .308 for home defense . A .308 is not going to magically dead someone . It still takes shot placement . If I shoot you in the toe a .308 does not dead you . A pistol is a compromise at best you are talking 20 -25% of the muzzle energy of a rifle . A riot gun is great if birds attack . . The only suggestion missing was to rack the slide . Please think before posting . Remember a deer and a person are pretty comparable in size

Also any of the hunting loads should be great for self defense . I have killed a lot of deer with Hornady 165 grain spire points and all drop dead very quickly . The Remington Cor-Loct loads tend to be not very accurate compared to a lot of others . I pulled a few of these and bullet weights varied a good bit

View Quote View All Quotes

View All Quotes

Quote History

Quoted:

Quoted:
You guys crack me up
Who is going to use a .308 for home defense?
Have you ever touched off a handgun round without hearing protection indoors? How loud do you think a .308 would be?
Use PISTOLS for home defense
If you live in a rural setting then great have a rifle handy, but inside a home the pistol or riot gun is king
And if you do shoot at a soft target with a .308 it will kill it dead, weather its a .50 cent FMJ or a $1.50 match grade HP
Jeesh go shoot one and you can tell it kills stuff dead without much effort.

I am not opposed to .308 for home defense . A .308 is not going to magically dead someone . It still takes shot placement . If I shoot you in the toe a .308 does not dead you . A pistol is a compromise at best you are talking 20 -25% of the muzzle energy of a rifle . A riot gun is great if birds attack . . The only suggestion missing was to rack the slide . Please think before posting . Remember a deer and a person are pretty comparable in size

Also any of the hunting loads should be great for self defense . I have killed a lot of deer with Hornady 165 grain spire points and all drop dead very quickly . The Remington Cor-Loct loads tend to be not very accurate compared to a lot of others . I pulled a few of these and bullet weights varied a good bit

I've had Core-Lokt terminally fail in 30-06 and 30-30. I used the last of it for practice and switched to Winchester PP. It's inaccuracy is just the icing on the cake I suppose.

150 grain 30-30 failed to penetrate a 200lb boar's skull from 30 yards, had to use a handgun to finish him. I had another 150 grain -06 Coke apart on a deer up in PA, bullet broke in half and only could find a piece of it. The saving grace is a chunk of the bullet entered up into its spine and kept her from running off.

Posted: 7/11/2016 10:51:54 PM EDT

[#47]

I just stock up on M80 spec ammo, anything in the torso or upper extremity is going to be a really bad day or whatever it hit.

150grain .30 cal bullets at 2500+ FPS are going to just destroy whatever tissue/bone they hit even if they don't really expand much.

I'm pretty confident that a double tap out of an AR-10/Scar-17/FAL/whatever is going to drop just about anything you're going to find including people.

Posted: 7/12/2016 2:39:08 PM EDT

[#48]

I use 168gr AMAX in my Garand because of its terminal effects. I live in an urban environment so I didn't want m2 ball to be my primary.

Posted: 7/12/2016 7:29:07 PM EDT

[#49]

"I am not opposed to .308 for home defense . A .308 is not going to magically dead someone . It still takes shot placement . If I shoot you in the toe a .308 does not dead you . A pistol is a compromise at best you are talking 20 -25% of the muzzle energy of a rifle . A riot gun is great if birds attack . . The only suggestion missing was to rack the slide . Please think before posting . Remember a deer and a person are pretty comparable in size

Also any of the hunting loads should be great for self defense . I have killed a lot of deer with Hornady 165 grain spire points and all drop dead very quickly . The Remington Cor-Loct loads tend to be not very accurate compared to a lot of others . I pulled a few of these and bullet weights varied a good bit"

EPIC FAIL

And you guys are harassing me about using 45 or 12 ga for home defense

Posted: 7/12/2016 7:56:03 PM EDT

[#50]

For my 308 I use Hornady TAP 155gr AMAX for my SHTF round. Great round if you don't need barrier penetration. I have used that load on deer and was extremely impressed with the internal damage it does. I stocked up deep when it was $14 a box. IMO it's one of the best.

[ARCHIVED THREAD] - self defense 308 ammo? (Page 1 of 2)

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