User Panel
User Panel
User Panel
|
Posted: 6/10/2011 7:57:59 PM EDT
[#1]
Originally Posted By AR15fan:
Is Silver Bear 55Gn generally more accurate or less accurate than Wolf/WPA 55Gn? In my experience, I would say marginally more accurate (and certainly more consistently loaded round to round) than the old Tula produced Wolf. Nowadays, with WPA being produced at Barnaul along with all the Bears, its the same stuff in a differently coated case. |
|
|
|
|
Posted: 10/11/2011 4:41:22 PM EDT
[Last Edit: squirrell18]
[#2]
Nice write up, I tried wolf ammo and it jammed up my colt hbar every shot. I had to donate the rest of the rounds to the South African fund to save the Somali pirates.
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: 10/13/2011 9:39:59 PM EDT
[#3]
Accolades to OP for his post and threads. I used wolf for quite a while. I tempted fate by taking a large group shooting. I had a Colt LE carbine and a Bushmaster SBR. On that day, after a couple mags, the rounds started to freeze in the chambers. I am talking cleaning rod, hammer, and a lot of effort to clear. I chamber brushed the guns and this shit continued. This was Wolf Polymer, black box and military classic.. I am selling off all my stockpile of Wolf .223 because of this. I don't know how it took so long for this to show up. |
|
|
|
|
Posted: 10/14/2011 12:23:40 AM EDT
[#4]
Originally Posted By wildearp:
Accolades to OP for his post and threads.
I used wolf for quite a while. I tempted fate by taking a large group shooting. I had a Colt LE carbine and a Bushmaster SBR. On that day, after a couple mags, the rounds started to freeze in the chambers. I am talking cleaning rod, hammer, and a lot of effort to clear. I chamber brushed the guns and this shit continued. This was Wolf Polymer, black box and military classic.. I am selling off all my stockpile of Wolf .223 because of this. I don't know how it took so long for this to show up. that doesnt seem correct, i believe it happened but its odd to say the least |
|
|
|
PA, USA
|
Posted: 10/14/2011 9:28:40 PM EDT
[#5]
I ran 60 rounds of the Wolf WPA Mil-Classic today (Baunaul stamped box & rim)
here the video.. mag #2 is the Wolf WPA.. though hard to tell it has about the same kick as Federal AE 223 mag #3.. 2 Minute Comparison Video the Tula shot in the 1st mag does not KICK as much, and seems to not quite get the bolt to catch the bolt.. but the bolt carrier.. so the new inserted mag (with the Wolf WPA) has to be manually cycled..  I had this issue before with Tula.. so I wasn't totally shocked..
so.. IMHO.. Tula < Wolf WPA.. the Wolf WPA (new box type).. runs 100% in my BCM 14.5" Middy with Carbine Buffer/Spring.. and DOES cycle the bolt 100% for me.. I just ordered 500 of it for $99.. going to shoot my other 60 rounds of Wolf WPA tomorrow.. (at a savings of $1.93/box over brass PMC XTAC) |
|
|
MN, USA
|
Posted: 10/15/2011 5:35:43 PM EDT
[Last Edit: dlblem]
[#6]
Molon!!! As a retired engineering technician (Cummins Power Gen), all I can say is, "UDAMAN".
|
|
|
KY, USA
|
Posted: 10/29/2011 5:46:28 PM EDT
[#7]
I've been looking at Daniel Defense ARs, but have seen a few comments about problems running Wolf steel case ammo in them. Has anyone out there had any experience using Wolf in DD guns?
|
|
|
|
Posted: 12/5/2011 11:07:36 PM EDT
[#8]
I just ran 196 rounds of the relatively new Wolf WPA 55Gn ammo through a 14.5" bushmaster in about 20 minutes. Only two stoppages, both failures to feed, from bad mags.
The WPA wolf is much improved over the old Tula Wolf. |
|
|
|
|
Posted: 12/5/2011 11:11:54 PM EDT
[#9]
Has anyone ever figured out why Molon dissappeared?
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: 12/6/2011 1:23:55 AM EDT
[#10]
Originally Posted By HeavyMetal:
Has anyone ever figured out why Molon dissappeared? He's hanging out with the cool kids on M4Carbine.net |
|
|
|
|
Posted: 12/6/2011 1:48:22 AM EDT
[#11]
I figured all this out years ago after shooting a couple cases of Wolf. Haven't bought any since.
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: 12/6/2011 6:36:23 AM EDT
[#12]
Originally Posted By Bub0214: I have a 14.5 Midlength DD barrel that eats wolf just fine in FL. Sometime I'd like to try it in cold weather, but it's gonna be 81 here today, December 6I've been looking at Daniel Defense ARs, but have seen a few comments about problems running Wolf steel case ammo in them. Has anyone out there had any experience using Wolf in DD guns? |
|
|
|
TX, USA
|
Posted: 12/6/2011 7:49:25 AM EDT
[#13]
Originally Posted By wildearp:
Accolades to OP for his post and threads.
I used wolf for quite a while. I tempted fate by taking a large group shooting. I had a Colt LE carbine and a Bushmaster SBR. On that day, after a couple mags, the rounds started to freeze in the chambers. I am talking cleaning rod, hammer, and a lot of effort to clear. I chamber brushed the guns and this shit continued. This was Wolf Polymer, black box and military classic.. I am selling off all my stockpile of Wolf .223 because of this. I don't know how it took so long for this to show up. How much, what weight/bullet type, and how much do you want for it lol. 
|
|
|
|
Posted: 12/6/2011 9:58:06 AM EDT
[#14]
Originally Posted By AR15fan:
Originally Posted By HeavyMetal:
Has anyone ever figured out why Molon dissappeared? He's hanging out with the cool kids on M4Carbine.net He ain't there either. He dissappeared from both sites at the same time. |
|
|
|
|
Posted: 12/6/2011 10:15:02 AM EDT
[#15]
Originally Posted By HeavyMetal: Originally Posted By AR15fan: Originally Posted By HeavyMetal: Has anyone ever figured out why Molon dissappeared? He's hanging out with the cool kids on M4Carbine.net He ain't there either. He dissappeared from both sites at the same time. He logged on here last month. Hasn't been on TOS is over a year. |
|
|
|
USA
|
Posted: 12/6/2011 12:48:36 PM EDT
[#16]
Originally Posted By RedFalconBill:
Originally Posted By HeavyMetal:
Originally Posted By AR15fan:
Originally Posted By HeavyMetal:
Has anyone ever figured out why Molon dissappeared? He's hanging out with the cool kids on M4Carbine.net He ain't there either. He dissappeared from both sites at the same time. He logged on here last month. Hasn't been on TOS is over a year. Here's to hoping he comes back with loads of kick ass new data. |
|
|
|
Posted: 1/8/2012 1:34:54 PM EDT
[Last Edit: owlless]
[#17]
Originally Posted By chris65:
Originally Posted By GHPorter:
Nicely done. You have demonstrated that Wolf generally goes somewhere close to where you point it and doesn't care whether it gets there through a 1:7 or 1:9 twist barrel. I assume that your dog is still in good health as well. It would be interesting to see what sort of numbers that ammo chrono'd at. Some of the target impacts being far enough away from the rest of the bunch make it look like velocities weren't particularly consistent. Again, great work. Agreed - always great work by Molon. Or a 1-8 twist barrel...  In June, I shot some Wolf Black Box 55gr FMJ through my Wilson 1-8 20" non free float from a bench, bagged front and back, 5x scope, out to 50 yards....
3025 3033 2970 3032 3032 Ave = 3018 Es = 63 Sd = 27 Ad = 19 Center to Center (CTC) 5-round group was 1.680". I know five rounds is a small sample, but I was surprised at the velocity consistency of the Wolf 55s. I was working up a load for 55gr Hornady V-Maxs (same day/gun/bench set-up), 23.4gr H322 averaged 2919 and went into a 0.975" group at 50 yards. This load and four other were fired before I gave the Wolf a "shot". I'll look for my data, but your data is what I recall for the 55grain Wolf too. Averages just over 3000. IIRC the 75 grain black box was getting around 2700 fps or a tad under. Edited to say out of a 16" 1/7 chrome barrel. |
|
|
|
NJ, USA
|
Posted: 1/10/2012 2:36:36 PM EDT
[#18]
wow great write up!
|
|
|
|
Posted: 1/11/2012 12:06:59 AM EDT
[#19]
First I would like to thank Molon for another great post. Excellent information as always.
I've shot 10's of thousands of rounds of Wolf over the years. I have a indoor 25 yard range 15 minutes from my home that only allows HP and SP. So I used to pick up Wolf HP for $99 per $1,000 and shoot the hell out of it all winter. More than 2k per month average for a few years. I've been very lucky with it and even reload the older boxer cases. It's not accurate stuff but at short ranges and carbine classes the stuff works fine. My results at 100 yards are all over the place and varies a great deal from lot to lot. It is never great and 3.5 MOA would be excellent. Some times it can be more than double that. I've been called a Wolf fanboy, but even I'm shocked when I see guys claim MOA groups with the stuff. I say no way. |
|
|
|
|
Posted: 1/27/2012 10:49:02 PM EDT
[#20]
I've fired over 1000 Rounds of WPA wolf now. Still have not experianced a single failure the extract. its much better than the older Wolf ammo I had tried.
|
|
|
|
WI, USA
|
Posted: 5/6/2014 6:52:49 AM EDT
[#21]
That Wolf 75 grain shot just terrible!!! Holy Shit.
|
|
|
|
Posted: 5/6/2014 7:07:54 AM EDT
[#22]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Green0: That Wolf 75 grain shot just terrible!!! Holy Shit. |
|
|
|
|
Posted: 5/6/2014 2:32:52 PM EDT
[#23]
Holy Necromancer
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: 5/6/2014 11:12:34 PM EDT
[#24]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By arres:
Holy Necromancer Right out of left field |
|
|
|
|
Posted: 5/7/2014 3:21:33 AM EDT
[#25]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Green0:
That Wolf 75 grain shot just terrible!!! Holy Shit. Considering the ammunition tested was produced by Tula and Wolf no longer works with them nor imports ammunition from them the article is a bit outdated. |
|
|
|
FL, USA
|
Posted: 8/26/2014 7:28:50 AM EDT
[Last Edit: USPH2]
[#26]
First Let me say good work on the test, I have to say your groups seemed overly large, looking at some of the targets you posted you seem to be all over the place. I have shot wolf ammo with 55 grain and 62 grain loads and my groups averaged less than 2 inches with my best group ever coming with Wolf 55 grain ammo 16 in barrel 1/7 twist with a Leopold .223 scope and the 5 shot group from a bench rest was .56 inches, that is less than inch. To be honest most of my groups if I do my part are less than 2 inches at 100 yards. I can shoot free hand with open sights and still get 3-4 inches at 100 yards. Most of the people in my shooting club can duplicate this level of accurate groups with ease.
|
|
|
|
Posted: 8/26/2014 8:35:36 AM EDT
[#27]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By USPH2:
First Let me say good work on the test, I have to say your groups seemed overly large, looking at some of the targets you posted you seem to be all over the place. I have shot wolf ammo with 55 grain and 62 grain loads and my groups averaged less than 2 inches with my best group ever coming with Wolf 55 grain ammo 16 in barrel 1/7 twist with a Leopold .223 scope and the 5 shot group from a bench rest was .56 inches, that is less than inch. To be honest most of my groups if I do my part are less than 2 inches at 100 yards. I can shoot free hand with open sights and still get 3-4 inches at 100 yards. Most of the people in my shooting club can duplicate this level of accurate groups with ease. New Wolf is different than old Wolf. Please scan pics of your statically significant (three 10 shot groups would be good, five 10 shot groups better) 0.56" groups. |
|
|
|
FL, USA
|
Posted: 8/26/2014 10:56:53 AM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By RedFalconBill:
New Wolf is different than old Wolf. Please scan pics of your statically significant (three 10 shot groups would be good, five 10 shot groups better) 0.56" groups. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By RedFalconBill:
Originally Posted By USPH2:
First Let me say good work on the test, I have to say your groups seemed overly large, looking at some of the targets you posted you seem to be all over the place. I have shot wolf ammo with 55 grain and 62 grain loads and my groups averaged less than 2 inches with my best group ever coming with Wolf 55 grain ammo 16 in barrel 1/7 twist with a Leopold .223 scope and the 5 shot group from a bench rest was .56 inches, that is less than inch. To be honest most of my groups if I do my part are less than 2 inches at 100 yards. I can shoot free hand with open sights and still get 3-4 inches at 100 yards. Most of the people in my shooting club can duplicate this level of accurate groups with ease. New Wolf is different than old Wolf. Please scan pics of your statically significant (three 10 shot groups would be good, five 10 shot groups better) 0.56" groups. I would but that was some time ago and all of the stars aligned just right that day and I have not been able to repeat it, but I try believe me. Best recent group was just over an inch, and that was the best of a five shot string of 3 shots. Average is about 1'5 inches I can consistently shot. I have tried the new wolf and the main difference I see is it is much cleaner than old wolf but accuracy is about the same. |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/27/2014 1:25:54 PM EDT
[#29]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By USPH2:
I would but that was some time ago and all of the stars aligned just right that day and I have not been able to repeat it, but I try believe me. Best recent group was just over an inch, and that was the best of a five shot string of 3 shots. Average is about 1'5 inches I can consistently shot. I have tried the new wolf and the main difference I see is it is much cleaner than old wolf but accuracy is about the same. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By USPH2:
Originally Posted By RedFalconBill:
Originally Posted By USPH2:
First Let me say good work on the test, I have to say your groups seemed overly large, looking at some of the targets you posted you seem to be all over the place. I have shot wolf ammo with 55 grain and 62 grain loads and my groups averaged less than 2 inches with my best group ever coming with Wolf 55 grain ammo 16 in barrel 1/7 twist with a Leopold .223 scope and the 5 shot group from a bench rest was .56 inches, that is less than inch. To be honest most of my groups if I do my part are less than 2 inches at 100 yards. I can shoot free hand with open sights and still get 3-4 inches at 100 yards. Most of the people in my shooting club can duplicate this level of accurate groups with ease. New Wolf is different than old Wolf. Please scan pics of your statically significant (three 10 shot groups would be good, five 10 shot groups better) 0.56" groups. I would but that was some time ago and all of the stars aligned just right that day and I have not been able to repeat it, but I try believe me. Best recent group was just over an inch, and that was the best of a five shot string of 3 shots. Average is about 1'5 inches I can consistently shot. I have tried the new wolf and the main difference I see is it is much cleaner than old wolf but accuracy is about the same. I don't believe you. |
|
|
|
|
Posted: 8/27/2014 2:51:14 PM EDT
[#30]
Let's just stop this right here - we are not going to crap up this thread with a pissing match about who shot the pecker off a gnat at 300 yards with Wolf.
Anyone making claims of great accuracy with Wolf, post pictures that are comparable to what Molon used when he started this thread, or start another thread to discuss your accomplishment. |
|
|
|
CO, USA
|
Posted: 9/2/2014 1:56:26 PM EDT
[#31]
Great post and thanks for your contribution!
|
|
|
|
Posted: 9/2/2014 5:02:06 PM EDT
[#32]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By USPH2:
First Let me say good work on the test, I have to say your groups seemed overly large, looking at some of the targets you posted you seem to be all over the place. I have shot wolf ammo with 55 grain and 62 grain loads and my groups averaged less than 2 inches with my best group ever coming with Wolf 55 grain ammo 16 in barrel 1/7 twist with a Leopold .223 scope and the 5 shot group from a bench rest was .56 inches, that is less than inch. To be honest most of my groups if I do my part are less than 2 inches at 100 yards. I can shoot free hand with open sights and still get 3-4 inches at 100 yards. Most of the people in my shooting club can duplicate this level of accurate groups with ease. I have to quote this so I can improve |
|
|
|
MN, USA
|
Posted: 9/3/2014 10:19:10 PM EDT
[#33]
Ahh, OK.
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By USPH2:
First Let me say good work on the test, I have to say your groups seemed overly large, looking at some of the targets you posted you seem to be all over the place. I have shot wolf ammo with 55 grain and 62 grain loads and my groups averaged less than 2 inches with my best group ever coming with Wolf 55 grain ammo 16 in barrel 1/7 twist with a Leopold .223 scope and the 5 shot group from a bench rest was .56 inches, that is less than inch. To be honest most of my groups if I do my part are less than 2 inches at 100 yards. I can shoot free hand with open sights and still get 3-4 inches at 100 yards. Most of the people in my shooting club can duplicate this level of accurate groups with ease. |
|
|
|
Posted: 9/4/2014 8:18:28 AM EDT
[Last Edit: Gunwritr]
[#34]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Eric802:
Let's just stop this right here - we are not going to crap up this thread with a pissing match about who shot the pecker off a gnat at 300 yards with Wolf. Anyone making claims of great accuracy with Wolf, post pictures that are comparable to what Molon used when he started this thread, or start another thread to discuss your accomplishment. Considering the ammunition Molon tested was manufactured at Tula Cartridge Works and Wolf and Tula split YEARS ago this thread should probably be deleted. The current production Wolf steel case ammunition is produced at different factories using different cases, bullets and powder......... as an example the Tula cases were Boxer primed the current cases are Berdan primed..... |
|
|
|
|
Posted: 9/6/2014 12:23:24 PM EDT
[#35]
I have shot a lot of Wolf ammo and never had any luck with the groups you have. I must be doing some thing wrong.
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: 9/6/2014 1:06:30 PM EDT
[#36]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Gunwritr: Considering the ammunition Molon tested was manufactured at Tula Cartridge Works and Wolf and Tula split YEARS ago this thread should probably be deleted. The current production Wolf steel case ammunition is produced at different factories using different cases, bullets and powder......... as an example the Tula cases were Boxer primed the current cases are Berdan primed..... Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Gunwritr: Originally Posted By Eric802: Let's just stop this right here - we are not going to crap up this thread with a pissing match about who shot the pecker off a gnat at 300 yards with Wolf. Anyone making claims of great accuracy with Wolf, post pictures that are comparable to what Molon used when he started this thread, or start another thread to discuss your accomplishment. Considering the ammunition Molon tested was manufactured at Tula Cartridge Works and Wolf and Tula split YEARS ago this thread should probably be deleted. The current production Wolf steel case ammunition is produced at different factories using different cases, bullets and powder......... as an example the Tula cases were Boxer primed the current cases are Berdan primed..... no, this thread must be saved for the tutorial it provides on how to professionally test ammo and evaluate the results. To delete it due to its age would be equivalent to throwing away Shakespeare because the language is old. |
|
|
|
|
Posted: 9/6/2014 1:26:01 PM EDT
[#37]
I agree with MRW. I don't think ANY new experience should be added, because as has been noted, the stuff labeled "Wolf" today isn't made by the same manufacturer, and is thus NOT comparable. But the methodology, the step-by-step care, and the documentation in the original post and its contemporary replies is exceptionally clear and useful as a model for testing ammunition. Maybe the mods should lock the thread, and keep it as a tutorial...
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: 9/7/2014 9:46:44 AM EDT
[#38]
Agreed. Won't be deleted, won't be archived.
|
|
|
Win a FREE Membership!
Sign up for the ARFCOM weekly newsletter and be entered to win a free ARFCOM membership. One new winner* is announced every week!
You will receive an email every Friday morning featuring the latest chatter from the hottest topics, breaking news surrounding legislation, as well as exclusive deals only available to ARFCOM email subscribers.
AR15.COM is the world's largest firearm community and is a gathering place for firearm enthusiasts of all types.
From hunters and military members, to competition shooters and general firearm enthusiasts, we welcome anyone who values and respects the way of the firearm.
Subscribe to our monthly Newsletter to receive firearm news, product discounts from your favorite Industry Partners, and more.
Copyright © 1996-2024 AR15.COM LLC. All Rights Reserved.
Any use of this content without express written consent is prohibited.
AR15.Com reserves the right to overwrite or replace any affiliate, commercial, or monetizable links, posted by users, with our own.
