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Page AR-15 » Rimfire and Pistol Calibers
AR Sponsor: bravocompany
Posted: 6/15/2016 12:49:03 PM EDT
BLUF: I have a Spikes Conversion kit with extra spring and three Black Dog mags.  Used to run like crap, and haven't touched it in years.  Now that my wife and daughter both have ARs, I'm thinking I might try to revitalize the conversion kit.  It there a particularly useful 'fluff and buff' guide or tips on making them run better?  

I did a search and will follow the tacked tip for making an AR22 run smoother, but am wondering specifically about Spikes and similar drop in conversion kits rather than dedicated 22 ARs or uppers.

---
I found a few Black Dog mags (with polymer [not nylon or steel] feedlips) and a Spike's conversion kit in a parts box.  I tried to run it several times years ago, but it ran like crap.  Every 2-3 rounds would require me to use a multitool to pry brass out from between the bolt and charging handle or gas tube (Colt 6920 with BCM Gunfighter if it matters).  After multiple range trips and a few hundred miserable rounds, I abandoned the idea.

I'm not looking to build or buy a dedicated upper right now, and not dying to shoot .22lr in an AR. This is just for giggles since I have one already and quit trying to figure out how to make it run years ago. As such, I imagine I might have missed a revelation or two since then.  Again, I will follow the thread that is tacked as closely as possible and I know dedicated uppers run a lot better, but want to see if this thing is worth bringing out of retirement or if any additional insights regarding conversion kits/ older Black Dog mags have come down the road since 2011-ish.

Thanks!
Link Posted: 6/15/2016 1:38:11 PM EDT
[#1]
polish anything on the conversion that  is metal on metal with Flitz (or similar)..  the rails, feed ramp, and the top of the breach (where the ammo will ride/slide as it is inserted). Also polish the firing pin and extractor.. I actually replaced some of those parts with this TACCOM reliability kit

you need to break any new kit in with high velocity ammo (think CCI mini-mag) - after that mine runs close to perfect on federal bulk

.22 LR is a hit or miss on reliability no matter what.. even the CCI will give you a mis-fire every so often..


I have an older Ciener conversion and after polishing it really good, and breaking it in it will run about +95% with bulk ammo now. It runs much better on better ammo.

with my Glock 26 .22LR conversion I found that if i spray the ammo with WD-40 it make improve feeding about 3 or 4x over non sprayed.. but i have not had a chance to try that on the AR conversion.

Good luck

Brian

Link Posted: 6/15/2016 3:58:15 PM EDT
[#2]
All of my CMMG conversions have always dropped in and run 100% with any ammo, in semi-automatic.  Full auto has been another story, but not relevant to most shooters.

The specific malfunction you mention is cured in several ways - first is replacing the extractor, since that malfunction is caused by the extractor slipping off the rim so that the empty casing bounces up inside the receiver instead of being ejected out when the case hits the ejector.  The second line of defense is an anti-jam charging handle - either purchased as such from CMMG, or filling part of the channel in the charging handle with bondo or rtv silicone or the like, so there's no cavity for the empty casing to stick in.
Link Posted: 6/15/2016 7:06:04 PM EDT
[#3]
If the 22 conversion moves inside the upper receiver this can cause malfunctions.  TACCOM sells a pressure plug which goes in front of the buffer putting forward pressure on the 22 rimfire bolt.  I had a nickel Spike's drop in 22 conversion with two O rings on the chamber insert.  My Spike's conversion ran good in two or three different uppers with 1:9 twist barrels.   I gave the conversion to my Brother who eventually sold his AR-15 and the Spike's conversion.  

I'd also recommend polishing the chamber insert with a barrel mop with Flitz.  I use a short cleaning rod attached to a hand drill.  If an unfired shell will not fall out a chamber insert polish the chamber.
Link Posted: 6/15/2016 7:13:02 PM EDT
[#4]
Use a Taccon pressure plug... Around 8 bucks will tighten everything up.  Also minimal lube.  Lube is the enemy of .22lr because of the dirty ammo.
Link Posted: 6/15/2016 7:52:59 PM EDT
[#5]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
polish anything on the conversion that  is metal on metal with Flitz (or similar)..  the rails, feed ramp, and the top of the breach (where the ammo will ride/slide as it is inserted). Also polish the firing pin and extractor.. I actually replaced some of those parts with this TACCOM reliability kit
you need to break any new kit in with high velocity ammo (think CCI mini-mag) - after that mine runs close to perfect on federal bulk
.22 LR is a hit or miss on reliability no matter what.. even the CCI will give you a mis-fire every so often..
I have an older Ciener conversion and after polishing it really good, and breaking it in it will run about +95% with bulk ammo now. It runs much better on better ammo.
with my Glock 26 .22LR conversion I found that if i spray the ammo with WD-40 it make improve feeding about 3 or 4x over non sprayed.. but i have not had a chance to try that on the AR conversion.
Good luck
Brian
View Quote


Spike you got a sewing maching for what you have.  They got so fed up with them, that they stopped selling them and offering the warranty.  I would start with the TACCOM Reliability kit and a CMMG anti-Jam charging handle.  That should get you up and running.  If not let us know what changed, and we will help you out.

MAHA
Link Posted: 6/15/2016 8:30:38 PM EDT
[#6]
If your efforts start to push into the $350 range, you may want to consider just getting a S&W M&P 15-22.  That would be the easy button, cheaper than a dedicated upper, and NAPA solvent trap on the front is still lower than that the front sight tower.  You can also get them in girly colors too.

Link Posted: 6/16/2016 12:07:49 AM EDT
[#7]
Ah. the old Spikes .22 conversion. Yes, some of  us remember that.....ah......thing.  Spikes was, at one time, one of the first big players in the dedicated .22 market. They tried to do the .22 conversion up right, plating it and such to make it run better. But they had problems. There are good reasons why they stepped away from that market.

I did my time with one. I had a Ciener .22 conversion that ran great but like a fool sold it and bought that slick looking Spikes thing. I paid for that mistake many times over.  What I found out about the Spikes was that it would work OK with some lowers and some ammo but in other rifles it just couldn't be made to work. Along the way some figured out it was a matter of what hammer you were using in the lower if I recall. Tom at Spikes worked with me on trying to make it run correctly and I thank him from the bottom of my heart for all his efforts. But, it was just too inconsistent to trust.

If you have a lower it will run with than it will perform. But if you don't have the parts it likes, good luck with it. Like I said, there is a good reason they quit selling them.
Link Posted: 6/16/2016 12:33:27 AM EDT
[#8]
This is all great info, people!

I've got a sick toddler at home while my wife is on a family vacation without us (and it's our anniversary), so my hands are a bit full for a few days.  I will definitely give the polishing and charging handle a try. Will order the kit, too.  I've got a few lowers I can try it with and see if that helps.

As I recall, I ran mostly CCI Mini-Mags in it, and a bit of Federal 550 round bulk.   I think I ran some Stingers, too.  I remember trying hotter and hotter stuff hoping it would help.  My daughter's 10/22 BX-25 mags hate anything that is HP including CCI, so I've put together a bit of round nose.  Maybe I'll try a wide variety starting with CCI SV and Mini Mag round nose, as well, as I apply all of your tips.  

I have a few days before I can get to my bench to do some polishing, so keep 'em coming if you have any other thoughts.  I appreciate it!
Link Posted: 6/16/2016 9:27:48 AM EDT
[#9]
The CMMG 22 charging handle helps too. It's mostly solid, which helps keep the spent brass out of that little channel. And +1 on the plug.



CMMG is the way to go, Spikes was way too unreliable.
Link Posted: 6/24/2016 11:49:41 PM EDT
[#10]
My spikes conversion for the lmt mrp set up has worked well from day one. Once the chamber starts to get extremely dirty, it will start to jam a bit but I just run a snake through it and some lube. Fixes it up right away. usually takes a couple to a few hundred rounds to get it dirty enough to start to jam.
Link Posted: 6/27/2016 12:43:27 PM EDT
[#11]
With Spikes, it either ran or it didn't. At one time Spikes had about 22 pages of "How to make it run" if that tells you anything.

First, the rail was too soft and Spikes encouraged people to take it apart. Once the rails were bent, they would never be the same.
The feed ramp had too much angle and many times was not lined up with the chamber. It should not have a gap, just a smooth transition.

Too much play fore and aft in the BCG also caused problems. Never consistant.

Try the Taccom "Plug" to tighten it up.
Check for a smooth transition between the feed ramp and chamber.
Make sure the rails are not bent. The bolt should ride with very little resistance.

CMMG got it right with the original drop ins, but they can't leave anything alone. Just keep changing and adding useless parts.

If you can find an old original stainless CMMG, grab it.

Dave N
Page AR-15 » Rimfire and Pistol Calibers
AR Sponsor: bravocompany
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