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sinlessorrow
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Posted: 1/16/2012 9:01:24 PM
Originally Posted By marko16:




Originally Posted By sinlessorrow:
Originally Posted By zulthor:
Originally Posted By sinlessorrow:
As far as accurace

Lwrci followed by pws imo

Ive seen lerc hit .5 and pws hit .8 moa


Ever see an AA hit .681 moa? With Russian surplus.

http://img23.imageshack.us/img23/162/545100ydnov.jpg

Checkout the awesome accuracy nutnfancy was getting from his LWRC http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3pM54oGTSv0 Skip to the 30 minute mark and you'll see groups ranging from .50" to 3" and almost all the good groups were with expensive match ammo(Federal Gold medal match, etc)... With normal ammo the groups weren't so great... That's just one example but I've seen plenty of guys getting both great and mediocre groups with LWRC's.


im not sure how you got .6moa with russian surplus its basically defies the laws of physics, since you know molon couldnt even get close to that using a mechanical rest

also nutnfancy isnt held to very high regard here


Actually there is the wolf ammo test thread and he did get a sub MOA with wolf. It was a 3 rd pick, but all ten rounds were 3-4in. It can happen, just don't count on it.



Thats also a great example of why most consider a 5 shot group the min and a 10 shot group the ideal
Tire
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Posted: 1/16/2012 11:11:46 PM
[Last Edit: 1/16/2012 11:12:10 PM by Tire]
10 10 shot groups.. lets see that.
just beacuse you have shot ONE 5 shot group under and inch means shit. I shoot those consistently in a nice bolt rifle.. but i still consider it a 1 moa rifle becasue it or I cant do it EVERY single time.
Sleeper396
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Posted: 1/16/2012 11:30:53 PM
Originally Posted By Tire:
10 10 shot groups.. lets see that.
just beacuse you have shot ONE 5 shot group under and inch means shit. I shoot those consistently in a nice bolt rifle.. but i still consider it a 1 moa rifle becasue it or I cant do it EVERY single time.
How about we do 20 20 shot groups or 40 40 shot groups while we are at it? Honestly a couple of 5 shot shot groups is all you need to judge accuracy. People go overboard when trying to judge accuracy.
sinlessorrow
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Posted: 1/16/2012 11:37:14 PM
Originally Posted By Sleeper396:
Originally Posted By Tire:
10 10 shot groups.. lets see that.
just beacuse you have shot ONE 5 shot group under and inch means shit. I shoot those consistently in a nice bolt rifle.. but i still consider it a 1 moa rifle becasue it or I cant do it EVERY single time.
How about we do 20 20 shot groups or 40 40 shot groups while we are at it? Honestly a couple of 5 shot shot groups is all you need to judge accuracy. People go overboard when trying to judge accuracy.


you actually should do 10-5shot groups and get the avg of all 10 groups
The_Evil_One
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Posted: 1/17/2012 12:05:20 AM
In Army BRM your expected to hit and kill targets at 300 meters with iron sights. So you'll excuse me if I don't bat an eye at the fact you can make a shot group the size of a quarter at 100 yards with a scope with I can only guess how much time in between shots. Sure I get the bragging rights or whatever it is you are going for but in my eyes it's bullshit because the only thing that matters is hitting and killing your target.

You aren't some delta operator trying to make a vital shot to free a hostage or some scout sniper trying to get that one shot kill. I've just wanted to say this for a while so please do understand why I'm not too impressed because it is not something you will need to worry about unless your LEO, military, or some competitor.

Most hits from my experience in BRM come from the 100 - 150m mark. This is all done with irons. Not some high power scope.

As I said sorry if I offended anyone but this is just my view and personal opinion on this whole accuracy thing. Please take it as that and no I'm not some Jack Bauer who can shoot you in the heart with a pistol at 100m's with one hand but to me all this fancy crap just makes it too easy in my eyes especially when there is no stress involved. Boy when you put limited exposure targets in there watch your shot group go to shit.

Just something I feel I needed to vent. Please though if you can try it with irons or put some distance on those shots if you can. I would love to see someone rub my face in the mud. I really can't put anything up as I'm not exactly at my home and don't have my rifle out here where I am and no it won't be coming to me for the time I can see so don't ask.

Please do keep in mind the kind of shooting I do is different and this is just my opinion on this matter as I said before that I feel I needed to let out.

Please don't hurt me.
"My country. May she always be right; but right or wrong--My Country!"

"Hatred is the cowards way of being intimidated."

"Ignorance is acceptable. Laziness is not."
Blackwind
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Posted: 1/17/2012 12:07:06 AM
Originally Posted By sinlessorrow:
Originally Posted By kubitza1234:
So would you guys build one or buy one ready such as the JP CTR-O2? If building one who makes best billet uppers and lowers ? Black rain , JP, POF or? Also who makes best internals and barrels . Not against building one I just want to make sure its a shoot with good ammo when done. I usually shoot Hornady ballstic tip ammo. Thanks for the info so far.


if you want the best imo thats PWS and LWRCI


" We sleep safe in our beds because rough men stand ready in the night to visit violence on those who would do us harm. " -George Orwell
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Edvvard
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Posted: 1/17/2012 12:18:25 AM
I'll get crap for this, but can an AA piston be used with an LMT MRP upper?
Rickymachinegun
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Posted: 1/17/2012 4:56:26 PM
[Last Edit: 1/17/2012 4:56:45 PM by Rickymachinegun]
Originally Posted By The_Evil_One:
In Army BRM your expected to hit and kill targets at 300 meters with iron sights. So you'll excuse me if I don't bat an eye at the fact you can make a shot group the size of a quarter at 100 yards with a scope with I can only guess how much time in between shots. Sure I get the bragging rights or whatever it is you are going for but in my eyes it's bullshit because the only thing that matters is hitting and killing your target.

You aren't some delta operator trying to make a vital shot to free a hostage or some scout sniper trying to get that one shot kill. I've just wanted to say this for a while so please do understand why I'm not too impressed because it is not something you will need to worry about unless your LEO, military, or some competitor.

Most hits from my experience in BRM come from the 100 - 150m mark. This is all done with irons. Not some high power scope.

As I said sorry if I offended anyone but this is just my view and personal opinion on this whole accuracy thing. Please take it as that and no I'm not some Jack Bauer who can shoot you in the heart with a pistol at 100m's with one hand but to me all this fancy crap just makes it too easy in my eyes especially when there is no stress involved. Boy when you put limited exposure targets in there watch your shot group go to shit.

Just something I feel I needed to vent. Please though if you can try it with irons or put some distance on those shots if you can. I would love to see someone rub my face in the mud. I really can't put anything up as I'm not exactly at my home and don't have my rifle out here where I am and no it won't be coming to me for the time I can see so don't ask.

Please do keep in mind the kind of shooting I do is different and this is just my opinion on this matter as I said before that I feel I needed to let out.

Please don't hurt me.


I agree with you for the most part but some of us don't just use our AR for smokin bad guys. Alot of people use their AR for other reasons ie target shooting (shooting pin point makes it more fun to accomplish this), coyote hunting, prairie doggin/ground hoggin, home defense, SHTF and just range shooting in general.

I rather enjoy being able to shoot nice tight groups when I bench my M6A3. just sayin


shade_1313
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Posted: 1/17/2012 9:29:42 PM
The forthcoming LWRC M6IC looks to be amazing, in terms of accuracy, tweaks to reliability, and a slight change to the gas venting from the piston/gas block.
Socialism is to Communism as HIV is to AIDS. - drizzle

You would be shocked to find out what my mouth can handle. - EXPcustom
sinlessorrow
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Posted: 1/17/2012 9:48:14 PM
Originally Posted By shade_1313:
The forthcoming LWRC M6IC looks to be amazing, in terms of accuracy, tweaks to reliability, and a slight change to the gas venting from the piston/gas block.


it should have won the IC program but its a conspiracy!!! well thats what the latest shooting time says
RUTGERS95
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Posted: 1/17/2012 9:50:31 PM
Originally Posted By shade_1313:
The forthcoming LWRC M6IC looks to be amazing, in terms of accuracy, tweaks to reliability, and a slight change to the gas venting from the piston/gas block.


it really is.....wow
shade_1313
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Posted: 1/17/2012 9:51:08 PM

Originally Posted By sinlessorrow:
Originally Posted By shade_1313:
The forthcoming LWRC M6IC looks to be amazing, in terms of accuracy, tweaks to reliability, and a slight change to the gas venting from the piston/gas block.


it should have won the IC program but its a conspiracy!!! well thats what the latest shooting time says

I know, I picket that issue up this morning.

I wish I knew just how the solicitation was amended, but either way, I like the sound of the new features the IC has.
Socialism is to Communism as HIV is to AIDS. - drizzle

You would be shocked to find out what my mouth can handle. - EXPcustom
The_Evil_One
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Posted: 1/17/2012 10:50:00 PM
Originally Posted By Rickymachinegun:
Originally Posted By The_Evil_One:
In Army BRM your expected to hit and kill targets at 300 meters with iron sights. So you'll excuse me if I don't bat an eye at the fact you can make a shot group the size of a quarter at 100 yards with a scope with I can only guess how much time in between shots. Sure I get the bragging rights or whatever it is you are going for but in my eyes it's bullshit because the only thing that matters is hitting and killing your target.

You aren't some delta operator trying to make a vital shot to free a hostage or some scout sniper trying to get that one shot kill. I've just wanted to say this for a while so please do understand why I'm not too impressed because it is not something you will need to worry about unless your LEO, military, or some competitor.

Most hits from my experience in BRM come from the 100 - 150m mark. This is all done with irons. Not some high power scope.

As I said sorry if I offended anyone but this is just my view and personal opinion on this whole accuracy thing. Please take it as that and no I'm not some Jack Bauer who can shoot you in the heart with a pistol at 100m's with one hand but to me all this fancy crap just makes it too easy in my eyes especially when there is no stress involved. Boy when you put limited exposure targets in there watch your shot group go to shit.

Just something I feel I needed to vent. Please though if you can try it with irons or put some distance on those shots if you can. I would love to see someone rub my face in the mud. I really can't put anything up as I'm not exactly at my home and don't have my rifle out here where I am and no it won't be coming to me for the time I can see so don't ask.

Please do keep in mind the kind of shooting I do is different and this is just my opinion on this matter as I said before that I feel I needed to let out.

Please don't hurt me.


I agree with you for the most part but some of us don't just use our AR for smokin bad guys. Alot of people use their AR for other reasons ie target shooting (shooting pin point makes it more fun to accomplish this), coyote hunting, prairie doggin/ground hoggin, home defense, SHTF and just range shooting in general.

I rather enjoy being able to shoot nice tight groups when I bench my M6A3. just sayin




On the flip side of the coin my own AR is used for most of those things you mentioned. I fucking wish I could smoke bad guys with it because no offense but any rifle the army gives me has nothing on mine.
"My country. May she always be right; but right or wrong--My Country!"

"Hatred is the cowards way of being intimidated."

"Ignorance is acceptable. Laziness is not."
sinlessorrow
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Posted: 1/17/2012 11:09:48 PM
Originally Posted By shade_1313:

Originally Posted By sinlessorrow:
Originally Posted By shade_1313:
The forthcoming LWRC M6IC looks to be amazing, in terms of accuracy, tweaks to reliability, and a slight change to the gas venting from the piston/gas block.


it should have won the IC program but its a conspiracy!!! well thats what the latest shooting time says

I know, I picket that issue up this morning.

I wish I knew just how the solicitation was amended, but either way, I like the sound of the new features the IC has.


the IC does have awesome features, but that shooting times article was pathetic. it read like a paid advertisement from a butt hurt LWRCI
kubitza1234
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Posted: 1/18/2012 8:53:11 AM
Yes this gun will be used for mainly varmint hunting such as prairie dogs,coyote,targets etc etc so yes accuracy is a must. Also no its nothing special to have a good scope and accurate gun and shoot a tight group at a 100yrds. But if a mini-14 can be modded to for under 2k a 2-3k AR-15 damn sure better or i would be very pissed.
45-Seventy
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Posted: 1/18/2012 10:02:50 AM
Originally Posted By Edvvard:
I'll get crap for this, but can an AA piston be used with an LMT MRP upper?


I don't believe so, but I could be wrong. However, with an MRP upper you'd be able to drop in an LMT piston barrel and BCG for something like 6 and a half.
mouthpiece
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Posted: 1/18/2012 10:15:20 AM
I'd rather start out with an accurate platform, not have to build into accuracy.

I'd stay away from AA.
I asked several times about what materials they were making their products out of and they never would answer me.
At the time i was researching piston systems they did not have materialmspecs on their website either.
He offered to let me shoot one of his rifles at some shoot in Missouri if i recall, but never did answer to the specs of their products.
Kappax1
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Posted: 1/18/2012 1:26:18 PM
lwrc, buy many, be happy
LA_357SIG
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Posted: 1/19/2012 12:13:42 PM
Originally Posted By The_Evil_One:
In Army BRM your expected to hit and kill targets at 300 meters with iron sights. So you'll excuse me if I don't bat an eye at the fact you can make a shot group the size of a quarter at 100 yards with a scope with I can only guess how much time in between shots.
<snip>
As I said sorry if I offended anyone but this is just my view and personal opinion on this whole accuracy thing.
<snip>
Please do keep in mind the kind of shooting I do is different and this is just my opinion on this matter as I said before that I feel I needed to let out.

Please don't hurt me.


There is a big difference between testing the accuracy potential of the shooter and the accuracy potential of the rifle. There is also a direct relationship between the two. How can you (the shooter) determine your ability if the weapon you are shooting is not capable of being accurate?

Anyway, I agree completely and would like to repost my old sigline in support.
"The fullsize A2 with a 20 inch barrel is the end of a long historical line of weaponry where the shooter was a real rifleman and not just some guy popping off rounds at 25 yards while looking through a magic looking glass." - JBnTX
Rifle > Carbine
Sleeper396
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Posted: 1/19/2012 6:00:13 PM
Originally Posted By LA_357SIG:
Originally Posted By The_Evil_One:
In Army BRM your expected to hit and kill targets at 300 meters with iron sights. So you'll excuse me if I don't bat an eye at the fact you can make a shot group the size of a quarter at 100 yards with a scope with I can only guess how much time in between shots.
<snip>
As I said sorry if I offended anyone but this is just my view and personal opinion on this whole accuracy thing.
<snip>
Please do keep in mind the kind of shooting I do is different and this is just my opinion on this matter as I said before that I feel I needed to let out.

Please don't hurt me.


There is a big difference between testing the accuracy potential of the shooter and the accuracy potential of the rifle. There is also a direct relationship between the two. How can you (the shooter) determine your ability if the weapon you are shooting is not capable of being accurate?

Anyway, I agree completely and would like to repost my old sigline in support.
"The fullsize A2 with a 20 inch barrel is the end of a long historical line of weaponry where the shooter was a real rifleman and not just some guy popping off rounds at 25 yards while looking through a magic looking glass." - JBnTX

I am so happy I learned how to shoot during that time. Everyone wants to look through the crystal ball, tech has replaced skill, but it will come back around. Mark my words, the rifleman will be king again one day. Nowadays you tell people that you shot 10 for 10 at 500 yards with iron sights they either discredit you and try to say that its easy or they actually give you respect. Whichever the case I know I have crossed keys that say I scored expert every time I qualified and no one will take that away from me. 500 yards with an ACOG is child's play for me anymore. I can truly say I am limited by my gear and not my skill. Every Marine a rifleman.
45-Seventy
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Posted: 1/20/2012 6:29:25 PM
Originally Posted By Sleeper396:
Originally Posted By LA_357SIG:
Originally Posted By The_Evil_One:
In Army BRM your expected to hit and kill targets at 300 meters with iron sights. So you'll excuse me if I don't bat an eye at the fact you can make a shot group the size of a quarter at 100 yards with a scope with I can only guess how much time in between shots.
<snip>
As I said sorry if I offended anyone but this is just my view and personal opinion on this whole accuracy thing.
<snip>
Please do keep in mind the kind of shooting I do is different and this is just my opinion on this matter as I said before that I feel I needed to let out.

Please don't hurt me.


There is a big difference between testing the accuracy potential of the shooter and the accuracy potential of the rifle. There is also a direct relationship between the two. How can you (the shooter) determine your ability if the weapon you are shooting is not capable of being accurate?

Anyway, I agree completely and would like to repost my old sigline in support.
"The fullsize A2 with a 20 inch barrel is the end of a long historical line of weaponry where the shooter was a real rifleman and not just some guy popping off rounds at 25 yards while looking through a magic looking glass." - JBnTX

I am so happy I learned how to shoot during that time. Everyone wants to look through the crystal ball, tech has replaced skill, but it will come back around. Mark my words, the rifleman will be king again one day. Nowadays you tell people that you shot 10 for 10 at 500 yards with iron sights they either discredit you and try to say that its easy or they actually give you respect. Whichever the case I know I have crossed keys that say I scored expert every time I qualified and no one will take that away from me. 500 yards with an ACOG is child's play for me anymore. I can truly say I am limited by my gear and not my skill. Every Marine a rifleman.


Amen, brother.
semperserveranceSTA
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Posted: 1/21/2012 2:24:00 AM
Stag Model 8 Plus Package has given me .44 moa. through a Trijicon TR24G 1-4x optic. Stag has 100% lifetime guarantee. They have great CS and treat their customers with the highest respect. Add in a POF cam pin and a free float rail and send those 70 gr. TSXBT down range. Wish I had this rifle in Iraq. It's my favorite among what I own. Don't spend 2500 for a name. I have before and I get all I want for alot less cash.
socal-prince
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Posted: 1/21/2012 7:17:44 AM
My LWRC M6A2 is accurate and reliable as hell. Eats anything I feed it and no malfunctions after 2k rounds yet. It's the best AR I own and it won't be my last LWRC. I'm on my phone so I cant post pics but I posted my shot group on another thread. Follow link below...


http://www.ar15.com/forums/t_3_126/560236_How_accurate_LWRC_556.html&page=1#i5363474
semperserveranceSTA
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Posted: 1/21/2012 12:51:08 PM
Yah I'm pickin up what your layin down man. I was an 03 until I finally got 8541. It's something that's lives within you. The fundamentals are part of my muscle, mind, and my heart. The reason I'm here now is I was better than the other man time and time again. Even with a severe brain injury when I go to the parish sherrifs dept. swat training center I am watched and listened too. All the dodads and watchamadoodles can make a bad shot decent. It won't make a good shooter great. That comes from all those cold range days and having the best teachers in the business building you into a COMPLETE weapon system.
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