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Posted: 2/22/2016 3:06:18 AM EDT
This is a first look at the Mid-Evil VFG. We will be updating this thread with our results after we've had a chance to use it for a while.
So I ran into the manufacturer of this product at SHOT this year. It's no secret that I'm not a fan of vertical foregrips for a number of reasons. But I must say that after using this for a very short time, if I were to use a vertical grip, I think this is the one I would use. It is available in three formats: a 1913 picatinny rail, M-Lok, and Keymod version. 
The manufacturer calls it a 360 degree VFG, but the truth is that it's much more versatile than that as it can be quickly adjusted to any position underneath your rail. This means it can go through a full 360 degree range parallel to the ground (i.e. as a "side grip" or even tucked under the forearm), as well as fully vertical or any angle in between. 
Adjustment is accomplished by simply rotating the lower half of the grip to loosen it, moving to the desired position, and rotating back to tighten. This lets you put it at whatever angle feels natural and comfortable for you vs a traditional and fully vertical position. The grip is hollow, so you could use the space for anything you might need it for. 
Again, I am not a fan of traditional vertical fore grips, but I will be leaving this one on for a while and reporting back. If anyone has any questions, feel free to ask. Their web site is: https://mid-evilindustries.com Price is $149 which is at the higher end, but it is an all metal grip that is very well built. ==================== UPDATE: 23 FEB 16 ==================== In response to some questions about the ball joint, here is a better view. 
==================== UPDATE: 20 MAR 16 ==================== Quick video: 
In response to those that had concerns about the holding ability of the ball joint, here's a quick photo: 
Hung a couple of plates off the grip (hand guard was slipped over a vertical post on the seated calf raise machine). There's 70lbs hanging on the grip, as far out as I could put it. Hopefully that will answer that question. For those of you that might be interested, but didn't like the $149.99 price to try it out, Mid-Evil is offering a 3-day special price of $99.99 for AR15.com only. Enter the coupon code AR15COM on their web site for the discount. This is a promo for the newsletter going out tomorrow morning, but it should be good to go tonight. |
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Posted: 2/22/2016 8:34:07 PM EDT
[#1]
Interesting, it appears that when the board owner posts something, the all too common trash talking of this section doesn't seem to appear. It sure would be swell if this entire section of the board stayed clean.
When do you think you will be able to post pics of it on a weapon? It would help give an idea of what it looks like for size, and give a clearer view of what appears to be the ball joint. Thanks! |
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Posted: 2/22/2016 8:45:55 PM EDT
[#2]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Interesting, it appears that when the board owner posts something, the all too common trash talking of this section doesn't seem to appear. It sure would be swell if this entire section of the board stayed clean. When do you think you will be able to post pics of it on a weapon? It would help give an idea of what it looks like for size, and give a clearer view of what appears to be the ball joint. Thanks! They have better pictures on their website if you click the link. It's shown on various firearms... I'd like to see how it holds up after some decent use. |
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Posted: 2/22/2016 9:31:19 PM EDT
[#3]
Looks...abrasive. Does it feel that way?
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Posted: 2/22/2016 9:36:16 PM EDT
[#4]
I looked at it earlier and honestly could only come up with one thing to post: how long will it take to destroy/warp/damage that ball joint?
Other than that, it looks interesting. I'd like to see it in use and hear some reviews. |
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Posted: 2/23/2016 12:03:55 AM EDT
[#5]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Interesting, it appears that when the board owner posts something, the all too common trash talking of this section doesn't seem to appear. It sure would be swell if this entire section of the board stayed clean. When do you think you will be able to post pics of it on a weapon? It would help give an idea of what it looks like for size, and give a clearer view of what appears to be the ball joint. Thanks! Cheers stickman! I agree with you 100 percent. I saw this when the views count was less than 50 and thought..... Lets see who comments first. I even chuckled over it today when count got over 700 that still there was no comments. I applaud you for saying your thoughts. |
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Posted: 2/23/2016 2:43:04 AM EDT
[#6]
I'm a faithful end user of VFG's, it's something I got really comfortable using overseas. My Grippod's are often used for range sessions, and I catch hell when my friends see it come out of the range bag.
I like the ability to cant this VFG, and that's going to be a real useful grip for those of us that use them. I can't wait to see some in-depth use, and reviews of it. |
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Posted: 2/23/2016 11:31:12 AM EDT
[#7]
First thing I thought of:
I don't see the appeal of this AT ALL. And at $149 it is not going to be a good seller. |
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Posted: 2/23/2016 12:22:21 PM EDT
[#8]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Interesting, it appears that when the board owner posts something, the all too common trash talking of this section doesn't seem to appear. It sure would be swell if this entire section of the board stayed clean. When do you think you will be able to post pics of it on a weapon? It would help give an idea of what it looks like for size, and give a clearer view of what appears to be the ball joint. Thanks! Quote HistoryQuoted:
Interesting, it appears that when the board owner posts something, the all too common trash talking of this section doesn't seem to appear. It sure would be swell if this entire section of the board stayed clean. When do you think you will be able to post pics of it on a weapon? It would help give an idea of what it looks like for size, and give a clearer view of what appears to be the ball joint. Thanks! What trash talk? Is there a problem to address? Here is a pic from the SHOT Show at least to give an idea of size. 
I can work on a better view of the ball joint, and will post shortly posted above in OP. Also working on video, but that won't be available until late next week. Quoted:
Looks...abrasive. Does it feel that way? No- at least not with the very limited use wed had. Need some friction as the thing is adjusted using one hand, so you need a certain amount of friction to get a good hold to twist. Obviously long term use may change this view, so we'll see. Quoted:
I looked at it earlier and honestly could only come up with one thing to post: how long will it take to destroy/warp/damage that ball joint? Other than that, it looks interesting. I'd like to see it in use and hear some reviews. Ball joint should be pretty solid, as it tightens over a good amount of area. Now could it be damaged over long term use especially if not tightened well? Possibly. Probably not a significant concern though. Quoted:
I'm a faithful end user of VFG's, it's something I got really comfortable using overseas. My Grippod's are often used for range sessions, and I catch hell when my friends see it come out of the range bag. I like the ability to cant this VFG, and that's going to be a real useful grip for those of us that use them. I can't wait to see some in-depth use, and reviews of it. Definitely going to provide a more comfortable angle, and you can quickly adjust. You can tuck it under the hand guard and put it up for easy storage/transportation too. |
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Posted: 2/23/2016 4:13:43 PM EDT
[#9]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
What trash talk? Is there a problem to address? Seems like a trap... 
Honestly, I could see this having more of an application as a stock monopod. ~Augee |
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Posted: 2/23/2016 6:07:29 PM EDT
[#10]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Seems like a trap...
Honestly, I could see this having more of an application as a stock monopod. ~Augee Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
What trash talk? Is there a problem to address? Seems like a trap...
Honestly, I could see this having more of an application as a stock monopod. ~Augee I'll bite.... Read the thread a few below about the aluminum skeletonized titan grip. There are a few comments in there that in my opinion took it a bit too far. |
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Posted: 2/23/2016 8:11:28 PM EDT
[#11]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I'll bite.... Read the thread a few below about the aluminum skeletonized titan grip. There are a few comments in there that in my opinion took it a bit too far. Agreed and posted. "Stay Classy, ARFCOM!" |
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Posted: 2/23/2016 8:20:41 PM EDT
[#12]
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Posted: 2/23/2016 9:31:33 PM EDT
[#13]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I'll bite.... Read the thread a few below about the aluminum skeletonized titan grip. There are a few comments in there that in my opinion took it a bit too far. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
What trash talk? Is there a problem to address? Seems like a trap...
Honestly, I could see this having more of an application as a stock monopod. ~Augee I'll bite.... Read the thread a few below about the aluminum skeletonized titan grip. There are a few comments in there that in my opinion took it a bit too far. Oh, I understood what he meant, I just meant that it's rather like a trap when the owner drops down to ask "is there a problem here?"
Some thoughts on the product itself: I'd be curious to know exactly how much pressure it takes to move the VFG when "tightened down," while not as many people use the "chicken choking" grip as used to, this grip seems optimized for such use, so that such a grip can be placed at the "optimal" angle depending on an individual's personal geometry. That being said, one of the criticisms of rail systems such as the KAC M4 RAS, was that under stress, users could occasionally pop the whole lower handguard off the forearm, and earlier FF rail systems were criticized for rotating under similar pressures (which is why most FF handguards today come with some sort of "anti-rotation" tabs or devices). It seems to me, therefore, a distinct possibility that under similar stress, this grip would simply shift, which could have undesirable consequences, e.g. when the ball joint "gives," the user will suddenly find the weapon pointing somewhere other than intended, possibly during a string of fire. Or, maybe if you're applying forward pressure to the VFG, and it suddenly "swivels" forward, the user's hand slips off - possibly ending up in front of the muzzle (think KSG), or if the user was attempting to use the muzzle to break glass, putting their hand into the glass or possibly through it... almost certainly breaking some bones. On the other hand, as a simple monopod for a stock, I think it has merit--it can be easily adjusted for height depending on the swivel angle, as well as for uneven terrain. It can be left "loose" so that the shooter can "shift fires" while still having the stability of a rear monopod, or it can be "locked down" for a more stable position, it can be swiveled out of the way when not in use. ::shrug:: Regardless, this particular product in this particular form is simply not for me, but there are many products like that on the market, which doesn't make them bad... simply "not for me." ~Augee |
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Posted: 2/23/2016 10:30:45 PM EDT
[#14]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
What trash talk? Is there a problem to address? Here is a pic from the SHOT Show at least to give an idea of size. http://media.ar15.com/newsletter/shot/2016/DSCF0201.jpg I can work on a better view of the ball joint, and will post shortly posted above in OP. Also working on video, but that won't be available until late next week. No- at least not with the very limited use wed had. Need some friction as the thing is adjusted using one hand, so you need a certain amount of friction to get a good hold to twist. Obviously long term use may change this view, so we'll see. Ball joint should be pretty solid, as it tightens over a good amount of area. Now could it be damaged over long term use especially if not tightened well? Possibly. Probably not a significant concern though. Definitely going to provide a more comfortable angle, and you can quickly adjust. You can tuck it under the hand guard and put it up for easy storage/transportation too. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Interesting, it appears that when the board owner posts something, the all too common trash talking of this section doesn't seem to appear. It sure would be swell if this entire section of the board stayed clean. When do you think you will be able to post pics of it on a weapon? It would help give an idea of what it looks like for size, and give a clearer view of what appears to be the ball joint. Thanks! What trash talk? Is there a problem to address? Here is a pic from the SHOT Show at least to give an idea of size. http://media.ar15.com/newsletter/shot/2016/DSCF0201.jpg I can work on a better view of the ball joint, and will post shortly posted above in OP. Also working on video, but that won't be available until late next week. Quoted:
Looks...abrasive. Does it feel that way? No- at least not with the very limited use wed had. Need some friction as the thing is adjusted using one hand, so you need a certain amount of friction to get a good hold to twist. Obviously long term use may change this view, so we'll see. Quoted:
I looked at it earlier and honestly could only come up with one thing to post: how long will it take to destroy/warp/damage that ball joint? Other than that, it looks interesting. I'd like to see it in use and hear some reviews. Ball joint should be pretty solid, as it tightens over a good amount of area. Now could it be damaged over long term use especially if not tightened well? Possibly. Probably not a significant concern though. Quoted:
I'm a faithful end user of VFG's, it's something I got really comfortable using overseas. My Grippod's are often used for range sessions, and I catch hell when my friends see it come out of the range bag. I like the ability to cant this VFG, and that's going to be a real useful grip for those of us that use them. I can't wait to see some in-depth use, and reviews of it. Definitely going to provide a more comfortable angle, and you can quickly adjust. You can tuck it under the hand guard and put it up for easy storage/transportation too. Ed you look great for you age and you managed to squeeze in a Superbowl win too! |
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Posted: 2/24/2016 12:41:49 AM EDT
[#15]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Ed you look great for you age and you managed to squeeze in a Superbowl win too! Thanks for noticing. And yeah I like to play a little ball with the guys on my off time. The Super Bowl was just being in the right place at the right time. No big. 
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Posted: 2/26/2016 7:06:23 AM EDT
[#16]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Interesting, it appears that when the board owner posts something, the all too common trash talking of this section doesn't seem to appear. It sure would be swell if this entire section of the board stayed clean. When do you think you will be able to post pics of it on a weapon? It would help give an idea of what it looks like for size, and give a clearer view of what appears to be the ball joint. Thanks! 
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Posted: 2/27/2016 4:31:20 AM EDT
[#17]
If it is at an angle, wouldn't it be legal to put on an AR pistol, since it isn't vertical?
I mean, if the user decided to lock it vertically, that's their fault... Right? Just an idea. |
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Posted: 2/27/2016 11:10:03 PM EDT
[#18]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
If it is at an angle, wouldn't it be legal to put on an AR pistol, since it isn't vertical? I mean, if the user decided to lock it vertically, that's their fault... Right? Just an idea. Please don't write a letter to tech branch. |
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Posted: 3/10/2016 6:09:02 AM EDT
[#19]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
If it is at an angle, wouldn't it be legal to put on an AR pistol, since it isn't vertical? I mean, if the user decided to lock it vertically, that's their fault... Right? Just an idea. Doesn't matter if it's vertical or not, really. A Thompson pistol with a Tommy foregrip installed on it is an AOW, AFAIK, even though the Tommy grip has a good amount of angle to it. The ATF may be a bunch of knuckleheads at times, but even they know that if strictly vertical grips were the only thing they cared about, every grip on the market would be 0.1 degree off of vertical as a means of skirting their regs. At any rate, back to the merits of the grip: I am hesitant to "shoot down" any gear before trying it, but my primary concern would be that under some kind of wacky shtf situation I would accidentally / unknowingly twist the bottom part just enough that the thing would move at the worst possible moment... even if it been rock solid for years of training. Murphy's laws kinda thing... On a fundamental level, I like the idea of a grip you can customize the angle on, it just seems like there would be one optimal angle for a shooter... and once there it would never really need to move again, so there should be a way to lock the thing semi-perma. Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile |
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Posted: 3/15/2016 2:58:50 AM EDT
[#20]
I don't see the point in the full range of movement, or whatever, from the ball joint. I could imagine maybe needing it off to one side, angled back a bit, but can't imagine needing to move it forward at all.
Like Augee posted, plenty of bad what if scenarios. Maybe have a different lock collar? One with knurled inside to grab the ball better? But might wear out faster. Would probably take quite a bit of force to move it, but only one way to find out. I don't think it needs the full range of motion, would be better if it can be locked physically into position, rather than rely on mere smooth clamping force on a smooth ball joint. Me personally, i don't like it. I prefer stubby grips, I've been digging the stubby BCM KM grip. I like the angle, can still grip the forearm and use the grip. Something like this with the bigger base would bother me, that's just a personal preference though. I don't like it overall. Plenty of better designs. It's unique, sure. But that's about it in my eyes. But im just some schmuck on the net. |
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Posted: 3/16/2016 1:56:43 PM EDT
[#21]
I don't see the utility in it.
I honestly don't see how adjusting it anywhere but front and back would be useful. Even if there was a good use for it...I don't know many people that would drop $150 for it. Full range of motion and locking mechanisms being a ball joint is just asking for tissues. Kind of a solution looking for a problem in my opinion. |
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Posted: 3/20/2016 10:47:50 PM EDT
[#22]
Quick video:
In response to those that had concerns about the holding ability of the ball joint, here's a quick photo:
Hung a couple of plates off the grip (hand guard was slipped over a vertical post on the seated calf raise machine). There's 70lbs hanging on the grip, as far out as I could put it. Hopefully that will answer that question. For those of you that might be interested, but didn't like the $149.99 price to try it out, Mid-Evil is offering a 3-day special price of $99.99 for AR15.com only. Enter the coupon code AR15COM on their web site for the discount. This is a promo for the newsletter going out tomorrow morning, but it should be good to go tonight. |
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Posted: 3/21/2016 12:40:53 PM EDT
[#23]
More choices is always a good thing. Not everyone is a fan of vertical grips, I'm old school & I prefer to use vertical grips. When Keymods hit the scene, vertical grips for them were few and far between, and picatinny adapter rails were needed, adding to weight) oddly enough the airsoft world had numerous keymod vertical grips, but not fond of mixing toy parts with gun parts.
Not a big fan of Magpul furniture, but they are good about realizing what people want. In the end I bought a Tangodown keymod vertical grip as soon as they hit the scene (msrp $29.99) and on another AR, I modified a Tangodown stubby quick release vertical grip (msrp $89.99) to be keymod compatible. One thing the Tangodown keymod vertical grip and this Mid-Evil doesn't have is light tape switch pockets, no big deal but nice to have. Two factors the Mid-Evil face is cost, $149 is a bit too pricey (I do appreciate the AR15 discounted offer), I also realize it's all metal, but that isn't always ideal, one it's heavy and two it's too long. They should sell a optional cap to close off the upper section and ball joint to allow it to be used as a stubby. An adapter cap could add a little length to make it a small stubby for those that don't want such a long vertical grip. In the end, having more choices is always nice. It looks like a nice vertical grip, but unless the better mousetrap is hands and feet better, I'm happy with the status quo. But I do wish Mid-Evil much success and continue to innovate. |
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Posted: 3/21/2016 1:03:37 PM EDT
[#24]
Colt looks like Collin Farrell
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Posted: 3/25/2016 1:48:14 AM EDT
[#25]
What the hell, I ordered one. Fingers crossed.
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Posted: 3/25/2016 8:11:19 AM EDT
[#26]
Interesting concept for sure. It seems very easy to twist that grip to unlock the movement of the ball joint. My worry would be how easy it would be to become inadvertently unlocked and moving around during a inappropriate time.
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Posted: 3/29/2016 12:47:28 AM EDT
[#27]
I got mine. For the record, I don't care much for VFG's and thought maybe the ability to customize the angle might sway me. I have tried AFG's and liked them ok.
My impression is I can't speak to durability and seems well-enough made. The twisting mechanism seems to lock up tight with some force on the twist. Careful the position it's in or getting the force to loosen it could be a challenge. 
In the end I don't know what to say. Just playing with positions on a REC7 for 10 minutes it liked it better as a more comfortably AFG than a VFG or any odd side-ways angles. If I liked VFG's this might be a great option to get the exact feel because I'm sure 100% straight up and down isn't for everyone. |
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Posted: 4/27/2016 4:36:27 AM EDT
[#28]
I bought this vfg because I was tired of the weird angle my wrist was at while holding the handguard.
If I had to sum up my experience with it thus far in one word, it would be VERSATILE. This foregrip is truly awesome. Here's my pros and cons after ~1000 rounds of use: PROS Any angle YOU want the grip at, is the angle you set it at. I had tried vertical foregrips in the past, but just like holding the handguard, your wrist is never in a naturally comfortable position. Even when the grip is flush against the handguard, parallel with the barrel, it is nice to hold on to. You can unscrew the bottom of the foregrip and store an assortment of useful things in the cavity (CR123 battery, extra firing pin, etc.). It is very quick-acting to set it in the position that is most comfortable to you, or collapse it for storage. As long as you tighten it, the foregrip will not budge during normal use. CONS The grip is slightly abrasive. I didn't have a problem with it but my wife's "poor domestic hands" suffered. Also, if you have a soft metal wedding band, it would be best to take it off for recreational shooting. I wish it came in a knurled option as well. It is heavy. Which is not necessarily a bad thing. I have a very light rifle and the extra weight on the end of the foregrip took out what little muzzle flip I ever had, but again, my wife wasn't too appreciative of the extra weight. Even if you don't think that foregrips are for you, I would recommend giving this one a try. It is truly a unique add-on that you tailor to yourself and your comfort. If you think that a solid vertical foregrip will outperform the Mid Evil VFG...... you're an idiot. - Jeff T. USN |
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Posted: 4/28/2016 4:12:23 AM EDT
[#29]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I bought this vfg because I was tired of the weird angle my wrist was at while holding the handguard. If I had to sum up my experience with it thus far in one word, it would be VERSATILE. This foregrip is truly awesome. Here's my pros and cons after ~1000 rounds of use: PROS Any angle YOU want the grip at, is the angle you set it at. I had tried vertical foregrips in the past, but just like holding the handguard, your wrist is never in a naturally comfortable position. Even when the grip is flush against the handguard, parallel with the barrel, it is nice to hold on to. You can unscrew the bottom of the foregrip and store an assortment of useful things in the cavity (CR123 battery, extra firing pin, etc.). It is very quick-acting to set it in the position that is most comfortable to you, or collapse it for storage. As long as you tighten it, the foregrip will not budge during normal use. CONS The grip is slightly abrasive. I didn't have a problem with it but my wife's "poor domestic hands" suffered. Also, if you have a soft metal wedding band, it would be best to take it off for recreational shooting. I wish it came in a knurled option as well. It is heavy. Which is not necessarily a bad thing. I have a very light rifle and the extra weight on the end of the foregrip took out what little muzzle flip I ever had, but again, my wife wasn't too appreciative of the extra weight. Even if you don't think that foregrips are for you, I would recommend giving this one a try. It is truly a unique add-on that you tailor to yourself and your comfort. If you think that a solid vertical foregrip will outperform the Mid Evil VFG...... you're an idiot. - Jeff T. USN Welcome to arf... |
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