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Posted: 7/6/2011 1:59:28 PM EST
[Last Edit: 7/6/2011 2:01:08 PM EST by SharpsMilSpec]
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Link Posted: 7/6/2011 4:14:54 PM EST
I like "A"
the A2 is not now, nor will it ever be, retro......but I still like 'em
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Link Posted: 7/6/2011 4:55:06 PM EST
Originally Posted By crackedcornish:
I like "A"


I like A as well, but I don't see the necessity of the "Legal in All 50 States" part. There may be a reason I don't know about, but just my 2 cents.

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Link Posted: 7/6/2011 6:41:34 PM EST
Option A for a hunting load, option C for a tactical load. In either case the bullet type needs to be included, not just the weight..

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Link Posted: 7/6/2011 6:46:21 PM EST

Originally Posted By BUIS:
Option A for a hunting load, option C for a tactical load. In either case the bullet type needs to be included, not just the weight..

Yup.

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Link Posted: 7/6/2011 7:08:33 PM EST
good points.....

The 50 States legal was a bit of a miscommunication with the advertising firm. Basically, we are looking into making sure that its 50 states legal for deer, boar, antelope, etc. but the research isn't done there yet, but the lead in was left on the box anyway.

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Link Posted: 7/6/2011 7:28:43 PM EST
Option B. It has the old school sharps feel with a clear modern purpose.

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Link Posted: 7/6/2011 8:57:53 PM EST
Originally Posted By The_Kyle:

Originally Posted By BUIS:
Option A for a hunting load, option C for a tactical load. In either case the bullet type needs to be included, not just the weight..

Yup.


+2

They're very different choices IMO. Putting a life-like dear on a box says "hunting" whereas multicam or a solider says "tactical". However, "A" is still nice for a hunting load since this load is designed to be used in the AR platform.
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Link Posted: 7/7/2011 4:44:17 PM EST
It's "C" for me.

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Link Posted: 7/8/2011 8:30:17 AM EST
Originally Posted By Snowman38:
Option B. It has the old school sharps feel with a clear modern purpose.


+1

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Link Posted: 7/8/2011 9:55:37 AM EST
Option B
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Link Posted: 7/8/2011 2:21:29 PM EST
I have to vote for A.
The background texture works with both the deer and the rifleman.
It's a good look and feel.

Option B works well with the wolf, but not so much with the rifleman.
The old-school feel of the gold clashes with the rifleman in my opinion.

Option C, the digital camo is just not right with the animals, maybe the rifleman if the colors were consistent.

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Link Posted: 7/8/2011 7:28:34 PM EST
Originally Posted By everman7:
I have to vote for A.
The background texture works with both the deer and the rifleman.
It's a good look and feel.

Option B works well with the wolf, but not so much with the rifleman.
The old-school feel of the gold clashes with the rifleman in my opinion.

Option C, the digital camo is just not right with the animals, maybe the rifleman if the colors were consistent.

my $0.02
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I mostly agree with this. With the exception that the digi camo and the lion work well together not because you'd hunt lions with it, but because the lion works well with the warrior spirit. Thus why I said I like option C best for a tactical loading.

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Link Posted: 7/8/2011 8:10:56 PM EST
Option B if you deleted the Wolf off the box, which has some connotations from all the "alpha wolf" t shirts and other garbage that used to go around. Plus confusion with Wolf brand ammo.
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Link Posted: 7/8/2011 11:59:40 PM EST
[Last Edit: 7/9/2011 12:01:18 AM EST by SharpsMilSpec-Mike]
Originally Posted By BUIS:
Originally Posted By everman7:
I have to vote for A.
The background texture works with both the deer and the rifleman.
It's a good look and feel.

Option B works well with the wolf, but not so much with the rifleman.
The old-school feel of the gold clashes with the rifleman in my opinion.

Option C, the digital camo is just not right with the animals, maybe the rifleman if the colors were consistent.

my $0.02
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I mostly agree with this. With the exception that the digi camo and the lion work well together not because you'd hunt lions with it, but because the lion works well with the warrior spirit. Thus why I said I like option C best for a tactical loading.


Actually that's suppose to be a Coyote in C....hard to tell with the close up as I heard this same comment from a staff member.

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Link Posted: 7/9/2011 12:00:47 AM EST

Interesting thoughts....they were shooting for Coyotes on these, but I think the photos aren't clear enough in that department.

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Link Posted: 7/9/2011 7:09:10 AM EST
"muzzle approximately 3000fps and 1681fpe"

Through how long of a barrel?

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Link Posted: 7/9/2011 9:22:17 AM EST
[Last Edit: 7/9/2011 9:27:32 AM EST by ar911d]
I'd go with A. I think the box covers the hunting theme with the deer and the tactical theme with the rifleman. B has a bit of an old west feel to it for me. On C I think it would look better if the camo pattern matched the colors of the animal pic, which should be zoomed out a little bit.

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Link Posted: 7/9/2011 5:54:07 PM EST
My vote goes for B I really like the gold goes with the black & white giving the box an old feel with a modern warrior in it. I know you have already decided on the 25 45 name but I would like it to read 257x45 as a reloader it tells me what it is.

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Link Posted: 7/9/2011 6:43:03 PM EST
Originally Posted By rgerh:
My vote goes for B I really like the gold goes with the black & white giving the box an old feel with a modern warrior in it. I know you have already decided on the 25 45 name but I would like it to read 257x45 as a reloader it tells me what it is.


Actually it was going to be the 25x45, but as SAAMI is working to be friends with CIP there we objection to the X as someone (no idea who) could mistake it for 25mm x 45mm. So we had to make the compromise.

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Link Posted: 7/9/2011 6:46:44 PM EST
Originally Posted By sferrin:
"muzzle approximately 3000fps and 1681fpe"

Through how long of a barrel?


24" test barrel. I know, a bit long for what an AR, but the numbers they publish for the 223 Rem, 250 Savage, 30/30, etc are all from the same 24" SAAMI Standard barrel. You can standardize on a shorter barrel, but it can cause a lot of problems. However, we will be publishing "practical" numbers for the round showing what it does in a 16" barrel, 18" barrel, 20" barrel, etc. so folks can match it up to whatever they are carrying.

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Link Posted: 7/9/2011 6:48:28 PM EST
Why does everyone keep calling it a wolf? Its clearly a coyote.

Something else to consider: Since you're obviously marketing this to hunters, ditch the soldier looking guy on the box and replace him with someone that resembles more of a hunter. Yes, I know that may be how he dresses to go hunting, but most people don't gear up like that to go after Bambi.

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Link Posted: 7/10/2011 4:43:12 AM EST
Originally Posted By The_Kyle:
Why does everyone keep calling it a wolf? Its clearly a coyote.

Something else to consider: Since you're obviously marketing this to hunters, ditch the soldier looking guy on the box and replace him with someone that resembles more of a hunter. Yes, I know that may be how he dresses to go hunting, but most people don't gear up like that to go after Bambi.


Not sure on the Coyote/Wolf confusion.

Kyle, you made the same observation as our corporate officer who is also a professional guide.

My thought, a compromise....Since the imagery here is allusion to the AR's transformation from a military rifle to a hunting rifle, I suggested doing a fade where half of the image was in traditional hunting gear for our ear, orange base ball cap, orange vest, etc. and the other half the military a fellow in fatigues. Maybe a slight change in background behind the "military" half as well to prevent confusion as in the brewing Coyote/Wolf debate.

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Link Posted: 7/10/2011 11:06:35 AM EST
[Last Edit: 7/10/2011 11:08:15 AM EST by Saryan]
Your "SRc" looks like Surgeon Rifles logo a little. Besides that it looks good and I would say option A but make it a hunter with a modern hunting style AR15. Not an A2..... Also if you put the word "dynamic" in there people will spend whatever you ask......

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Link Posted: 7/12/2011 8:53:18 AM EST
I like "B"

I'm assuming the caliber would prove more useful for dispatching varments and preditors than deer. I also like the gray on bronze look.
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Link Posted: 7/13/2011 4:46:27 AM EST
Sharps 2010, Way Beyond Mil Spec.
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Link Posted: 7/13/2011 4:50:16 AM EST
Sharps 2010, Way Beyond Mil Spec.
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Link Posted: 7/19/2011 12:16:48 AM EST
[Last Edit: 7/19/2011 12:17:13 AM EST by JZAF]
option A

my only quirk, which may be caused by a lack of sleep and posting at the closing of a swing shift, is the "legal in 50 states". It just doesn't flow as well as "50 state legal" IMO

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Link Posted: 7/19/2011 8:32:44 PM EST
No, you are 100% right, that is our goof. should say 50 states legal for Deer or something similar

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Link Posted: 7/20/2011 2:57:18 AM EST
B - But lose the Tactical "Operator". I like the Old School look, but I agree with earlier comments that the soldier clashes. It would be cool to see an old-time hunter (like something from the 30's or 40's) with a modern AR platform boom-stick. Throw-back, but with a nod to the future. In any case, lose the Digicam. That stuff's days are numbered and besides, us Jarheads ain't going to buy anything with stinking ARMY cammo on it!

Ooh-Freakin'-Rah.

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Link Posted: 7/20/2011 4:14:45 AM EST
My opinion;
Option A Deer head box art = Hunting load
Option B M4 box art = Tactical/ plinking load
Option C Wolf head box art =Varmint load
I'm really impressed with the company logo panel on option B.
Humans, being what they are tend to key on visual cues before they read the label.

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Link Posted: 7/20/2011 4:36:30 AM EST
Originally Posted By exspook:
B - But lose the Tactical "Operator". I like the Old School look, but I agree with earlier comments that the soldier clashes...
Ooh-Freakin'-Rah.


Respectfully disagree. Keep in mind the Sharps was used by "Tactical operators" a little over a century ago.
Which gives me an idea. For your tactical load drop the animal images and ghost a cavalry trooper in the background of the modern day trooper.
The Sharps name and its association with the US Army is a venerated part of American history, useful in today's marketing environment.

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Link Posted: 7/20/2011 10:03:00 AM EST
I guess it wasn't clear that their plan is to offer a specific tactical load, which is why I suggested the old school hunter. It looked to me like there was only one load available and it was geared toward deer hunters. I like your idea for Box B as a "tactical" load, though. Maybe replace the Coyote with a ghost trooper, then change the brown color to a grey to match the "operator" or vice versa.

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Link Posted: 7/23/2011 1:56:31 PM EST
Originally Posted By SharpsMilSpec-Mike:
No, you are 100% right, that is our goof. should say 50 states legal for Deer or something similar


No rifle rounds are legal for deer in MA or RI.

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Link Posted: 7/23/2011 6:36:55 PM EST
Originally Posted By Loe_307:
Originally Posted By Snowman38:
Option B. It has the old school sharps feel with a clear modern purpose.


+1


THIS

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Link Posted: 7/23/2011 11:00:49 PM EST

Good point, I think there might be some other slug only states out there. Probably should be something more along the lines of legal in states that permit rifle hunting for deer, or legal for with the check your states rules type of a thing.

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Link Posted: 7/25/2011 10:31:46 AM EST

Originally Posted By SharpsMilSpec-Mike:

Good point, I think there might be some other slug only states out there. Probably should be something more along the lines of legal in states that permit rifle hunting for deer, or legal for with the check your states rules type of a thing.

Or just not have it on the box at all. Most people know what is or isn't legal in their own state.

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Link Posted: 7/25/2011 5:24:27 PM EST

Also true, might be sufficient to just say something about being good for deer which was the point of the whole exercise.

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Link Posted: 8/2/2011 1:35:15 AM EST
Originally Posted By inGobwetrust:
Originally Posted By SharpsMilSpec-Mike:
No, you are 100% right, that is our goof. should say 50 states legal for Deer or something similar


No rifle rounds are legal for deer in MA or RI.



The .25-45 is not legal in Ohio, Indiana, Illinois, or New Jersey either.

Also parts of many states are restricted to shotgun only for deer hunting.

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Link Posted: 8/2/2011 6:47:17 AM EST
Will post my opinion, mostly agreeing with what has already been posted:

Option A
Drop the "50 states Legal", its not and hunters already have figured out what is.
Hunter should be dressed in old school red plaid jacket carrying an AR(old school/new school)
List bullet type, not just weight.
Keep deer pic for deer load, use coyote for varmint load, steel plates or something for target load.

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Link Posted: 8/2/2011 7:08:42 PM EST
Originally Posted By HAGDADDY:
Will post my opinion, mostly agreeing with what has already been posted:

Option A
Drop the "50 states Legal", its not and hunters already have figured out what is.
Hunter should be dressed in old school red plaid jacket carrying an AR(old school/new school)
List bullet type, not just weight.
Keep deer pic for deer load, use coyote for varmint load, steel plates or something for target load.


Yup.
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Link Posted: 8/4/2011 12:04:22 PM EST
Sharps 2010, Way Beyond Mil Spec.
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Link Posted: 8/6/2011 7:05:30 AM EST
[Last Edit: 8/6/2011 7:13:25 AM EST by 96Ag]

Originally Posted By exspook:
B - But lose the Tactical "Operator". I like the Old School look, but I agree with earlier comments that the soldier clashes. It would be cool to see an old-time hunter (like something from the 30's or 40's) with a modern AR platform boom-stick. Throw-back, but with a nod to the future. In any case, lose the Digicam. That stuff's days are numbered and besides, us Jarheads ain't going to buy anything with stinking ARMY cammo on it!

Ooh-Freakin'-Rah.

I really dig this line of thought. A Pendleton jacket with a flat-top free floated AR with a good looking piece of glass would be awesome. Something iconographic appeals to our demographic, hence the reason a lot of the arms company still use this type of work. Imagine the guy below with an AR dressed similarly. It would really work well and could open up a complimentary product line for shirts and posters.




And yes, I realize that this is not a bear gun, it was the first image that was indicative of the feel I was trying to impart.

Also, being late to the party, are there going to be dies available for this round?
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Link Posted: 8/6/2011 7:37:22 AM EST
Originally Posted By 96Ag:

Originally Posted By exspook:
B - But lose the Tactical "Operator". I like the Old School look, but I agree with earlier comments that the soldier clashes. It would be cool to see an old-time hunter (like something from the 30's or 40's) with a modern AR platform boom-stick. Throw-back, but with a nod to the future. In any case, lose the Digicam. That stuff's days are numbered and besides, us Jarheads ain't going to buy anything with stinking ARMY cammo on it!

Ooh-Freakin'-Rah.

I really dig this line of thought. A Pendleton jacket with a flat-top free floated AR with a good looking piece of glass would be awesome. Something iconographic appeals to our demographic, hence the reason a lot of the arms company still use this type of work. Imagine the guy below with an AR dressed similarly. It would really work well and could open up a complimentary product line for shirts and posters.

http://i55.tinypic.com/200smyh.jpg


And yes, I realize that this is not a bear gun, it was the first image that was indicative of the feel I was trying to impart.

Also, being late to the party, are there going to be dies available for this round?


I could see a mountain lion there instead of a bear
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Link Posted: 8/6/2011 8:42:59 AM EST
Originally Posted By 96Ag:

Originally Posted By exspook:
B - But lose the Tactical "Operator". I like the Old School look, but I agree with earlier comments that the soldier clashes. It would be cool to see an old-time hunter (like something from the 30's or 40's) with a modern AR platform boom-stick. Throw-back, but with a nod to the future. In any case, lose the Digicam. That stuff's days are numbered and besides, us Jarheads ain't going to buy anything with stinking ARMY cammo on it!

Ooh-Freakin'-Rah.

I really dig this line of thought. A Pendleton jacket with a flat-top free floated AR with a good looking piece of glass would be awesome. Something iconographic appeals to our demographic, hence the reason a lot of the arms company still use this type of work. Imagine the guy below with an AR dressed similarly. It would really work well and could open up a complimentary product line for shirts and posters.

http://i55.tinypic.com/200smyh.jpg


And yes, I realize that this is not a bear gun, it was the first image that was indicative of the feel I was trying to impart.

Also, being late to the party, are there going to be dies available for this round?


I really like this. I've had that sign, on tin, hanging in my office for the last half decade or so. And yes, we've talked to Hornady & Redding about doing dies. RCBS probably will as well as they are part of ATK, but no guarantee there.

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Link Posted: 9/11/2011 7:39:19 PM EST
Sounds like a great product. If priced well I may consider against the 6.8 spc. Where do I order the rounds bolt and barrel.

Box art has never made me buy a round. Rounds on the shelf do make me consider them. Is there any links to the production product?
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Link Posted: 9/11/2011 7:47:53 PM EST
Having shot a lot of deer with the 223 I dont think the 25 caliber would make a big enough difference to warrant going to boutique caliber, unless you are in a state that restricts caliber. I have shot about 15 deer with 223 in the past 2 years it works fine.

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Link Posted: 9/12/2011 4:41:50 AM EST
Originally Posted By 96Ag:

Originally Posted By exspook:
B - But lose the Tactical "Operator". I like the Old School look, but I agree with earlier comments that the soldier clashes. It would be cool to see an old-time hunter (like something from the 30's or 40's) with a modern AR platform boom-stick. Throw-back, but with a nod to the future. In any case, lose the Digicam. That stuff's days are numbered and besides, us Jarheads ain't going to buy anything with stinking ARMY cammo on it!

Ooh-Freakin'-Rah.

I really dig this line of thought. A Pendleton jacket with a flat-top free floated AR with a good looking piece of glass would be awesome. Something iconographic appeals to our demographic, hence the reason a lot of the arms company still use this type of work. Imagine the guy below with an AR dressed similarly. It would really work well and could open up a complimentary product line for shirts and posters.

http://i55.tinypic.com/200smyh.jpg


And yes, I realize that this is not a bear gun, it was the first image that was indicative of the feel I was trying to impart.

Also, being late to the party, are there going to be dies available for this round?


Got me thinking about this one. Not what you had in mind but you get the idea.





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Link Posted: 10/13/2011 7:53:59 PM EST
B with or without the wolf. Lose the wolf, though.

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