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Page AR-15 » AR-15 / M-16 Retro Forum
AR Sponsor: bravocompany
Posted: 4/30/2016 9:07:04 PM EDT
So....my retro lust got me reevaluating the appearance of my XM177. I was once happy with it now I notice the little things and some were overlooked. I want her as period correct as possible so input from the peanut gallery is needed. For starters the lower is a NoDak partial as a SBR on a Form 1 and the upper is a 604 round forge. I'm getting hung up on which slip ring to use as well. Any thoughts?  I threw the buffer into the picture that came with the stock years ago because it's odd. It looks like someone cut a rifle buffer down to size but it weighs exactly 2.8 ounces just like real carbine buffer. Could it be an old proto buffer?  Seems like a lot of work to get it exactly the weight of a "normal" carbine buffer.

Link Posted: 4/30/2016 10:29:43 PM EDT
[#1]
Flat slip ring
Link Posted: 4/30/2016 11:18:51 PM EDT
[#2]
XM 177 and XM 177E1 both would wear the flat slip ring. Your rig makes me
Can't answer about your buffer, but can add that my Palmetto (SGW) carbine made in 1977-78 had a mini version of the edgewater buffer. So I would venture to say that the aftermarket community back then did all kinds of things when parts were hard to get. We KNOW Jerry Drasen (Nesard/Sendra) did some cleaver things.
PS, really, the only thing I can think of to do would be to replace the upper with a 2nd pattern square forge receiver (not recessed under the port door) as that would be more correct for the 66-67 timeframe when the XM177 came out. But that's not even totally necessary....

Link Posted: 5/1/2016 12:58:54 AM EDT
[#3]
A partial fence 610 would have had the slip ring rather than the delta ring.
Link Posted: 5/1/2016 12:59:49 AM EDT
[#4]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
XM 177 and XM 177E1 both would wear the flat slip ring. Your rig makes me
Can't answer about your buffer, but can add that my Palmetto (SGW) carbine made in 1977-78 had a mini version of the edgewater buffer. So I would venture to say that the aftermarket community back then did all kinds of things when parts were hard to get. We KNOW Jerry Drasen (Nesard/Sendra) did some cleaver things.
PS, really, the only thing I can think of to do would be to replace the upper with a 2nd pattern square forge receiver (not recessed under the port door) as that would be more correct for the 66-67 timeframe when the XM177 came out. But that's not even totally necessary....

ETA,, are you sure that's a round forge upper?? The 2nd pic looks square...Can you post a straight on pic of the left side of the upper???
View Quote

The second pic isn't the OPs.
Link Posted: 5/1/2016 4:06:17 AM EDT
[#5]
Not to argue with the others who are more knowledgeable of the retro guns than I, but according to the Retro Black Rifles website a 629/XM177E2 uses a delta ring. I've seen both delta and flat used and, like the OP, have had a bit of a struggle to figure out which to use, especially color.
My E2 project has been plagued with issues almost from the start, ranging from poor luck/bad timing for parts to vapor lock because of my perfectionist with OCD side.
I'll probably do a full write up at some point for everyone's 'enjoyment'.
Link Posted: 5/1/2016 7:28:11 AM EDT
[#6]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:

The second pic isn't the OPs.
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Quoted:
XM 177 and XM 177E1 both would wear the flat slip ring. Your rig makes me
Can't answer about your buffer, but can add that my Palmetto (SGW) carbine made in 1977-78 had a mini version of the edgewater buffer. So I would venture to say that the aftermarket community back then did all kinds of things when parts were hard to get. We KNOW Jerry Drasen (Nesard/Sendra) did some cleaver things.
PS, really, the only thing I can think of to do would be to replace the upper with a 2nd pattern square forge receiver (not recessed under the port door) as that would be more correct for the 66-67 timeframe when the XM177 came out. But that's not even totally necessary....

ETA,, are you sure that's a round forge upper?? The 2nd pic looks square...Can you post a straight on pic of the left side of the upper???

The second pic isn't the OPs.

Ouch,, you are correct...I scrolled down so fast and passed by the break in replies that I missed it was another members.. Sorry HKiller.... Yours also makes me
Link Posted: 5/1/2016 7:31:28 AM EDT
[#7]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Not to argue with the others who are more knowledgeable of the retro guns than I, but according to the Retro Black Rifles website a 629/XM177E2 uses a delta ring. I've seen both delta and flat used and, like the OP, have had a bit of a struggle to figure out which to use, especially color.
My E2 project has been plagued with issues almost from the start, ranging from poor luck/bad timing for parts to vapor lock because of my perfectionist with OCD side.
I'll probably do a full write up at some point for everyone's 'enjoyment'.
View Quote


You are correct there,,,however re-read the OPs question. He's doing an XM177 (slickside upper receiver and 10" barrel),, not an XM177E2.  And the XM177E1 (with forward assist) is set up the same as the XM177

Now on rebuilds or franken carbines you may come across some XM177s and XM177E1s that had delta rings installed.,
Link Posted: 5/1/2016 7:47:17 AM EDT
[#8]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:


You are correct there,,,however re-read the OPs question. He's doing an XM177 (slickside upper receiver and 10" barrel),, not an XM177E2.  And the XM177E1 (with forward assist) is set up the same as the XM177

Now on rebuilds or franken carbines you may come across some XM177s and XM177E1s that had delta rings installed.,
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Quoted:
Not to argue with the others who are more knowledgeable of the retro guns than I, but according to the Retro Black Rifles website a 629/XM177E2 uses a delta ring. I've seen both delta and flat used and, like the OP, have had a bit of a struggle to figure out which to use, especially color.
My E2 project has been plagued with issues almost from the start, ranging from poor luck/bad timing for parts to vapor lock because of my perfectionist with OCD side.
I'll probably do a full write up at some point for everyone's 'enjoyment'.


You are correct there,,,however re-read the OPs question. He's doing an XM177 (slickside upper receiver and 10" barrel),, not an XM177E2.  And the XM177E1 (with forward assist) is set up the same as the XM177

Now on rebuilds or franken carbines you may come across some XM177s and XM177E1s that had delta rings installed.,


My mistake.

I must not read and post at four in the morning.
I must not read and post at four in the morning.
I must not read and post at four in the morning.
I must not...
Link Posted: 5/1/2016 10:44:18 AM EDT
[#9]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
XM 177 and XM 177E1 both would wear the flat slip ring. Your rig makes me
Can't answer about your buffer, but can add that my Palmetto (SGW) carbine made in 1977-78 had a mini version of the edgewater buffer. So I would venture to say that the aftermarket community back then did all kinds of things when parts were hard to get. We KNOW Jerry Drasen (Nesard/Sendra) did some cleaver things.
PS, really, the only thing I can think of to do would be to replace the upper with a 2nd pattern square forge receiver (not recessed under the port door) as that would be more correct for the 66-67 timeframe when the XM177 came out. But that's not even totally necessary....

View Quote


I have a real nice 2nd pattern square forge that I'm using for a early 604 build.  Damn decisions.  Maybe I should just do a normal 604 with this round forge but then I have to deal with what to do with the chrome Colt bolt carrier with a 3/4 round key.  Regardless I gotta get the damn A2 port door off the round forge upper and get a thinner barrel. It's been very hard to find a A1 door lately.  First world problems I guess.....
Link Posted: 5/1/2016 11:07:47 AM EDT
[#10]
Op you can use that barrel and turn it down to .625 repin a fsb. If you need help lmk.
Link Posted: 5/1/2016 11:55:40 AM EDT
[#11]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Op you can use that barrel and turn it down to .625 repin a fsb. If you need help lmk.
View Quote


Sweet!!  Good to know because it's a good shooting barrel.
Link Posted: 5/1/2016 8:16:23 PM EDT
[#12]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:


I have a real nice 2nd pattern square forge that I'm using for a early 604 build.  Damn decisions.  Maybe I should just do a normal 604 with this round forge but then I have to deal with what to do with the chrome Colt bolt carrier with a 3/4 round key.  Regardless I gotta get the damn A2 port door off the round forge upper and get a thinner barrel. It's been very hard to find a A1 door lately.  First world problems I guess.....
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Quoted:
XM 177 and XM 177E1 both would wear the flat slip ring. Your rig makes me
Can't answer about your buffer, but can add that my Palmetto (SGW) carbine made in 1977-78 had a mini version of the edgewater buffer. So I would venture to say that the aftermarket community back then did all kinds of things when parts were hard to get. We KNOW Jerry Drasen (Nesard/Sendra) did some cleaver things.
PS, really, the only thing I can think of to do would be to replace the upper with a 2nd pattern square forge receiver (not recessed under the port door) as that would be more correct for the 66-67 timeframe when the XM177 came out. But that's not even totally necessary....



I have a real nice 2nd pattern square forge that I'm using for a early 604 build.  Damn decisions.  Maybe I should just do a normal 604 with this round forge but then I have to deal with what to do with the chrome Colt bolt carrier with a 3/4 round key.  Regardless I gotta get the damn A2 port door off the round forge upper and get a thinner barrel. It's been very hard to find a A1 door lately.  First world problems I guess.....

Oh hell Taz,, easy peasy. Use the square forge for the XM, put together the later 604, use that chrome BCG for now, but keep in mind that the chrome BCG is really the start of your 602.....
Link Posted: 5/2/2016 4:01:41 PM EDT
[#13]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:

Oh hell Taz,, easy peasy. Use the square forge for the XM, put together the later 604, use that chrome BCG for now, but keep in mind that the chrome BCG is really the start of your 602.....
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
XM 177 and XM 177E1 both would wear the flat slip ring. Your rig makes me
Can't answer about your buffer, but can add that my Palmetto (SGW) carbine made in 1977-78 had a mini version of the edgewater buffer. So I would venture to say that the aftermarket community back then did all kinds of things when parts were hard to get. We KNOW Jerry Drasen (Nesard/Sendra) did some cleaver things.
PS, really, the only thing I can think of to do would be to replace the upper with a 2nd pattern square forge receiver (not recessed under the port door) as that would be more correct for the 66-67 timeframe when the XM177 came out. But that's not even totally necessary....



I have a real nice 2nd pattern square forge that I'm using for a early 604 build.  Damn decisions.  Maybe I should just do a normal 604 with this round forge but then I have to deal with what to do with the chrome Colt bolt carrier with a 3/4 round key.  Regardless I gotta get the damn A2 port door off the round forge upper and get a thinner barrel. It's been very hard to find a A1 door lately.  First world problems I guess.....

Oh hell Taz,, easy peasy. Use the square forge for the XM, put together the later 604, use that chrome BCG for now, but keep in mind that the chrome BCG is really the start of your 602.....


You sir..................are evil.....
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