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Page AR-15 » AR-15 / M-16 Retro Forum
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Posted: 7/8/2015 1:24:04 AM EDT
You retro guys are sick and evil planting thought in my head.

I ordered a midlength barreled upper from BCM and got it today.  Once in hand, I'm thinking it's screaming for a 604 style upper.  Running through my spare parts I have a flat delta ring, A1 flash hider, A1 pistol grip, and a fiber carbine buttstock off my 9mm for swap too.  I have RRA middy hand guards coming.  It looks like the best option receiver would need refinishing.

The FSB is a F so the post will just sit a little low, I think.  Otherwise I could always shorten the post too or have the flat on the FSB machined lower.

Am I crazy to want a retro midlength carbine?   Are the Fulton Armory "slick side" 604 style uppers GTG?


Link Posted: 7/8/2015 6:15:45 AM EDT
[#1]
Quoted:
You retro guys are sick and evil planting thought in my head.

I ordered a midlength barreled upper from BCM and got it today.  Once in hand, I'm thinking it's screaming for a 604 style upper.  Running through my spare parts I have a flat delta ring, A1 flash hider, A1 pistol grip, and a fiber carbine buttstock off my 9mm for swap too.  I have RRA middy hand guards coming.  It looks like the best option receiver would need refinishing.

The FSB is a F so the post will just sit a little low, I think.  Otherwise I could always shorten the post too or have the flat on the FSB machined lower.

Am I crazy to want a retro midlength carbine?   Are the Fulton Armory "slick side" 604 style uppers GTG?

http://i228.photobucket.com/albums/ee73/tangotag_bucket/7C04C981-7614-4C4D-84B9-F4107A6FEA35_zps7satrstj.jpg
http://i228.photobucket.com/albums/ee73/tangotag_bucket/BC4141F9-B04E-4B88-8896-37BCE59C6AEC_zpsnmtefvwk.jpg
View Quote



You's be crazy to NOT want a Retro Middy!



This is still on my list of "Things needing to be finished one day" but the barrel needs to be circumcised, that .750 FSB really gets to me too and I need another rear handguard cap since that one is now on my GX-5857.

Oh and I want to move the bayonet lug back to the back of the FSB too!


Link Posted: 7/8/2015 2:08:06 PM EDT
[#2]
I think the "hard" part would be finding a pair of mid-length handguards that fit the theme (triangular). I have never looked so I can't honestly say just how hard they may or may not be to find or modify from rifle ones. For the modification, I'm sure the guys who have done 607 clones can be of assistance.

Link Posted: 7/8/2015 7:30:05 PM EDT
[#3]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
I think the "hard" part would be finding a pair of mid-length handguards that fit the theme (triangular). I have never looked so I can't honestly say just how hard they may or may not be to find or modify from rifle ones. For the modification, I'm sure the guys who have done 607 clones can be of assistance.

View Quote


No sweat! Ya just have to roll your own!







Measuring tape, hacksaw, J&B Welding Compound and a donor set of handguards. (Or two. I THINK I got lucky and got it on the first try.)

Use one of the Primary Industries 607 rear cap and the "shims" fit inside nicely. (File and sand to fit.)
Link Posted: 7/8/2015 7:38:24 PM EDT
[#4]
midlength gas system in this one, Not really retro, only the Ai grip and butt stock.

Link Posted: 7/8/2015 7:58:07 PM EDT
[#5]
Quoted:

Am I crazy to want a retro midlength carbine?

View Quote


Not at all.  I sort of have one in the works and just need to refinish it with Norrell's grayish flat black if I can ever find the time.
Link Posted: 7/8/2015 11:26:54 PM EDT
[#6]
I did a 629 with a Fulton Slick side as a middy so no SBR stamp unlike the XM177E2

Link Posted: 7/9/2015 12:31:07 AM EDT
[#7]
This is what my mid length currently looks like. I still need to get a correct rear handguard cap made so I can run triangular guards.



Link Posted: 7/9/2015 12:47:41 AM EDT
[#8]
No pressure from the audience.

Link Posted: 7/9/2015 10:15:59 AM EDT
[#9]
Lots of great looking rifles guys.

A GUU-5P mid-length could be another option without molesting a nice set of triangles.
Link Posted: 7/9/2015 12:20:35 PM EDT
[#10]
Link Posted: 7/9/2015 5:16:12 PM EDT
[#11]
Here's my retro'ed midlength.  Totally not correct with the upper and lower, but the handguards were fun to make and are really comfortable!



Link Posted: 7/9/2015 5:45:50 PM EDT
[#12]


Link Posted: 7/9/2015 7:33:11 PM EDT
[#13]
More middy goodness.

Link Posted: 7/9/2015 8:31:59 PM EDT
[#14]
My first middy. Of course, it wasn't really a middy except in handguard length... and it was chambered .458 Socom. And bent the crap out of stock latch pins.





Link Posted: 7/9/2015 10:33:38 PM EDT
[#15]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History


What did you do for the rear handguard cap?
Link Posted: 7/12/2015 5:52:44 PM EDT
[#16]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:


What did you do for the rear handguard cap?
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Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:


What did you do for the rear handguard cap?


m1sniper. He made a few many years ago, then broke the mold.
Link Posted: 7/12/2015 7:23:48 PM EDT
[#17]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:


What did you do for the rear handguard cap?
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Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:


What did you do for the rear handguard cap?



They USED to be CHEAPER!

That's the style I used.
Link Posted: 7/12/2015 9:47:57 PM EDT
[#18]
my old XMiddy177 in 6.8SPC


and of course one of my favorite middy build pics

Link Posted: 7/14/2015 11:27:10 PM EDT
[#19]
Getting closer, it should be together by the weekend for testing.  After that the lower will probably get broken down for refinishing.  I plan to put on a prong flash hider which looks fuzzy in the pic.  

See what you guys made me do.
Link Posted: 7/15/2015 5:15:18 PM EDT
[#20]
It's functionally together at this point and it feels great.  The color of that lower.  Well probably this weekend or next that should change matching the upper.
Link Posted: 7/15/2015 5:46:05 PM EDT
[#21]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
It's functionally together at this point and it feels great.  The color of that lower.  Well probably this weekend or next that should change matching the upper.
<a href="http://s228.photobucket.com/user/tangotag_bucket/media/12F3CC5E-E90A-45A0-B9CF-17ED4CB2FB20_zpshsxekyv0.jpg.html" target="_blank">http://i228.photobucket.com/albums/ee73/tangotag_bucket/12F3CC5E-E90A-45A0-B9CF-17ED4CB2FB20_zpshsxekyv0.jpg</a>
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Looks great!  Are you going to do triangle handguards on her?
Link Posted: 7/15/2015 6:14:14 PM EDT
[#22]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Looks great!  Are you going to do triangle handguards on her?
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At this point why not.  I have a machinist friend who was excited about making the stock caps.  If I come across a functional set of triangles then yes they will be done.
Link Posted: 7/15/2015 7:54:10 PM EDT
[#23]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:


At this point why not.  I have a machinist friend who was excited about making the stock caps.  If I come across a functional set of triangles then yes they will be done.
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Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Quoted:
Looks great!  Are you going to do triangle handguards on her?


At this point why not.  I have a machinist friend who was excited about making the stock caps.  If I come across a functional set of triangles then yes they will be done.


Thanks to Hipshot's thread:  http://www.ar15.com/forums/t_7_159/1436148_WTS_Retro_Triangle__M203_and_XM148_Hand_Guards__3_Prong_Flash_Suppressor__Small_Parts_Price_Drop.html

I bought mine from Numrich, but the condition varies considerably.  One was in great shape, the other was scratched and gouged pretty good.
Link Posted: 7/19/2015 9:39:08 PM EDT
[#24]
Initial range report, rifle is now zeroed following that long range steel gong ringing.
Here is what the front sight looks like with the F front sight based barrel on a pre-A2 upper.
My lower is already degreased and in the process of refinishing, I should have it beck before the end of the week.  The steel painted parts will be reparked by then too.
More pics will be up once reassembled.
Link Posted: 7/19/2015 10:18:45 PM EDT
[#25]
I like this very much.

OK! Who is going to make some mid-length triangle hand guards?

I built custom corvettes for several years and just being around resins and fiber glass make me break out in a rash.
So, it's something I can no longer do.

This would sell if the price is not to far out there.

I got some of the plastic carbine triangle one from Model-1 and they work great for what I need.
That would work for me.

It would help it they would work with stock end caps.

Ron




Link Posted: 7/19/2015 11:06:10 PM EDT
[#26]
I love showing mine off whenever I get the chance

Here is a "retro Pic" with an Israeli scope and GP sling



here with an RRA entry stock ( I have gone back to the type D)



and a short vid of it in action

http://vid335.photobucket.com/albums/m475/spuriosreset/Militaria/CE7F8891-9C2E-4BCD-9B71-14D537AC66C8.mp4
Link Posted: 7/20/2015 8:46:41 PM EDT
[#27]
Years ago I built a 723ish Middy.  Great rifle, very handy.
Link Posted: 7/20/2015 10:14:51 PM EDT
[#28]
That's a great looking carbine, Forager!
Link Posted: 7/22/2015 1:37:38 PM EDT
[#29]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
I like this very much.

OK! Who is going to make some mid-length triangle hand guards?

I built custom corvettes for several years and just being around resins and fiber glass make me break out in a rash.
So, it's something I can no longer do.

This would sell if the price is not to far out there.

I got some of the plastic carbine triangle one from Model-1 and they work great for what I need.
That would work for me.

It would help it they would work with stock end caps.

Ron




View Quote


I considered making a bulk run using a front cap.It would have been cheap and very easy to install (unless knocking a FSB off is beyond your skill)
The factory h/g's have a reinfoprcement bar molded into them. The cut marks for a 607 front cap carbine or midlength fall right on this mark as if the h/gs were made to modified that way....

Cutting the area not reinforced makes the h/g thin and weak.. Using rear caps does this very thing......

But every other person wanted a different style... No way to make everyone happy there fore I did not spend my hard earned dollars on it....


Link Posted: 7/22/2015 11:03:37 PM EDT
[#30]
OP, why did you buy the BCM-built upper instead of just a barrel?
Link Posted: 7/23/2015 9:08:33 AM EDT
[#31]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:


I considered making a bulk run using a front cap.It would have been cheap and very easy to install (unless knocking a FSB off is beyond your skill)
The factory h/g's have a reinfoprcement bar molded into them. The cut marks for a 607 front cap carbine or midlength fall right on this mark as if the h/gs were made to modified that way....

Cutting the area not reinforced makes the h/g thin and weak.. Using rear caps does this very thing......

But every other person wanted a different style... No way to make everyone happy there fore I did not spend my hard earned dollars on it....


View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Quoted:
I like this very much.

OK! Who is going to make some mid-length triangle hand guards?

I built custom corvettes for several years and just being around resins and fiber glass make me break out in a rash.
So, it's something I can no longer do.

This would sell if the price is not to far out there.

I got some of the plastic carbine triangle one from Model-1 and they work great for what I need.
That would work for me.

It would help it they would work with stock end caps.

Ron






I considered making a bulk run using a front cap.It would have been cheap and very easy to install (unless knocking a FSB off is beyond your skill)
The factory h/g's have a reinfoprcement bar molded into them. The cut marks for a 607 front cap carbine or midlength fall right on this mark as if the h/gs were made to modified that way....

Cutting the area not reinforced makes the h/g thin and weak.. Using rear caps does this very thing......

But every other person wanted a different style... No way to make everyone happy there fore I did not spend my hard earned dollars on it....




Knocking the FSB is OK!
It is the working with the glass and resin that is the problem for me.

I was hoping some one here would make up some using the plastic molding method with a single heat shield and some end caps to fit it.
I know this is asking for a lot. I just don't have that skill. or equipment to do it.
I don't have a clue of the cost to do it to make a profit on it, maybe out of range for many of us.
We can still look at what some of you have done and drool at them.
They all look very good.

Thanks
Ron
Link Posted: 7/23/2015 10:50:50 AM EDT
[#32]


forager  Your Carbine with the Israeli Scope and D stock, is a really neat looking carbine.  How does she shoot for you?

I wonder if the Military would have replaced the M-1 Carbine with something like that if there would have been any complaint's ?

My next Carbine is going to be along the same lines as yours.  Thanks for the pic.



Link Posted: 7/23/2015 11:36:05 AM EDT
[#33]
Forager I shouldn't be looking at your pictures. They have me wanting to keep working on my idea for a carbine build.
Very nice rifle.
Link Posted: 7/23/2015 7:54:57 PM EDT
[#34]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
OP, why did you buy the BCM-built upper instead of just a barrel?
View Quote

I kind of had a future project tossed into the mix when looking for options.  I specifically wanted a chrome lined 1:7 true pencil weight with a .625 FSB having the barrel assembled was just a bonus.  I already had the 2/0 taper reamer for installing taper pins and have extra pins.  So that really wasn't an issue.  But, they included the BCG and their Mod 4 charging handle for a reasonable price which encouraged the assembled upper purchase.  The BCM upper receiver and Mod 0 brake will probably go toward a 16" SS410 middy-gas Recce style Key-Mod upper down the road.  I already have a BCM 18" SS410 based rifle which is an insane tack driver.  Before committing to the sale my concern was the F FSB on the barrel once zeroed. But by dimensions listed it should have been acceptable to me, which seems to work just fine.

If I had bought the BCM stripped barrel I would have installed a non-F FSB on it at that point.
Link Posted: 7/24/2015 8:33:48 PM EDT
[#35]
Thanks for the inspiration guys.  Back together all refinished.

Link Posted: 7/24/2015 9:41:18 PM EDT
[#36]
Link Posted: 7/27/2015 5:43:51 PM EDT
[#37]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History




I REALLY need to build one of those.  Ive wanted to for years but keep putting it off.
Link Posted: 7/29/2015 2:10:49 PM EDT
[#38]
One day I might post a DIY guide on how to make them correctly.
Link Posted: 7/29/2015 6:35:03 PM EDT
[#39]
Link Posted: 7/29/2015 9:27:34 PM EDT
[#40]


Damn, Harlan,  That is exactly what I was thinking.  That is one Beautiful AR Carbine.

The only thing I'd change on that AR Carbine of yours, is to put a 3-prong Flash-Hider instead of the Bird Cage.

If you EVER feel the need to get rid of it, Call Me !!!!



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