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MO, USA
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Posted: 10/22/2006 1:23:33 AM EDT
[#1]
Are these picky about buffer-gas block specs? I'm wishing to add a mil-spec buffer system for interchangeability. Will that cycle fine with a pistol configuration upper?
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PA, USA
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Posted: 10/25/2006 4:19:22 AM EDT
[#2]
hi i am new to this and am building an ar 15 7.5 pistol. will a standat=rd car buffer and spring work in this barrel length? thanks.
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Posted: 10/28/2006 7:54:49 AM EDT
[#3]
If you buy a purpose-built pistol upper, ( gas port is slightly larger) YES . 
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OK, USA
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Posted: 12/28/2006 10:57:29 PM EDT
[#4]
Used to build AR pistols when they first came on the scene 15years ago. Tried to make do with the rear buffer assembly sold by Model 1, M and A, and Gunsmoke. None worked to my satisfaction. Those 45 pistol recoil springs never held up to the violent force placed on them by the AR bolt carrier. A very high cyclic rate. Not even the Wolfs...(.and I used 18 up to 25 pounds in my testing ) could sustain more than a few mags before giving it up. And that little buffer they all used, couldn't keep the bolt from bouncing back. Purely, not enough mass to steady the carrier assembly after chambering the next round.
There were also many problems were with the gas port diameter and its location on the barrels. The AR needs about 4 inches of barrel in front of the gas port to function. This DWELL TIME is critical for proper extraction and good ejection. Unless you enjoy constant jams! At first, the gas ports were coming out undersized for the short rear ends and that didn't work. But by drilling out the port and installing an adjustable gas port fixture, you could then tune for the exact amount of gas volume and pressure,each weapon needed to cycle. A modified CAR buffer tube with the bottom machined smooth (and round), allowed me to then use a CAR buffer and spring combo. No more bolt bounce. You'll also need a genuine Smith Vortex to tame the muzzle flash. Don't believe me? Test with a regular GI A1 or A2 about dusk. You'll soon SEE why. And be sure to wear a long sleeve shirt....unless you want to burn your forearms. Peace out. |
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NC, USA
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Posted: 1/11/2007 9:15:19 PM EDT
[#5]
"And be sure to wear a long sleeve shirt....unless you want to burn your forearms" That's just badass.
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NJ, USA
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Posted: 7/6/2007 6:56:25 PM EDT
[#7]
http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b230/jonoboy/IM002020.jpg
http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b230/jonoboy/IM002015.jpg Can someone identify this buffer tube (or buffer tube cover) for me? 
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Posted: 7/9/2007 8:20:30 PM EDT
[Last Edit: zwvirtual]
[#8]
It appears to be a pistol buffer tube with a CAA Buttstock saddle strapped to it. Interesting idea. I'm curious as to what was used to secure it to the buffer tube. 
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NJ, USA
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Posted: 7/19/2007 5:25:00 PM EDT
[#9]
Yeah I'm curious too... that black strap (whatever it may be) is probably the key.
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USA
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Posted: 9/10/2007 10:42:24 PM EDT
[#10]
I had the gunsmoke-type buffer tube and spring. Lots of forward assisting prior to putting the ACE on there. 7 inch barrel. With the full carbine ACE tube originally I was getting some short stroking. Clipped 3 coils from the buffer spring. 500 rds later it hasn't done it since.
I plan on buying another carbine buffer and spring to see if I can cut that down and make it work with my shorter buffer tube, but I'm partial to the ACE at this point. |
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FL, USA
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Posted: 10/24/2007 2:29:12 PM EDT
[Last Edit: dragonmaster1951]
[#11]
This is my pistol with GSE buffer never had a problem.
http://i227.photobucket.com/albums/dd173/piratesover40/th_MyPistols.jpg |
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Posted: 11/26/2007 9:02:50 AM EDT
[#12]
Anyone have part numbers and prices for all that is required to do this? I'm getting ready to build my first pistol and this seems to be the way to go to get the best balance of length vs. reliability. |
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TX, USA
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Posted: 11/26/2007 1:16:30 PM EDT
[#13]
Here is what I did when I built my pistol - it functions 100% all the time no questions asked.
Parts: Colt M4 barrel (1/7) cut to "11 inches, I rethreaded and recrowned the muzzle, enlarged the gasport by .015 - for a total size of around .085 IIRC. This put no more than an inch of barrel in front of the FSB. RR Bolt/carrier cut down to mimic the Bushmaster pistol carrier, left .125 of webbing around the back end. Smooth all edges and reblued the exposed steel. Buffer tube is an old Model-1 sales tube like the one that everyone says doesn't work. I used the tube, cap, and spring guide, threw away the rest. Drilled/tapped the end of the cap and installed a KNS sling mount mount, and an Uncle Mike's sling mount. Machined an aluminum spacer to set how far the end cap screws onto the tube - if/when you build this, you will see why..... Spring/buffer is from the Bushmaster pistol, I just called them up and ordered the parts, think it was all of $16 or so. So, assembled all this stuff on a RR flat upper, and virgin fully-milled POF lower and off I was. Has been and continues to be 100% reliable - one of my favorite AR's! |
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FL, USA
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Posted: 12/29/2007 7:57:07 PM EDT
[#14]
I have a Gunsmoke and it works great. |
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VA, USA
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Posted: 12/29/2007 10:24:25 PM EDT
[#15]
mine works great as well |
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Posted: 1/30/2008 2:26:58 AM EDT
[#16]
Does the Gunsmoke buffer tube use a standard bolt carrier? Thanks in advance.
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Posted: 3/2/2008 10:12:10 PM EDT
[#17]
I'm new to this, and considering an AR pistol build. I want mine in .223, and love that style buffer tube assembly. Will that run 100% for a .223 or is that for a 9mm? |
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AZ, USA
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Posted: 4/2/2008 3:09:39 PM EDT
[#18]
I have something very similar to the Gunsmoke pistol from Chester Arms http://www.chesterarmsllc.com/Handgun/AR-15%20Pistols.htm and it works flawlessly. 7 1/2" barrel, 4" buffer tube. After about the first 30 rounds and a good cleaning it has fired over 300 rounds with no problems. As fast as you can pull the trigger it will pile all the brass right in a pile about 3' ahead and at about 1 o'clock to the shooter. Definitely needs a better flash hider. there is a 18" ball of fire exiting the barrel. It is the most fun you can have with an AR IMHO.
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Posted: 5/16/2008 10:44:50 PM EDT
[#19]
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OK, USA
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Posted: 5/27/2008 11:32:43 PM EDT
[#20]
Why would he go to jail? That isn't a buttstock, it is simply a pistol buffer tube with a battery compartment on the side. You can't use that against your shoulder.
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Posted: 5/29/2008 3:34:08 AM EDT
[#21]
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Posted: 5/31/2008 5:14:03 PM EDT
[Last Edit: nobody123]
[#22]
If you use a "pistol" tube created from a CAR tube that is smooth (i.e. no stock position lug holes in the bottom side), then you are OK because a normal, off-the-shelf CAR stock will not work. I beleive this is what Model 1 Sales sells now as their "pistol tube/buffer". The ATF concept that you all have been dancing around here is "constructive intent". This is ATF's terminology and their logic - not mine. Don't shoot the messenger.
As for "face slap" (muzzle blast hitting you in the face), the solution is a muzzle device that forces the blast forward (down range). I have had good results with the DPMS Muzzle Brake Levang Linear 1/2" x 28 Thread AR-15 Pre-Ban Steel Matte (MidwayUSA sells them - $32.49 - at http://www.midwayusa.com/eproductpage.exe/showproduct?saleitemid=524840&t=11082005) |
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OK, USA
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Posted: 6/3/2008 2:14:49 PM EDT
[#23]
Unlike machine guns, there is no such thing as "constructive intent" with SBRs.
I think you would have more to fear from ignorant local cops, than from Federal agents in this matter. Any BATFE agent will likely be aware of the fact that this is still a legal pistol, and that there is no "constructive intent" with SBRs. But a local cop is likely to be uneducated on the more "in-depth" aspects of firearms law. |
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OK, USA
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Posted: 7/7/2008 11:16:09 PM EDT
[#24]
You first have properly ID the hole you're referring to. The hole for the safety/selector detent and spring exit from just above the pistol grip housing. That small hole in the top of the grip holds the spring which presses up and on the detent engaged with the safety and or selector.
It is the rear take-down pin spring and detent that exits from the rear of the lower reciever and is held in place by the rifle buttstock or end plate from a carbine stock. the fact no one noticed this error leaves me to doubt the technical skill you guys possess. |
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OK, USA
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Posted: 7/7/2008 11:30:47 PM EDT
[#25]
In 5.56 or 7.62x39, the key to getting these short buffer assemblies to function is the mass of the buffer.
Heavy 22-26lb 1911 springs only go so far. Without the mass(weight) of at least a carbine buffer, not much else will work reliably. Most often the weapon will fire once but after chambering the next round, the bolt will bounce out of battery just enough so when pulling the trigger for shot number 2 the hammer only dents the primer as it pushes the bolt back into battery. Bolt bounce has occurred in many weapon designs and here it is again. Which ever buffer tube you chose, it should use a CAR buffer in weight and mass, same for the spring...unless you enjoy a single shot pistol. |
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TX, USA
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Posted: 8/10/2008 10:50:26 PM EDT
[#26]
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NY, USA
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Posted: 8/13/2008 6:56:31 PM EDT
[#27]
Can someone show me a pic or link to, of a Bushmaster pistol tube, buffer, spring, and modified bolt carrier ? Looked on their site and here but didn't find anything. How long does the bushmaster pistol buffer tube stick out the back ? |
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MO, USA
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Posted: 10/18/2008 6:40:58 PM EDT
[#28]
the simple answer for pistol buffer tubes and available butt stocks is no threaded hole in back of tube for stock mounting screw. I threaded a aluminum rod JB welded in place and ground to flush. With bake on finish it is invisable and perfectly legal.
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Posted: 12/5/2008 11:05:33 AM EDT
[Last Edit: millsusaf]
[#29]
The Bushmaster system:
Complete Bolt/Bolt carrier assembly___# AZ15008 for $159.95 Chrome bolt carrier with key________ # AZ15178 for $95.95 Black bolt carrier with key __________# AZ15267 for $75.95 Buffer_______________________________# AZ15009 for $16.95 Buffer spring_________________________# AZ15998 for $2.95 Buffer tube__________________________# AZ15078 for $7.95 Lower receiver end cap_______________# AZ15307 for $7.95 End cap screw_______________________# AZ15029 for $.50 Buffer tube O ring___________________# AZ15077 for $.50 Since on one has said much about the system and I had a hell of a time finding the parts list I though I would put it here. I HAD  one and loved it. Worked flawlessly with Wolf.
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TX, USA
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Posted: 1/3/2009 7:03:40 PM EDT
[#30]
Update FYI on Ace Pistol Buffer Assemblies. Ordered mine 12/17/08, received it today 1/3/09. The gusset or take down pin retention block is pretty well made, billet alum I assume. Went together easily of course and can't wait to try it the new addition at the range.
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Posted: 1/27/2009 3:22:01 PM EDT
[#31]
The Gunsmoke buffer/spring system works just as good as it looks. My pistol is my favorite gun by far now. Everybody wants a turn when I pull it out at the range. I cant wait to get back home and fire it some more. Too bad I couldnt bring it to Iraq with me. 
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WI, USA
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Posted: 1/29/2009 6:55:52 AM EDT
[#32]
I use a Spikes pistol tube with a Ace foam tube over it. It is really clean looking. And you have many good options for buffers. One more thing...The CAA modular grip is the cat's ass for a pistol. You can hold my 7.5" .223 at arms length. One handed. As long as you like.
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USA
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Posted: 2/21/2009 10:02:42 AM EDT
[#33]
Is gunsmoke the only place to find the 4" buffer tube?
Anyone else have one? |
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OK, USA
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Posted: 2/21/2009 9:49:59 PM EDT
[#34]
Those of you using the ACE Ltd pistol kits. Did you use the same buffer included in the kit or did you have to go heavier ???
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Posted: 3/30/2009 9:07:13 PM EDT
[#35]
Originally Posted By QwikKotaTx:
Update FYI on Ace Pistol Buffer Assemblies. Ordered mine 12/17/08, received it today 1/3/09. The gusset or take down pin retention block is pretty well made, billet alum I assume. Went together easily of course and can't wait to try it the new addition at the range. ordered one today, the wait begins. |
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MI, USA
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Posted: 4/2/2009 11:15:52 PM EDT
[Last Edit: suepahfly]
[#36]
I used a commercial diameter carbine buffer tube, filled in the bottom groove with JB weld (slightly heaped), and dipped it in plasticote. There is no way a carbine stock is going on unless I shave off the plasticote and grind out the JB weld. I finally got the pistol done today and it ran great, no problems (only shot 80 rounds though).
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Posted: 4/7/2009 9:17:05 PM EDT
[#37]
Originally Posted By suepahfly:
I used a commercial diameter carbine buffer tube, filled in the bottom groove with JB weld (slightly heaped), and dipped it in plasticote. There is no way a carbine stock is going on unless I shave off the plasticote and grind out the JB weld. I finally got the pistol done today and it ran great, no problems (only shot 80 rounds though). you running a standard carbine buffer? |
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MI, USA
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Posted: 4/8/2009 1:18:07 PM EDT
[#38]
Yeah, I've only shot it the 1 time with brown bear .223, but it worked fine. I may get a heavier buffer in the future to try it out though.
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NV, USA
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Posted: 4/9/2009 12:05:00 AM EDT
[Last Edit: wynn]
[#39]
I have a question regarding the statement about RRA buffer tubes. Page one states "RRA Entry Stock Tube ––––-> Works 100% but you need to rig something to hold the pin in the rear of the lower for the selector."
Does a receiver plate help with this? The PK Firearms RRA Pistol buffer tube/spring/buffer kit just arrived the other day and I think I have all the parts needed. I also wondered about installation of the RRA as I do not see photos with it having a castle nut. Any info or links to info are appreciated. I'll be putting together my first (w/ help) and would like to see/hear what others have done. Thank you again. |
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PA, USA
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Posted: 4/13/2009 4:09:01 PM EDT
[#40]
Spikes Pistol Buffer tube!Nicest of the bunch!Works 100%
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SC, USA
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Posted: 4/25/2009 6:39:33 PM EDT
[#41]
Anyone know how long it is taking to find pistol parts like the buffer tube ? Before it was a matter of what works, now it's a matter of what works and what can be found!
I just got my receivers in and would like to set it up with the buffer kit and LPK before an upper arrives. Speaking of that are pistol uppers like a Kitty Kat just as difficult to find as standard rifle uppers. |
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FL, USA
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Posted: 8/5/2009 11:19:54 PM EDT
[#42]
I have a Gunsmoke on my pistol and i took it out to the range and every time it would jam up on cycling a new cartridge. It seems like the bolt will not come back far enough. I have adjusted the threads on the tube to different lengths, but still jams. Lubed the heck ot of it as well. Anyone got any suggestions with the Gunsmoke on how to fix this problem.?
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TN, USA
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Posted: 11/10/2009 8:36:56 PM EDT
[#43]
Anybody try an FTF Industries pistol buffer? Wondering how short it is compared to the RRA tube. FTF link Supposedly it works.
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CA, USA
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Posted: 11/21/2009 3:54:53 PM EDT
[#44]
Can anyone provide the length of the Model 1 pistol buffer tube, RRA tube, and FTF tube, measured from the back of the lower receiver?
Would be nice to have the exposed lengths of these all listed in one place. Here is what I have so far: Pistol Buffer Tube Length, from back of lower receiver ACE = 7" Spikes = 7" RRA = ? Model 1 = ? FTF = ? |
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Posted: 12/28/2009 3:30:47 PM EDT
[#45]
Originally Posted By ColdDeadHands1:
Can anyone provide the length of the Model 1 pistol buffer tube, RRA tube, and FTF tube, measured from the back of the lower receiver? Would be nice to have the exposed lengths of these all listed in one place. Here is what I have so far: Pistol Buffer Tube Length, from back of lower receiver ACE = 7" Spikes = 7" RRA = ? Model 1 = ? FTF = ? If I had to guess, the the Model 1 is about 5". |
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FL, USA
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Posted: 12/28/2009 4:48:02 PM EDT
[#46]
Originally Posted By ColdDeadHands1:
Can anyone provide the length of the Model 1 pistol buffer tube, RRA tube, and FTF tube, measured from the back of the lower receiver? Would be nice to have the exposed lengths of these all listed in one place. Here is what I have so far: Pistol Buffer Tube Length, from back of lower receiver ACE = 7" Spikes = 7" RRA = ? ......7" Model 1 = ? FTF = ? |
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KY, USA
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Posted: 1/4/2010 9:05:10 PM EDT
[#47]
Where is a good place to buy the Ace set up?
I am leaning toward the Spikes with a cover, but can't find the Ace buffer set up to compare. Looking to complete my 10.5 pistol. THANK YOU.. |
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OR, USA
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Posted: 3/16/2010 5:51:49 PM EDT
[#48]
Originally Posted By bulltoadie:
I have a Gunsmoke on my pistol and i took it out to the range and every time it would jam up on cycling a new cartridge. It seems like the bolt will not come back far enough. I have adjusted the threads on the tube to different lengths, but still jams. Lubed the heck ot of it as well. Anyone got any suggestions with the Gunsmoke on how to fix this problem.? I just got a Gunsmoke pistol kit and it seems I might have the same problem. The piece that sits in the rear of the bolt carrier doesn't seem to be going in far enough. I am using the kit on a LWRC 10.5 M6A1 upper with their 2 piece bolt carrier. Anyone have any ideas? I assumed this would work since LWRC's M6A2-P Pistol uses the same or similar pistol buffer. |
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Posted: 3/25/2010 5:46:14 PM EDT
[#49]
I just put another pistol together, 11.5" this build. Went with the Ace kit again, since they have worked great in the past. This one is no different. $59.00 from Midway.
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SC, USA
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Posted: 5/30/2010 6:00:15 PM EDT
[#50]
Anyone have another source for the ACE kits OTHER than Midway that is good? They have had them on B/O for awhile now and I'd like to get my pistol lower built quickly since I have a SBR upper lined up but my Form 1 has not come back yet. I want to get that upper before it's gone but don't want to get a less than 16' upper in the house with no pistol lower or SBR in the same house.
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