New NDS-18S (semi) lower receiver (AR-180 type) p.3 new pics - Page 6

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[ARCHIVED THREAD] - New NDS-18S (semi) lower receiver (AR-180 type) p.3 new pics (Page 6 of 7)

Posted: 11/11/2014 9:42:17 AM EDT

[#1]

The NDS-18S uses an AR-15 pistol grip. The 180B's pistol grip is part of the lower and can't be removed.

I imagine you could get a couple of adapters from stormwerkz and use the original buttstock.

The NoDak is designed to use his adapters to mount whatever buttstock you choose.

Posted: 11/18/2014 9:26:01 PM EDT

[#2]

You may have seen my posts about shortening my AR180B upper and building a pistol/sbr on the NDS-18S lower.

I considered doing all the machine work myself but as my access to my buddy's machine shop is limited and I haven't used a lathe in about 15 years, I called John Thomas.

Here are some of the pics he sent me of the work he did today.

Needless to say, I'm very excited about finishing this up and getting her to the range and working out the final gas port size to make it run.

I also bought myself a domain and started a blog where I hope to collect all the AR-180 info I can lay my hands on.

AR180S.com

Give it a look and I welcome your feedback.

Posted: 11/19/2014 1:52:15 AM EDT

[#3]

You're a true hero Rix.

Now to keep praying and saving for an update from Nodak Spud.

Posted: 11/19/2014 8:35:08 PM EDT

[#4]

Looks like John is done and it should be heading back to me soon.

Then I can start work on the hand guards and the gas port.

Enjoy the pics.

AR180S.com

Posted: 11/20/2014 7:52:16 PM EDT

[#5]

That is Sweeeeeeet.

JT does nice work.

Posted: 11/20/2014 8:12:48 PM EDT

[#6]

Anyone have a 3D printer who could make some shorty handguards?

Posted: 11/20/2014 8:33:57 PM EDT

[#7]

I know next to nothing about 3D printing but would they be able to use my finished handguards as a model?

Posted: 11/21/2014 12:48:42 AM EDT

[#8]

Know what would rustle my jimmies? A variant of the lower that could take AK mags (magically) to make a sort of modern version of this;

http://www.ar15.com/forums/t_3_123/660717_AR_100_Series_of_Weapons.html

Posted: 11/24/2014 9:59:30 PM EDT

[#9]

The majority of this project is going to be in this thread.

AR-180B Shorty Project

And my blog.

AR180S.com

But I just wanted to thank the guys at NoDak for making this awesome lower.

You have really kick started a new chapter for me, and cost me a lot of money.

A pic to wet your appetite.

Posted: 11/24/2014 10:57:49 PM EDT

[#10]

Looks phenomenal, Rix.

Hope to follow in your footsteps with mine.

Posted: 11/24/2014 11:34:10 PM EDT

[#11]

Cool...

Posted: 11/25/2014 9:55:47 PM EDT

[#12]

What are the chances of making the bolt hold open catch?
Those of us with original AR180's don't want to give up that feature. By my estimates it will cost $400 - $450 to build your lower and use it on my 180 and I loose a very good feature of the AR180.
I'm really glad to see someone take up this project. I never really understood why the AR180 wasn't back in production.

Posted: 11/25/2014 10:07:28 PM EDT

[#13]

Quote History

Quoted:

snip

I'm really glad to see someone take up this project. I never really understood why the AR180 wasn't back in production.

View Quote

Pulling it out of my butt, but based on what happened in the old AR10/180 subforum is that Armalite wanted to for about 30 seconds, then realized that the cost to make the rifle for a very limited market wasn't worth the capitol invested, especially if it cut into it's own capability of making AR-15's.

That's why companies like Masterpiece can make the MPAR556... a lot of the parts are off the shelf stuff from their other guns or AR-15's, and they are one of the only companies making stamped guns so they are set up for it already.

Posted: 12/2/2014 6:19:53 PM EDT

[#14]

Well I was in the shop a little this Thanksgiving weekend and whipped up a safety selector prototype.

I figure it would be less expensive for us to do a turned shaft and bolt-on levers that investing in a casting tool.

This is just a rough proof of concept piece. The sheet metal lever was cut from a scrap AK receiver and cut on the manual mill and with a dremel.

I bent the "hump" with a torch and hand tools.

I tried to replicate the right side lever on the Originals, but with a more solid attachment. The levers will be the same on both sides, and we'll use a round head cap screw.

Probably make the lever a bit longer also.

Posted: 12/3/2014 8:16:23 PM EDT

[#15]

So do you take Debit, Mike?

Posted: 12/4/2014 1:05:40 AM EDT

[#16]

Quote History

Quoted:
Well I was in the shop a little this Thanksgiving weekend and whipped up a safety selector prototype.

I figure it would be less expensive for us to do a turned shaft and bolt-on levers that investing in a casting tool.

This is just a rough proof of concept piece. The sheet metal lever was cut from a scrap AK receiver and cut on the manual mill and with a dremel.

I bent the "hump" with a torch and hand tools.

I tried to replicate the right side lever on the Originals, but with a more solid attachment. The levers will be the same on both sides, and we'll use a round head cap screw.

Probably make the lever a bit longer also.

http://www.hunt101.com/data/500/18S_safety_2.JPG
http://www.hunt101.com/data/500/18S_safety_1.JPG
http://www.hunt101.com/data/500/18S_safety_3.JPG

View Quote

That lever looks damn close to my Costa Mesa!

Posted: 12/4/2014 9:04:42 AM EDT

[#17]

My next "Project" is to see if I can make chicken soup out of chicken sh!t.

Can I make the NDS-18S work with a Vulcan V18?

The problem seems to be that Vulcan moved the placement of the front pivot lug back ever so slightly and then modified the bolt.

The distance from the front pivot to the centerline of the hammer pin is about .250" less on an AR lower than a 180 lower.

They machined a .80" deep groove by the firing pin and rounded off the bottom.

I'm hoping it will feed rounds as is and then I can swap bolt carriers and make it function.

Posted: 12/4/2014 12:57:42 PM EDT

[#18]

Quote History

Quoted:
What are the chances of making the bolt hold open catch?
Those of us with original AR180's don't want to give up that feature. By my estimates it will cost $400 - $450 to build your lower and use it on my 180 and I loose a very good feature of the AR180.
I'm really glad to see someone take up this project. I never really understood why the AR180 wasn't back in production.

View Quote

We are going to make the "B" style BHO.

I'm not even going to bother making the original style catch. Too expensive for too small of a market.

There might be a way to mod the NDS-18S lower to take the original BHO.

When I get some free time I'll cut one of the protos to see if it would work.

Posted: 12/4/2014 1:26:02 PM EDT

[#19]

Quote History

Quoted:

We are going to make the "B" style BHO.

I'm not even going to bother making the original style catch. Too expensive for too small of a market.

There might be a way to mod the NDS-18S lower to take the original BHO.

When I get some free time I'll cut one of the protos to see if it would work.

View Quote View All Quotes

View All Quotes

Quote History

Quoted:

Quoted:
What are the chances of making the bolt hold open catch?
Those of us with original AR180's don't want to give up that feature. By my estimates it will cost $400 - $450 to build your lower and use it on my 180 and I loose a very good feature of the AR180.
I'm really glad to see someone take up this project. I never really understood why the AR180 wasn't back in production.

We are going to make the "B" style BHO.

I'm not even going to bother making the original style catch. Too expensive for too small of a market.

There might be a way to mod the NDS-18S lower to take the original BHO.

When I get some free time I'll cut one of the protos to see if it would work.

Any other updates?

Posted: 12/4/2014 4:19:40 PM EDT

[#20]

Quote History

Quoted:

We are going to make the "B" style BHO.

I'm not even going to bother making the original style catch. Too expensive for too small of a market.

There might be a way to mod the NDS-18S lower to take the original BHO.

When I get some free time I'll cut one of the protos to see if it would work.

View Quote View All Quotes

View All Quotes

Quote History

Quoted:

Quoted:
What are the chances of making the bolt hold open catch?
Those of us with original AR180's don't want to give up that feature. By my estimates it will cost $400 - $450 to build your lower and use it on my 180 and I loose a very good feature of the AR180.
I'm really glad to see someone take up this project. I never really understood why the AR180 wasn't back in production.

We are going to make the "B" style BHO.

I'm not even going to bother making the original style catch. Too expensive for too small of a market.

There might be a way to mod the NDS-18S lower to take the original BHO.

When I get some free time I'll cut one of the protos to see if it would work.

How much do you want for that prototype selector you made?

Posted: 12/8/2014 9:00:17 AM EDT

[#21]

Those selectors will be a production item.

I have no idea what our price will be yet.

Posted: 12/8/2014 12:53:51 PM EDT

[#22]

Quote History

Quoted:
Those selectors will be a production item.

I have no idea what our price will be yet.

View Quote

Awesome, I am eagerly awaiting production!

Posted: 12/13/2014 10:20:52 AM EDT

[#23]

Alright, I'm going to float a stupid question to Mike and anyone else who's done a conversion with one of these.

Which stock adapter did we want to use, the 180 or 180B?

I think I may definitely have just ordered the wrong one, judging by the photos.

Thanks!

Spenny

Posted: 12/13/2014 12:26:51 PM EDT

[#24]

Quote History

Quoted:
Alright, I'm going to float a stupid question to Mike and anyone else who's done a conversion with one of these.

Which stock adapter did we want to use, the 180 or 180B?

I think I may definitely have just ordered the wrong one, judging by the photos.

Thanks!

Spenny

View Quote

You want the 'B' type.

Posted: 12/21/2014 6:04:22 PM EDT

[#25]

Hi Mike - Desperately need a selector like that for my original AR180 (Costa Mesa) parts kit and NDS-18 receiver I bought from you.

I got the right AR180B trigger-group parts directly from Armalite - the only missing link now to make mine work is a selector from a AR180B. I suppose I could also machine/dremel/hack one myself, but if you've got something in the works already, it will be a huge relief and time-saver, as was the billet receiver.

Once you've got something ready to go out the door, consider it sold.

.

Posted: 12/28/2014 12:01:16 PM EDT

[#26]

Make me a complete AR-180.....I will buy.

I trust NDS to do a good job on a upper/lower combo/parts,etc. way more than I ever did Armalite.

I been wanting an AR-180, but the earlier ones....not quite worth the money. NDS makes it: It will be worth it.

Posted: 1/3/2015 7:11:16 PM EDT

[#27]

Tag...

Posted: 1/4/2015 8:12:42 PM EDT

[#28]

I was able to get my Vulcan V18 running using a NDS-18S lower.

I eventually plan to install a VZ-58 folding stock on my AR-180S pistol after my stamp comes back.

So I decided to make it fit by modifying the locating tab and machining up an adapter.

On this gun it is a complete fail since the sights are already too tall. You almost sit your chin on the stock to line up with the sights.

I think it will work better with My Bravo upper.

Posted: 1/5/2015 4:02:29 PM EDT

[#29]

Hey NDS, you should consider doing this lower to take AK grips. They are more like the original AR180 style, and there are lots of choices these days. A Magpul AK grip would be perfect for a 'modernized' AR180. It would also simplify the machine work in that area, and take less machine time.

I'm just saying.

Posted: 1/5/2015 8:51:34 PM EDT

[#30]

Quote History

Quoted:
Hey NDS, you should consider doing this lower to take AK grips. They are more like the original AR180 style, and there are lots of choices these days. A Magpul AK grip would be perfect for a 'modernized' AR180.

I'm just saying.

View Quote

The US Palm AK grip? It does look very close.

There is also the Tango Down Battle Grip for AR15's that has a profile close to the original AR18 grip.

Posted: 1/6/2015 4:58:51 PM EDT

[#31]

The Tango down is what you seek. We will not be doing AK grips. Sorry.

UPDATE:

I have a couple of pieces of barstock threaded and drilled for AR15 barrel nuts. These will be the basis for my upper prototypes.

I will show pics after I start cutting on them later in January.

Posted: 1/6/2015 6:35:34 PM EDT

[#32]

I'm VERY excited.

Posted: 1/6/2015 9:33:17 PM EDT

[#33]

Quote History

Quoted:
I was able to get my Vulcan V18 running using a NDS-18S lower.

I eventually plan to install a VZ-58 folding stock on my AR-180S pistol after my stamp comes back.

So I decided to make it fit by modifying the locating tab and machining up an adapter.

<a href="http://s576.photobucket.com/user/BigRix/media/AR-180B%20Shorty/4B1013F9-25CB-408A-8FB2-98BFBE9EC46C_zpsvzpkv1fj.jpg.html" target="_blank">http://i576.photobucket.com/albums/ss208/BigRix/AR-180B%20Shorty/4B1013F9-25CB-408A-8FB2-98BFBE9EC46C_zpsvzpkv1fj.jpg</a>

<a href="http://s576.photobucket.com/user/BigRix/media/AR-180B%20Shorty/54EC9C0E-D9CC-417B-A328-9F468E23E264_zpsnrt2pcdd.jpg.html" target="_blank">http://i576.photobucket.com/albums/ss208/BigRix/AR-180B%20Shorty/54EC9C0E-D9CC-417B-A328-9F468E23E264_zpsnrt2pcdd.jpg</a>

<a href="http://s576.photobucket.com/user/BigRix/media/Vulcan%20V18/FE31A7C7-91D4-488E-8F6F-F3509D862DB4_zps4zcki0g4.jpg.html" target="_blank">http://i576.photobucket.com/albums/ss208/BigRix/Vulcan%20V18/FE31A7C7-91D4-488E-8F6F-F3509D862DB4_zps4zcki0g4.jpg</a>

<a href="http://s576.photobucket.com/user/BigRix/media/Vulcan%20V18/F752036C-EAA1-40DD-A8A4-CCE441B7387B_zpsw3hgnfrj.jpg.html" target="_blank">http://i576.photobucket.com/albums/ss208/BigRix/Vulcan%20V18/F752036C-EAA1-40DD-A8A4-CCE441B7387B_zpsw3hgnfrj.jpg</a>

On this gun it is a complete fail since the sights are already too tall. You almost sit your chin on the stock to line up with the sights.

I think it will work better with My Bravo upper.

View Quote

You actually bought a Vulcan? I'm sorry.

Posted: 1/8/2015 2:24:05 PM EDT

[#34]

Quote History

Quoted:
Hey NDS, you should consider doing this lower to take AK grips....

I'm just saying.

View Quote

I think it's hilarious that dudes are displaying high level artistry on this thread and you're asking him to redesign it for another grip... that's not even the correct grip?

3D print one... then take the file to someone with a tormach and have them cut an injection mold.

Easiest part of this whole project.

I LOVE the retro commando Rix did, and wish I could pick up an upper like that...

Posted: 1/8/2015 7:52:43 PM EDT

[#35]

Quote History

Quoted:

You actually bought a Vulcan? I'm sorry.

View Quote View All Quotes

View All Quotes

Quote History

Quoted:

Quoted:
I was able to get my Vulcan V18 running using a NDS-18S lower.

I eventually plan to install a VZ-58 folding stock on my AR-180S pistol after my stamp comes back.

So I decided to make it fit by modifying the locating tab and machining up an adapter.

<a href="http://s576.photobucket.com/user/BigRix/media/AR-180B%20Shorty/4B1013F9-25CB-408A-8FB2-98BFBE9EC46C_zpsvzpkv1fj.jpg.html" target="_blank">http://i576.photobucket.com/albums/ss208/BigRix/AR-180B%20Shorty/4B1013F9-25CB-408A-8FB2-98BFBE9EC46C_zpsvzpkv1fj.jpg</a>

<a href="http://s576.photobucket.com/user/BigRix/media/AR-180B%20Shorty/54EC9C0E-D9CC-417B-A328-9F468E23E264_zpsnrt2pcdd.jpg.html" target="_blank">http://i576.photobucket.com/albums/ss208/BigRix/AR-180B%20Shorty/54EC9C0E-D9CC-417B-A328-9F468E23E264_zpsnrt2pcdd.jpg</a>

<a href="http://s576.photobucket.com/user/BigRix/media/Vulcan%20V18/FE31A7C7-91D4-488E-8F6F-F3509D862DB4_zps4zcki0g4.jpg.html" target="_blank">http://i576.photobucket.com/albums/ss208/BigRix/Vulcan%20V18/FE31A7C7-91D4-488E-8F6F-F3509D862DB4_zps4zcki0g4.jpg</a>

<a href="http://s576.photobucket.com/user/BigRix/media/Vulcan%20V18/F752036C-EAA1-40DD-A8A4-CCE441B7387B_zpsw3hgnfrj.jpg.html" target="_blank">http://i576.photobucket.com/albums/ss208/BigRix/Vulcan%20V18/F752036C-EAA1-40DD-A8A4-CCE441B7387B_zpsw3hgnfrj.jpg</a>

On this gun it is a complete fail since the sights are already too tall. You almost sit your chin on the stock to line up with the sights.

I think it will work better with My Bravo upper.

You actually bought a Vulcan? I'm sorry.

I believe rix has a large collection of ar180s and the Vulcan could be considered a "fun" gun for him. Knowing him a little Im sure he knows exactly what he got himself into and I also bet it works like a treat. :-)

Posted: 1/9/2015 11:47:01 AM EDT

[#36]

Quote History

Quoted:

I believe rix has a large collection of ar180s and the Vulcan could be considered a "fun" gun for him. Knowing him a little Im sure he knows exactly what he got himself into and I also bet it works like a treat. :-)

View Quote View All Quotes

View All Quotes

Quote History

Quoted:

Quoted:
I was able to get my Vulcan V18 running using a NDS-18S lower.

I eventually plan to install a VZ-58 folding stock on my AR-180S pistol after my stamp comes back.

So I decided to make it fit by modifying the locating tab and machining up an adapter.

<a href="http://s576.photobucket.com/user/BigRix/media/AR-180B%20Shorty/4B1013F9-25CB-408A-8FB2-98BFBE9EC46C_zpsvzpkv1fj.jpg.html" target="_blank">http://i576.photobucket.com/albums/ss208/BigRix/AR-180B%20Shorty/4B1013F9-25CB-408A-8FB2-98BFBE9EC46C_zpsvzpkv1fj.jpg</a>

<a href="http://s576.photobucket.com/user/BigRix/media/AR-180B%20Shorty/54EC9C0E-D9CC-417B-A328-9F468E23E264_zpsnrt2pcdd.jpg.html" target="_blank">http://i576.photobucket.com/albums/ss208/BigRix/AR-180B%20Shorty/54EC9C0E-D9CC-417B-A328-9F468E23E264_zpsnrt2pcdd.jpg</a>

<a href="http://s576.photobucket.com/user/BigRix/media/Vulcan%20V18/FE31A7C7-91D4-488E-8F6F-F3509D862DB4_zps4zcki0g4.jpg.html" target="_blank">http://i576.photobucket.com/albums/ss208/BigRix/Vulcan%20V18/FE31A7C7-91D4-488E-8F6F-F3509D862DB4_zps4zcki0g4.jpg</a>

<a href="http://s576.photobucket.com/user/BigRix/media/Vulcan%20V18/F752036C-EAA1-40DD-A8A4-CCE441B7387B_zpsw3hgnfrj.jpg.html" target="_blank">http://i576.photobucket.com/albums/ss208/BigRix/Vulcan%20V18/F752036C-EAA1-40DD-A8A4-CCE441B7387B_zpsw3hgnfrj.jpg</a>

On this gun it is a complete fail since the sights are already too tall. You almost sit your chin on the stock to line up with the sights.

I think it will work better with My Bravo upper.

You actually bought a Vulcan? I'm sorry.

I believe rix has a large collection of ar180s and the Vulcan could be considered a "fun" gun for him. Knowing him a little Im sure he knows exactly what he got himself into and I also bet it works like a treat. :-)

For the long version of the story.

Chicken Shit to Chicken Soup

Posted: 1/9/2015 12:08:50 PM EDT

[#37]

Quote History

Quoted:

I think it's hilarious that dudes are displaying high level artistry on this thread and you're asking him to redesign it for another grip... that's not even the correct grip?

View Quote View All Quotes

View All Quotes

Quote History

Quoted:

Quoted:
Hey NDS, you should consider doing this lower to take AK grips....

I'm just saying.

I think it's hilarious that dudes are displaying high level artistry on this thread and you're asking him to redesign it for another grip... that's not even the correct grip?

There is no correct grip, because nobody makes an AR180 grip anymore... but the AK grip is very similar (arguable closest to correct) and available in many different styles and options. Besides, most AR grips won't fit on the NDS 18 without dremelling anyway because the transition above the grip leaves no room for the 'tang' on rare and uncommon grips like the Magpul MOE.

It wouldn't take too many pocket protectors to make the bottom of the receiver flat, with a square boss with a screwhole in it, to make it fit an AK grip.

Posted: 1/10/2015 8:03:08 PM EDT

[#38]

So in. And subscribed.

Posted: 1/11/2015 9:36:36 AM EDT

[#39]

I don't have an AR180, but upon thinking about it a bit, the AK grip may be too wide (or the receiver too narrow)... but an FAL grip might fit much better. Tapco pretty much ruined the 'Saw' style grip for me, but the FAL grip geometry with a M249 grip would probably work better than the AK grip geometry...and look better.

The AR grip is just not an elegant solution.

/unwanted advice

Posted: 1/14/2015 7:48:03 PM EDT

[#40]

We had 2 issues when I was working on the grip interface.

The first was the angle of attack. It was too steep, like an FAL but not comfortable.

The other was it placed the hand too tight to the bottom of the receiver. This would cause people with gloves or fat hands problems.

The height, angle, and trigger reach are both quite good now. Especially with an M16A1 grip.

If you want something a bit more "AR-180-ish", the Tango Down very much looks the part.

Posted: 1/14/2015 8:01:11 PM EDT

[#41]

Quote History

Quoted:
I don't have an AR180, but upon thinking about it a bit, the AK grip may be too wide (or the receiver too narrow)... but an FAL grip might fit much better. Tapco pretty much ruined the 'Saw' style grip for me, but the FAL grip geometry with a M249 grip would probably work better than the AK grip geometry...and look better.

The AR grip is just not an elegant solution.

/unwanted advice

View Quote

An AK grip won't work because you need the material directly above the grip to allow the tail of the trigger to have somewhere to go.

The "B" model has a molded in grip so there can be a recessed channel in that area.

Posted: 1/16/2015 10:01:36 AM EDT

[#42]

Hey Mike in your range vid you had the original "B" type stock mounted in the fixed position. I take it you used the type 1 and type 3 adapters from Stormwerks no? Looks really good. I was going to cobble up something with an original AR-18 stock I have laying around but after seeing your vid I think I'll try the ole club foot. Really hated the look of that thing til I saw your setup. The B type stock can't be any flimsier than the original after all right? Conjecture on my part as I just secured a donor AR-180B at Buds a day ago and have never handled one. Also is that black ano the NDS-18 is finished in? Thank you sir.

ETA: Hey guys on the "original look grip issue" Mike's got it figured. Just take a look at the many styles of AR grips out there. There has to be a unit that could be reworked to more closely resemble the original. The first that came to my mind was indeed the Tango Down. Remove the stippling, pop a couple of shallow holes in it for the sling swivel and "voila" as the frenchie's say.

Posted: 1/17/2015 12:45:53 PM EDT

[#43]

Yes, I used a Stormwerkz adapter for the OEM stock.

I've never been comfortable with the comb height of that stock. I feel a bit cramped.

If I put an original upper on it, then it feels fine because the sights are taller above bore than the "B".

Posted: 1/18/2015 12:40:20 PM EDT

[#44]

I am more than happy with the pistol grip I traded for.

A1 style with Armalite logo and sling swivel. Perfect compromise in my opinion.

I believe these were made right after Eagle Arms bought the Armalite name.