 Forest
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Posted: 12/18/2008 3:54:25 PM
[Last Edit: 3/25/2010 12:58:32 PM by Forest]
THE IMAGE ABOVE IS A PAID ADVERTISEMENT Please post what you know, I'll format this up into a content page, just like we're doing with the other FAQs. Thanks! Wikipedia Entry on 7.62x51 / 7.62 NATO Wikipedia Entry on .308 Winchester Q: Don't all 'AR-10s' / .308 ARs use the same parts? A: NO! There are several different upper receiver styles, 3 different magazine formats used, and RRA even uses a different thread for their upper receivers (so you can't use standard barrel nuts or free float systems). For more infomation see:
The AR15.com Armalite AR-10 FAQ as well as continue reading below. Q: What parts are different from company to company? A: Upper Receivers, Barrel nuts (Armalite, DPMS, and RRA use different thread pitches), magazines may be different, gas tubes can be different (Armalite's are longer than DPMS's).
Q: What parts from an AR-15 can I use in a .308 rifle? A: (from the AR-10 FAQ)
The AR-15 Bolt catch should work on KAC/DPMS type lowers, but not AR-10 type lowers. From DnPRK: Most AR trigger assemblies will fit an LR-308. The two triggers that require modification are 1) the Chip McCormick straight trigger which needs th end of the trigger clipped to clear the trigger guard and 2) the RRA trigger which might require the tip of the cocked hammer to be clipped to prevent it from dragging on the bottom of the bolt carrier. An AR-15 rifle buffer tube will fit an LR-308, but you need the 308 rifle buffer and spring. A CAR-15/M-4 collapsible stock buffer tube will fit an LR-308 but you need to use a Slash shortened buffer and 308 spring, or use Armalite's collapsible stock buffer, tube and spring for the AR-10 carbine. DPMS LR-308 Lower Receiver Assembly Do not trust the schematics in the DPMS dealer catalog! Mine (2009) had many errors that I only discovered by accident. Having just tonight completed assembling my LR-308 lower, I though you might find this useful - Carbine_Man. Essential LR-308 Lower Receiver Parts Many AR-15 lower parts are compatible with the LR-308, but the parts listed here are NOT AR-15 COMPATIBLE and must be included in your build. DPMS part numbers to the screw Other things to note:
Q: Are the AR10 and LR-308 Lower parts kits interchangable? A: (from shrikefan) YES, however, the fit will not be ideal and the pins may require some polishing down to size with emory cloth. The pivot pin and the takedown pin will be too short or too long depending on which kit is used with which lower. Not the IDEAL set-up but it will work in a pinch. The bolt stop may or may not work but it is not critical for the BANG function of the gun.
Rifle Manufacturers Custom Rifle Builders Sources for Complete Uppers What lowers do these work on?
Sources for Stripped Lowers Sources for Stripped Uppers Sources for Bolts Barrel Manufacturers Whose Uppers fit whose Lowers? A: Armalite uppers WILL fit on DPMS lowers, but you have a gap in the back where the Armalite upper has the 45 degree angle cut. DPMS uppers WILL NOT fit on a Armalite lower.
Stock Options? FF Tube/Rail Options Other Specialty Parts Magazines There are primarily two magazines styles for the .308 rifles, the original Armalite-Fairchild magazines used in the original AR-10s, then picked up by the KAC SR-25 (henceforth called the SR-25 Type) and the Modern Armalite AR-10 type which is a modified M-14 magazine. It should be pointed out RRA (and formerly Bushmaster) make rifles that use FAL magazines, and CMMG has a lower which uses G3 magazines.
Magazine Manufacturers Alternate Calibers for use with the .308/7.62x51 Lowers? |
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Forest
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Posted: 12/18/2008 5:08:15 PM
Come on guys, I need some help here.
do you have any other questions that should be covered? |
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Posted: 12/18/2008 5:11:27 PM
Armalite makes 15rders also
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SHIVAN
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Posted: 12/18/2008 5:29:10 PM
[Last Edit: 12/18/2008 5:33:51 PM by SHIVAN]
Originally Posted By Forest:Alternate Calibers that can be loaded (with a barrel change)? Who makes them? .243 Winchester .260 Remington 6.5 Creedmoor 7mm-08 .300 Remington Short Action Ultra Magnum .338 Federal I have no experience with this company but: http://www.ar-10-rifles.com/index.php I am pretty sure GAP will do .260 Remington and .338 Federal without issues. You can get barrels in .243Win from ArmaLite (special runs) and DPMS vendors directly. 300 RSAUM can be had from ArmaLite directly, special runs. |
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SHIVAN
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Posted: 12/18/2008 5:36:20 PM
Discontinued 500 Phantom from Teppojutsu - Link
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Forest
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Posted: 12/18/2008 6:19:27 PM
Thanks!
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Posted: 12/18/2008 7:18:34 PM
A few thoughts in no particular order:
DPMS also offers a 300 RSAUM as part of their regular offerings. Don't forget CMMG also offers a DPMS compatible lower using DPMS mags and a DPMS compatible lower (with minor mods) using G3 mags. POF 308 billet stripped lowers can be purchased from several dealors (CWS, Ranier Arms, DDs ranch come to mind). These use DPMS mags and require a small metal sleeve to work with DPMS uppers. JP rifles produce a side charging 308 (and 260 Rem) compatible with DPMS mags. Accuracy Systems will make a rifle for most any round you can stuff into an AR10 or DPMS308. Christian Hofmeister of Hofmeisters Custom Shop will make custom 308s, 260s etc. using either AR10 or DPMS receivers. AR10/308 free float handguards: Daniel Defense Lite Rail SWS JP makes one, not sure if it is sold separately C Products also makes 19 rd DPMS compatible mags. POF is apparently working on a 25 rd DPMS compatible mag. American Spirit Arms produces a side charging 308 I believe. Krieger also makes drop in barrels for both AR10 and (started recently) DPMS. Will do 308, 243, 260. Weren't doing 338 Fed when I ordered last month. Iron Ridge Guns is working on a line of billet 308 lowers (not sure of compatibility yet). Patriot Arms makes a DPMS based 308 Gun Creations builds a DPMS based rifles in 308, 243, 260, 300 RSAUM XRing Precison Rifles builds 308, 243, 7mm-08, and 300 RSAUM rifles based on DPMS or AR10 |
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Forest
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Posted: 12/18/2008 7:28:21 PM
Excellent!
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SHIVAN
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Posted: 12/18/2008 8:50:33 PM
[Last Edit: 12/18/2008 8:52:02 PM by SHIVAN]
LaRue makes ArmaLite pattern rails 9.0, 11.0 and 13.2...
LaRue is also coming out with their 7.62 OSR 308 AR, but LaRue/mfingar would be the source for info... LaRue offers AR-10 specific gas blocks. Noveske AR-10 rails are sourced from Superior Weapon Systems, but are configured differently. Badger Ordnance and PRi both makes ArmaLite AR-10 rails. PRi also offers their M84 Gas Buster charging handle/tac latches in AR-10 size. Clint (aka Slash aka HeavyBuffers@gmail.com) can custom manufacturer buffers in many weights for DPMS, RRA, or ArmaLite guns. He can also make buffers that will allow you to convert to AR-15 receiver extensions for a wider selection of parts. Surefire, YHM, AAC, Gemtech, SAS, and many other suppressor manuf's make 5/8x24tpi mounts for their 7.62 suppressors. |
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SHIVAN
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Posted: 12/18/2008 8:54:49 PM
[Last Edit: 12/18/2008 8:59:17 PM by SHIVAN]
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Posted: 12/18/2008 8:55:16 PM
Awesome idea! I was just wondering the other day why there wasn't one.
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Forest
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Posted: 12/18/2008 9:00:20 PM
Originally Posted By SHIVAN:
LWRC has a 308 SABR that is being produced. Min Data on SABR http://img81.imageshack.us/img81/8697/lwrc308boltos9.jpg I saw some posts about it - but I can't find their website to get info. Thanks for posting the link. |
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Cold
AR Variants Mod and Juris Doctor (in training)!
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Posted: 12/18/2008 10:13:26 PM
Tacked for now!
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Posted: 12/28/2008 1:31:20 AM
SO what I'm gathering is Armalite is the creme de le creme for .308s
my questions are as follows Are there any .308 Rifle kits? Is assembly the same as the ar15? |
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Palm
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Posted: 12/28/2008 1:29:41 PM
This morning I woke up and decided I want a gas piston .308 in a AR type platform. This rife will be for hunting so I want a 20 or 24 inch barrel.
What are my options? |
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Posted: 12/28/2008 2:51:33 PM
Originally Posted By Palm:
This morning I woke up and decided I want a gas piston .308 in a AR type platform. This rife will be for hunting so I want a 20 or 24 inch barrel. What are my options? Bump..thats why I want to build one |
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Forest
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Posted: 12/29/2008 1:39:23 PM
Originally Posted By Palm:
This morning I woke up and decided I want a gas piston .308 in a AR type platform. This rife will be for hunting so I want a 20 or 24 inch barrel. What are my options? Did you guy's READ the FAQ? Especially under 'Rifle Manufacturers'? |
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Posted: 12/30/2008 2:38:12 AM
Would the dpms .308 have large or small trigger and hammer pins? I'm thinking about upgrading the trigger group... I did some digging on the dpms web page and nada. Also did a search of arf.com of the last 30 days and same thing.
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SHIVAN
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Posted: 12/30/2008 7:15:39 PM
I believe the trigger pins on all current model .308 AR's is the same @ 0.154".
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Posted: 1/1/2009 10:34:57 PM
yes, ar-15 trigger (.154 pins) will fit, but I have heard that the hammer and spring were needed to be upgraded to fire hard military type primers, I think this applies to mil surp ammo, but I do not Know first hand. Using commercial ammo the standard trigger should work
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SHIVAN
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Posted: 1/3/2009 8:23:08 PM
Originally Posted By Delta4:...but I have heard that the hammer and spring were needed to be upgraded to fire hard military type primers...
No issue in my guns. I have had an issue with the older ArmaLite AR-10 carriers narrow hammer notch vs. AR-15 wider hammer. Never had issues with AR-15 interoperability. Source from which you heard this? |
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Posted: 1/7/2009 2:05:15 PM
[Last Edit: 1/7/2009 2:18:04 PM by PhrozenChild]
A CAR-15/M-4 collapsible stock buffer tube will fit an LR-308 but you need to use a Slash shortened buffer and 308 spring, or use Armalite's collapsible stock buffer, tube and spring for the AR-10 carbine.
This is incorrect, the LR-308's come with a commercial buffer tube. The buffer is a standard carbine buffer cut down to 2.48" and one steel weight removed. The spring is 308 specific. The bolt catch and srew is also 308 specific. The only other 308 specific parts in the lower are the take down pins, everything else (including hammer and spring) are standard ar-15 parts. The upper does not share any ar-15 parts exept the gas block and tube. The Armalite Ar-10 uses a slightly longer gas tube, so if you use an Armalite barrel use the armalite tube. Armalite Ar-10's uses a standard carbine buffer with a slightly longer buffer tube, so if you put a milspec CTR stock on it the buffer tube will stick out a half inch(ouch). This is why you use Slash's buffer with a standard buffer tube on an Armalite. Slash's buffer is a drop in replacement for a LR-308 carbine. |
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shrikefan
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Posted: 1/11/2009 11:00:43 PM
[Last Edit: 1/11/2009 11:19:35 PM by shrikefan]
Originally Posted By PhrozenChild:
A CAR-15/M-4 collapsible stock buffer tube will fit an LR-308 but you need to use a Slash shortened buffer and 308 spring, or use Armalite's collapsible stock buffer, tube and spring for the AR-10 carbine. This is incorrect, the LR-308's come with a commercial buffer tube. The buffer is a standard carbine buffer cut down to 2.48" and one steel weight removed. The spring is 308 specific. The bolt catch and srew is also 308 specific. The only other 308 specific parts in the lower are the take down pins, everything else (including hammer and spring) are standard ar-15 parts. The upper does not share any ar-15 parts exept the gas block and tube. The Armalite Ar-10 uses a slightly longer gas tube, so if you use an Armalite barrel use the armalite tube. Armalite Ar-10's uses a standard carbine buffer with a slightly longer buffer tube, so if you put a milspec CTR stock on it the buffer tube will stick out a half inch(ouch). This is why you use Slash's buffer with a standard buffer tube on an Armalite. Slash's buffer is a drop in replacement for a LR-308 carbine. It should also be noted that a "standard" Armalite AR10 spring needs to have some coils cut off to function with the AR15 carbine buffer tube and shory buffer. The earlier LR-308's used a standard AR15 bolt catch. I believe the forward assist is the same as the AR15 forward assist - on models that have them. The AR10 carbine uses a standard length AR15 carbine buffer - the AR10 standard carbine buffer is equal to an H3 AR15 carbine buffer in weight. The depth of a standard AR15 carbine buffer tube is approx 7". The depth af a standard AR10 carbine buffer tube is approx 7-3/4" The AR15 mag catch will work in the AR10. They are slightly different but the AR15 model will work in the AR10. The un-modified M14 magazines are also "supposed" to work in the AR10 without a notch for the mag catch. The mag is held into place by a tight sling. |
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SHIVAN
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Posted: 1/12/2009 9:29:17 AM
[Last Edit: 1/12/2009 9:30:08 AM by SHIVAN]
Originally Posted By shrikefan:It should also be noted that a "standard" Armalite AR10 spring needs to have some coils cut off to function with the AR15 carbine buffer tube and shory buffer.
I've never cut any of the 4 of mine. Maybe I didn't get the memo.  |
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shrikefan
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Posted: 1/12/2009 1:05:08 PM
Originally Posted By SHIVAN:
Originally Posted By shrikefan:It should also be noted that a "standard" Armalite AR10 spring needs to have some coils cut off to function with the AR15 carbine buffer tube and shory buffer.
I've never cut any of the 4 of mine. Maybe I didn't get the memo. Slash's buffer/spring chart suggests a modified AR10 spring for this application. Calculations back up the chart's suggestions. The factory DPMS shorty buffer is 2.500" OAL.. The Flange is .250 thick. Which leaves 2.250" for the spring to freely compress. The factory DPMS spring will stack 30 coils onto one another and the wire is .072 thick. The DPMS spring will be 2.16" when fully compressed which leaves .09" clearance. The factory Armalite spring will stack 34 coils onto one another and the wire is .072 thick. The Armalite spring will be 2.448" when fully compressed. The spring will be fully compressed before the buffer bottoms out on the buffer tube using a buffer that only has 2.250" for the spring to freely compress. This probably does not apply if the spring wire dimensions differ (from round .072") such as possibly in a flat wire spring. That is not to say that the gun won't function with the spring fully compressed onto itself before the buffer bottoms out. I can't imagine that it would be good for the life of the spring. I would also imagine that the inside of the buffer tube will start to show signs of premature wear as well. YMMV |
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SHIVAN
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Posted: 1/12/2009 3:23:10 PM
[Last Edit: 1/12/2009 3:24:01 PM by SHIVAN]
Originally Posted By shrikefan:YMMV
I see that I got confused by the original post you quoted and your response. I don't mix and match DPMS gear with ArmaLite gear so I got all swimmy in the head. 
A Slash ArmaLite AR-10 custom CAR-10 buffer uses the factory spring with an AR15 receiver extension. 
I am out of my lane talking about DPMS carbine conversions using Slash's stuff. Sorry.  |
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