Figured compiling the important info out there into one document would be helpful to people trying to make informed decisions regarding this round in the AR-15 platform.





Any info not accurate or missing that you can provide or you think should be include please post.  I will try to keep it updated.  





Hope this is useful.





Tim Welter

The 6.8 Remington Special Purpose Cartridge


                                                  6.8 SPC

 


Manufactures of 6.8 Uppers and Complete Rifles:





Lewis Machine & Tool – Both / Piston Soon


Bushmaster – Both / Piston also


CMMG – Both


Precision Reflex Inc – Both


Barrett Rifles – Both                                                    


       DPMS Panther Arms – Both


J&T Distributing – Full Kits


MGI – Both / QCB


Robinson Armament Co. – XCR Rifle


Rock River Arms – Both & Kits


Stag Arms – Both and Lefties


Land Warfare Resources Corp. (LWRC) – Both / Piston


Noveske Rifleworks – Both


Model 1 Sales – Kits (barrels not recommended)


Olympic Arms – Both


SSK Industries – Both








Builders of Custom to Order Uppers and Complete Rifles:





AR15 Barrels – Uppers


White Oak Armament – Uppers


Denny’s Guns / Global Tactical Supply – Both


JTAC Tactical Supply – Both


Ko-tonics – Both


Mid-South Tactical Network (MSTN) – Both


Rainier Arms – Both


Talon Arms Custom – Uppers


Maybe others
6.8 SPC Chambers Available:





       1: SAAMI / 0.05 " throat / akin to .223 standard


       2: SPC II / 0.10" throat / akin to 5.56 NATO


       3: DMR (only offered as a custom) / 0.08" throat &  a 30 degree case to leade taper instead of 45 degrees / akin to .223 Wylde
Barrels of Manufactures of Uppers & Rifles: Twist / Rifling / Groove / Chamber / Stainless or Chrome Lined / M4 Extended Cuts / Thread Pitch





Lewis Machine & Tool sub to Mike Rock – 10:1 / standard /standard / SAAMI / chromed & stainless / M4 / 5/8X24


Ko-tonics - 11:1 / standard shallow / 4 groove / SPC II / chromed / M4 / 5/8X24


       Bushmaster – 10:1 / standard /standard / SAAMI / ? / proprietary ramps "M2" / ?


CMMG – 10:1 / standard /standard / SAAMI / Chromed / Both Option / 5/8X24


Barrett Rifles – 10:1 / standard / standard / SPC II / Chromed / ? / 5/8X24  


Precision Reflex, Inc. (PRI) – 10:1 / standard /standard / SPC II / stainless / M4 / 5/8X24


DPMS Panther Arms – 10:1 / standard /standard / SAAMI / chrome- moly and NOT Chromed / M4 / 1/2x28


JTAC Tactical Supply – 10:1 / standard /standard / SAAMI / Stainless & Chrome-moly, no chromed  / M4 / 5/8X24


MGI – uncertain supplies change - M4 / 5/8x24


Robinson Armament Co. – 10:1 / standard / standard / SPC II  / chromed / ? / 5/8X24


Rock River Arms – 10:1 / standard /standard / SPC II / chrome- moly and NOT Chromed / ? / 5/8X24


Stag Arms – 10:1 / standard /standard / / SPC II / chromed / Not M4/ 1/2x36


Land Warfare Resources Corp. (LWRC) – Sub to Shaw – 10:1 / standard / standard / SPC II  / chromed / M4 / 5/8X24


Noveske Rifleworksthese are Pac-Nor blanks he chambers and profiles -10:1 / standard /polygonal / SAAMI  / stainless / M4 / 5/8X24


Model 1 Sales – 9.5:1 / standard / standard / SAAMI  / Chromed / Not M4 / 1/2x36 NOT RECOMMENDED: too fast twist rate


Olympic Arms – 10:1 / standard / standard / SAAMI  / stainless / M4 / ?


SSK Industries – customer choice / ? / ?
Barrel Makers & Barrel Smiths: Twist / Rifling / Groove / Chamber





Shaw: 10-11:1 / standard / 6 groove or 4 groove / old SAAMI present & future SPC II


Rock Creek OEM: 10:1 / standard /6 groove / SAAMI


Rock Creek Custom: custom / 5R / 5 groove / chambering not offered


Noveske Rifleworks: 10:1 / polygonal / 6 groove / SAAMI


Hart: 10:1 & 12:1 / standard / 6 groove / reamer of your choice


       Krieger: Custom/ Custom / Custom / reamer of your choice


       Douglas: 10:1 & 12:1 / standard / 6 groove / SAAMI may be able to supply reamer or have done


       Wilson: 10:1 & 11:1 / standard / 6 groove / SAAMI


       White Oak Armament: See Wilson also use other custom blank but cut a SAAMI chamber


Compass Lake Engineering: See Wilson also use other custom blank but cut a SAAMI chamber


Bartlein: Custom / standard / custom / reamer of your choice


Lawton: Custom / standard / custom / reamer of your choice


Lilja: 10:1 & 12:1 / standard / 10:1 3 & 4 groove 12:1 6 groove / chambering not offered


Shilen: 10:1 / standard / 6 groove


Spencer: 10:1 & 12:1 other possible/ standard / 6 groove / reamer of your choice


Lothar Walther: 10:1 / standard / 6 groove / chambering not offered


Pac-Nor: custom / standard and polygonal / custom / reamer of your choice



Barrel Configurations & Useable Ammo: Twist / Chamber (SAAMI, Improved SAAMI, DMR)





10:1 / SAAMI / Most makers (see list above): all presently no restricted manufactured ammunition.  hand loads not exceeding recommended published max Warning: DO NOT USE SSA Combat or Old Extreme





11:1 / SAAMI / (see list above): Must test individual barrel results will vary but indications are most do handle all presently manufactured ammunition to include SSA Combat, hotter loads, maximum hand loads (always start low), Warning: DO NOT USE SSA Extremes no longer in production





10:1 / SPC II / (see list above): all loads, hotter loads, SSA Combat loads and all versions of SSA Extreme, maximum hand loads (always start low)





11:1 / SPC II / (see list above): all loads, hotter loads, SSA Combat loads and all versions SSA Extreme, maximum hand loads (always start low),





10-12:1 / DMR #3 / custom ( no factory offerings): all loads, including SSA Combat loads and all versions SSA Extreme, maximum hand loads (always start low),
Grooves





The number of grooves in combination with chamber configuration and twist rate has not yet been thoroughly tested to make a definitive statement on its entire effect on the different configurations above so therefore has been left out.  That being said their stands a large amount of evidence that reducing the number of grooves and lands, as well as changing their basic form (5R, Polygonal, 5C), does reduce pressure.  This can cause increases in velocity because of the ability to increase the charge in the case of said ammunition without experiencing over pressure.
6.8 Uppers Evaluation Report Link
Velocity Differences of Bullet in Different Length Barrels  





SSA 2nd generation 115 gr SMK OTM w/cannelure, 5 shot averages:





20” barrel: ave vel = 2561 fps; 10 fps extreme spread





16” barrel: ave vel = 2525 fps; 18 fps extreme spread –– lost 36 fps from 20"





12.5” barrel: ave vel = 2384 fps; 12 fps extreme spread –– lost 141 fps from 16"





10” barrel: ave vel = 2265 fps; 27 fps extreme spread –– lost 119 fps from 12.5"





7.5” barrel: ave vel = 2035 fps; 27 fps extreme spread –– lost 230 fps from 10"


––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––


20" barrels: Rifle Length Gas System.


18": Midlength Gas System.


16" barrels: Best with Midlength Gas System, but will also work with Carbine Length.


14.5" barrels and below: Carbine Length Gas System.


from PaulSantos
Loaded Ammunition Manufacturers:





Remington


115 grain Open Tip Match [BC .344]


115 grain Metal Case [BC .292]


115 grain Boat Tail Hollow Point Match [BC .333]


115 grain Core-Lokt Ultra Bonded [BC .295]


http://www.remington.com/products/ammunition/ballistics/comparative_ballistics_results.aspx?data=R68R1*R68R2*RM68R1*PRC68R4]Ballistics for Remington 6.8 Ammo [24" test barrel][/url]





Hornady


110 GR V-MAX [BC .370]


110 GR BTHP/WC [BC ~.352]


https://www.hornady.com/shop/?page=shop/browse&category_id=55410454d3b6c1edb710ea593c0e033d]Ballistics for Hornady 6.8 Ammo [16" test barrel][/url]





Silver State Armory


110 grain Barnes Triple-Shock X-Bullet [BC .323]


110 grain Sierra Pro Hunter Bullet [BC .314]


115 grain Sierra OTM Match King bullet [BC .324 to .317]


115 grain Seirra OTM Combat (special order restricted item) [BC .324 to .317]


95 grain fragmentation bullet [BC ?]


97 grain AP (ARMOR PIERCING) restricted item - Law Enforcement & Military only


115 grain Extreme Copper Plated (WARNING: no longer made but may still be found)


115 grain Extreme Combat Copper Plated (WARNING: no longer made but may still be found)


Ballistics for SSA 6.8 ammo from a 16” test barrel
Ammunition Reloading Components:
Bullets available for the 6.8 SPC:





Remington


115 grain Premier Core-Lokt Ultra Bonded Pointed Soft Point [BC .295]


115 grain Remington Express Metal Case [BC .292]


.277 caliber bullet list





Hornady


110 grain V-MAX [BC .370] - length 1.036


110 grain Hollow Point [BC .352]


130 grain Soft Point InterLock [BC .409]


130 grain SST InterLock [BC .460] - length 1.248





.277 caliber bullet list
Barnes


110 grain Barnes Triple-Shock X-Bullet [BC .323] - length 1.086


120 grain Banded Spitzer BT [BC .438] - length 1.294


110 grain Barnes Tipped Triple-Shock-X-Bullet





Sierra


90 grain Varminter [BC .203 to .219]


110 grain Pro Hunter [BC .314] length 0.944


115 grain HPBT MatchKing [BC .324] - length 0.991


130 grain SBT GameKing [BC .402]


130 grain SPT Pro Hunter [BC .383] - length 1.098


135 grain HPBT MatchKing [BC .440] - length 1.265


140 grain SBT GameKing [BC .437 to .412]


140 grain HPBT GameKing [BC .366 to .390]


150 grain SBT GameKing [BC .462 to .435]


.277 caliber bullet list





Woodleigh


130 grain Protected Point [BC .409] - length 1.087


150 grain Protected Point [BC .463] - length 1.209


.277 caliber bullet list


Retail supply





Swift


130 grain Scirocco II bonded [BC .450] - length 1.315


130 grain A-Frame SS Bullet [BC .323] - length 1.090


140 grain A-Frame SS Bullet [BC .414] - length 1.190


150 grain A-Frame SS Bullet [BC .444] - length 1.230


Rifle Bullets list





Speer


90 grain TNT HP [BC .275]


100 grain Jacketed HP [BC .225]


130 grain Grand Slam SP [BC .345]


130 grain Hot-Cor Spitzer SP [BC .408]


130 grain Spitzer BTSP [BC .449]


140 grain Trophy Bonded Bear Claw SP [BC .392]


150 grain Grand Slam SP [BC .385]


150 grain Hot-Cor Spitzer SP [BC .481]


150 grain Spitzer BTSP [BC .496]


.277 caliber bullet list





Nosler


New 6.8 Bullet 110 grain AccuBond [BC. ?]


130 grain Nosler Solid Base [BC. 420]


130 grain Nosler Ballistic Tip [BC .433] - length 1.215


130 grain Nosler AccuBond [BC .435] - length 1.245


130 grain Nosler Partition [BC .416] - length 1.135


140 grain Nosler Ballistic Tip [BC .456]


140 grain Nosler AccuBond [BC .496] - length 1.310


140 grain Nosler Partition [BC .432] - length 1.190


150 grain Nosler Ballistic Tip [BC .496] - length 1.350


150 grain Nosler Partition [BC .465] - length 1.250


160 grain Nosler Partition [BC .434] - length 1.300


.277 caliber bullet list





Winchester


130 grain Super-X Power-Point Bullet [BC .372]





KJG by Lutz Moeller


(Das Kupferjagdgeschoß - the copper hunting projectile)


95.7 grains [BC .426] - length 1.18 inches [load data in German]
Lost River Ballistic


135 grain J36 Hunting Bullet [BC .649] - length ~1.35?





Sako


130 grain HammerHead Bullet





Norma


130 grain SP [BC .359]


150 grain SP Bullet Oryx Bonded [BC .373]





Kodiak Bullets


Available here and here.


130 grain Bonded Jacketed Pointed Soft Point [BC .494]





GS Custom Bullets


80 grain High Velocity monometallic copper bullet - length 0.858


110 grain High Velocity monometallic copper bullet - length 1.157


120 grain High Velocity monometallic copper bullet - length 1.256
Powders Tried in the Current Reloading of 6.8 SPC:





RL 7


RL 10X


H322


H335


H4198


H4895


AA2520


Varget


WCC844


IMR 4895


AA2230


X-Terminator


Benchmark


Ramshot TAC


VV N135


VV-N133


AA 1680
The best powders seem to be these below:





H332, Benchmark, RE10x, H335, X-Terminator, AA2230 for bullets 110-130 grains


H322, H4198, RE7, H335, and X-Terminator for bullets 90-100 grains
Brass used for the 6.8 SPC:





Remington: Large primer pocket (average quality / weaker than small primer pocket and holds less powder)


Hornady: Small primer pocket (better quality / brass on the soft size smaller powder capacity)


Silver State Amory (SSA): small prime pocket (best quality / strong brass / largest powder capacity / many reloads / still needs to be properly prepped)
Links To Other Resources





6.8 Uppers Evaluation Report Link





6.8 SPC Resource/FAQ Page





6.8 SPC Reloading Resources (including recipes)





Original 6.8 Thread (Archived - Members Only)





6.8 Thread Part II (Archived - Members Only)





6.8 Thread Part III





Zak's FAQ





6.8SPC.com (Randall's FAQ/List of Links)





2004 NDIA Small Arms Symposium Presentation on the 6.8 SPC (Power Point File)





Wikipedia Entry for 6.8 SPC





Yahoo 6.8 SPC Group





6.8 Remington SPC Forum





Barrett's 6.8SPC Forum



Links to Reloading Data





Burn Rate Chart





Zak's Reloading Data





Hodgdon's 6.8 SPC Reloading Data





IMR's 6.8 SPC Reloading Data
Preferred Muzzle Thread Pattern: 5/8-24
Dimensions of the 6.8 SPC


**************new case––-resized case ––-SAAMI––––––-SPCII––––––-DMR


base dia. ******* .4155***** .418**** * .422***** .422 ***** .4205


shoulder dia. ***** .402 * ** .402 ***** .4028**** * .4028 **** .403


neck @ shoulder dia* .301 *** .301 **** .3085**** .3085 ***** .305


neck @ throat dia ** .301 *** .301****** .307 ***** .308 **** .304


leade dia. ***************** ********* .2781**** .2781 **** .277


length of leade ******************** ** .064**** .105 ****** .095
Trim To Length = 1.676" (from Hodgdon Powder Co)





Note from Art (kalwasart): You will have to work to the bottom of the spec otherwise the case will not work in a DPMS or CMMG weapon.





6.8 SPC Magazines: Over all best quality has been PRI and also gives you the the largest OAL for ammo, C-Products comes in second because of some feed lip adjustment issues and a shorter OAL for ammo.  Barrett has not had enough feed back yet but seem to be good quality as well not sure on OAL for ammo.





6.8 SPC Magazines Specs:





PRI: 5, 10, 15, 25 round capacities / Round OAL Dimension: 2.3"


Barrett: 30 round capacity Round OAL Dimension: 2.2?"
Suppressors





The 6.8 SPC can use suppressors designed for the .308 as the size is only slightly larger in bore size and are cut to the prevalent 5/8x24 thread pitch.   The only draw back to this is that .308 suppressors tend to be both longer and heavier.  There are a number of companies that now make dedicated 6.8 SPC suppressors.  These are 5.56 NATO suppressors with the bore increase and the thread pitch changed to the 6.8 SPC specs.  If you happen to have one of the barrels cut to a a thread pitch other than 5/8x24 you can, have an adapter made, have the suppressor's thread pitch changed, have your barrel threads re-cut ( may require shortening of barrel) , purchasing a new barrel.  It is not advisable to have the suppressors threads changed to match your thread pitch as the 5/8th pitch seems to becoming the standard.  This would cause you to have all your future barrels threads custom cut to the other thread pitch.  Below are the Manufactures (linked) and models of available suppressors dedicated to 6.8 SPC cartridge:





Under Construction
Choosing the Proper .277 Bullets for Use in the 6.8SPC


Writen By User Screen Name: PauloSantos
INTRO:


I have put together this thread as an informative thread for the new guys or anyone else who needs help with selecting the correct .277” bullets for reloading for the Remington 6.8SPC.





Before I begin, I just want to touch up on the Remington 6.8SPC. If you are using the 6.8SPC in an AR-15, there is an OAL that you have to keep in mind. With the C-Products and Barrett magazines, I would not load the ammo longer than 2.260" to load reliably. If you have PRI magazines, I would not load the ammo longer than 2.280". Also, due to the limited powder capacity, it is best to load bullets in the range of 90-115 Gr., although you can load some of the 130 Gr., you will be hard pressed to get velocity over 2200fps.





POWDERS:


So far, I have tested a boat load of powders and the best powders are definitely the medium-fast powders such as H322. As far as velocity, I've found that for the 90-100 Gr. bullets, the H4198 is hard to beat and it is very accurate. H4198 is ok for the 110 Gr. bullets, but the velocity is not as good as the H322 and you will need a light buffer or else you may have cycling problems, especially with the rifle length buffer tubes. If given a choice, I would start with the Hodgdon Extreme Powders since they are very accurate and they are not as sensitive to temperature changes as some of the other powders. Also, I would prefer a extruded powder over ball powder since they are generally more accurate.





Best Powders for 90-100 Gr. Bullets:


1. H4198.


2. H322.


3. H335.


4. X-Terminator.


5. Reloaders 7.





Best Powders for 110-135 Gr. Bullets:


1. H322.


2. Benchmark.


3. Reloaders 10x.


4. 2015.


5. H335.


6. N133.


7. X-Terminator.


8. TAC.


9. 2230.





RIFLE TWISTS:


The two most popular twists for the Remington 6.8 SPC are the 1:11" twist and the 1:10" twist. Both twists can handle bullets from 90-135 Gr., but the 1:11" twist is supposed to reduce the pressure and is quickly becoming the popular choice.





BULLET TYPES:


1. FMJ-Full Metal Jacket (Ball Ammo). Unknown at what velocity the Remington FMJ fragments, but the SSA Extreme FMJ is supposed to fragments at 2100+ fps.


2. OTM-Open Tip Match.


HP-Hollow Point.


SMK-Sierra Match King. Generally fragments at 2100+ fps.


3. SP-Soft Point. Generally expands at 1700+ fps.


4. BT-Ballistic Tip. Generally expands or fragments at 1900+ fps.





NOTE: You may see the letter "BT" (Boat-Tail) in front or after the above ammo types. BT stands for "Boat Tail" and refers to the base of the bullet. A "Boat Tail" is a sloping end which narrows gently at the base of the bullet, so that the cross-section resembles the shape of a boat's hull. The boat tail shape reduces drag on a bullet, helping it to retain velocity and resist deflection from crosswinds, but causes the bullet to take longer to "settle" after leaving the barrel compared to a standard "flat-base" bullet. Boat tail bullets are usually selected for long-range shooting, while the flat-base bullet shape tends to be more accurate at short ranges. A "HPBT" bullet is a "Hollow Point Boat Tail" bullet.





The last thing I would like to explain is a "Cannelure.” A Cannelure is a cut or pressed groove (or grooves) around the shank of a bullet. Cannelures provide an area into which the case mouth may be securely crimped. Military ammo has cannelures to prevent bullet set-back. Bullets with cannelures are not generally used in match ammo because cannelures may decrease the accuracy of the bullet. For Military/LE purposes, bullets with cannelures are preferred. For sniper type applications, bullets without cannelures are usually used.





HOME PROTECTION/SHTF:


Penetration and Fragmentation are key for Home Protection/LE applications. 10-12" is ideal to ensure that it will reach the vital organs.





1. Hornady:


a. 100 Gr. SP.


b. 110 Gr. V-Max.


c. 110 Gr. HP.





2. Remington:


a. 100 Gr. SP.


b. 115 Gr. FMJ.





3. Sierra:


a. 110 Gr. SPT.


b. 115 Gr. SMK.





4. Silver State Armory:


a. 115 Gr. SMK Enhanced Fragmentation Version.





BARRIER PENETRATION BULLETS:





1. Barnes:


a. 110 Gr. Barnes XXX.


b. 110 Gr. Barnes tipped XXX.





2. Nosler:


a. Accubond 110 Gr. Spitzer.


b. Accubond 130 Gr. Spitzer.


c. Ballistic Tip 130 Gr. Spitzer.





3. Remington:


a. 115 Gr. Core Lockt SP.





4. Sierra:


a. 110 Gr. SPT.


b. 130 Gr. SPT.


c. 130 Gr. SBT.





5. Speer:


a. 130 Gr. SP.


b. 130 Gr. BTSP.





HUNTING BULLETS:


For hunting bullets that expand/mushroom are preferred because they don’t damage too much meat like the fragmenting bullets.





1. Barnes:


a. 110 Gr. Barnes XXX.


b. 110 Gr. Barnes tipped XXX.





2. Hornady:


a. 100 Gr. SP.


b. 110 Gr. HP.


c. 130 Gr. Interbond.


d. 130 Gr. SST.


e. 130 Gr. SP.





3. Nosler:


a. Accubond 110 Gr. Spitzer.


b. Accubond 130 Gr. Spitzer.


c. Ballistic Tip 130 Gr. Spitzer.





4. Remington:


a. 100 Gr. SP.


b. 115 Gr. Core Lockt SP.





5. Sierra:


a. 90 Gr. HP.


b. 110 Gr. SPT.


c. 130 Gr. SPT.


d. 130 Gr. SBT.





6. Speer:


a. 100 Gr. SP.


b. 100 Gr. HP.


c. 130 Gr. SP.


d. 130 Gr. BTSP.





MATCH/COMPETITION/SNIPER BULLETS:





1. Hornady:


a. 110 Gr. V-Max.


b. 110 Gr. HP.





2. Sierra:


a. 115 Gr. SMK.


b. 135 Gr. SMK.





3. Speer:


a. 90 Gr. TNT.





Note: Cannelures are generally not used because of possible accuracy loss.





VARMINT HUNTING:


Varmint Hunters want a bullet that offers great accuracy and rapid expansion. Some of the best bullets for Varmint hunting are the lighter 90-100 Gr. Bullets.





1. Hornady:


a. 110 Gr. V-Max.





2. Sierra:


a. 90 Gr. HP.





3. Speer:


a. 90 Gr. TNT.


b. 100 Gr. HP.





PLINKING BULLETS:





1. Remington:


a. 100 Gr. SP.


b. 115 Gr. FMJ.





2. Speer:


a. 90 Gr. TNT Value Packs.





3. Silver State Armory


a. ? should be soon 115 FMJ ?
Reloading Recipes for 6.8 SPC:





Warning note: 1: always start at least 5% low and work up on all loads.  Remember you need to know your barrel configuration.  Using a hot load recipe for a Improved Chamber in a 10:1 SAAMI Chamber could have possible lethal effects on the shooter and bystanders.  At the very least rifle damage would result.





The information below has been taken off  of different forums on the internet and is for INFORMATIONAL PURPOSES ONLY.  In no way should you rely on these recipes being safe in your rifle!!  Please start low and go slow.  Always check your reloading manuals.  








It is organized in the following order: bullet, powder by burn rate fast to slow, charge size, barrel length.





6.8 SPC Hand Load Data Chart


**


















Chart Still in progress  Not Complete





Tim Welter
TACKED AND BOLDED THE TITLE ~ COLD
 

excellent info!

Thanks

Paul,

Your info on velocity at different barrel lengths is now added.


Tim Welter

best powders updated thanks Paul

Tim Welter

SWEEEEET

If both of you will do that I will add the names on the ones that don't have the names.  What I did was just grabbed these from the threads.  Almost all of them were either posted by you Paul or Tim @Kot

That is a lot of good information.

Thank you.

updated with other resource links and powder burn rate chart

Tim Welter

That is what I always thought but everyone on all the ar-15 web site talks about how he builds  the greatest barrels.  The reason for my suspicion was when you go to PAC-NOR site and click on AR-16 barrel link it takes you to his site.  Now as far as barrels go Pac-Nors are OK in the accuracy game.  Now we aren't talking about what most here consider accuracy 1-0.5 moa.  We are talking about benchrest kind 0.2-0.1 moa or less.  Now AR's can't really use that kind of accuracy but the best (one's that win competitions) are Baritlien, Krieger, Hart, etc..  Pac-Nor's are in that same grouping just on the lower end of the list.  Seems what John Noveske is really good at is profiling and cutting and designing a very strait and good chamber.  That is a very big part to accuracy.  His work is excellent.

I've gotten off track here sorry.  I will change his positioning and get around to tagging you reloads.  You are certainly up late.  And yes I certainly do have time on my hands as of late this at least gives me something to do. the whole category thing is tough as some overlap  most barrel makers also do chambering and profiling as well as some builders and manufacturers.

Tim Welter

Outstanding.  Vote for sticky.

One suggestion:  under Barrels of Manufactures of Uppers & Rifles: twist / rifling / groove / chamber, the chamber offered by Ko-Tonics is listed as Improved SAAMI.  But under Barrel Configurations & Useable Ammo: Twist / Chamber (SAAMI, Improved SAAMI, DMR), there's no Improved SAAMI, only Improved SAAMI #2.

Ok I have put a notation of the Pac-Nor blanks on there and updated your reloads with your name on the ones you marked.

I need to still add the specs for a SAAMI, Improved SAMMI, and DMR chambers.  Reloading Equipment  Suppressors lastly whatever else of real value I find while going through those 120 pages of the "6.8 FAQ & Loads" threads.  Some of bullshit that when on in those threads was, well, let's just say, I wish I'd didn't feel the need to re-read them to gleen off any real info that showed up in there, other than the things from a few of the same people that always seem to be the ones with real and usable info.  I think I have most of what was in those but I don't want to miss something useful.

Tim Welter

Originally Posted By absael: Outstanding.  Vote for sticky. One suggestion:  under Barrels of Manufactures of Uppers & Rifles: twist / rifling / groove / chamber, the chamber offered by Ko-Tonics is listed as Improved SAAMI.  But under Barrel Configurations & Useable Ammo: Twist / Chamber (SAAMI, Improved SAAMI, DMR), there's no Improved SAAMI, only Improved SAAMI #2.

I can now see hgow that could be confusing.  It was actually a carry over when on another thread we were talking about the 3 different chamberings 1: SAAMI 2: improved SAAMI 3: DMR  I will remove it as I only used it on the Improved.  Thanks for catching that.

Tim Welter

Good job!  Many thanks.

Constructor,

Your changes to DMR and brass have been update.

Also added magazines.  Can someone give me the max inside length for each brand?

Thanks

Tim Welter

Great job Tim.  If you could, I would add the thread sizes that these barrels have.  Most of them are the 5/8x24, but off of the top of my head, STAG and DPMS have the 1/2x28.

Originally Posted By paulosantos: Great job Tim.  If you could, I would add the thread sizes that these barrels have.  Most of them are the 5/8x24, but off of the top of my head, STAG and DPMS have the 1/2x28.

The Stag I had was 1/2x36, same as the Colt 9mm barrels.

Originally Posted By vmpglenn: Originally Posted By paulosantos: Great job Tim.  If you could, I would add the thread sizes that these barrels have.  Most of them are the 5/8x24, but off of the top of my head, STAG and DPMS have the 1/2x28. The Stag I had was 1/2x36, same as the Colt 9mm barrels.

Sorry about that.  Stag is 1/2x36.  DPMS is 1/2x28.

Tim,


Please excuse me if someone has already suggested this, but I did not see in the secifications for each barrel manufacturer, etc. whether their product included M4 feedramps.  We all know that the M4 ramps are actually made up of cuts in both the barrel extension and the receiver, though.  For example, if you buy a complete upper from Ko-Tonics, Tim builds the ramps into all them.  However, if you buy a barrel from  Ko-Tonics, the extension has the ramps cut, and the builder will then still need to machine the cuts into the receiver.  Some noobs might not know that.  Randall showed some pics a while back detailing the proper configuration in which the extension ramp cuts had to line up with the receiver cuts to properly allow for feeding.

This seems to be a little more important with the 6.8 SPC than with 5.56, (especially given the propensity for the C-products mags occasionlly to require a little feed lip tweaking) and since this appears to be the new comprehensive buyer's/user's guide, that might also be useful to first-time 6.8 buyers.

Run with it  

condensed info is a good thing

Originally Posted By hi-tech-rancher: Tim, Please excuse me if someone has already suggested this, but I did not see in the secifications for each barrel manufacturer, etc. whether their product included M4 feedramps.  We all know that the M4 ramps are actually made up of cuts in both the barrel extension and the receiver, though.  For example, if you buy a complete upper from Ko-Tonics, Tim builds the ramps into all them.  However, if you buy a barrel from  Ko-Tonics, the extension has the ramps cut, and the builder will then still need to machine the cuts into the receiver.  Some noobs might not know that.  Randall showed some pics a while back detailing the proper configuration in which the extension ramp cuts had to line up with the receiver cuts to properly allow for feeding. This seems to be a little more important with the 6.8 SPC than with 5.56, (especially given the propensity for the C-products mags occasionlly to require a little feed lip tweaking) and since this appears to be the new comprehensive buyer's/user's guide, that might also be useful to first-time 6.8 buyers.

This is a good idea about the feed ramps.  When I started calling up the companies I asked and DPMS has the M4 feedramps.  STAG doesn't and Bushmaster has what they call M2 feedramps.

Wow, a lot of great things to add in I hadn't though of.  I will add the listed things in over the night.   I wasn't on today as one, I'm usually a night bird and I was away for Thanksgiving today.  I hope everyone had a great Thanksgiving and now has their now fatter rear-ends on the lazy boy enjoying the rest of the day.

I also would much prefer this format for info as opposed to searching through 100+ pages of info 3/4 of which most can't get to, even if I think you should pay and support this site.  I can tell you I was ready to jump off a bridge, out of frustration, last night as I started to get the important info out of the other threads.  I can't see most people being willing to read all of that to get what amounts to a few pages of info out of it.  I don't mind doing it but I am not right in the head so thats not a good indication for others..  

Also, I have no problem if this does get stickied with the Mods ie Cold etc adding things as they come up if they feel the need.  I would just ask that if it's updated, add a post stating what has changed or been added so we can keep track.  

The only thing I can take credit for is find and consolidating the info and even that I had help from Paul and Constructor so.  All this info was somewhere on this site or linked to from here in some fashion.  I just wanted to help make it accessible.  Hell, it wasn't even my idea it was paulosantos idea.  I just volunteered and took it and ran.  The only things new is knowing what dealer are suppling what but again it can probably still be found on this site somewhere it would just take a lot of searching and reading to find.

Well I'm going to finish up with my family and get to work on the updates.  I'm on the site almost every night and accept PM's.  So I'm reachable.


Happy Thanksgivings,

Tim Welter  

Ok guys, I have updated all the info you provided along with the suggestions you gave.

I added:

M4 cut or not.  
Thread pitch.  
Magazine OAL Dimension for ammo and rating based on feed back on here and every other site.
Addition of 2 other 6.8 forums

I still haven't gotten through all the Old 6.8 SPC 1, 2 ,and 3 threads so there is probably more to come ie: reload equipment, suppressors, bdc scopes etc...


Hope everyone's Thanksgiving was relaxing and enjoyable,

Tim Welter

Originally Posted By Tim_W: Ok guys, I have updated all the info you provided along with the suggestions you gave. I added: M4 cut or not.   Thread pitch.   Magazine OAL Dimension for ammo and rating based on feed back on here and every other site. Addition of 2 other 6.8 forums I still haven't gotten through all the Old 6.8 SPC 1, 2 ,and 3 threads so there is probably more to come ie: reload equipment, suppressors, bdc scopes etc... Hope everyone's Thanksgiving was relaxing and enjoyable, Tim Welter

Thanks, Tim  same to you.   I'm still recovering from the food orgy

BTW, I have some more info for you:

1) on any 5/8 X 24 threaded barrel, you can use .308 screw on cans made by Jet,  SWR, Shark, SRT, AAC, Gemtech and Ops Inc.  Surefire can be mounted to similar threads, but you must purchase the adapter for their proprietary fast atach mount. From my own personal experience, and from that of others on the board, the .308 cans work really well on the 6.8 SPC guns.   I may have left others out, and apologize if I did.  I hope some of the "suppressor guys" will finish this list off for you.   I think there are some companies which will make 6.8 bored cans like Jet, Shark and maybe one other whose name escapes me right now.   I am not very familiar with the other QD models, so I can't give any input there, other than to say that most of them attach to a flash hider, compensator, etc., and installation should be simple.

2) we have not mentioned whether barrels are "target crowned" or posess standard crowns.   Another factor which IMO is likely to affect accuracy.


ETA:  I have a thread in "suppressors" and am already getting a list built for you from the various dealers and users.  Should be pretty complete in a few days.  Hope this saves you a little time

- OPS INC 3rd, 12th, 14th, 15th, 16th models.

More to come as the thread builds.  Here's the link in case you want to refer to it:

http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=6&f=20&t=231789

Thanks I just go back from being dragged to black Friday morning shopping by the Mrs. and my 3 daughters.  Man I hate crowds.  What would ever posses someone to camp out for 36 hours in front of a store just to save 100-200 dollars on a very low end laptop.  Or getting up at 4AM just to go into very crowded stores with other grumpy people to get sales that will be the same in 3 weeks for Christmas.  Just don't get it.


I will add the Suppressor data tonight.  Maybe you will have the list complete by then and I can add that.


Tim Welter

Has the industry settled on a standardized primer?  I know originally Remington used a large rifle primer and others a small rifle primer.  Is there still a division among manufaturers?  Or did they settle on the small primer?

This is one of the things that has kept me from jumping on this cartridge.  It seems it still has some growing to do.

This is just an idea, but does anyone know how to make charts?  Maybe in excell or a similar program.  You could have all of the manufacturers on top and then have on the left side categories such as:
Twist, thread size, Ramps, Chamber, chrome lined or not, etc.

I was thinking of doing that as this has now morphed into a lot of info.  Let me see what I can do.  I'm fairly good in excel.

Tim Welter

Originally Posted By Rcd567: Has the industry settled on a standardized primer?  I know originally Remington used a large rifle primer and others a small rifle primer.  Is there still a division among manufaturers?  Or did they settle on the small primer? This is one of the things that has kept me from jumping on this cartridge.  It seems it still has some growing to do.

I don't understand why a primer size would prevent you from getting into the 6.8 SPC. Brass is available in both choices and I can not believe you do not shoot rifles with both size primers and therefore stock both in your reloading components. If you only stock one - then buy brass for that size primer. I am buying both SSA and REM brass and experimenting to make my own determination of which to use. So far they seem to perform equally and powder selection is more of an issue than primer / brass mfg.

Awesome resource!  Thank you very much for taking the time to put it together.

One small note is that LWRC now stands for Land Warfare Resources Corp. and they prefer to no longer have anything to do with Leitner-Wise (the man or the name).

Thanks,
Stephen

Originally Posted By stephen_101st: Awesome resource!  Thank you very much for taking the time to put it together. One small note is that LWRC now stands for Land Warfare Resources Corp. and they prefer to no longer have anything to do with Leitner-Wise (the man or the name). Thanks, Stephen

That's what happens when you are cutting and pasting @ 4:30 AM I really did know that.  I'll make the changes tonight.  

I have started on working this info into a spread sheet format to see how that looks.  I'll put it up when I get it looking good.  Until then I will keep updating this page as info/changes comes in.



Tim Welter

Just as an correction; my original Douglas barrels ('04 time frane) are 1:11.

Why are Model 1 Barrels not recomended aren't they made by Shaw?

Why are Model 1 Barrels not recomended aren't they made by Shaw?

Originally Posted By mamasboy: Why are Model 1 Barrels not recomended aren't they made by Shaw?

The reason I put that denotation is the twist rate @ 9.5:1 is way to fast for the bullets used in the 6.8 and will cause increased pressure especially if you want to stetup the reloads hot.  On top of that they also use a SAAMI chamber which doesn't help and compounds the problem.  As far a E.R Shaw making them this is true but they make barrels based on what the customer wants and specs to them.  They also make LWRC SAAMI-10:1 6 groove and their new Improved 10:1.  Also Ko-tonics 11:1 Improved 4 groove.  I think Model 1 got that twist from thinking that the 6.8 was just another .270 as that twist would work in a .270 but even that is a fast twist for that cartridge.  This is of course just speculation.  We now know you can drop the twist down to 12:1 and still fully stabilize everything currently being offered in loaded ammo. The other problem with to fast a twist is it can "over"stabilize bullets which will hurt accuracy in most cases.  

But with all that said, it will work with all the loaded ammo openly available.  In all honestly though, its barrels with this spec that cause ammo manufactures like Art to have to keep there loads so low for safety.   They have to load to the lowest common denominator out there which is at present SAAMI chamber  9.5 twist spec'd.  Other than that, is a perfectly fine barrel.  It isn't defective.  Unless, you were unfortunate enough to get one of the early defective barrels that had the bad chroming.  Which caused tight chambers and bores.

Hope this explains the comment.


Tim Welter

I don't even have a 6.8 yet (budget woes), but THANKS for putting this info together in one place for us to peruse.

Great info and links all in one spot. Thank you!  BTW I was just on the DPMS web site and noticed they offer 16" barrels in 1x10 twist, but their 20" barrels are 1x11 twist, any idea why they do this? Thanks again!

DPMS 1x11 twist uppers

Cold,  
Thanks for tacking this.   I will give DPMS a call tomorrow to find out the particulars on the barrel specs for the 16 & 20.  I think they may still not be sure for themselves that 11:1 isn't to slow.  But they can risk it in longer barrels.  The longer the barrel the higher the velocity the slower the twist can be.   But I'll try to find out for sure tomorrow.

Tim Welter

I have add a suppressor section after the mag section,  It has a small writeup.  I will be adding the tech info over the next day.

I have been working on the Excel spreed sheet version of this.  It should work out well.  The only thing is, as this is still being revised and many things added, I won't be able to put something up until we have the categories all finished.  We can then  place everything in the proper order on the sheet.  Trying to do this after it is up would get confusing if we end up having to reformat it, moving data around.  People will end up getting confused and frustrated when things aren't where they were the day before.  So, once most things are added and we generally agree its solid.  I will workup a spreadsheet format for it.  I will then post it and let everyone review it and make suggestions.

Thanks to everyone thats helping get info and making suggestion or just proofing everything ie broken links etc...  I will do my best to get things up / changes quickly.

Thanks

Tim Welter

LWRC name change to reflect the current Company name Land Warfare Resources Corp..

Sorry it took so long.  I had actually forgotten to do it.  While re-reading the thread I saw the request and remembered I hadn't done it.


Tim Welter

tag

Well I called DPMS a few times in regard to there different twist barrels and couldn't get anyone in the tech dept.  I will try again tomorrow.  I'd shoot them an email but don't think I'll get as complete answer that way


Tim Welter

Originally Posted By Tim_W: Well I called DPMS a few times in regard to there different twist barrels and couldn't get anyone in the tech dept.  I will try again tomorrow.  I'd shoot them an email but don't think I'll get as complete answer that way Tim Welter

When I called, I was told that all of their barrels were 1:10" twist with SAAMI chamber.  I even pointed out that they are advertising the 20" barrel as a 1:11" tist but he still said it was 1:10" twist.

I figured it was a misprint.  Funny how there misprint is actually what they should be.  Maybe the persons subconscious was talking there.  I would still like to get a hold of someone there high enough up to be able to answer whether they are even considering switching over to 11:1 or #2 chamber or both especially as Shaw is now going to the #2 chamber.

Tim Welter

I wonder what's going on. I just went to the AR15.com industry section and the DPMS area there and clicked on the "DPMS official myth busting" thread that's tacked at the top. There they again state that the  6.8SPC  16" barrels are 1x10 twist and an "M4" profile and the 20" barrels are  1x11  twist and an "HBAR" profile. Next time someone calls DPMS they should get the name of the person that tells them the 20" barrels are not 1x11 twist as advertised.