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Posted: 1/29/2015 11:13:32 PM EDT
I keep going back-and-forth on what handguard to use on my current build, but one thing that is of particular importance is the rigidity of both the mount (rail to barrel nut to receiver) and the rail itself. If you had to absolutely trust that it would stay true around the barrel, even when abused, what would use? My gut says Geissele would be up there, but my gut doesn't have much first-hand experience.
Note: for a couple of reasons, I'm not looking for a quad rail, but something like a Troy SDMR or Geissele Mk4 with the quad at the very end would work. |
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Posted: 1/29/2015 11:25:12 PM EDT
[#1]
I think you got it right with geissele.
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Posted: 1/29/2015 11:26:49 PM EDT
[#2]
Noveske NSR
BCM KMR |
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Posted: 1/29/2015 11:27:26 PM EDT
[#3]
YHM.
Laugh if you want, but there's nothing I've used or played with that is as solid as the YHM mounts as long as you properly torque the barrel nut. |
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Posted: 1/29/2015 11:33:14 PM EDT
[#4]
check out the EMR as well really long barrell nut, the V3 will have a continuous rail as well
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Posted: 1/29/2015 11:52:35 PM EDT
[#5]
Geissele. The barrel nut and rail system is solid and a breeze to install.
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Posted: 1/30/2015 12:13:06 AM EDT
[#6]
URX 4. The rail is the barrel nut. I haven't installed one but it seems more difficult to install than most.
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Posted: 1/30/2015 12:14:43 AM EDT
[#7]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I think you got it right with geissele. Geissele |
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Posted: 1/30/2015 12:26:22 AM EDT
[#8]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Geissele Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: I think you got it right with geissele. Geissele |
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Posted: 1/30/2015 7:02:37 AM EDT
[#9]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
YHM. Laugh if you want, but there's nothing I've used or played with that is as solid as the YHM mounts as long as you properly torque the barrel nut. Haha ,lol ... wait, you're right. I have one. Solid as a tank. |
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Posted: 1/30/2015 8:33:58 AM EDT
[#10]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Noveske NSR BCM KMR Quote HistoryQuoted:
Noveske NSR BCM KMR Looked at both. Noveske was eliminated for completed unrelated reasons. The KMR seems to be way up there on strength-to-weight and the design of their mount makes sense. My concern was whether they went for ultra-light, using the magnesium content to make it reasonably strong, but not necessarily top-level strong. In other words, I have no doubt that it is stronger than a similar aluminum-only design; I just wonder if it is as strong as some of the heavier aluminum designs (e.g., Geissele.) Quoted:
YHM. Laugh if you want, but there's nothing I've used or played with that is as solid as the YHM mounts as long as you properly torque the barrel nut. Have to admit, I wasn't expecting YHM. The 12.5" Slant SLR is interesting for my particular build, but I just can't decide if I'd be OK with (or even like) the slant nose or if it will bug me (same with the Rainier Force Mk2.) Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
I think you got it right with geissele. Geissele Interesting. I was looking at either the Mk4 Keymod (still for sale at Valhalla Tactical) or the new Mk8 with M-LOK, but the bomb-proof-i-ness of the older models (Mk1 and Mk2, I assume) is worth looking at. That definitely comes with a different category of weight, though. |
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Posted: 1/30/2015 8:47:14 AM EDT
[#11]
(double tap)
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Posted: 1/30/2015 9:31:31 AM EDT
[#12]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I think you got it right with geissele. Quote HistoryQuoted:
I think you got it right with geissele. Quoted:
Noveske NSR BCM KMR These! |
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Posted: 1/30/2015 9:40:58 AM EDT
[#13]
Look for a rail with a long, fat proprietary barrel nut. Those typically also have larger and multiple means to fasten the tube securely. Also look for thicker metal on the tube and fewer, rather than more "Swiss cheese" holes. These rails may be a couple ounces heavier, perhaps total weight, including nut, working out to about one ounce per inch of length.
Geissele and Daniel Defense come to mind. |
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Posted: 1/30/2015 9:53:35 AM EDT
[#14]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Noveske NSR BCM KMR The NSR (mine is still in box and not installed) I believe has an anti rotation pin which is great for a 'bomb-proof'. For regular use I don't think its needed. There are a ton of screws on that thing. If you don't want to drill your upper for the pin you can send it off to ADCO to do it. |
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Posted: 1/30/2015 10:45:59 AM EDT
[#15]
how about a cop or m4e1 from aero
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Posted: 1/30/2015 10:49:20 AM EDT
[#16]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
how about a cop or m4e1 from aero Yup, likely the most rigid you'll find. |
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Posted: 1/30/2015 10:54:18 AM EDT
[#17]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
how about a cop or m4e1 from aero That's cheating 
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Posted: 1/30/2015 11:23:06 AM EDT
[#18]
BCM KMR
They spent a lot of time working on that and wouldn't release something sub-par. And the cross bolt lockup system is as strong as they come /thread
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Posted: 1/30/2015 11:40:51 AM EDT
[#19]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Look for a rail with a long, fat proprietary barrel nut. Those typically also have larger and multiple means to fasten the tube securely. Also look for thicker metal on the tube and fewer, rather than more "Swiss cheese" holes. These rails may be a couple ounces heavier, perhaps total weight, including nut, working out to about one ounce per inch of length. Geissele and Daniel Defense come to mind. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Look for a rail with a long, fat proprietary barrel nut. Those typically also have larger and multiple means to fasten the tube securely. Also look for thicker metal on the tube and fewer, rather than more "Swiss cheese" holes. These rails may be a couple ounces heavier, perhaps total weight, including nut, working out to about one ounce per inch of length. Geissele and Daniel Defense come to mind. The extensions at 3, 6 and 9 o'clock (as well as the usual gas tube one at 12) on the Geissele should also provide rigidity against deflection (like having two mini I-beams at each one. Quoted:
how about a cop or m4e1 from aero Unfortunately, that idea came to me after I had decided on and purchased an ASA side-charging upper. Quoted:
BCM KMR They spent a lot of time working on that and wouldn't release something sub-par. And the cross bolt lockup system is as strong as they come /thread I don't doubt the connection at all and their material choice certainly helps. But, again, I am concerned with the cross-sectional design being about weight-savings, relying on the material difference to make it stronger than a comparable aluminum design. Maybe I'm wrong, but if you grabbed two rifles, one with a KMR and the other with a Geissele, while the former would no doubt be significantly lighter, my gut says that the latter would be harder to make deflect off center. |
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Posted: 1/30/2015 12:31:45 PM EDT
[#20]
Mega's MKM set up is pretty "bomb proof" but you pay a little more in weight
The best "value" in engineering + low wt. is BCM KMR -imo And if you buy it from V7 Weapons you can get it with their Ti barrel nut....Joel has stated that Ti hardware is in the works. |
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Posted: 1/30/2015 12:42:43 PM EDT
[#21]
Im all about the BCM KMR but as far as bombproof goes, I think that it should be closer to the bottom of the list due to its fragile finish. Not to say that any other rail wont scratch, but if you plan on keeping you BCM looking like it did when you took it out of the box you can forget about it...
My vote goes to any Geissele rail... |
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Posted: 1/30/2015 2:35:46 PM EDT
[#22]
Geissele is what you want since it has the quad pic rails at the end.
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Posted: 1/30/2015 3:34:16 PM EDT
[#23]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Mega's MKM set up is pretty "bomb proof" but you pay a little more in weight Quote HistoryQuoted:
Mega's MKM set up is pretty "bomb proof" but you pay a little more in weight Same problem as the AP M4E1; attachment is integrated into the upper. Quoted:
Im all about the BCM KMR but as far as bombproof goes, I think that it should be closer to the bottom of the list due to its fragile finish. Not to say that any other rail wont scratch, but if you plan on keeping you BCM looking like it did when you took it out of the box you can forget about it... Actually, when it comes to "bomb proof", finish wouldn't be what I would include (unless losing it allows the material below to degrade, which I don't believe is the case with the KMR.) Don't get me wrong, I'd prefer a durable finish, too, but it's just not what I'm most concerned about in this case. Quoted:
Geissele is what you want since it has the quad pic rails at the end. The Mk4 Keymod does, but the Mk8 (M-Lok) does not. However, its cross-section does have bump-outs to the Keymod/M-Lok that should provide rigidity. |
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Posted: 1/30/2015 4:03:21 PM EDT
[#24]
Geissele mk1 would probably be up there. It's a monster.
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Posted: 1/31/2015 7:20:44 AM EDT
[#25]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Geissele mk1 would probably be up there. It's a monster. Hard to find the Mk1. I have seen the Mk2, which is pretty close. I was thinking that the Mk4/Mk8 would be a slight compromise between strength and weight. Maybe I can find a steel barrel nut (they sell the aluminum one, so perhaps a Mk1/Mk2 owner who has purchased one would want to sell the steel one.) I wouldn't mind the added weight so close to the center of balance (gravity). I hate to even mention them due to the inevitable "f**k Troy" comments, but how would Troy's products rate? Specifically, I was looking at the SDMR. It would be a reluctant choice, but the 13" is available for around $205 and there are some other characteristics of it that would work well in my case. |
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Posted: 2/1/2015 4:16:49 AM EDT
[#26]
Vltor casv setup would fit the bill
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Posted: 2/1/2015 9:05:41 AM EDT
[#27]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
URX 4. The rail is the barrel nut. I haven't installed one but it seems more difficult to install than most. Quote HistoryQuoted:
URX 4. The rail is the barrel nut. I haven't installed one but it seems more difficult to install than most. I skipped this earlier because I had ruled out older URX models. Now that I have seen the 4, I may have to reconsider. Quoted:
Vltor casv setup would fit the bill Actually, this my very first idea. I agree that it is a very solid design. Unfortunately, it was ruled out for non-bomp-proof-related reasons. |
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Posted: 2/7/2015 10:53:55 PM EDT
[#28]
Well, it may not be as bombproof as the Mk1, but a surprising stock of the new Mk4 w/ M-Lok was too hard to pass on.
Loved the MK4, but wanted M-Lok. Geissele service told me last week that the Mk4 M-Lok would be coming in the spring. Googled it today and viola! Mmmmmm.... 
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Posted: 2/9/2015 12:14:45 AM EDT
[#29]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Well, it may not be as bombproof as the Mk1, but a surprising stock of the new Mk4 w/ M-Lok was too hard to pass on. Loved the MK4, but wanted M-Lok. Geissele service told me last week that the Mk4 M-Lok would be coming in the spring. Googled it today and viola! Mmmmmm.... http://www.ar15news.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/01/Geissele-SMR-MK4-MLOK-Rail-2.jpg I like it what's the wt on the 13.0 including barrel nut and attaching hardware (not including accessory rails) |
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Posted: 2/9/2015 11:54:03 AM EDT
[#30]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I like it what's the wt on the 13.0 including barrel nut and attaching hardware (not including accessory rails) They don't have the weight yet for the Mk4 M-Lok on their website, but the Mk4 Keymod is 13.44 oz w/ barrel nut (11.52 without) and the Mk8 (M-Lok, no small rails) is roughly 0.5 oz heavier than the Mk5 (Keymod, no small rails.) So, I'd guess that it will be around 13.8 oz with barrel nut. Make you wonder how they kept the original Mk4 down to 12.8 oz. I guess because the sides didn't have to stand up to having things mounted to them (short rails excluded.) |
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Posted: 2/9/2015 1:55:38 PM EDT
[#31]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I skipped this earlier because I had ruled out older URX models. Now that I have seen the 4, I may have to reconsider. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
URX 4. The rail is the barrel nut. I haven't installed one but it seems more difficult to install than most. I skipped this earlier because I had ruled out older URX models. Now that I have seen the 4, I may have to reconsider. I don't own one, but it seems very solid due to lack of barrel nut/rail interface. However it looks to be a PITA to install. Some people are confirming some of your fears about the KMR: http://www.ar15.com/forums/t_3_12/668089_I_m_at_a_loss_for_words______I_think_my_new_BCM_KMR_is_a_lemon__PIC_.html Shame, I just ordered one. |
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