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Posted: 7/22/2014 11:37:30 PM EDT
For those who own them/have used them, what is the general consensus?  From my experience in the Army I'm used to using a standard bolt catch.  But I'm always open to new ideas/improvements.

Is it just a tacticool thing?  Or does it actually enhance the rifle without getting in the way?

I've seen some videos showing there is some "play" or wiggle.  I've seen another showing a not-so-good fit on a billet lower.  

Should I just stick with a standard catch/release or is it worth buying?  Thanks for any help or advice.
Link Posted: 7/22/2014 11:39:53 PM EDT
[#1]
Prepare for 50/50 responses.

I have one, it functions as advertised on a standard forged lower. The wiggle is from the actual bolt catch, not the BAD lever. It does not impede my use of the trigger. It does make it easier to perform functions of the rifle, as I can leave my firing hand in position and both lock the bolt to the rear, as well as release the bolt without moving my grip.

Link Posted: 7/23/2014 12:15:24 AM EDT
[#2]
I've kind of wondered the same thing, almost got one a few times but decided I really didn't need it.
Link Posted: 7/23/2014 12:17:59 AM EDT
[#3]
It's inexpensive and doesn't require any modifications to your AR to use. Easy to install and remove. Give it a try and find out if you like it or not.

I had one on my first AR and I liked it. I ended up selling that gun along with the lever.
Link Posted: 7/23/2014 12:47:48 AM EDT
[#4]
They tend to up the rates of malfunction enough they have a reputation in the troubleshooting forum.

I just don't know why anyone would put something that has a 20% malfunction rate on a gun. 20% is a guess, but anything with a rate hight enough to notice is too high.
Link Posted: 7/23/2014 2:50:33 AM EDT
[#5]
I had one on my Stag, I tossed it as it was not stable, I bought one from Tactical Link, much better, ended up outfitting all my AR's with them. Much tighter grip, sits out of the way much better.

Link Posted: 7/23/2014 3:58:47 AM EDT
[#6]
I've got them installed on two 6920's. Didn't like them at first but the more I use them the more I like them. So far both rifles have functioned 100% w/a variety of ammo and mags. However, should they decrease reliability I'll remove them in a heartbeat.
Tomac
Link Posted: 7/23/2014 4:03:38 AM EDT
[#7]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
They tend to up the rates of malfunction enough they have a reputation in the troubleshooting forum.

I just don't know why anyone would put something that has a 20% malfunction rate on a gun. 20% is a guess, but anything with a rate hight enough to notice is too high.
View Quote


It's all in the gun. I have had no malfunctions caused by the BAD lever on multiple rifles/pistols.

OP - try it on your gun. Because of manufacturing tolerances, some bolt catches may be thicker/thinner than others and induce malfunctions. If you try and and don't notice any malfunctions, you're good to go. It makes clearing other issues MUCH easier as well as reloading.
Link Posted: 7/23/2014 4:50:26 AM EDT
[#8]
For me, the main advantage of a B.A.D. lever is when used in conjunction with an extended tactical charging handle, like a BCM. You can pull the charging handle with your left hand and lock it back with the B.A.D. lever, without ever breaking your right hand from the pistol grip.  They work great together, but individually I do not see the great advantage of having either one without the other.  Together, they are a great combination.
Link Posted: 7/23/2014 5:01:07 AM EDT
[#9]
I have several.  I really like the idea and for use in working in the shop.  On the range I have had some that will cause the bolt to stay back while shooting.  Never happens unless there is the additional pressure of the magazine in the lower.   For a hunting/range gun it is not a problem.  For defense probably not ideal unless you use enough to prove it always works.
Link Posted: 7/23/2014 5:22:15 AM EDT
[#10]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
For me, the main advantage of a B.A.D. lever is when used in conjunction with an extended tactical charging handle, like a BCM. You can pull the charging handle with your left hand and lock it back with the B.A.D. lever, without ever breaking your right hand from the pistol grip.  They work great together, but individually I do not see the great advantage of having either one without the other.  Together, they are a great combination.
View Quote


I was going to write this^  Spot on IMO.
Link Posted: 7/23/2014 5:48:06 AM EDT
[#11]


I have one on my pistol.

It didn't fit out of the box.  After lots of filing and tinkering, I finally got it on but the screw threads didn't seem to match the back plate.

I use it but it's loose and it pisses me off when I look at it.

I think mine was just bad from the factory, I should have probably returned it.


Link Posted: 7/23/2014 6:34:44 AM EDT
[#12]
Quoted:
For those who own them/have used them, what is the general consensus?  From my experience in the Army I'm used to using a standard bolt catch.  But I'm always open to new ideas/improvements.

Is it just a tacticool thing?  Or does it actually enhance the rifle without getting in the way?

I've seen some videos showing there is some "play" or wiggle.  I've seen another showing a not-so-good fit on a billet lower.  

Should I just stick with a standard catch/release or is it worth buying?  Thanks for any help or advice.
View Quote


Personally, i think they're a great improvement, except for one thing, which i'll get to in a minute.  They aid in reloading faster, make it easier to clear malfunctions, and unload/lock the bolt back.  No doubt about that, they are a great ergonomic upgrade to the factory AR.  

That being said, my personal experience with them was not all good.  I noticed my rifles (all 4 of them badlever equipped, 2 sbrs, 2 16 rifles) had a tendency to not hold the bolt open on the last shot about 25-50% of the time.  This was an observation i had on them over a couple years.   While searching for a solution to this i found some threads that listed the Bad Lever as a possible culprit.  I took my rifles to the range with a mixture of pmags (8 gen2 20/30 rounders, gen3 20/30 rounders) and loaded all of them with one round.  i fired them through the badlever equipped rifle and the bolt failed to lock back on 3-5 of those mags.  Took the badlever off, and ALL locked back.  put the badlever back on, same thing as before.  repeated again without badlever, all locked back.  Since i removed them i cannot recall a single instance where they bolt on any of my rifles has failed to lock back on the last shot.  

My buddy's badlever equipped rifles (which i mostly built) didn't seem to have as high of a tendency to fail to lock as mine, but they still did.  I guess what i'm saying is, if your rifle functions as it should with one on it, great...i would use one, but if not i would beware.  The observation that they work on some rifles and not others is kind of worrisome too.  I like all my rifles to handle more or less the same, so it's either bad lever on all of them, or none for me.  

Also, i'll add it's a cheap enough option to give it a shot.  Install, if it functions...use it.  If not, sell it on the EE.  Guys gobbled up my bad levers in about 6 seconds on the EE.  As for it's use with a BCM CH, i totally agree with that as well.  But i also think the BCM CHs are a great upgrade by themselves.
Link Posted: 7/23/2014 7:46:24 AM EDT
[#13]
Am I in before the "bad idea because your finger has to go inside the trigger guard to operate it" crowd? Every time I see this posted I know for a fact they have no clue whatsoever and haven't used one. I have several and they work as advertised, I do see the occasional complaint on the bolt lock back issue though but have never experienced it myself.
Link Posted: 7/23/2014 8:22:37 AM EDT
[#14]
Didn't think it was a good idea at first...

Installed one and worked with it.

Now I really like having them on the gun for malfunction clearance.

Good addition and no real drawbacks I've found over a few years of use on numerous guns.
Link Posted: 7/23/2014 8:39:01 AM EDT
[#15]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:


I was going to write this^  Spot on IMO.
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Quoted:
For me, the main advantage of a B.A.D. lever is when used in conjunction with an extended tactical charging handle, like a BCM. You can pull the charging handle with your left hand and lock it back with the B.A.D. lever, without ever breaking your right hand from the pistol grip.  They work great together, but individually I do not see the great advantage of having either one without the other.  Together, they are a great combination.


I was going to write this^  Spot on IMO.


+2, I love the simplicity of locking the bolt back and being able to drop it forward quietly if I am in the field, not every application requires one to release the bolt forward and make a racket. In conjunction with my BCM Gunfighter Medium charging handle it is great. Like others have said, function test it with your gun and if it works, great, but then again some people report issues with it. My gun runs 100% with it (Windham) and I think it is a great tool that not only allows me to be safer with the weapon by making it easier to manipulate the bolt and release with my hand on the pistol grip, but also allows me to remain stealthy while hunting (or tier one operating in my secret backyard operations). Basically I recommend it IF you are willing to properly function test it with your rifle and MOST IMPORTANTLY not bitch about it being the worst invention ever if you choose not to use it. Its 25-30$, not worth begin nearly as butthurt over if it doesn't work as some people make it out to be.

my .02c
Link Posted: 7/23/2014 1:00:44 PM EDT
[#16]
It saves you time in sending the bolt home after inserting a new mag, as your trigger finger is already right there. you insert a mag and your weak hand goes straight to its hold instead of to the paddle, and your trigger finger sends the bolt home then goes straight to the trigger. It works great on my rifles, but some billet receivers that protrude further outward on the lower lip where the paddle rests with a bad lever installed will cause malfunctions. So it really just depends what rifle you put it on.
Link Posted: 7/23/2014 2:01:31 PM EDT
[#17]
I really enjoyed having the lever on my rifle. Had I not switched to a billet lower I'd still be using it.
The key to the lever working correctly is that everything else MUST be in spec. I see problem over and over on this board and though guys just sit there and blame the   lever I have never actually seen a single case that wasn't caused by another part of the rifle being out of spec.
Link Posted: 7/26/2014 9:13:31 AM EDT
[#18]
I am using several and they all work 100% on my weapons.
They have some advantages which have been mentioned.
Link Posted: 7/26/2014 2:18:38 PM EDT
[#19]
I have them on 4 of my rifles and have had zero issues.
Link Posted: 7/26/2014 2:59:37 PM EDT
[#20]
I have one on my M&P and I've never had any trouble with it.
Link Posted: 7/26/2014 3:12:00 PM EDT
[#21]
I like mine
Link Posted: 7/26/2014 5:45:24 PM EDT
[#22]
I have it on two of my rifles (both are standard forged lowers with basic "mil-spec" lower parts) and I did have it fail to hold the bolt open one time.  I thought it might have been the cheap magazine I was using, but after reading this thread I wonder if we need to use a different bolt catch spring/plunger combination when using the BAD Lever?  If that simple fix is enough to eliminate any malfunctions, I don't see why someone would not want it.

I install mine so the paddle is as far away from the trigger as it can be without rubbing the receiver and I can still reach it with my index finger without any problems.  It also does not crowd my trigger manipulation when it is rolled forward (for those who would be concerned about this).
Link Posted: 7/26/2014 7:04:14 PM EDT
[#23]
I have a BAD lever as well as the Tactical Link version. Neither has ever given me a single problem of any kind. The Tactical Link version sits closer to the trigger it seems and is easier to engage. I actually prefer the BAD lever though because it's a bit more out of the way. Both are good products.

Link Posted: 7/27/2014 5:34:11 AM EDT
[#24]
I'm used to not having one so when I put one on, I didn't like it at all.  Thinking about trying it again.
Link Posted: 7/27/2014 6:27:38 AM EDT
[#25]
I had one and did not experience any malfunctions when plinking at the range and found it beneficial. That being said, train with it regularly because if you don't you might find yourself reverting back to the old manual of arms with emergency, tactical reloads and malfunctions under stress. I learned that the hard way in a carbine course as I would either have brain freeze, or revert back and "cave man"  struggling with the lever. I never put mine back on after that.
Link Posted: 7/27/2014 6:54:01 AM EDT
[#26]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
I had one and did not experience any malfunctions when plinking at the range and found it beneficial. That being said, train with it regularly because if you don't you might find yourself reverting back to the old manual of arms with emergency, tactical reloads and malfunctions under stress. I learned that the hard way in a carbine course as I would either have brain freeze, or revert back and "cave man"  struggling with the lever. I never put mine back on after that.
View Quote


Good advice. Either commit to it fully or don't use them at all (all my AR's have it). It can really screw up your muscle memory trying to train both w/and w/o it.
Tomac
Link Posted: 7/27/2014 7:40:28 AM EDT
[#27]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
They tend to up the rates of malfunction enough they have a reputation in the troubleshooting forum.

I just don't know why anyone would put something that has a 20% malfunction rate on a gun. 20% is a guess, but anything with a rate hight enough to notice is too high.
View Quote


This.

With gloves on it's even more likely to cause malfunctions.

I had them on my rifles when I went to DARC a couple years ago. My intention was to only use the BAD lever hold the bolt open in the event of needing to clear double-feeds, etc.

It actually ended up causing more issues than it helped me solve... By the end of the second day I was desperatly searching for the Torx wrench to take the damned thing off my gun.
Link Posted: 7/27/2014 7:43:05 AM EDT
[#28]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
I have several.  I really like the idea and for use in working in the shop. On the range I have had some that will cause the bolt to stay back while shooting.  Never happens unless there is the additional pressure of the magazine in the lower.   For a hunting/range gun it is not a problem.  For defense probably not ideal unless you use enough to prove it always works.
View Quote


This is the issue I kept running into at DARC during the carbine course. Very frustrating in class and possibly dangerous on a two way range.

Link Posted: 7/30/2014 7:36:32 AM EDT
[#29]
I wear gloves all the time when shooting.
The fit of bolt catches seems to vary a lot so it is not surprising the BAD levers are not 100% for everybody.
Link Posted: 7/30/2014 8:04:18 AM EDT
[#30]
I have one one every AR I own.  They work as advertised and I've never had a single malfunction with them.  Your hand never has to leave fire control and reloads are faster.  I've been using one during 3gun competitions for almost 3 years without a single issue.

Sure it is a product that addresses a non-existent problem but it does improve the function of the rifle.

I highly recommend them.
Link Posted: 7/30/2014 12:11:14 PM EDT
[#31]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
I have one one every AR I own.  They work as advertised and I've never had a single malfunction with them.  Your hand never has to leave fire control and reloads are faster.  I've been using one during 3gun competitions for almost 3 years without a single issue.

Sure it is a product that addresses a non-existent problem but it does improve the function of the rifle.

I highly recommend them.
View Quote



Im in the same boat.

But what I do is use a product called fast-steel when I install them.

I roll up a little bead of the stuff, and use it to fill in the gaps between the bolt hold open and the bad lever internally.  I have noticed that the BAD lever can shift on the BHO fore/aft (yes I am taking into account the inherent wobble in the BHO) which can cause issues.  I also use red loctite on the screw.

Basically I permanently install the bad lever and as a result it becomes rock solid.

Takes a little bit of time, but I find it makes a good product even better.  I always wished magpul would offer these permanently installed on a BHO.

I have used the BAD lever basically since it came out, and have never had it induce a malfunction, even through courses and much rougher-than-range use.
Link Posted: 7/30/2014 12:35:40 PM EDT
[#32]
The BAD levers I've used have all worked well...
No malfunctions.
I like having one.

I can see how gloves might cause problems,  but...
Even in the dead of winter I don't wear gloves when actively shooting. I need to "feel" what I'm doing.
Link Posted: 7/30/2014 12:57:58 PM EDT
[#33]

Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:


They tend to up the rates of malfunction enough they have a reputation in the troubleshooting forum.



I just don't know why anyone would put something that has a 20% malfunction rate on a gun. 20% is a guess, but anything with a rate hight enough to notice is too high.
View Quote
The malfunctions your talking about are failure to lock the bolt back, it's not like the rifle fails to cycle.  Even then it can normally be fixed fairly easily.
 
Link Posted: 7/30/2014 1:34:48 PM EDT
[#34]
I've installed them on almost all of my ARs, save my 22LR which it won't work on because the bolt is different (short throw). For the reasons others have mentioned I love 'em especially when combined with a BCM charging handle.
Link Posted: 7/30/2014 1:47:21 PM EDT
[#35]
i find it to be very useful. but just like anything else that changes the way you use the rifle, it takes extra training to beat it into your head to use it and how to stay away from it when needed. its so cheap, why not try it? it takes about 10 secs to un/install

like others said, i like the ability to release the bolt after a mag change with out having to really move my hands at all. But having or not is not going to make a HUGE difference so totally up the operator.
Link Posted: 7/30/2014 1:58:32 PM EDT
[#36]
I've had good luck with them on most builds. There was one that gave me issues, but for the life of me I can't remember the issue it gave me.
Link Posted: 7/30/2014 4:10:01 PM EDT
[#37]
Depends on the lower. I had a LaRue Stealth lower that had the ears machined too far apart on the bolt catch so it had a ton of slop/wobble with a BAD leverr even after trying three different bolt catches.

Currently building an Aero Precision lower with the Troy version and it is rock solid with no lateral movement whatsoever.
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