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Posted: 6/25/2010 5:15:29 PM EDT
So I'm looking for the best FF handguard for my SHTF/beater rifle. I want to attach it to a BCM Middy and I plan on running it hard. Im leaning towards the Vltor CASV-EL mostly due to the looks and ease of assembly but I've heard some things about the bottom section coming loose over time. I'm also thinking about the DD Omega rail.

Thoughts?
Link Posted: 6/25/2010 5:20:12 PM EDT
I'd vote LaRue.
Link Posted: 6/25/2010 5:27:21 PM EDT
Do you want a full rail? Tubular type? Upgradable where you can add rails as you need them(like the CASV?) I've got a PRI that works great.
Link Posted: 6/25/2010 5:34:12 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 6/25/2010 5:35:38 PM EDT by Market_Garden]
Of the choices you mentioned, I'd take the Omega hands down over the CASV, if for no other reason than it's 5.5 ounces lighter. The Omega has an excellent reputation as well.

My favorite handguard though is the JP/VTAC Modular piece. It doesn't look tacticool but it's solid, light, comfortable, and gives you tons of options for mounting stuff.
Link Posted: 6/25/2010 5:43:25 PM EDT
Originally Posted By CJFirefly:
I'd vote LaRue.


+1
Link Posted: 6/25/2010 5:49:18 PM EDT
DD omega
Link Posted: 6/25/2010 6:00:18 PM EDT
Well then it looks like the DD Omega is the way for me to go. I do like the way the casv-el looks but 5.5 ounces is a pretty big difference.

Does anyone have any pics of their DD Omega thats been beat to hell? Or even just on a painted rifle?

Thanks for the info
Link Posted: 6/25/2010 6:30:38 PM EDT
I'm partial to LaRue rails
Link Posted: 6/25/2010 7:24:52 PM EDT
I don't think the Omega is the very best rail out there for "SHTF", but it will definitely take a lot of abuse. I would prefer the Lite rail.

Here is my BCM 14.5" ML with a 9" Omega.




Link Posted: 6/25/2010 7:42:26 PM EDT
My small hands and wallet prefer the YHM Smooth Tubes. The short forward rails are all I need for lights and gadgets. Not too heavy either.
Link Posted: 6/25/2010 7:54:09 PM EDT
DD or LaRue
Link Posted: 6/25/2010 7:58:05 PM EDT
Reliability, durability, simplicity, and weight......factor in your needs/criteria and make your choice.

My next builds will have an MOE handguard, then another with a lightweight handguard where rail space is continuous on the top and rail peices can be added to the bottom and sides.
Link Posted: 6/25/2010 9:58:09 PM EDT
I've been using my LaRue 9.0 for over four years now and it is still running fine, it even fell on the floor once sideways while leaning on a wall without any damage.

Most of the FF handguard problem is that it could get loose from its mounting when used in the extreme conditions, so the proper rail design that would survive it would be the ones with the locking system like the LaRue, DD Lite, and DD RIS II (also other brands with similar feature).

If it doesn't have these locking feature even the use of blue Loctite on the mounting rings and mounting fasteners don't usually work according to past threads here in the archives that I've seen over several years.


Link Posted: 6/25/2010 11:36:02 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 6/25/2010 11:36:54 PM EDT by KJB]
DD M4A1 RIS II FSP, M4a1 RIS II or Lite in that order.
Link Posted: 6/26/2010 4:22:51 AM EDT
DD Lite rail or LaRue.
Link Posted: 6/26/2010 5:05:36 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Market_Garden:
Of the choices you mentioned, I'd take the Omega hands down over the CASV, if for no other reason than it's 5.5 ounces lighter. The Omega has an excellent reputation as well.

My favorite handguard though is the JP/VTAC Modular piece. It doesn't look tacticool but it's solid, light, comfortable, and gives you tons of options for mounting stuff.


I have the Troy Extreme 13" and I love it. My hands aren't huge and I can get an excellent grip on them. Plus without the rails it is only 11.5 ounces. The long sight radius is nice too.
Link Posted: 6/26/2010 5:26:19 AM EDT

Originally Posted By gee223:
Originally Posted By Market_Garden:
Of the choices you mentioned, I'd take the Omega hands down over the CASV, if for no other reason than it's 5.5 ounces lighter. The Omega has an excellent reputation as well.

My favorite handguard though is the JP/VTAC Modular piece. It doesn't look tacticool but it's solid, light, comfortable, and gives you tons of options for mounting stuff.


I have the Troy Extreme 13" and I love it. My hands aren't huge and I can get an excellent grip on them. Plus without the rails it is only 11.5 ounces. The long sight radius is nice too.


I just got my first Troy Extreme TRX Battle Rail, and I love it. The lockup design is so much better than my YHM rails that I'm probable going to make the change on my other AR's soon.
Link Posted: 6/26/2010 5:31:22 AM EDT
I think the OP is looking for a 2 piece FF rail so he doesn't have to remove the FSB and muzzle device. That limits his options considerably. I would lean toward the DD Omega or Troy 2 piece. If I had to bet my life on the rail in a SHTF event I would much prefer Larue or DD Lite.
Link Posted: 6/26/2010 6:15:04 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 6/26/2010 6:15:36 AM EDT by nomondaydreams]
I dont really think SHTF has anything to do with it. I think it will be what ever is most comfortable for you. Ive got a surefire quad rail and an 11in DD, both setup the same. love em both TBH.
Link Posted: 6/26/2010 6:33:25 AM EDT
DD Lite or RIS II.
Link Posted: 6/26/2010 8:40:11 AM EDT
Thanks everyone!

So what makes the DD Lite better than the Omega? And is there any reason the Larue rail would be better than the DD Lite?

I was hoping to do without cutting off my D-ring but if it gets me a more reliable rail then I'll do it.
Link Posted: 6/26/2010 11:58:44 AM EDT
Originally Posted By LRB_M1A:
Thanks everyone!

So what makes the DD Lite better than the Omega? And is there any reason the Larue rail would be better than the DD Lite?

I was hoping to do without cutting off my D-ring but if it gets me a more reliable rail then I'll do it.


More secure attachment, they both use special barrel nuts that attach to the rail via bolts and/or keepers. The Omega rail clamps around the existing barrel nut and uses set screws to tighten the whole affair up. It is a pretty secure arrangement but nowhere near as substantial an attachment point as the DD lite or Larue rails.

Note: In order to install the Larue or DD rails (other than the Omega) you have to remove the front sight base and flash hider as well as the stock barrel nut and delta ring assembly. You are thinking of the Midwest Industries and Troy 2 piece rails with regard to cutting off the delta ring.

Hope this helps!
Link Posted: 6/26/2010 12:20:14 PM EDT
Rail type
-Daniel Defense
-LaRue

Tube
-PRI
Link Posted: 6/26/2010 5:52:26 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Bushman_269:
Originally Posted By LRB_M1A:
Thanks everyone!

So what makes the DD Lite better than the Omega? And is there any reason the Larue rail would be better than the DD Lite?

I was hoping to do without cutting off my D-ring but if it gets me a more reliable rail then I'll do it.


More secure attachment, they both use special barrel nuts that attach to the rail via bolts and/or keepers. The Omega rail clamps around the existing barrel nut and uses set screws to tighten the whole affair up. It is a pretty secure arrangement but nowhere near as substantial an attachment point as the DD lite or Larue rails.

Note: In order to install the Larue or DD rails (other than the Omega) you have to remove the front sight base and flash hider as well as the stock barrel nut and delta ring assembly. You are thinking of the Midwest Industries and Troy 2 piece rails with regard to cutting off the delta ring.

Hope this helps!


Thanks

Is removing the front sight base, flash hider, and the stock barrel nut a hard thing to do? As in should I plan to let a gun smith do it?
Link Posted: 6/26/2010 7:31:39 PM EDT
It isn't particularly hard to do but you have to have the proper tools, as in a vice, armorer's wrench, upper receiver block, and a set of punches. If you are not a "do it yourselfer" then you can pay a smith to do it (ADCO is who I'd recommend). If you are a "do it yourselfer" then buy the tools with the money you would save from paying someone else.
Link Posted: 6/26/2010 8:03:45 PM EDT
Originally Posted By LRB_M1A:

Is removing the front sight base, flash hider, and the stock barrel nut a hard thing to do? As in should I plan to let a gun smith do it?


Take a look at these instructions, if you have the proper tools and think you could do it yourself, it's not too hard, I did it myself when I installed my LaRue rails following these same instructions.

The only problem with having tools and having done it is that your AR will multiply.

If it's too much hassle, I agree let someone else do it and just send it to ADCO.


Assemble Your Lower, Upper, Free Float, Trigger, Gas Block - Step by Step Instructions - tacked thread link


Link Posted: 6/29/2010 8:48:24 AM EDT
Tubular with all the gripping surface you could want, and slightly narrower than most... With all the rail surface a squad could ever need. Blackheart International is what I run with.

Link Posted: 6/29/2010 2:01:58 PM EDT
Originally Posted By 308Sako:
Tubular with all the gripping surface you could want, and slightly narrower than most... With all the rail surface a squad could ever need. Blackheart International is what I run with.

http://www.bhigear.com/images/Handguard-Closeup.jpg


That looks just like the rail from Apex Machine.
Link Posted: 6/29/2010 5:18:27 PM EDT
DD Lite FTW !
Link Posted: 6/29/2010 6:53:32 PM EDT
What prevents the DD Lite and Omega from shifting under torque, besides friction and pressure? If I recall, the LaRue was designed with some means of countering rotation but my memory may be incorrect.
Link Posted: 6/29/2010 7:46:18 PM EDT

Originally Posted By CJFirefly:
Originally Posted By 308Sako:
Tubular with all the gripping surface you could want, and slightly narrower than most... With all the rail surface a squad could ever need. Blackheart International is what I run with.

http://www.bhigear.com/images/Handguard-Closeup.jpg


That looks just like the rail from Apex Machine.

It sure does, thanks for that bit of information


Link Posted: 6/30/2010 1:23:39 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 6/30/2010 1:24:29 AM EDT by metroplex]

Originally Posted By YoungPatriot:
What prevents the DD Lite and Omega from shifting under torque, besides friction and pressure? If I recall, the LaRue was designed with some means of countering rotation but my memory may be incorrect.

The set screws on the Omega/Omega X chew into the barrel nut at 4 spots. The DD Lite appears to clamp together on the barrel nut applying compression at the fore and aft of the nut.

If they gave a free barrel nut wrench and got the name "Daniel Defense" off the handguard (call it DD or something), I'd buy the DD Lite.
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