Hey guys, I'm a LEO down south here and my department is new to patrol rifles, so instead of buying them for us they allow us to roll our own. I've had my 6920 as my duty rifle for about 3 years now and I'm feeling the itch to modify it, the reason why is that I've had several instances now where I am holding it on a suspect or building for very prolonged periods of time and the weight (albeit minor) starts to effect my position. So the rifle has already been in two configurations, heres the first...



and here is how it is now...



I weighed it last night without a magazine and it comes in just under 9 pounds

So with the rifle getting up to about 5000 rounds (I know thats not a lot give me an excuse to spend money) and it being carbine gas I figured I could swap in a Noveske Light Barrel Link and slap on some lighter hand guards and save myself some weight, and thats where I was hoping to get some input from y'all. I personally prefer to have my irons available in the lower 1/3 and do not trust a rail mounted front sight, so thats a big part of what led me to the Noveske barrel, but that does limit what I can run as far as hand guards. At this time I'm leaning a lot on the new Magpul SL hand guards as they are simple enough and since the only accessory I need to mount is my light I think it will work out just fine but if you guys know of some voodoo magic hand guard I'm not considering I'd love to know about it.

So while I'm getting my parts list ready is there any particular bolt I should be considering to run in that barrel?

Next question is how much does this danged Troy Charlie rail weigh? I can't find any info on it's weight anywhere.

Last question is how much lighter will that Noveske barrel be compared to whats already on the rifle? Again I can't seem to find real numbers besides approximations.

Once I can get the nose of this pig lightened up a little bit and the front sight moved out I'm tossing the vert grip, but if anyone has any other ways I can save an ounce or two it would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks in advance guys,
-Clint

UPDATE:

I wanted to start by saying thank you to all the folks who gave their input here and helped me appreciate some realistic goals for this rifle as far as weight.

I did end up going with the Noveske barrel I linked before, and yes despite being labeled as "Light" it does not seem any lighter then the old Colt barrel . But I can already feel a greatly improved balance in the rifle and it is definitely faster onto target with less overshoot. I was originally playing with the idea of simply rebarreling my 6920, but building a new upper seemed like a better option when I thought about it, why have one when you can have two for twice the price right?!

The build ended up like this...
  Lower
Aero Gen 2 lower
BCM Enhanced LPK
Rainier Buffer Assembly
MOE Stock

  Upper
Aero assembled upper
Noveske N4 16" Midlength
Magpul SL Handguards
PSA "Premium" BCG and CH

...I never really did get an answer from anyone to tell me weather or not the barrel would be appreciably more accurate with a true Noveske bolt or not so I ended up tossing in my spare for now, if anyone can give me an answer as to whether or not I'd be better off like that or not I'd greatly appreciate it.

As for the setup I guess I was trying to build something halfway between my long gone but beloved M16A2 and a lighter functional patrol rifle. Somehow knowing I can snap my old bayonet onto this makes me happy (yes I have already cleared the house with the bayo affixed ). For the FSB and hand guards, I know its not the latest vogue but knowing the rifle is capable of taking a hard hit and me still being able to trust it is worth more then anything to me. Lord knows I go on patrol with a shamrock shoved up my ass but I'm overdue for my fair share of bad luck.

I got a case of 500 rounds of hot M193 to run through this for the weekend so that will be the gauntlet for it to take over for the Colt, if it makes me happy it will get to wear the sling and go for a ride. Wish me luck fellas, and thanks again for the input.
-Clint

That's the direction im taking it. I did have some specific questions in that sea of text though.

Swap the 6920 upper for a Colt 6720 upper (lightweight barrel). 30mm Aimpoint for a Micro. Play around with mounts, but I'm pretty sure the LaRue 660 is under 3 ounces. For a rear sight, KAC 300m Micro.  *IF* you want to stick with a FF rails, Geissele Mk8. It'll shave a touch of weight off the rail over the Mk4, and contribute to further weight savings if you use direct MLOK mounts for your light and forward grip (think about a handstop style it'll save weight & bulk over a gangster grip). You'll now need a flip up front site since you lose your FSB (get it shaved & retain the double taper pins, don't mess with after market low pro gas blocks), take a look at the knights, either the micro flip up or the mk18 flip up.

ETA: just saw the part about magpul SL handguards. On the right track bro

This. Lose the rail. In the grand scheme of things a rail is really only needed to so IR Lasers will hold zero.

IMO I would go back to the KAC RAS rail, keep the tango down stubby, add a surefire light, and then call it good. Basics on a patrol rifle. My dad had a 6920 with a eotech 553, surefire light, 2 point sling, and a car stock for his patrol rifle for years. Served him well.

KAC RAS, Aimpoint, Surefire, Sling, G2G

Up north.  

As someone else suggested, switch to the Colt AR6720 &/or Upper.

I agree with losing the rail and switching to a polymer hand guard of your choice. You can still mount your light and vertical grip. You can also consider a more minimalistic stock. I'm not sure how in love you are with your current optic but you could always go with a T1 or something really light, funds permitting.

I don't think I'd bother with a lighter barrel, BCG, etc. unless you're trying to get it really light.

OP, I'd absolutely get rid of the quad rail and maybe go an Aimpoint T2.  I say maybe because the rifle should be balanced with a lighter rail; overall weight by changing the optic is not as important as balance.

I'd leave it as-is, and start over with the goal of having a lighter rifle. No FSP, no BUIS, just a lightweight barrel, a free float lightweight mlok or keymod handguard, a T2 RDS, and a light. Ideally, I'd use a SBR, because that would take the most weight off, and you don't need long range, but I'm sure NFA applies for a personal gun.

You already have a lower, so what I'd do myself is just head over to palmettostatearmory.com and get a lightweight upper.

I agree with the quad rail. Those are extremely heavy.  I would ditch the fab and go to a 12.5-13.5 inch Midwest Industries mlok rail or a SLR Solo mlok rail. Both are under 10oz and very comfortable on the hand. The SLR Solo is very durable and has super smooth edges.  Your barrel and bcg of good so I wouldn't mess with them. Plus since it is a duty gun you know it works and it is guaranteed to work. As for another upgrade I think would be worth while is swapping the trigger if your agency allows it. Alg ACT trigger is great, or the Hyperfire EDT3 duty trigger. The Hyperfire has adjustable pull weights and is a great trigger for under 100.00.

Get an SSA or SSA-E trigger. the factory trigger sucks. it's more important than aftermarket stocks and rail clips and hang off the gun make it heavier shit


I get it, you don't trust non-fsb sights.. but the rest of the world does and is leaving you behind. time to accept modern technology
MK4, MK13, MK14 rail. Lo pro gas block included. that will shave significant weight off.

Grow stronger

Plus, you can hold someone at gunpoint and not be aimed in on them.  It's actually safer in many cases to be at the low ready.  Use cover...rest rifle on cover.

KAC RAS, Aimpoint, Streamlight, Sling, G2G

Chop 5.5 inches off the barrel...

...

...

That thing looks SO HEAVY! Losing the rail alone will be a game changer. Could always go with a smaller sight too, like a T1 or T2. Also, you could even consider a lightweight or just lighter barrel if you feel it wouldn't be a disadvantage for your uses.

There's a lot of good advice in here, but there is nothing wrong with just losing the rail for a magpul mlok hand guard and putting a light mount on it.  It's stupid simple and will lighten it up in a big way.

Eta: I just did the light mount on my 6920.

Attached File


And an mlok mount for the tape switch.

Attached File

Just letting you know that Noveske Light barrel won't be any lighter than your 6920 barrel.

This.  Not a LEO but I do have a BUNCH of SBR's and my 6933 is one of my favorites:



If I were to have to use it I have a Surefire in a Larue mount I'd toss on and that's it.  I've got plenty of other rifles with lots more heavy crap on them but I always gravitate back to this one and my early Mk18 clone (on the bottom):



Anymore I like them light and simple.

ETA - I'd suggest going back to the KAC or an MLOC and chopping the barrel.  11.5" is nice with no can, with a can 10.3" just to get it as short as possible but keep it reliable.

I agree. Much like this setup.

Attached File

Ditch the FSB and huge quad rail. Get a Geissele or similar rail; they'll come with everything needed to install. Ditch the irons. Get a lighter Aimpoint (T1 or T2). Can you SBR it? If so, do that and chop it down to 10.5. I would also replace the Inforce with a Surefire Mini Scout personally, especially on a rifle that you will depend on.

This.  Block 1 or check out the BHD thread in A2.  My 727 has a Surefire 660 with a tape switch on a SF barrel mount and a simple 2pt silent sling.  It's fairly light and simple, and it has a light for low/no light situations.

ETA: If you want to go really light, my early 723 w/ 14.5 pencil bbl and 604 upper weighs 7 lbs with a loaded surplus 30rd mag.

Here's my duty rifle. If looking to cut weight is your goal I would opt for a lighter rail and barrel or just buy a new upper if you're not into that. Sorry it's a shit picture.



And this is my backup rifle (firearms instructor so I qual with more than one rifle due to going to and teaching classes often) which is also a very handy set up. Similar to your first configuration.



I much prefer the top set up for duty use.

Colt CCU upper.

Lightweight barrel, KAC RAS, Tango Down stubby, T1/T2, Surefire Scout light.

Maybe add a magpul trigger guard too.  Makes it more comfortable on your knuckle, especially if you're holding the rifle with one hand while you're doing something else.

TL:DR

Get a MLOK handguard. 

Replace FSB with low profile gas block

Are you standing over your patrol car while holding down a suspect? If so, why not get a grip pod?

Honestly it doesn't matter how much weight you trim. If you're aiming it for a prolong time, anything will get heavy. Take for example a long hiking trip. Even 1 pound will get extremely heavy over time.

Also do you have a 1-point or 2-point sling? I recommend getting a 2 point sling with a converter. Reason why I say this is that 1 point is great when you're walking around, but it gets in the way when you're kneeling over or having to bend down. Such as arresting someone or giving first aid. So a 2 point will allow you to easily control your weapon and the situation. Just a thought.

Op, to keep it simple, reliable and lighten it up a bit here is what I suggest. Get a quality pencile barrel 14.5". Carbine gas will keep it more 6920 and save a little weight I do like mid length though but we are talking shaving weight on a duty rifle. Magpul MOE or SL handgaurds. Small light like a TLR-2. A small quality optic...MRO. BUIS. Lightens it up and still keeps it reliable and does not alter it much from factory. You could just build another upper or modify your currene setup. If your department allows you to have a SBR thats a new ball game.

Since you said you are planning to spend some money, I'd invest in a smaller red dot (Aimpoint Micro models come to mind). Then, I'd ditch those rails like a cheating spouse, along with the forward grip. I'd add a Magpul hand guard and a small rail section for the light, and call it good. If the rifle was still too heavy, I'd hit the gym. I've been in many instances like you describe over the course of many years and yes... A long gun gets heavy after a while. I think you could retain function while improving the weight situation, but it will always get heavy after a while.

Since you want to keep the FSB why not get a mid length or even a mock dissy that either has a light weight rail or cut off the retainer and put on one of the new Midwest Ind drop in free floats
BCM LW Middy with KMR


Or a bit cheaper
http://palmettostatearmory.com/psa-16-midlength-5-56-nato-1-7-melonite-freedom-upper-no-bcg-or-ch-507280.html


or a dissapator
http://palmettostatearmory.com/blem-psa-16-mid-length-5-56-nato-1-7-phosphate-dissipator-no-bcg-or-ch-516445156b.html



and then add one of these
https://www.midwestindustriesinc.com/MI-Gen2-Two-Piece-Free-Float-Handguard-Mid-Length-p/mi-21m.htm
https://www.midwestindustriesinc.com/product-p/mi-22m.htm

My department requires irons on all guns, so I couldn't get away with that setup

I know that rails and gas blocks are the new hotness, but I'm abusive with my guns at times and I can actually trust the reliability of the good old fashioned A-Tower FSB. I've actually thrown rifles this rifle off the top of a hill before to make a point to a couple AK guys back when it had the KAS rail. But having a thin lightweight rail on it now I can just see it getting crushed in the trunk of the car (our racks don't fit ARs ).

I had two very similar "oh shit" moments with this rifle recently that led me to want the change. Both were similar with me in cover behind a power pole holding the rifle on a home in one and on the suspect in the other. Both times I started to shake after a few minutes from trying to keep the sights on the target. The one with the suspect was a metal pole so that was no real help as I was already L-posting the rifle off my thumb and the pole, but my sweat was making my hand slide The other I ended up stabbing the rail into the wooden pole to try and get it to stick but it wouldn't. If I could've used low rest on those I would've loved too.

I'm reading that, but no one really has any specifics on the weight of the Noveske. But i'm hoping the balance is better.

I feel like you and I have very similar taste haha

I'm running a Vickers two point, love the hell out of it. My knees appreciate it too!

That rail may be a good option to look into if the department ever gives us mounts in the car that will hold an AR. For now it has to ride in my trunk and despite blocking out an area for it stuff always falls on it or slams into it, so i'm worried about denting a thinner hand guard.

MOLON posted the weight before and it's almost exactly the same, 1 lb 12 oz. The profile of Noveske Light barrel makes way more sense than the M4 barrel but your goal is losing weight, right? You'd save 5.5 oz just going to a 16" lightweight barrel and an additional 2 oz going to a 14.5" lightweight barrel.

I don't have a problem w a rail mounted front sight and I'm an LEO. Within your parameters I'd say 6720 upper cut down shorter if it can be an SBR. If not leave it at 16. Then the magpul slim handguard add your light and 2 point sling of choice. That will be a HUGE improvement. Change to a lighter optic if you want but it isn't as big of a deal since the weight is more rearward.

@pez as long as the weight is better balanced I can handle it, but I think losing the rail will be the best part. I really like the Noveske barrel for what it is, stout and well built, I think its going to be what I go to. If the carbine didn't bunch up my arms so darned badly I'd just slap a MOE hand guard on there and put the light on it, but as it is that moves my hand into a bad place for hitting the light and I don't want two grips. Mid length is definitely a sweet spot.

As far as the SBR option its just a lot of paperwork but it is possible, if I could have BOTH .

Honestly I'm just in a hurry because the way its setup now is just flat out wrong and I need a better option for the summer (which is already proving to be a wild one)

ADCO could shave that barrel down to pencil specs for a reasonable price. I would ditch the rails, use the magpul forearm, with a light mount. I would also maybe look at a lighter aimpoint mount.

yeah... you're not  going to crush a mk4 in the trunk of your car, unless you have a 20 ton press in there.
new hotness implicates new, and this technology is 20 years old now.

it sounds like you've already made your mind up, your goal isn't losing weight, it's justifying a 400$ barrel that weighs the same.

Yep. Doesn't sound to me he is really trying to drop weight just searching for an excuse to dump more money into his rifle.

If you really want to shave weight, skip the barrel. You don't need another barrel. The barrel that comes on the 6920 is good. Save that $400 and ditch the Aimpoint. Get a lighter sight. Either a T1, T2, or a Trijicon MRO. Ditch that rail. I would go with a Centurion Arms C4 7" rail. It is very light, is free floated and works with your factory barrel nut. I would swap out that light with a Surefire scout and an offset mount from Gear sector that will get your light higher and off the gun. When you are done your gun will look similar to mine below but will be lighter and better balanced. The balance of a rifle in more important than the weight IMO. You have a very front heavy rifle because of that rail and light combo. Swapping them out is going to make the biggest impact.

This saves me a lot of typing.

Honestly brother I went the same route 12-14 years ago, you may want to consider returning your colt to the almost stock condition you have in the first photo and keep your aim point & rear sight.

If you really want to modify a carbine, just get another rifle to modify and have fun with it.  for a duty weapon the less is better. You probably already know our chiefs & administrative types don't know crap about weapons on average. If you're unfortunate enough to ventilate a bad guy with your rifle remember it'll be on display in front of 12 people not smart enough to get out of jury duty. I wouldn't want mine looking like a Star Wars blaster.  

But times are good for buying a second rifle and mod it all you want, shoot some two gun matches or whatever.
If your close to Jackson or Corinth I'm teaching a carbine class in the next couple weeks. IM me if your interested.
I promise you'll be ready to ditch that rail.

These guys are offering some well meaning advice, but keep in mind we live in a different world now days.