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Posted: 9/25/2016 7:04:38 PM EDT
[#1]
I don't think ANYONE completely manufactures all the parts of an LPK in house. The best hammers have an "S" mark on them, and come from either L.W. Schneider or Schmid Tool.
Making roll pins isn't trivial, and making springs is a specialty in itself. Most companies that "make" lower parts outsource many such parts. What parts have you found to be "hit and miss"? |
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Posted: 9/25/2016 7:20:15 PM EDT
[#2]
I thought Daniel Defense made their own LPKs.
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Posted: 9/25/2016 7:35:03 PM EDT
[#3]
I get my LPK's at my local AR15 store that also manufactures Rogue Defense rifles. These rifles have a lifetime warranty so they don't sell junk that they would need to replace that would hurt their reputation. I've had zero issues, but keep in mind that most AR parts wear out and eventually need replacement.
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Posted: 9/25/2016 7:37:42 PM EDT
[#4]
I recall from years ago, Oly Arms made everything but springs and pins...that may have changed though.
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Posted: 9/25/2016 7:59:50 PM EDT
[#5]
Quoted: I'm in the market for some LPK's and my normal go-to brand is out of stock. I know that some of these LPK's are are hit and miss on quality, so I was hoping one of you could turn me on to some quality parts. (Bcm is out of stock). If you're allowed to post a link please do. The triggers aren't as important, but I'll probably use at least one mil-spec trigger. I'm trying to finish a few builds before the election. I have everything for 3 rifles except the LPK's and barrels. Thanks ?? I have a whole pile of rifles and all were built with random LPK's... the only thing hit or miss with them all were the triggers/hammers and the way they feel when assembled. I put 2 stage triggers in the rifles I needed better triggers in... the others I swapped triggers around till I got combos that felt better. You will have the same experience. |
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Posted: 9/25/2016 8:35:37 PM EDT
[#6]
I think kns does
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Posted: 9/25/2016 10:20:56 PM EDT
[#7]
I won't name brands in case they are board sponsors, but I've had more than one kit missing parts. Most commonly I've had selectors that were not smooth - I know that's easy to replace.
Anyway, I've tried to research who actually makes these things without luck. L.W.S. are in the Colt kits, correct? Since I plan on keeping at least one mil-spec trigger, I'm hoping to buy it right the first time. ALG, LMT, and other reputable companies are selling LPK's. It's the matter of how much of a premium I want to pay for a certain brand I suppose. Most of my first choices of LPK's are all out-of-stock. Appreciate the responses. |
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Posted: 9/26/2016 2:39:13 AM EDT
[#8]
DS Arms I believe makes their own LPKs except for some springs.
It's hard to screw up the small parts, you could always just piece together your own LPK. |
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Posted: 9/26/2016 2:46:06 AM EDT
[#9]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I thought Daniel Defense made their own LPKs. They do. |
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Posted: 9/26/2016 7:37:54 AM EDT
[#10]
stag is my go to for over a decade
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Posted: 9/26/2016 7:42:30 AM EDT
[#11]
CMMG sells a nice lpk without the trigger group. All the components can be seen through the packaging.
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Posted: 9/26/2016 9:54:16 AM EDT
[#12]
I've read that LMT makes their own LPKs. They're expensive, but you get quality parts for the price.
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Posted: 9/26/2016 3:09:56 PM EDT
[#13]
Spike's Tactical DEFINITELY manufactures some of their lower parts kits. The parts used in their Enhanced Battle Trigger system are proprietary.
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Posted: 9/26/2016 4:26:01 PM EDT
[#14]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
They do. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
I thought Daniel Defense made their own LPKs. They do. No way. They MAY finish their Hammers and Triggers. But, I guarantee you they are not coiling springs and making roll pins. That's not efficient. DD only manufactured 16k rifles in 2014 compared to Colt's 60K (ATF 2014 MFG Report). If Colt still finds it beneficial to outsource at that volume, then it certainly makes more since for DD to do the same at a substantially lower volume. Economies of scale and all. I don't get why so many put such emphasis on who machined what part. If you buy from a reputable company it doesn't matter who machined it. Something being machined "in-house" does not make it better than something machined by a third party OEM who has an infinite amount of experience machining on their multi-million dollars worth of equipment. |
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Posted: 9/26/2016 4:32:53 PM EDT
[#15]
I really don't care who makes them as long as they are in spec, Chinese monkeys can make then as long as they fit my lower and function correctly.
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Posted: 9/26/2016 5:20:56 PM EDT
[#16]
X2
I have used many different ones & they all function just fine. I never had any issues. But I will say nothing I have used feels as good as the LMT complete lower I have. |
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Posted: 9/26/2016 6:06:51 PM EDT
[#17]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
No way. They MAY finish their Hammers and Triggers. But, I guarantee you they are not coiling springs and making roll pins. That's not efficient. DD only manufactured 16k rifles in 2014 compared to Colt's 60K (ATF 2014 MFG Report). If Colt still finds it beneficial to outsource at that volume, then it certainly makes more since for DD to do the same at a substantially lower volume. Economies of scale and all. I don't get why so many put such emphasis on who machined what part. If you buy from a reputable company it doesn't matter who machined it. Something being machined "in-house" does not make it better than something machined by a third party OEM who has an infinite amount of experience machining on their multi-million dollars worth of equipment. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
I thought Daniel Defense made their own LPKs. They do. No way. They MAY finish their Hammers and Triggers. But, I guarantee you they are not coiling springs and making roll pins. That's not efficient. DD only manufactured 16k rifles in 2014 compared to Colt's 60K (ATF 2014 MFG Report). If Colt still finds it beneficial to outsource at that volume, then it certainly makes more since for DD to do the same at a substantially lower volume. Economies of scale and all. I don't get why so many put such emphasis on who machined what part. If you buy from a reputable company it doesn't matter who machined it. Something being machined "in-house" does not make it better than something machined by a third party OEM who has an infinite amount of experience machining on their multi-million dollars worth of equipment. I don't know what to tell you. All I know is that DD themselves will tell you that they make their LPKs in house. Whether that matters to someone or not, that's up to them. |
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Posted: 9/26/2016 6:26:25 PM EDT
[#18]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Spike's Tactical DEFINITELY manufactures some of their lower parts kits. The parts used in their Enhanced Battle Trigger system are proprietary. I could be wrong, but I didn't think Spikes made anything in house, it's all out sources. |
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Posted: 9/27/2016 12:53:43 PM EDT
[#19]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I don't know what to tell you. All I know is that DD themselves will tell you that they make their LPKs in house. Whether that matters to someone or not, that's up to them. Below is a picture of the DD lower parts kits from their website. You can clearly see the "boxed S" cast mark on their hammer (found in many an LPK from various suppliers), as well as the Magpul logo on their trigger guard. One can ascertain that since they are not casting their hammer (they may finish them), they are likely not winding springs, stamping disconnects or making detents. They like everyone else take advantage of economies of scale and contract that out. Again, not a bad thing and definitely not knocking DD for it. If anything it's the smart move to contract it out to companies who specialize in such things. No One makes everything in house. 
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Posted: 9/27/2016 1:51:01 PM EDT
[#20]
Quoted:
I'm in the market for some LPK's and my normal go-to brand is out of stock. I know that some of these LPK's are are hit and miss on quality, so I was hoping one of you could turn me on to some quality parts. (Bcm is out of stock). If you're allowed to post a link please do. The triggers aren't as important, but I'll probably use at least one mil-spec trigger. I'm trying to finish a few builds before the election. I have everything for 3 rifles except the LPK's and barrels. Thanks ?? Nobody will be manufacturing everything. The roll/spring pins will come from a pin manufacturer. Springs will come from a spring manufacturer. The quality of the hammer, trigger and bolt catch will depend on who the casting house is as well as who does the final machine work. And, I seriously doubt anybody other that a dedicated solid pin manufacturer would invest in a pin cutter to make detents and the like, the volume of production would make it unwise. |
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Posted: 9/27/2016 2:11:48 PM EDT
[#21]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Below is a picture of the DD lower parts kits from their website. You can clearly see the "boxed S" cast mark on their hammer (found in many an LPK from various suppliers), as well as the Magpul logo on their trigger guard. One can ascertain that since they are not casting their hammer (they may finish them), they are likely not winding springs, stamping disconnects or making detents. They like everyone else take advantage of economies of scale and contract that out. Again, not a bad thing and definitely not knocking DD for it. If anything it's the smart move to contract it out to companies who specialize in such things. No One makes everything in house. https://danieldefense.com/media/catalog/product/cache/1/image/0dc2d03fe217f8c83829496872af24a0/s/m/smallpartskit.jpg Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
I don't know what to tell you. All I know is that DD themselves will tell you that they make their LPKs in house. Whether that matters to someone or not, that's up to them. Below is a picture of the DD lower parts kits from their website. You can clearly see the "boxed S" cast mark on their hammer (found in many an LPK from various suppliers), as well as the Magpul logo on their trigger guard. One can ascertain that since they are not casting their hammer (they may finish them), they are likely not winding springs, stamping disconnects or making detents. They like everyone else take advantage of economies of scale and contract that out. Again, not a bad thing and definitely not knocking DD for it. If anything it's the smart move to contract it out to companies who specialize in such things. No One makes everything in house. https://danieldefense.com/media/catalog/product/cache/1/image/0dc2d03fe217f8c83829496872af24a0/s/m/smallpartskit.jpg The last time I spoke with someone at DD over the phone about this topic in particular (around 2 years ago now), I was told that they now make about 99 percent of everything in house. This was around the time they had somewhat recently released their new grips and stocks...which they make in house as well. I was told the only parts they source were the Magpul trigger guards (which only go in their LPKs, and are no longer on their lowers/complete rifles due to the integrated trigger guard on their newer grip), and some screws they use. Once again, this is what I was told directly from DD. And they have told far more than just me that they make essentially everything in house. Personally, they're about as standup as a company gets, and I'll take their word for it. |
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Posted: 9/27/2016 2:36:30 PM EDT
[#22]
Ive noticed Bcm has a star on alot of their lower parts. I've also noticed a difference in quality of Bcm to other lpks.
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Posted: 9/27/2016 2:56:11 PM EDT
[#23]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I don't know what to tell you. All I know is that DD themselves will tell you that they make their LPKs in house. Whether that matters to someone or not, that's up to them. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: I thought Daniel Defense made their own LPKs. They do. No way. They MAY finish their Hammers and Triggers. But, I guarantee you they are not coiling springs and making roll pins. That's not efficient. DD only manufactured 16k rifles in 2014 compared to Colt's 60K (ATF 2014 MFG Report). If Colt still finds it beneficial to outsource at that volume, then it certainly makes more since for DD to do the same at a substantially lower volume. Economies of scale and all. I don't get why so many put such emphasis on who machined what part. If you buy from a reputable company it doesn't matter who machined it. Something being machined "in-house" does not make it better than something machined by a third party OEM who has an infinite amount of experience machining on their multi-million dollars worth of equipment. I don't know what to tell you. All I know is that DD themselves will tell you that they make their LPKs in house. Whether that matters to someone or not, that's up to them. My ALG QMS trigger and hammer have the exact same markings. My BCM PNT trigger is S marked, but it has a star on it as well. My LMT trigger is also S marked. |
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Posted: 9/27/2016 2:59:30 PM EDT
[#24]
ALG.
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Posted: 9/27/2016 6:28:12 PM EDT
[#25]
Armalite is the only one with a fully serrated bolt catch. Not sure what else is their own.
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Posted: 9/27/2016 8:26:09 PM EDT
[#26]
I would find an LPK with an ALG trigger, for milspec they are well made and smooth.
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Posted: 9/28/2016 2:16:27 AM EDT
[#27]
Try KAK.
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Posted: 9/28/2016 7:22:52 AM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I thought Daniel Defense made their own LPKs. I believe Daniel Defense has said they not have the capability of manufacturing 98% of their own parts, I am guessing everything but springs). Some parts they surely still outsource as it is more efficient OP, try grabbing a BCM kit from one of their retailers as opposed to them direct (Brownells etc) if that is what your really want, and I don't blame you it is a superior kit. |
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Posted: 9/28/2016 7:41:30 AM EDT
[#29]
Doesn't Armalite make they're own LPKs?
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Posted: 9/28/2016 9:01:56 AM EDT
[#30]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
OP, try grabbing a BCM kit from one of their retailers as opposed to them direct (Brownells etc) if that is what your really want, and I don't blame you it is a superior kit. Good luck. I've been looking all over the place and it seems as thought they are not in stock anywhere and have not been for quite a while. I'm anxiously awaiting their availability as I think are numerous others. |
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Posted: 9/28/2016 8:27:36 PM EDT
[#31]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Try KAK. That's a good catch. They state that their kits "feature KAK produced parts throughout." Including their own springs, apparently. Nice price, too. |
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Posted: 9/28/2016 8:43:54 PM EDT
[#32]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
No way. They MAY finish their Hammers and Triggers. But, I guarantee you they are not coiling springs and making roll pins. That's not efficient. DD only manufactured 16k rifles in 2014 compared to Colt's 60K (ATF 2014 MFG Report). If Colt still finds it beneficial to outsource at that volume, then it certainly makes more since for DD to do the same at a substantially lower volume. Economies of scale and all. I don't get why so many put such emphasis on who machined what part. If you buy from a reputable company it doesn't matter who machined it. Something being machined "in-house" does not make it better than something machined by a third party OEM who has an infinite amount of experience machining on their multi-million dollars worth of equipment. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
I thought Daniel Defense made their own LPKs. They do. No way. They MAY finish their Hammers and Triggers. But, I guarantee you they are not coiling springs and making roll pins. That's not efficient. DD only manufactured 16k rifles in 2014 compared to Colt's 60K (ATF 2014 MFG Report). If Colt still finds it beneficial to outsource at that volume, then it certainly makes more since for DD to do the same at a substantially lower volume. Economies of scale and all. I don't get why so many put such emphasis on who machined what part. If you buy from a reputable company it doesn't matter who machined it. Something being machined "in-house" does not make it better than something machined by a third party OEM who has an infinite amount of experience machining on their multi-million dollars worth of equipment. Maybe that's why DD only produced 16K vs 60K... |
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Posted: 9/28/2016 9:18:00 PM EDT
[#33]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Spike's Tactical DEFINITELY manufactures some of their lower parts kits. The parts used in their Enhanced Battle Trigger system are proprietary. Still S marked. I've put in a few hundred to know... |
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Posted: 9/29/2016 12:21:51 AM EDT
[#34]
LMT makes their own parts in house, and for other companies as well.
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