There is something very very right about this type of gun.  I'm glad someone started the thread and that we got some people building them to look at.  

I think if I had to only have two AR's one would be a 723 and the other would be one of these.  Although I wouldn't care if it had the fold down front sight or not.  I'm sure it might help avoid that little bit of fuzziness on low power though.


I bet these are a hoot to shoot.

Anyone have a lead on a KAC flip up front sight gas block? I know they're unicorns, but thought I'd ask..

If I did I would buy it

I let one go on ebay a month or so ago

I learned not to do that anymore.



 

The ARMS 41-B (although not 100% authentic) is a functional, pin-able alternative.

I've been working on my SAM-R for the last several months and stumbled onto this thread, thanks for creating it! Glad there's one (not the DMR, RECCE, MK12, Etc)

That depends on your definition of "alternative".



 

Operation Parts had them but they are out of stock now. That's where I got mine a few years back
http://www.operationparts.com/kac-knights-armament-locking-front-folding-sight-fits-sr15-sr16-m16-ar-15-with-0-750-inch-barrel/

Here's my SAM-R build:

Alright Junk, I apologize for the quality, but it was still rainin' at the time.        



And I'm glad you showed up jcrowl. I've been waiting to see that blue couch make an appearance.
 

Out of spec. Wrong flash hider

 

I noticed the FH a few pages back but didn't know what was wrong with it.  So yeah, what's up with the grooves in that thing?  

Beautiful rifle though.

Jcrowl, blue couch FTW!!!!!!  Nice rifle too.  Is this a newer build?

 
KAC NT4 comp

I'll make up for it one of these days by hanging an NT4 off it.





Got the wrong trigger in it too.



 

No,,I actually first put it together in 2007 using Larue rails. Upgraded it with the KAC gas block and KAC rails about 4 years ago

What barrel are you runnin'?





She got a little wet yesterday. Stayed drier than my feet though.



 

Thank you so much!  She looks incredible!  this is exactly the motivation I needed to get off my ass and start a SAM-R.  Sorry that you got wet, but it was so worth it, to me  

Also, I love the close-up of the Noveske Lower.  I used one for my MK12 Mod 0 Build, and have another for my mod 1 build that is still waiting patiently in the safe.

You always take such great pics.  I appreciate it.

Junkyard

My pleasure. My Merrell's got washed for free, so it all worked out.



It also helped me discover that I need a sling ASAP, 'cause carryin' that bad boy through the woods wasn't easy.



 

I can relate.  I sewed a vtac type sling directly to a fixed mount last year on the Mod 0. Cut it off the first week of the season and carried it the rest of the year.  

The easiest way I found to carry it was to hook the magazine through the hip belt on my backpack, and wrap my right hand around the rail to grab the pod-loc.





And that still sucked.
 

Did you try where you rest the receiver on your right shoulder sidweways and grab a hold of the barrel with your right hand?  Of vice verse with the buttstock forward.

Stop being a sissy and right shoulder arms that thing

Bonus points for carrying throught the woods at Port or Present Arms the whole time.

You underestimate the weight of this thing.



This ain't no A4, homie.



 

I agree, the SAM-R is no light weight. Does anyone know how it compares to a Mk12? With and w/o suppressor?

William

Another alternative to those wanting a SAM-R but can't find the KAC FSGB is the Wilcon Combat FUFS which is also no longer in production but easier to find and VERY SIMILAR.

If anyone is building a SAM-R and wants one of these to sub for the KAC PM me

How could one build a SAM-R with a non KAC FSGB?

I don't think I could live with the clone incorrectness.
Definitely does look similar though.

If you did, I'd kill you myself.    




 

When I first put my SAM-R together, I used a PRI gas block.sight..didn't look too bad...later replaced it with the KAC
http://www.midwayusa.com/product/2367431442/pri-gas-block-with-flip-up-front-sight-bolt-on-mount-ar-15-lr-308-steel-matte

Yeah my head would explode with so much force little pieces would go into low orbit...they one of those little pieces would re-enter the earth's atmosphere, find you and hit you in the face.....yes that's how strongly I feel about it. When I was doing some research and looking through the old SAM-R/SDMR threads and saw some of the builds people were trying to pass off it almost sent my cloning ass into orbit with fucking Mars

 

this is fitting for the convo I'm having in Mk18 right now.

Clone incorrectness can be a real bitch. I'd honestly rather have no SAM-R than a "SAM-R" with the wrong gas block. (Probably THE single most stand-out part on the gun)

No offense matty. I don't blame you if you do at all, my OCD would just pillage me.

This showed up in the mail today. And so the journey begins, my host rifle is going to be RRA NM A4. Going to swap the BCG out for a parkerized unit and the trigger will be replaced with an SSA-E. Now I just need to patiently wait for KAC to make some more rails!

Couldn't a guy just forget the folding front sight, use FSB and call it an SDM-R?    Why does everyone flock to the marine build?  The FSB doesn't really get in the way too much, especially on higher magnification.

Glad to see you got one!

Now that I think about it, there really is only one use for the one that I have....would be a shame to waste it on some Frankenbuild.

It's hard enough trying to track down one KAC FF RAS, now I need two.

I'm thinking a Colt AR15A4 would be the tits base for this build.

No. There's more to it than that.



Different barrel, rail, and optics.



 

Yeah it took searching but thanks to a super cool member on here I ended up with one!

It's cool to see that KAC didn't install the e-clip on the same side on all of these.





 

Pieced together some leftovers for a temporary sling setup.

I was going to build another one up after seeing the builds here (mine was taken it apart almost 10 years ago, never shot it after i built it).  I have no idea how GaTacomma found the one and only picture I took of mine way back when, but I'm glad it's found a good home and not sitting in my parts bin

For those building 20" SPR rifles...

http://ballisticadvantage.com/20-inch-223-wylde-dmr-rifle-length-ss-premium-barrel.html

$171 shipped with coupon 'save10now'

The SAM-R was the outgrowth of the DMR when it was determined the M14 based DMRs were problematic;  The DMR was the result of need identified by Marine Security Force Regiment after training with the Israelis.  The IDF's use their DMRs similar to the Soviet army.

Yes you can..... See Me on Page 4 of this thread.
cp

yeah, that's what I'm talking bout.  Nice rifle.

I never got the impression the SAM-R was trying to be a .308, it was used in conjunction with the DMR's, it was really only meant to be a 500yd weapon system. Now would a .308 be better at that range, of course, but it worked great while we had them.

Now for something that really makes no sense, why is the SAM-R with a 20" barrel a marksman rifle but the Mk12 with a 18" considered a sniper rifle? Hell the real difference between the Mod 1 and the SAM-R is the barrel and of course suppressor compatibility, and the trigger. I believe that really had to do with who developed the systems and their purpose, but I'd think 2" would have a slight advantage right?

William

It is not a matter of impression but why the weapons were field to the Marine Corps.  The origin of the DMR  was based training with the IDF were "squads from the Israeli Defense Force school of infantry were observed using a "support cell" to support the maneuver of assault elements during deliberate attacks.  The "cell" consisted (in part) of a one-man 60 mm mortar system, automatic rifleman and a precision rifleman equipped with an M16-type rifle with a magnifying optic and bipod.  During the attack this "cell" occupied an over-watch position; from this, the precision rifleman demonstrated the ability to destroy priority targets on the objective while the assault element closed to destroy.  Priority targets (represented by colored balloons) were positioned in and around a vehicle hulk approximately 300 yards down range.  As per the order, the colors of these balloons corresponded to notional officers and crew-served weapons personnel.  During the conduct of the attack, this rifleman was able to destroy these priority targets while riflemen next to him, though in range, were incapable of identifying or distinguishing between the targets."

This resulted in a Fleet Need Statement by II MEF to field a rifle to equip designated marksmen; " The DM was to be a member of the rifle squad who could be called upon for a multitude of missions. These mission could be anything from removing a problem facing a squad in a high intensity environment, assisting the Squad Leader in adjusting supporting arms, to surgically removing the bad guy on an urban patrol or at a feeding station  during MOOTW."  To meet this requirement they needed a semi-automatic rifle that had at least semi-precision capability (2 MOA or better) from 300-600 meters with an optic that could provide positive ID  (PID) to at least 600 ms.  Testing done with ACOGs and the scope to eventually equip the SAM were that the ACOG could provide PID to approx 350 ms and the TS-30 A1 could provide PID to 700 ms

The reason it was determined shit can the DMR and move to the SAM were:
"The DMR is a good weapon, but it is a dinosaur whose time has come and gone. I was one of the biggest proponents of the DMR, until I started testing the SAM. Hands down, the SAM beats the DMR in accuracy, maintainability, weight, reduced signature, reduced recoil (ability to re-engage faster), and ease of use.   Our battalion has had the DMR since 1992 and all agree it is a maintenance nightmare. At least one DMR "goes down" per DM School for one reason or other. The cycling action on an M-14 is fairly violent and leads to receiver damage or scope mount movement over time."
And
"Without a doubt the M16 series of rifles has proven itself to be that rifle. Not only for the sake of commonality with the ease of training, logistics and maintenance, but because it can still outshoot its shooter! I have heard the argument on lethality, or the lack there of, of the 5.56 ball round until I am sick! For every war story about an enemy soldier not being effected by the impact of the 5.56 round there is a matching one about the 7.62. The only difference is the age and size of the beer gut of the storyteller. "

The SAM-Rs being custom built guns by Quantico was not sustainable with the other requirements Quantico had without either adding staff or putting it as a higher priority than other projects (at the time of production, if parts were available they could produce 15 a week, but there were times when manufactures were not able to provide parts).  After the 100 SAM-Rs were delivered to II MEF in April 2003, there were no more guns made. In late 2006 I MEF submitted a Urgent Need Statement for a semi-precision capability which lead to the acquisition of 400 Mk12s.  

You would have to ask someone at NSWC Crane the intent behind the Mk12 when it was originally fielded, as fielded by the Marines it was to fill the squad marksmen requirement.

Yeah, I was gonna say I watched this documentary on Netflix that was about some Marines in Afghanistan and they had a Mk12 Mod1, if I'm not mistaken.  I think I remember the ops inc collar and maybe it had a can on it.  I forget now.  But they were using it more as a DMR.  In fact in that particular documentary, most of the shooting was done with the 240 and the DMR.  There was not a lot of shooting in that particular documentary.  I forget what the name of it was.

So....  a Mk12 doesn't necessarily have to be viewed a "sniper rifle".


RON, who are you quoting in your post about the SAM there?....  And furthermore....  he's making reference to a "DMR"...  I'm assuming that was basically the A4 with an ACOG....  Eh?  We don't really hear much in here about cloning the first "DMR" type rifles.  But I do remember reading an article in SOF early in the GWOT where they were talking about a DM rifle that was basically an A4 with an ACOG and it being capable out to 900 meters.  I remember it specifically talking about the stadia lines in the ACOG making it affective.  I'm guessing it was just the TA01NSN.....  I don't think it had a FF rail either.......

The people quoted are the gunners who worked the program(s) and got the DMR, SAM-R and Mk12 adopted

The DMR was a PWS built M14.  It was the original squad rifle for a small part of the Marine Corps; it only got fielded to Marine Corps Security Forces (FAST and strat weapons security), base SRTs and EOD.  It made its way to the operating forces when 4th MEB stood up and adopted MCSF Regiment (was a BN back than) and later when 5.56 guns replaced the DMRs they were used to fill shortages in their EMR upgraded format

Oh duh, yeah, the M14....  I actually figured that out before I asked you and then forgot.  But do you remember a more simple version of the 5.56 DMR, or was that Army?   Or neither......  I'm not sure I wanna go digging in my basement for the SOF mag article.  It's buried.  LOL.  

For a short period of time the Army field AMU built SDM rifles, that were accuratized free floated A4s with ACOGs on them.  For similar reasons to why the SAM-R did not become a program of record the Army abandoned those guns and went to M14 based EBRs.

Following OIF 1, many people referred to the M16A4 modular weapon system with an ACOG as the "West Coast SAM-R"   I MEF units never got SAM-Rs and pressed A4s into the role.  In comparison to what was being issued at the time, A2s without optics, the optically equipped A4 was a leap ahead in capability, even have made hits on Iraqis in the 700 meter range.  However, there officially was never a "West Coast SAM-R" and with the decision to field RCOs across the board, the capability gap to provide accurate PID and fires from 300-600 still existed because  of the limitation of the 4X RCO and the non-free floating A4 MWS generally showed a 2.9 MOA capability.