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Posted: 1/22/2015 1:42:49 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 4/18/2016 8:24:23 AM EDT by Muad]
Saw this while visiting their booth. They are dubbing it the BFS (Binary Firing System). It's currently awaiting BATFE approval. The concept sounds interesting. In the third position, it fires a round when the trigger is pulled, then another when it is released forward to reset. No claimed cyclic rates or anything, and that's all the details I have right now.



What say ye?

Update 12/27/2015:

BFS FAQ and technical summary:

Will the BFS work with 9mm uppers?
Yes, though given the amount of mass in the bolt and buffer some tuning to the rifle may be required. But it has been done by at least 1 Arfcommer in this thread.

Will the BFS work with my .22 kit/upper?
Yes, but it requires permanent modification to your .22 bolt, as it's factory configuration cocks the hammer too far, and actuates the backup disconnector.

Why does the rifle need tuning, doesn't the trigger work? Should I wait for bugs to be worked out?
There are no bugs in the trigger. The trigger works exactly as advertised. However, because it operates independently of the bolt carrier, your finger and outrun your gun. Our testing so far has shown that a total reciprocating mass of approximately 11 oz allows the rifle to operate at a cyclic rate high enough to prevent out running the gun. Franklin Armory has also suggested opening the gas port as an alternative to using lightweight carriers or buffers.

If lighter is better, why not take all the weights out of the buffer?
Reducing buffer weight to the extreme allows the bolt carrier to bounce too far when going into battery, resulting in light strikes.

What is a backup disconnector? How does it work? Why can't I "ride the reset" and get this thing to work?

Watch this for an explanation

There are 2 types of malfunctions that can occur when using the trigger. Inadvertent actuation of the backup disconnector is one. That is also the easiest to prevent. You simply need to make sure that on the pull stroke, you pull the trigger past the point of releasing the hammer, and take up all of the over travel. This moves the backup disconnector out of the path of the hammer. The second malfunction is a light primer strike, caused by hammer follow or bolt bounce. This occurs when your rifle is not capable of the same cyclic rate as your finger, or because your carrier bounces too far when going into battery. To speed up your rifle, you have 3 options: enlarge your gas port, reduce the mass of the system with lightweight components, or use a heavier buffer spring, or a combination of all three. Currently it appears 11 oz total mass for BCG and buffer works well with a normal gas configuration.

What about the possibility of a 0-45-90 selector?
Given the amount of material being removed to house multiple disconnectors, FA has stated this is not possible to do.

What lowers will this fit?
The trigger housing is machined to a maximum material condition meaning that slight variations in the lower on the small side will cause issues with fit. There are a wild variety of lowers this trigger drops right into, and some it does not, some even from the same manufacturer. I think to say "because it fit mine it will fit yours" is foolhardy. Generally, a minor amount of material removal from either the FCG pocket of your lower or the trigger housing is all that will be required to get fitment. In some cases, shimming of the trigger housing in a loose fitting lower is recommended by FA. The trigger housing is 0.681-0.682 wide. Most lowers have 0.685 wide pockets, however a slight taper to the pocket can cause binding.

What do you need to help prevent hammer follow ?
In most cases, running a lightweight carrier with carbine buffer and a SpringCo Red or Orange extra power buffer spring will give you a pretty reliable setup. Most have seen great success with this combination.




Videos posted from ARFCOMMERS using the BFS:

http://youtu.be/1hKUZBd8npo

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vMp3PC0diwI&feature=youtu.be

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m-XbcP6AbD0

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eP-bygySVlY

http://vid199.photobucket.com/albums/aa46/muad_dib1982/IMG_3953_zps7m7sr1dj.mp4

http://vid788.photobucket.com/albums/yy166/jimmys120/FC3EF678-A038-4E4F-AF48-FA3BBEEC31B7_zpsy35lxpie.mp4

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JQNUGR0QAdU

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ipiGtsZUxko

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TQV15-wmrBY


http://vid261.photobucket.com/albums/ii65/turtlesniper/Mobile%20Uploads/trim.3D404ABB-7ABA-4AAA-964E-0BD9C72F0BD0.mp4

http://vid261.photobucket.com/albums/ii65/turtlesniper/Mobile%20Uploads/trim.0DDDE443-FABB-4DB9-91F5-4CDA354790E8.mp4

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WcOciQ9IXvo&feature=youtu.be

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TFiD8I3JP_s

https://youtu.be/h-9VoW7DEYg

https://youtu.be/Gftg8t3ltDw



https://youtu.be/NaumdeRsQns

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=emNr5PmagDc





BFS maintenance guide:

IF YOU HAVEN'T YET, GREASE THIS CAM FOLLOWER PIN



Link Posted: 1/22/2015 1:45:40 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Muad:
Saw this while visiting their booth. They are dubbing it the BFS (Binary Firing System). It's currently awaiting BATFE approval. The concept sounds interesting. In the third position, it fires a round when the trigger is pulled, then another when it is released forward to reset. No claimed cyclic rates or anything, and that's all the details I have right now.

http://ar15hunter.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/01/Franklin-Armory-BFS-trigger-1.jpg

What say ye?


View Quote

Ye say id like to try one out. I feel like there would be some major getting used to with it firing on pull and release, but should be twice the ROF as semi so i'll give one a whirl if theyre affordable
Link Posted: 1/22/2015 1:54:43 AM EDT
Cool concept....my prediction...If the second shot is fired by releasing the trigger from the first pull, this will die a quick death at the tech branch.

Wes
Link Posted: 1/22/2015 1:59:03 AM EDT
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Wangstang:
Cool concept....my prediction...If the second shot is fired by releasing the trigger from the first pull, this will die a quick death at the tech branch.

Wes
View Quote

This is what I was thinking. However, their engineer said something about another firearm that had a similar design that was approved. Something on a M14 or Mini 14. It was loud, and I didn't hear him clearly, and I am not familiar with what he was referring to.
Link Posted: 1/22/2015 5:29:16 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/22/2015 8:08:31 AM EDT by HighpowerRifleBrony]
*fires more than one shot per trigger pull*

"Hurrdurr, isa masheengun!"




I doubt it gets approved.
Link Posted: 1/22/2015 6:32:02 AM EDT
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Wangstang:
Cool concept....my prediction...If the second shot is fired by releasing the trigger from the first pull, this will die a quick death at the tech branch.

Wes
View Quote


That would be my guess as well.

I actually had it happen to me with my SP1 ~35 yrs ago. The gun started shooting "funny." After about the third shot I started holding the trigger back until recoil was all done. BAM!! As I released it. So I tried it a couple more times and the decided I'd better find out what was wrong before I went to jail. It was either the hammer pin or the trigger pin had worked it's way out of the side of the receiver. Pushed it back in and was good to go again.
Link Posted: 1/22/2015 6:42:31 AM EDT
The law states "one shot per function of the trigger", the pull is one function and the release is another function. Most likely this will get approved.
Link Posted: 1/22/2015 6:46:46 AM EDT
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By coltshorty14:
The law states "one shot per function of the trigger", the pull is one function and the release is another function. Most likely this will get approved.
View Quote


This, we had a thread about this very trigger (or one very similar to it) a while back. Statutes/Laws were posted as well as previous ATF opinions. This thing will most likely get approved.
Link Posted: 1/22/2015 7:04:52 AM EDT
Training and muscle memory what it is, this sounds dangerous as all h*ll. Releasing a trigger to fire off a round ? What could go wrong ?

If I want a fast trigger I'll get an S3G or similar.
Link Posted: 1/22/2015 7:31:42 AM EDT
Damn that's fast.




Link Posted: 1/22/2015 8:23:34 AM EDT
my old paintball gun could do this. With a double trigger, it was pretty fast. this aint gonna pass.
Link Posted: 1/22/2015 8:48:00 AM EDT
Here is the letter on the mini-14 trigger. I posted up how you could modify a 3rd burst trigger group to do this in the last thread. It looks like they have made some improvements over the basic design I had.

Link Posted: 1/22/2015 8:55:19 AM EDT
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Kinganuthin:
my old paintball gun could do this. With a double trigger, it was pretty fast. this aint gonna pass.
View Quote




Link Posted: 1/22/2015 9:18:40 AM EDT
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By coltshorty14:
The law states "one shot per function of the trigger", the pull is one function and the release is another function. Most likely this will get approved.
View Quote



+1

I believe there is a FCG like this in use, don't remember for what firearm.
Link Posted: 1/22/2015 9:27:33 AM EDT
something like this was posted here a while ago and somebody about trap/skeet guns using this kind of set up iirc
Link Posted: 1/22/2015 9:30:16 AM EDT
Staple in a Mini, wut?

I won't get one, even if it was approved, simply because I can't afford to burn ammo 2x as fast.

I can kinda see the appeal, though.
Link Posted: 1/22/2015 9:38:13 AM EDT
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Mr_Smiley:
Damn that's fast.

http://youtu.be/AtuZfONeqbM


View Quote


If there is a ruling/approval I'm sure the ATF will get so many follow up letters that they will reverse their ruling just like shouldering the sig brace. BTW, someone should tell the guy in the video it isn't a good idea to record and post any illegal/felonious activity such as shouldering a sig brace.
Link Posted: 1/22/2015 9:42:14 AM EDT
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By meijerclassics:


If there is a ruling/approval I'm sure the ATF will get so many follow up letters that they will reverse their ruling just like shouldering the sig brace. BTW, someone should tell the guy in the video it isn't a good idea to record and post any illegal/felonious activity such as shouldering a sig brace.
View Quote View All Quotes
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Originally Posted By meijerclassics:
Originally Posted By Mr_Smiley:
Damn that's fast.

http://youtu.be/AtuZfONeqbM




If there is a ruling/approval I'm sure the ATF will get so many follow up letters that they will reverse their ruling just like shouldering the sig brace. BTW, someone should tell the guy in the video it isn't a good idea to record and post any illegal/felonious activity such as shouldering a sig brace.


Video answered my one question about being able to decline the fire on release after pulling the trigger. I'm glad to see that you can.

If it's approved I'll buy one.
Link Posted: 1/22/2015 9:53:18 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/22/2015 9:55:35 AM EDT by Roadblock]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By jaqufrost:
Here is the letter on the mini-14 trigger. I posted up how you could modify a 3rd burst trigger group to do this in the last thread. It looks like they have made some improvements over the basic design I had.
View Quote

That "opinion" letter really doesn't mean a damn thing though. Look at the SIG Braces. All those letters went out CLEARLY stating that shouldering an AR pistol with a SIG Brace install on it does NOT change the classification of the gun to make it an SBR and that shouldering it would be 100% legal.

As soon as I saw those braces and those letters I thought to myself, "yeah this isn't going to last long at all". This is going to be an Akins Accelerator debacle ALL OVER AGAIN! Now to be honest it I had just started to think hmm maybe these will last, the ATF hasn't reserved there decision yet. I was about to build an MK18 using one as a matter of fact.

Then SHOTSHOW 2015 rolled around, the ATF knew a bunch of companies were going to market new SIG style Braces, guns that used them etc and BOOM the hammer got dropped.

What they approve today will be reversed tomorrow when they "catch on" and everyone starts buying them.

I know SIG is currently suing the ATF but seriously, come on, really? How many "YEARS" is that going to take?

Point being if the ATF want's something off the market, it will happen no matter how they have to bend the rules to get it done and they have unlimited resources to fit it out in court.

If this gets approved it will get reversed down the road.

I really just want to see Geissele release a 3 position SSA/S3GD trigger. Something I know the ATF won't come after.




Link Posted: 1/22/2015 10:05:47 AM EDT
At the same time the ATF can't arbitrarily change their opinion as it suits their whims without a logical technical explanation. Their opinions and rulings ultimately need to be upheld by Congress, and historically manufacturers affected have sued in such cases. For the rest of us we just have to watch our own butts.

On the trigger, it's a cool concept, but not a whole lot of an advantage over doing a quick double tap with any decent conventional trigger.
Link Posted: 1/22/2015 10:17:59 AM EDT
Need to see Jerry Miculek do a side by side with normal trigger before I form any hard opinions. If he can make it shoot like an mg42, then I could maybe get M3 (greasegun) like rof. No practical value, could be fun with a .22 upper and tracers
Link Posted: 1/22/2015 10:25:55 AM EDT
It's easy to get a trigger that will do this. Just send a good-quality mil-spec trigger to that Springfield guy.
Link Posted: 1/22/2015 11:15:50 AM EDT
I like the idea and hope it becomes available. I hope the guy in the video has a tax stamp for his Sig brace, or he will be getting some ATF loving.
Link Posted: 1/22/2015 11:26:34 AM EDT
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By GriswoldGuns:
Need to see Jerry Miculek do a side by side with normal trigger before I form any hard opinions. If he can make it shoot like an mg42, then I could maybe get M3 (greasegun) like rof. No practical value, could be fun with a .22 upper and tracers
View Quote
It's not hard to time yourself. I can nearly do M3 ROF with a regular trigger (at least for 1 magazine). I think it would be fairly common for people to get 800 to 900RPM with a fire on pull/fire on release design. That's still not quite as fast as this semi auto:

Link Posted: 1/22/2015 11:29:41 AM EDT
Amazing trigger. Makes double tap a thing of the past. I too will pick on up if they get approval.

Even though the mini-14 got approved i would think the ATF would consider that multiple rounds being fired with one trigger pull and consider it full auto, i mean its basically a two round burst.
Link Posted: 1/22/2015 11:33:42 AM EDT
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Spartikis:
Amazing trigger. Makes double tap a thing of the past. I too will pick on up if they get approval.

Even though the mini-14 got approved i would think the ATF would consider that multiple rounds being fired with one trigger pull and consider it full auto, i mean its basically a two round burst.
View Quote
It meets the letter of the law as two functions happen per pull. This is especially apparent because you can turn off the second shot at any time with the safety.
Link Posted: 1/22/2015 11:45:26 AM EDT
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By jaqufrost:
It meets the letter of the law as two functions happen per pull. This is especially apparent because you can turn off the second shot at any time with the safety.
View Quote View All Quotes
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Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By jaqufrost:
Originally Posted By Spartikis:
Amazing trigger. Makes double tap a thing of the past. I too will pick on up if they get approval.

Even though the mini-14 got approved i would think the ATF would consider that multiple rounds being fired with one trigger pull and consider it full auto, i mean its basically a two round burst.
It meets the letter of the law as two functions happen per pull. This is especially apparent because you can turn off the second shot at any time with the safety.

Fair enough.

I wonder how the rate of fire compares to a full auto. Obviously only 2 rounds being fired but i wonder how much time is in between the rounds, seems like it would be a bit slower since their would be some mechanical delay between the trigger being pulled and the trigger being released.
Link Posted: 1/22/2015 11:48:21 AM EDT
What if there were two triggers???????? Writing in my patent book...........BRB.
Link Posted: 1/22/2015 11:53:29 AM EDT
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Spartikis:

Fair enough.

I wonder how the rate of fire compares to a full auto. Obviously only 2 rounds being fired but i wonder how much time is in between the rounds, seems like it would be a bit slower since their would be some mechanical delay between the trigger being pulled and the trigger being released.
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Originally Posted By Spartikis:
Originally Posted By jaqufrost:
Originally Posted By Spartikis:
Amazing trigger. Makes double tap a thing of the past. I too will pick on up if they get approval.

Even though the mini-14 got approved i would think the ATF would consider that multiple rounds being fired with one trigger pull and consider it full auto, i mean its basically a two round burst.
It meets the letter of the law as two functions happen per pull. This is especially apparent because you can turn off the second shot at any time with the safety.

Fair enough.

I wonder how the rate of fire compares to a full auto. Obviously only 2 rounds being fired but i wonder how much time is in between the rounds, seems like it would be a bit slower since their would be some mechanical delay between the trigger being pulled and the trigger being released.
In a semi auto you can pull the trigger too fast and outrun the carrier. If you read my bump gun thread I address some of the timing issues semi auto's run into.
http://www.ar15.com/forums/t_3_118/655109_BumpSAW_Bump_IAR_Picture_Video_and_theoretical_discussion_thread_.html
It appears that Franklin Armory has addressed some of the timing control issues. I haven't had one in my hands yet, to give it a good inspection, but if you look at the top they have added a few pieces that look to keep the hammer from being dropped too early.

Depending on what type of AR you have will determine your max rate of fire. A traditional M16 will cycle in the 650-700RPM range, that is as fast as the bolt closes and pretty much as early as it can go off. Since the average person can probably pull a traditional trigger at roughly 400rpm, you can expect to effectively double that ~800rpm with the new trigger. This would lead to hammer follow on a traditional M16 but be perfectly fine on an M4 that routinely cycles at 900rpm. Hopefully the timing control implemented by Franklin Armory will keep it from having hammer follow issues.
Link Posted: 1/22/2015 12:34:39 PM EDT
I'm more wondering about that vertical grip...

I know they can be put on if the length is over a certain amount but that sucker looks shorter than the other one's I've seen.
Link Posted: 1/22/2015 12:39:09 PM EDT
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By GrantS:
I'm more wondering about that vertical grip...

I know they can be put on if the length is over a certain amount but that sucker looks shorter than the other one's I've seen.
View Quote
I don't care. He also shouldered it

FWIW: There is a good chance that is a registered MG to cover themselves if ATF decides the FCG is a MG FCG.
Link Posted: 1/22/2015 12:46:25 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/22/2015 12:51:41 PM EDT by Spartikis]
Not sure if its been posted but there is another company out there making a similar trigger. Not sure if it has a semi and double tap selector, might just be double tap only.

http://shop.libertygunworksinc.com/

Obviously the franklin armory BFS seems a bit nicer but figured i would post the link as if that trigger system was approved by the ATF, along with the letter from the Mini 14 then i would say this will be approved as well.

EDIT: This rifle is Safe/Double, no options for a semi auto.
Link Posted: 1/22/2015 12:50:49 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/22/2015 12:51:24 PM EDT by Mr_Smiley]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By jaqufrost:
I don't care. He also shouldered it

FWIW: There is a good chance that is a registered MG to cover themselves if ATF decides the FCG is a MG FCG.
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Originally Posted By jaqufrost:
Originally Posted By GrantS:
I'm more wondering about that vertical grip...

I know they can be put on if the length is over a certain amount but that sucker looks shorter than the other one's I've seen.
I don't care. He also shouldered it

FWIW: There is a good chance that is a registered MG to cover themselves if ATF decides the FCG is a MG FCG.


Franklin Armory is an 07/FFL and Class II SOT.
per their Facebook

Could very well be.
Link Posted: 1/22/2015 1:06:31 PM EDT
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Spartikis:
Not sure if its been posted but there is another company out there making a similar trigger. Not sure if it has a semi and double tap selector, might just be double tap only.

http://shop.libertygunworksinc.com/

Obviously the franklin armory BFS seems a bit nicer but figured i would post the link as if that trigger system was approved by the ATF, along with the letter from the Mini 14 then i would say this will be approved as well.

EDIT: This rifle is Safe/Double, no options for a semi auto.
View Quote
No option for safing the second shot, which IMO is a fatal flaw to the liberty gun works rifle.
Link Posted: 1/22/2015 1:16:56 PM EDT
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By jaqufrost:
No option for safing the second shot, which IMO is a fatal flaw to the liberty gun works rifle.
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Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By jaqufrost:
Originally Posted By Spartikis:
Not sure if its been posted but there is another company out there making a similar trigger. Not sure if it has a semi and double tap selector, might just be double tap only.

http://shop.libertygunworksinc.com/

Obviously the franklin armory BFS seems a bit nicer but figured i would post the link as if that trigger system was approved by the ATF, along with the letter from the Mini 14 then i would say this will be approved as well.

EDIT: This rifle is Safe/Double, no options for a semi auto.
No option for safing the second shot, which IMO is a fatal flaw to the liberty gun works rifle.


That and their price point is ridiculous, requires you to buy a $800 lower, no thanks!

If Franklin Armory can keep their trigger in the $300 range i bet they will sell like hot cakes.

I personally will buy one assuming it has a half way decent two stage semi auto trigger. Certainly not going to sell my full auto M16 as a two shot burst doesnt compare to true full auto but for a couple hundred bucks its a reasonably priced way to add higher rate of fire to multiple AR15s in your collection, or for anyone who wants burst fire without having to sell a kidney to afford it.
Link Posted: 1/22/2015 1:24:38 PM EDT
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By ArmedFerret:
It's easy to get a trigger that will do this. Just send a good-quality mil-spec trigger to that Springfield guy.
View Quote

Lmao!
Link Posted: 1/22/2015 1:25:43 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By MILSPEC556:

Lmao!
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Originally Posted By MILSPEC556:
Originally Posted By ArmedFerret:
It's easy to get a trigger that will do this. Just send a good-quality mil-spec trigger to that Springfield guy.

Lmao!
Yeah, I thought it was pretty funny too.
Link Posted: 1/22/2015 1:31:28 PM EDT
interesting
Link Posted: 1/22/2015 2:04:33 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/22/2015 2:04:58 PM EDT by titanse05]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Roadblock:
I really just want to see Geissele release a 3 position SSA/S3GD trigger. Something I know the ATF won't come after.
View Quote
This is what I'll be purchasing once available. I'm not a fan of the pull fire/release fire function. Dangerous IMHO
Link Posted: 1/22/2015 3:48:26 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/22/2015 3:53:03 PM EDT by Kuraki]
I don't understand why this is considered dangerous by some.

Trap gun release triggers are more dangerous in my opinion. Shooters develop an expectation that the gun will not fire on pulling the trigger because the pull sets the trigger. Then release to fire. I've watched more than one release shooter say, "Oh, sweet shotgun, mind if I try a few birds?" and they promply dust the trap house with a load of #8 shot because they were attempting to set the trigger like they would on their personal shotgun.


The only expectation a shooter should develop with a fire on pull fire on release trigger is that bullets might come out of the business end no matter what your trigger finger does. Who in their right mind pulls a trigger, retains the trigger and begins muzzle sweeping prior to release and reset? Anyone who does is a danger to themselves and others regardless of the type of trigger they have.

Additionally, this requires zero modification to your normal weapon handling. None. Unlike bump firing.
Link Posted: 1/22/2015 4:01:25 PM EDT
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Mr_Smiley:
Damn that's fast.

http://youtu.be/AtuZfONeqbM


View Quote

The guy is a felon. He shouldered the brace.
Link Posted: 1/22/2015 4:05:42 PM EDT
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By GriswoldGuns:
Need to see Jerry Miculek do a side by side with normal trigger before I form any hard opinions. If he can make it shoot like an mg42, then I could maybe get M3 (greasegun) like rof. No practical value, could be fun with a .22 upper and tracers
View Quote

His limitation is how fast the gun is cycling.
Link Posted: 1/22/2015 5:50:50 PM EDT
I want to see it paired with a bump fire stock!
Link Posted: 1/22/2015 5:54:36 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By rdb2403:
I want to see it paired with a bump fire stock!
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It probably wouldn't work very well because of the timing issues.
Link Posted: 1/22/2015 5:58:09 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By jaqufrost:
It probably wouldn't work very well because of the timing issues.
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Originally Posted By jaqufrost:
Originally Posted By rdb2403:
I want to see it paired with a bump fire stock!
It probably wouldn't work very well because of the timing issues.
And possibly illegal.
Link Posted: 1/22/2015 6:11:49 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By MINOBARN:
And possibly illegal.
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Originally Posted By MINOBARN:
Originally Posted By jaqufrost:
Originally Posted By rdb2403:
I want to see it paired with a bump fire stock!
It probably wouldn't work very well because of the timing issues.
And possibly illegal.


As has already been stated, it follows the letter of the law. I bet this thing gets approved.
Link Posted: 1/22/2015 6:58:22 PM EDT
I would definitely consider buying one of these if they are priced reasonably (*cough Tac-Con cough*) and get approved. If anything, just to have fun and send lead down range.
Link Posted: 1/22/2015 6:58:45 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/22/2015 6:59:31 PM EDT by pointman12]
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Originally Posted By MINOBARN:
And possibly illegal.
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Originally Posted By MINOBARN:
Originally Posted By jaqufrost:
Originally Posted By rdb2403:
I want to see it paired with a bump fire stock!
It probably wouldn't work very well because of the timing issues.
And possibly illegal.

They're an 02 SOT. They can test what they want.
Link Posted: 1/22/2015 7:06:10 PM EDT
Wasn't there was a thread in here not too long ago that detailed out how you could make the same basic thing out of a modified M16A2 burst trigger group?

yup, here it is
Link Posted: 1/22/2015 8:32:48 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By jaqufrost:
No option for safing the second shot, which IMO is a fatal flaw to the liberty gun works rifle.
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Originally Posted By jaqufrost:
Originally Posted By Spartikis:
Not sure if its been posted but there is another company out there making a similar trigger. Not sure if it has a semi and double tap selector, might just be double tap only.

http://shop.libertygunworksinc.com/

Obviously the franklin armory BFS seems a bit nicer but figured i would post the link as if that trigger system was approved by the ATF, along with the letter from the Mini 14 then i would say this will be approved as well.

EDIT: This rifle is Safe/Double, no options for a semi auto.
No option for safing the second shot, which IMO is a fatal flaw to the liberty gun works rifle.

Link Posted: 1/22/2015 10:47:10 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By ROMAD-556:
Wasn't there was a thread in here not too long ago that detailed out how you could make the same basic thing out of a modified M16A2 burst trigger group?

yup, here it is
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So is Franklin basically just making that trigger described in the link it are they adding extra features? Ie 2 stage semi trigger or other features? If not all you're buying from them is a modded mil spec trigger with a ATF approval letter.
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