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Posted: 2/4/2012 7:57:06 AM EDT
Ok, being new to the world of assault style firearms, I've been struggling to completley understand what all this means and thats raised other questions.

I understand that pre ban weapons were manufactured and sold before the Weapons act in the 90's.

I guess what I'm wondering is, the difference between pre ban rifles and post ban rifles is that pre ban rifles have threaded barrels for suppressors and also have combinations of other features that post ban rifles do not have? And this is the reason that pre ban rifles are more sought out than post ban rifles?

Another question is, since the ban has been expired since 2004, this lifted the ban on combinations of features on rifles that were once banned, right? So with that said, rifles being produced now would be equaled to "pre banned" rifles before 1994 right?

So If I bought a rifle now with a threaded suppressor, bayonet lug ect, it would be no different than a pre banned gun?

Just trying to understand all the pre ban post ban verbage.
Link Posted: 2/4/2012 8:04:03 AM EDT
Originally Posted By jafo220:
Ok, being new to the world of assault style firearms, I've been struggling to completley understand what all this means and thats raised other questions.

I understand that pre ban weapons were manufactured and sold before the Weapons act in the 90's.

I guess what I'm wondering is, the difference between pre ban rifles and post ban rifles is that pre ban rifles have threaded barrels for suppressors and also have combinations of other features that post ban rifles do not have? And this is the reason that pre ban rifles are more sought out than post ban rifles?

Another question is, since the ban has been expired since 2004, this lifted the ban on combinations of features on rifles that were once banned, right? So with that said, rifles being produced now would be equaled to "pre banned" rifles before 1994 right?

So If I bought a rifle now with a threaded suppressor, bayonet lug ect, it would be no different than a pre banned gun?

Just trying to understand all the pre ban post ban verbage.


Correct, at least for most of us. There are people in some states such as NY and CT that still have state AWBs. So they still need true pre ban receivers.
Link Posted: 2/4/2012 8:06:03 AM EDT
You're in MO. No need to concern yourself with pre and post ban.
Link Posted: 2/4/2012 8:09:30 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/4/2012 8:13:54 AM EDT by AKengineer]

Originally Posted By jafo220:
Ok, being new to the world of assault style firearms, I've been struggling to completley understand what all this means and thats raised other questions.

I understand that pre ban weapons were manufactured and sold before the Weapons act in the 90's.

I guess what I'm wondering is, the difference between pre ban rifles and post ban rifles is that pre ban rifles have threaded barrels for suppressors and also have combinations of other features that post ban rifles do not have? And this is the reason that pre ban rifles are more sought out than post ban rifles?

Another question is, since the ban has been expired since 2004, this lifted the ban on combinations of features on rifles that were once banned, right? So with that said, rifles being produced now would be equaled to "pre banned" rifles before 1994 right?

So If I bought a rifle now with a threaded suppressor, bayonet lug ect, it would be no different than a pre banned gun?

Just trying to understand all the pre ban post ban verbage.

You pretty much have it. All the AWB did was ban "scary looking" features. The barrels are threaded for flash hiders and muzzle brakes. Most suppressors for ARs mount onto muzzle brakes designed to work with that particular suppressor. It gets confusing because a few states still have assault weapons bans on the books. If you live in a state without a ban I really can't think of a single reason not to have a "pre-ban" style setup. The nomenclature is confusing and I would rather people and manufacturers refer to "post-ban" guns as "ban-era" and everything else as just a normal AR. It gets tricky because in some states with a AWB guns manufactured pre-ban can still be owned in that configuration, which is why "pre-ban" manufactured guns sell for premium over new stuff in those states. The timeline basically is Pre-ban––-Ban era ("post-ban")––-Current time (which looks like and is referred to also as "pre-ban")
Link Posted: 2/4/2012 8:13:41 AM EDT
I didn't consider that there are still states that have active AWB laws. It's making more sense to me now, about the offering of parts either pre or post ban on manufacurers web sites, Got it.

So these individuals states with active AWB laws would be allowed to buy pre ban recievers as long as they can prove they were pre ban rifles in accordance with the federal 1994 AWB?
Link Posted: 2/4/2012 8:26:09 AM EDT
So a propper time line would be Pre-ban, Ban-era and Post-ban.

I get it, some states with AWB laws allow posession of pre-ban and ban-era but not post ban guns.

I understand they muddy the waters on the law on purpouse to make it so confusing for individuals that they just would rather not own one than take the risk of buying or possesing something that may or not may be legal to own in that state.

I realise I live in a state with no AWB law, but who's to say it may not happen somewhere down the road?? I just lke to be "up" on the knowledge of these types of things so that I can deal with possible future buying and selling. Nothing worse than dealing with someone who doesn't have a clue what they're talking about. Thats why I'm asking these questions, and I'm just curious about knowledge by nature. First thing I did when I got my AR was take it apart and put it back together.
Link Posted: 2/4/2012 8:27:38 AM EDT
By the way, thanks for the info!
Link Posted: 2/4/2012 8:36:34 AM EDT
Just to give you an example of the sorts of things people in other states have to do: In California they either have a "bullet button" which attaches to the mag catch and requires a tool to remove the magazine(luckily someone designed a catch that just needs a simple tool (a bullet) to push in the latch thus"bullet button") or they do not have a pistol grip. What does a California legal AR with no pistol grip look like you ask?


Or this

Link Posted: 2/4/2012 8:51:31 AM EDT
Bullet Button? Thats screwy.

Interesting looking rifle though.
Link Posted: 2/4/2012 8:53:36 AM EDT
I guess it also show's that what ever law they come up with short of banning all firearms, manufactures can and do design thier way around such laws. Good example.
Link Posted: 2/4/2012 8:55:05 AM EDT
jafo,

Just to clear up one point of confusion. A suppressor, commonly called a silencer, is a can looking thing that mounts on the muzzle of a firearm & lowers the audible noise from the expansion of burning gunpowder. It's a federally taxed item, so you have to fill out paperwork, undergo a background check, & pay a $200 tax to own one - if your state allows it.

A flash suppressor, or flash hider, is a device that mounts on the muzzle of a firearm and while not lowering the noise, effects the burning of the remaining gunpowder expelled from the barrel so that the visible flash is minimized, better enabling followup shots in darkness and attracting less return fire. Generally useless on a deer rifle unless you're poaching, but handy on a hog gun or self-defense weapon. These "evil" devices were included in many of the liberal decreed "Assault Weapon" bans because most "assault weapons" being derived from military guns had them. What the liberals didn't understand was the evil part unscrews, making the newly unflashed suppressored weapon legal under the bans.

A muzzle brake or compensator is a device that mounts on the muzzle of a firearm, or is machined into the barrel close to the muzzle, and consists of ports that provide the rapidly expanding gunpowder another path to go than simply out the muzzle. As the total amount of gasses are no longer exiting the muzzle, recoil is reduced, and if the gasses are redirected slightly to the rear, recoil is further reduced - at the cost of greatly increasing the noise to the shooter. Commonly used on high caliber & competition pistols, the gasses are directed upwards to reduce the flip of the pistol in the shooters hand; also commonly used on magnum rifles & .50" cals, to reduce felt recoil. A .223" AR does not commonly need a muzzle brake; however, under the liberal AW bans (AWB) muzzle brakes were not banned b/c liberals didn't know what they were. As muzzle brakes look somewhat like flash suppressors, muzzle brakes on ARs became common after the AWB's were passed.

Gig 'em,

backbencher
Link Posted: 2/4/2012 9:00:47 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/4/2012 9:01:38 AM EDT by Aimless]
Link Posted: 2/4/2012 9:40:01 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Aimless:
Be glad you don't have to worry about this stupidity I bet it's tough for younger guys in ban states-there used to be tons of ban legal barrels and brakes but the market is pretty small for ban rifle crap now and pre ban lower prices are starting to climb to more than they were during the ban


Nah, I paid $1200 for just the lower duing the ban.
Link Posted: 2/4/2012 11:56:47 AM EDT
California has some of the strictest laws on pre and post ban guns. Preban guns had to be owned by the person and registered with the Ca Dept of Justice prior to the date the ban went into effect. The gun cannot be sold or transfered to another person within the state. If you want to sell your preban registered assault weapon, you can do so if the purchaser lives in another state. Same is true with high capacity mags, if you owned them prior to the ban they are GTG otherwise 10 round max. Postban ARs are either featureless (no pistol grips, flash suppressors etc) or have to have a fixed magazine ( bullet button) that requires a tool to remove.There's a little bit more to it then that, but that's the basics. Specific guns are listed as illegal, etc.. Preban or post ban wouldn't really matter as you had to own it prior to the ban. I have 2 preban RAWs and I still get ask to see my paperwork occassionally at the range. Once they see it there's no problem.
Link Posted: 2/4/2012 1:33:17 PM EDT
Backbencher, thanks for the input. Yeh, I understand the difference between the three different options. I've been around firearms all my life, but relitively new to the assault rifle scene and trying to understand alittle history behind the ban laws.

When I was refering to a "supressor", my intent was flash supressor. I mean you can call both silencers and flash supressors...Suppressors because they both suppress something. But hey we both know this. My bad, I'll try to be more decisive with the context in my posts next time. no biggy.

Link Posted: 2/4/2012 1:42:38 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Aimless:
Be glad you don't have to worry about this stupidity I bet it's tough for younger guys in ban states-there used to be tons of ban legal barrels and brakes but the market is pretty small for ban rifle crap now and pre ban lower prices are starting to climb to more than they were during the ban


oh man, I live near Kansas City. We have a One of two large outdoor retailers about five minutes away from my house. Sadly, it's more angled towards......anglers. Got a big Bass on the sign. It's ok in case I run out of primers or reloading stuff and don't want to wait for it. But my favorite place is over the state line in Kansas. Cabela's has such a better gun dept. then the other place....but if I want certain firearms, I have to have them sent to an FFL dealer in my state. It's not as bad as the ban stuff in other states, but it's still a hassel and totaly unecessary really. It does nothing but stop law abiding citizens from buying and transporting a gun across a state line. But it's perfectly fine for the same person to buy the same gun in thier own state. ????? So what have they realy gained from this law? It's ignorant and unecessary.
Link Posted: 2/24/2012 12:55:12 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/24/2012 12:56:06 PM EDT by nsg1970]
Hope I'm not hijacking the thread here, but I've gotten mixed answers from retailers about a similar question.

Simply put, can I add a collapsible Magpul stock to a Post Ban (Ban Era) M4. Mine has a fake collapsible stock which is fixed.

Thanks...

Link Posted: 2/24/2012 1:25:25 PM EDT
Originally Posted By nsg1970:
Hope I'm not hijacking the thread here, but I've gotten mixed answers from retailers about a similar question.

Simply put, can I add a collapsible Magpul stock to a Post Ban (Ban Era) M4. Mine has a fake collapsible stock which is fixed.

Thanks...



Unless you live in a ban state (such as NJ, NY, MA, ect), then yes you can.

Link Posted: 2/24/2012 1:58:21 PM EDT
Thanx...good to go in Pensacola.
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