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Sobreviviente08
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Posted: 8/20/2011 8:14:03 PM
I know only half of you will even give this the time of day- I went the out-of-box way and bought a predator. I've only been able to find 55gr FMJ's to shoot through it. I'm getting about an inch. When I bought this I was under the impression that it would do tighter groups.

I can't say I'm *unhappy* with the gun- it's 100% reliable and I love to shoot it. But, every groundhog I've killed has required a second shot. That shouldn't be the case. I want to laser beam a bullet into their eye ball. Wish the bipod and laying prone, I can keep it as steady as can be.

What gives ? Admittedly it only has a Tasco 3-9 glass on it that I had laying around from the .22 days. But I'm sure you can see my frustration still! I spent a lot of money on this because I love the platform, but I could have bought an L96 or something for the money..

Any advice, info, experience, or the like is welcome and much appreciated!
warpig8654
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Posted: 8/20/2011 8:17:42 PM
Use better ammo & better glass & try again.
"You can take the man out of the Marine Corps but you can never take the Marine Corps out of the man"

"If I wanted your opinion I would give it to you" - Gunny

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durabo
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Posted: 8/20/2011 8:19:04 PM
Originally Posted By warpig8654:
Use better ammo & better glass & try again.


this.
meestermurphy
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Posted: 8/20/2011 8:39:06 PM
Originally Posted By durabo:
Originally Posted By warpig8654:
Use better ammo & better glass & try again.


this.


x2

A friend runs his with 69gr SMK reloads and he was slaying squirrel after squirrel when we went out. In 2.5 days he went 776 kills with 1000 rounds. He has an 18x Burris on it.
gqllc
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Posted: 8/20/2011 8:50:42 PM
[Last Edit: 8/20/2011 8:53:10 PM by gqllc]
Here is a target from a Rock River Varmint using 75gr Hornady and 10 shots at 100 yrds. Scope is a Mueller 8.5-25x50 a.nd trigger sucked at 5.5#...ordered a Giessele today for it.
I sighted it in with 55 gr and could not get these tight groups
Another-Bill
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Posted: 8/20/2011 8:54:31 PM
[Last Edit: 8/21/2011 7:18:13 PM by Another-Bill]
55 grain fmj ain't gonna get you under 1 inch.

The holy grail of rifles would be one that shoots match groups with mass produced ammo.

To truly get the match results you gotta have "match" everywhere.
The rifle, the barrel, the trigger, the ammo and of course the shooter.

The glass is another concern, as is the bench, the bags, the rest, the on and on.

It isn't as easy as some would like it to be.

Consistency is the KEY.

Eliminate the variables and you will find consistency.
When you find consistency, you will have found accuracy.





Good luck, it ain't your rifle that's the problem,
Bill



ETA, actually getting an inch out of 55 grain fmj is pretty damn good in my book.
Happiness is a warm gun,
Bang bang, shoot shoot.

The Beatles
Nov. 1968
dennyd
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Posted: 8/20/2011 9:00:10 PM
1 inch groups, with the only ammo you could find, wow.
wulkyrie
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Posted: 8/20/2011 10:12:32 PM
The issue that you have is FMJ ammo. Mail order some ballistic tip ones.
If you look at the gel block test on youtube, you can see that the temporary cavity forms(neck length) about 6-8 inches from point of impact. You have to ask yourself the question: does the intended target (groundhog)present that thick a body for the 55 gr to do its job even w/ fragmentation?
johnfz6
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Posted: 8/21/2011 6:22:38 AM
Some rifles/barrels like different ammo/bullet weights more than others. Sometimes you have to try several types of bullets to see which yours likes best.

I shot one of our clubs F-class matches yesterday. Our range is only 200 yrds, so we shoot on reduced targets, where the 10 ring is appox. 1.75" in diameter. I was using my Dad's Compass Lake rifle, and with Sierra 69gr Matchkings, could easily hold the 10 ring, if i did my part. Well, I ran out of the 69's, so my last eight shots were with a different bullet, and the change was extraordinary! You would think I was using a shotgun the way the group opened up so much! So, long story short, the bullets you use can make a big difference in how well your rifle shoots.

I would say though that 1" groups at 100 yrds with just cheap 55gr FMJ's is actually pretty darn good - you can probably shrink that a bit with premium bullets, but I would say if you are getting MOA groups with cheap bullets then your rifle has the potential to be a very accurate shooter!
sickser66
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Posted: 8/21/2011 10:15:29 AM
try the Black Hills 60 gr V-max. my Predator loves those.
EJThor
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Posted: 8/21/2011 12:46:18 PM
1" groups with off the shelf plinking ammo and a cheap optic is pretty damn good. As others have said, ammo is the key. You may have to try several different loads until you find one the barrel really likes. I'd also look at buying better glass.
PAPPYO
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Posted: 8/21/2011 1:32:08 PM
well. it's about time to get into reloading for you!

most any cheap button rifled AR barrel will shoot 2 moa with a load it likes provided the shooter is up to par.

never seen many rifles do well with ball ammo. a cheap open base bullet just is'nt going to shoot!

some folks spend all that time on brass prep to load shitty bullets on top!

bottom basement bullets are speer 50 gr. TNT's. Step up to a 52 gr. Match bullet or 68-69 gr.
PredatorWhacker
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Posted: 8/22/2011 12:31:54 AM
1" groups with FMJ is pretty damn good and shows your rifle is equipped to perform very well when fed the proper ammo. I think you will be quite impressed when you get some quality ammo designed to shoot well and kill stuff. I got a couple BMs that I built almost 20 years ago. They are set up similar to the Predator. They are tack drivers. They shoot many types of ammo well. Right now I'm handloading 60 gr. V-Maxs. Accuracy is well under an inch. People can say what they want about Bushy but accuracy has never been an issue for me. Even my M4ish BMs shoot decent.
Colt_sporter
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Posted: 8/22/2011 3:55:37 AM
Better trigger, ammo, optics and mounts. Combind all those and report back.
"You been watching some videos? Because you seriously look like the poster child for Magpul Dynamics."

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FMJ
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Posted: 8/22/2011 8:15:17 AM
Try BTHP,OTM bullets
YHVH
Another-Bill
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Posted: 8/27/2011 8:40:51 PM
Originally Posted By PredatorWhacker:
1" groups with FMJ is pretty damn good and shows your rifle is equipped to perform very well when fed the proper ammo. I think you will be quite impressed when you get some quality ammo designed to shoot well and kill stuff. I got a couple BMs that I built almost 20 years ago. They are set up similar to the Predator. They are tack drivers. They shoot many types of ammo well. Right now I'm handloading 60 gr. V-Maxs. Accuracy is well under an inch. People can say what they want about Bushy but accuracy has never been an issue for me. Even my M4ish BMs shoot decent.


I'll second this.

I have and have had many Bushmasters and their accuracy has never been an issue. Very accurate rifles.





Bill
Happiness is a warm gun,
Bang bang, shoot shoot.

The Beatles
Nov. 1968
Sobreviviente08
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Posted: 9/5/2011 6:42:56 PM
Thanks for all the tips. Looks like glass and just try a box each of a wide variety.
I tried heavier ammo- Hornady V-Match. It actually did a lot worse. Here are two targets, the left is the 55gr Federal FMJ (Wallie World 33$/100). The right is the Hornady stuff (Cabela's, about 21$/20). I estimated about 125 yards. The diameter of the white ring is 6cm (just printed that offline somewhere).

the other pic you can see my shooting setup & distance. I used the blanket as a bag, it was pretty steady. I actually readjusted it since I last shot it, implying the glass might have been bumped or just not be very shock resistant. It was 40$ after all. I guess I'd like to shrink that group about half size.

Those of you that have or have had these rifles, in your experience, are they ~1 MOA on a bench? I'd love that...

I'll try the glass that's on my .270 and see if it helps. If it's about the same, I'm going to resight the .270 and see how it does in comparison (it's currently out of sight because I just had a brake put on it)

http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6074/6118135806_55dff41727_b.jpg
http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6187/6117589839_852599ae14_b.jpg
jwb47
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Posted: 9/5/2011 8:46:48 PM
you need different glass and ammo . I have a bushmaster v-match , 20 inch barrel , 2 stage trigger topped with a weaver 3x10 tactical with mil/mil turrets.
for me I reload all my serious ammo . the pic below I shot at 200 yds with sierra 60 grain varminter bullets launched with accurate arms 2230 powder and cci small rifle primers .
I likw using a 10 shot magazine when shooting from the bench so the 20 shot group was actually 2 10 shot groups.

PAPPYO
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Posted: 9/5/2011 9:45:31 PM
Originally Posted By EJThor:
1" groups with off the shelf plinking ammo and a cheap optic is pretty damn good. As others have said, ammo is the key. You may have to try several different loads until you find one the barrel really likes. I'd also look at buying better glass.


hell yes it is!

most cheap ball ammo has an open base with exposed lead. Anybody that can stick 5 American Eagle or any other cheapo 55 gr. ball loads into 1"@ 100 should be peeing themselves! Thats great shooting!

Get some Blackhills 52 gr, or 68-69 Match ammo. see wich your rifle prefers.

I roll my own but I've seen what B.H. ammo can do at my club. Good stuff!

Sobreviviente08
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Posted: 9/7/2011 10:17:56 AM
Originally Posted By gqllc:
Here is a target from a Rock River Varmint using 75gr Hornady and 10 shots at 100 yrds. Scope is a Mueller 8.5-25x50 a.nd trigger sucked at 5.5#...ordered a Giessele today for it.
I sighted it in with 55 gr and could not get these tight groups
http://i100.photobucket.com/albums/m12/gqllc/RRVarmint.jpg


Originally Posted By jwb47:
you need different glass and ammo . I have a bushmaster v-match , 20 inch barrel , 2 stage trigger topped with a weaver 3x10 tactical with mil/mil turrets.
for me I reload all my serious ammo . the pic below I shot at 200 yds with sierra 60 grain varminter bullets launched with accurate arms 2230 powder and cci small rifle primers .
I likw using a 10 shot magazine when shooting from the bench so the 20 shot group was actually 2 10 shot groups.

http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f247/jwb47/DSC_0049.jpg




Yeah I really want to be able to do this! So that's what it is, I'm gonna buy about 20 groundhog target, try a variety of ammo, and if needs be, buy a Leupold 3-12x40. I mean if I can hit the zombies before they get too close, I won't have to resort to smashing heads and risking contact contamination.

(Typing this in a CAD/FEA lab class)