Wether or not if it is 'spec' is not the issue here. It's your titty baby like attitude you're portraying if something isn't 100% as-issued from Crane perspective that gives off a bad taste in this thread.


 

Lol right to the personal insults. Way to go.


Is this Mrs. Greys 3rd grade math class? I feel deja vu happening

Fuck it.


As far as I'm concerned, there are two veins of Mk12 "clone correctness" here.

1) There's "As-Issued", off the rack or as listed in the Mk12 manual. A1 lowers, A1 stocks, Ergo, A1, A2 grips, correct Vari-X or TS30 Leupold glass with Illumination. ARMS rings. Knight's trigger. No Fucking Exceptions.

2) There's "in the wild", primarily verified by PICS OR IT DIDN'T HAPPEN, secondarily official military documentation, thirdly by "I used one/saw one" and with some clout to back it up. This is where your A1 lowers w/carbine stocks, Nightforce 3.5-10x50s, LaRue mounts, and other photographed stuff belong. This also includes M4A1 lowers where applicable, based on pics and anecdotes.


Outside that, we have the "gray area" called "it was in inventory and likely makes sense to me" group. This consists of the 3.5-10x40s on the later Mod 0s and other stuff like that. If it were Mythbusters, this would be labeled PLAUSIBLE.


Finally, there's the blob of  "I have kids", aka "I'm poor", "I'm working on it", "I shoot my rifle", etc. excuses for not fitting into the above. I spent a few years in this category, so I'm well aware of what it's like.


But by all means, let's be assholes. Let's ruin the one good, laid back Clone thread this board has to offer. Let's talk shit about the guy who built the contract Mk12 uppers because he wasn't good with grammar and the benevolent folks at Badger Ordnance because you think they suck at machnining. That sounds like a good fucking idea, to shit where we eat.


SPR by LanceCriminal86, on Flickr

Well said Lance.  The bold part and all the rest too.

Ding.



 

Sounds good. I will no longer correct any non spec stuff i see nor comment about any out of spec stuff i handle.


Back to pics only. Works for me. If the members in here want it relaxed and no talk of the nit picky stuff then i will stop. I was operating off page 1 and in the wild only. Let the mk12 lounge continue its meetings.

hate to break up the hate and hostility here guys but I got a question.

I bought a longer rail for the bottom of my tube thinking it'd just screw in... As you all (and I now) know that was wrong.

Is there a way to get that tube off without the tool and without risking damaging anything do put the back screws in?

I fished the backing plate in from the front and held it in place with a screw driver through one of the vent holes.





I did, however, remove my heatshields before initial install, so you may not be able to do it that way.





 

I'd need a long screw driver.. Hmm.

It's been a few years, but doesn't the backing plate sit inside the heatshield?



 

Did you paint the carbon fiber?  Shit looks good, man.

Need some input. I do not have a ops can or AE can but have to mk12's. I am using my AAC 7.62 SD can on both untill my AAC M4-2k gets out of NFA jail. So my question is would you leave the SPR Collar on the rifles even though I am using the AAC 51T mounts, the collar serves no purpose other than looks good.

 
If the muzzle device is already on, I'd just leave the collar on and avoid the hassle

it's pretty simple, set the receiver end of your upper on the couch then lay down next to it, hold your upper parallel to the ground then slide the silver back piece into the tube, adjust with a chopstick, yes, I was using chopstick. get your screw and allen key ready, as soon as you align the first hole. screw it on, then the second one should be easy  

So I bought a Mk4 in the EE it's not illuminated. I understand that I can send it to Leupold and have that feature added.

I did the same. Heat shield is now in a bench drawer. The channel in the shield is too narrow.

Still waiting to see a second person use the clone correct m16a1 lower

Who was the first? It's a dream I often dream lol

I've seen it on here, can't remember the guy's name. That's really the thing about cloning, very few of us have the $30,000 to make it 100%.

Ecprevatte has the A1 lower, does double duty with his Mk18/CQBRs.


And it seems to have been forgotten that the SPR in fact started its very existence on M4A1 lowers. That's fact. It was later on, after a bunch of the PRI type uppers had been built that the A1 lower thing happened. So, even without "in the wild" pics it is correct to have early SPR uppers on M4A1 lowers.

"Spec" is short for "Specification". "Speck" is a small particle, like something you see in other people's eyes when you've got a plank in your own.

Speaking of which… there's nothing "mean" about being spec. But your rifle isn't. It's pretty far away given you have the wrong can. There are a few things on the Mk 12 system that are "no compromise, no exceptions." The can is one of them. The Ops 12th / AEM 5 is a big part of what uniquely makes the Mk 12 a Mk 12. Without it, it's really just a random SPR civilian build. Anything else is not only wrong, it just looks retarded. You can wrap it up all you want, you can still spot how wrong your build is from a mile away.

The same cannot be said about A2 lowers. For one, we don't know for a fact A2 lowers were not used on Mk 12s. Crane has a history of using whatever surplus they have laying around. Just like the Mk 18 program where everyone was 100% convinced that a Mk 18 Mod 0 was built off of M16A1 lowers only, until years later pics started showing up of turn-ins that had various A2 lowers on them. It's completely possible, and even probable, that there's a lot of Mk 12s out there with A2 lowers. But even if there's not, it's such a minute detail it doesn't matter much. The only way we'd know this for sure is if you worked at Crane during the whole program or had access to every build log they have. Making blanket statements like "M4a1 isnt part of the mk12 program. But nice try." is just asinine. Because you don't really know. Qualifying such a statement with something like "As far as we know" can come off much more polite and conversational.

Either way, what's more correct - a Colt/FN A2 lower or some off-brand POS garage build A1 lower? They're both wrong. Neither is more correct.

People have already posted pic evidence of Mk 12s sitting on top of M4 lowers. How many pictures have we seen of Mk 12s in theater with an alternative can on them?

It just comes off as complete douchebaggery when you keep beating a dead horse about someone's lower profile and then keep posting pics of some Holland build with some random ass can on the end of it. But whatever. Every thread ends up having "that guy".

You can't afford to build a spec rifle? Who cares? But then coming in to the thread and pissing on people for doing the exact same thing you do, to a WAY lesser degree, is pretty… well…

I've been searching the best way to convey that Tiny, and you have done it better than I could've hoped for.



Thanks.

Bow down you non-third pin A1 peasants. How do you sleep at night knowing you don't have a $10 part in your lower?



Now someone can one up me with a real Ops.

not a real Ops but the top one is 1/2 way correct (Your third pin still wins the game)

I've often wondered...........what measures are there to stop someone from buying the sear parts? I see all the parts fairly regularly, albeit with the quote "all NFA rules apply". Are there no checks in place for a company to check to see if you're allowed to buy them?

Other than constructive intent (which I am not sure if it is even a thing or not I just hear it a lot), none.  I always assumed if I was going to do it, I would just pay someone else to buy them for me lol.

Okay gents, hows about we all step back, and consider a "Code of Conduct". We're all adults here, and while this isn't a safe space hugbox, we ought to be able to play nicely in the damn sandbox.


1) No level of "correctness" of any poster gives them position to be an asshole. We shouldn't even have to think twice about the old "throwing rocks in glass houses" thing, because it shouldn't be an issue. At the end of the day, even a 3rd pin isn't 100% because well, it still wasn't an issued Mk12 receiver, wrong S/N range, etc.

2) Non-correctness should be approached with a mindset of engendering folks to want to stick around and get correct parts. Dick stomping and passive-aggressive comments result in a toxic atmosphere, which ends up in good thread locked all too often.

3) If you can't find something nice to say, save your data plan or the extra brain cells and just don't post. Or, take your beef to PMs. Hell, there's an ignore button too.

4) This is an expensive game, so many folks are simply unable to make rapid, sweeping changes to their builds just because you told them XYZ part is wrong. Give folks time, and options, to work towards correctness.

Thusly, here's a handy guide to handling non-clone parts, while at least attempting to not be an asshole:

"You heard the Leupold Mk4s dropped in price right?"

"Brownells has A1 lowers now!"

"When you doing a Braceman lower ?"

"XYZ Arms is blowing out milspec forged receivers you know...."

"The AEM5 is really a bargain compared to other cans out there"


I hope I don't need to create an example of dick moves, but generally saying someone's rifle is ruined because they don't have an A1 lower, Colt stamped upper, etc. falls into that category.

I had figured it was something like that. Don't feel like inviting the man into my life, so I ain't fucking with it.

Just want to say this is the best clone thread IMO because of the number of solid people who stick around, know their shit, and offer up steady constructive criticism / share information in a positive way. LC's code above has BEEN the code of this thread for years.

For those considering it, though, an A1 lower makes a MK12 clone just feel right. ...and now they're easily attainable.

PiC tHrEAd : MK12 Mod Holland

I'll have one eventually. Along with an A1 stock. I gotta finish this thing first. It's taking forever, but the last high dollar part has been purchased (other than the can). I have a bunch of stuff I need to put on the EE, I'm just feeling lazy right now.

When is the long rail section on the bottom of a Mod 0 hand guard appropriate?  Was it a certain time period, only with a vertical fore grip or just user choice? I see them with and without so I was just wondering what the rule is.

" />
Saw these at a gun show down here in San Antonio. I have absolutely no urge to shoot full auto. I hand load each round. But they are out there if needed. Idk how you can buy them, maybe for educational purposes. Or paper weights or belt buckles. Seems like how they sell other illegal shit. Just say there's a different use for it lol

" />

Interesting.

When you are so rich you can have one mk 12 per each environment

Lol, na. These were years in the making. Plus, only one real mk12 clone upper here. The one is a 16" seal recce, and the other is a 308 version

Back from vacation and ready to get back at it. I'm sending all my lowers to braceman as soon as they arrive. I need to make sure I've read correctly and know I'm correct. All mk12's were built on A1 lowers. Colt and hydromatic marked. So I'm thinking 2 and 2. Early mod 0 and late mod 0 will get A1 hydromatic marked. Mod 1 and holland will get colt m16a1 marked. I was thinking of having mk12 mod 0, mk12 mod 1 engraved on the other side of the mag well like I've seen. I don't know if it's going too far to do mk12 mod H on the holland or not. Opinions and "dick stomps" welcome if needed...... I don't know why I just think that word is funny as hell.


For wheelman: what bipod stud did you use to screw in the rail for the low pro bipod? If I already asked forgive me. I forgot.

The 308 version is the only Mk12 I have ever really wanted to build...if only because it's essentially an Mk11

Perfectly legal if you have a registered receiver, you can replace the sear or switch to burst / auto groups. Alternatively if you don't have any AR lowers you can purchase them without getting into constructive possession.

that's the problem I'm now running into. Guess I'll have to try and figure out how to get that shield out.

EDIT: That solved the problem.

FINALLY I UNDERSTAND ALL THE STEAK SAUCE PICTURES!!!!!!!!!

Some people drink the Kool-Aid, I sip the A1 Sauce...

I'm embarrassed for you guys who have A-1 sauce with a broken seal.  You guys are nasty

The AEM5 tone is awesome. Like sex in my ears.

Can we post non clones still?

" />

Standing duty Saturday morning for the clay bar/wax/beer session on the Acura.

Yes, my work bench is a clusterfuck. You sound like my wife.

" />

I really like the solid FDE look.

Thanks. Alumahyde Magpul FDE. I'm an FDE whore.

Man, that .308....that's what the Mk12 should have been! Love it.

I poured the sauce out, washed and rinsed it really well, and filled it with oil. It's A1 (lower) Sauce now!