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Basic
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Posted: 11/29/2010 4:01:47 PM EST
[Last Edit: 11/29/2010 4:21:12 PM EST by Dep805]
I'm kinda green in the AR field, so I always have questions. Bought myself a AR-10 (Armalite.) Now I'm looking for a AR15. I see DPMS Oracles selling for $500-600 new in the box. This seems awfully cheap. Any one know if they are any good. How does DPMS compare to others. My first inclination was to hold out for a Armalite AR15. I always try to keep re-sale value in mind too. But, I don't want to miss out on a good deal either. What say you AR gurus?
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Link Posted: 11/29/2010 4:24:16 PM EST
Never heard of the Oracle before but it seems to be just a Sportical w/ std A3 upper receiver rather than the bulky slickside.

Yes $500-600 is pretty cheap but I'd prefer to go with something like a Spike's M4LE($760) or one of the many rifles you could "build" yourself for $500-600 using the 9pgs worth of deals posted in the tacked thread above.
"When will the economy get better?" When you start spending!
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Link Posted: 11/29/2010 4:30:38 PM EST
I would definitely pass. Save up another $200 and get yourself a quality rifle like a Spikes for $800.
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Link Posted: 11/29/2010 4:52:18 PM EST
I can no longer recommend anything DPMS. They are ok, & will do the job fine for most people. I don't feel there's anything wrong with them. Mine was a great shooter & I know tons of people that are happy. However price points have come down. For only a little more $ you can get a better featured AR.
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Link Posted: 11/29/2010 5:37:03 PM EST
There's nothing wrong with DPMS. They've been around a long time and still going strong. They produce good rifles at a fair price.
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Link Posted: 11/29/2010 5:47:05 PM EST
Forget the DPMS and get another...

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Link Posted: 11/29/2010 6:08:10 PM EST
Originally Posted By Paul59:
There's nothing wrong with DPMS. They've been around a long time and still going strong. They produce good rifles at a fair price.


BLUE: correct

RED: That's debatable. This is the reason the question of "should I buy this DPMS" even comes up. Sure they make a decent rifle that will function but they are not priced as to give you the best bang for your buck. Just because it's cheaper does not mean it's a fair price for the given product. As I stated you can build a better AR for the same price, and it's very simple to do so.
"When will the economy get better?" When you start spending!
Basic
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Link Posted: 11/29/2010 6:10:37 PM EST
DPMS is fine, I had an Oracle, it was a great rifle. But don't listen to me as I also love and shoot Olympic AR's...I will get stoned to death at the mere mention of that brand.
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Link Posted: 11/29/2010 6:19:31 PM EST
[Last Edit: 11/29/2010 6:24:06 PM EST by Paul59]
Originally Posted By jerz_subbie:
Originally Posted By Paul59:
There's nothing wrong with DPMS. They've been around a long time and still going strong. They produce good rifles at a fair price.


BLUE: correct

RED: That's debatable. This is the reason the question of "should I buy this DPMS" even comes up. Sure they make a decent rifle that will function but they are not priced as to give you the best bang for your buck. Just because it's cheaper does not mean it's a fair price for the given product. As I stated you can build a better AR for the same price, and it's very simple to do so.



You know what they say about opinions, right?

I wonder what would be said if he had asked about a Noveske for $2500? No, nevermind... I know what would be said here.
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Link Posted: 11/30/2010 2:35:23 AM EST
DPMS? No.
"You can take the man out of the Marine Corps but you can never take the Marine Corps out of the man"

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Link Posted: 11/30/2010 7:19:33 AM EST
Originally Posted By Paul59:
Originally Posted By jerz_subbie:
Originally Posted By Paul59:
There's nothing wrong with DPMS. They've been around a long time and still going strong. They produce good rifles at a fair price.


BLUE: correct

RED: That's debatable. This is the reason the question of "should I buy this DPMS" even comes up. Sure they make a decent rifle that will function but they are not priced as to give you the best bang for your buck. Just because it's cheaper does not mean it's a fair price for the given product. As I stated you can build a better AR for the same price, and it's very simple to do so.



You know what they say about opinions, right?

I wonder what would be said if he had asked about a Noveske for $2500? No, nevermind... I know what would be said here.


Opinions? Yes... Exactly my point! The majority, if not all, rational people here would agree that DPMS is overpriced for what it is in the current market. On the flip side, as you proposed, a Noveske for $2500 is probably not the best bang for the buck(read: value), which is why I don't own one. If I did want a Noveske I'd take advantage of their free blem lower deal and build the exact rifle for roughly $350 less (this was discussed in another thread a few weeks back).

Maybe you should go back and re-read my post. I never said there was anything wrong with DPMS as far as quality. There are simply better options for the money (that is not opinion).
"When will the economy get better?" When you start spending!
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Link Posted: 11/30/2010 8:07:33 AM EST
[Last Edit: 11/30/2010 8:11:23 AM EST by Paul59]
Originally Posted By jerz_subbie:
Originally Posted By Paul59:
Originally Posted By jerz_subbie:
Originally Posted By Paul59:
There's nothing wrong with DPMS. They've been around a long time and still going strong. They produce good rifles at a fair price.


BLUE: correct

RED: That's debatable. This is the reason the question of "should I buy this DPMS" even comes up. Sure they make a decent rifle that will function but they are not priced as to give you the best bang for your buck. Just because it's cheaper does not mean it's a fair price for the given product. As I stated you can build a better AR for the same price, and it's very simple to do so.



You know what they say about opinions, right?

I wonder what would be said if he had asked about a Noveske for $2500? No, nevermind... I know what would be said here.


Opinions? Yes... Exactly my point! The majority, if not all, rational people here would agree that DPMS is overpriced for what it is in the current market. On the flip side, as you proposed, a Noveske for $2500 is probably not the best bang for the buck(read: value), which is why I don't own one. If I did want a Noveske I'd take advantage of their free blem lower deal and build the exact rifle for roughly $350 less (this was discussed in another thread a few weeks back).

Maybe you should go back and re-read my post. I never said there was anything wrong with DPMS as far as quality. There are simply better options for the money (that is not opinion).



A lot of people here would agree. If it isn't a Noveske, LaRue, BCM or even a Spikes, it is doomed to be dumped on.

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Link Posted: 11/30/2010 8:13:53 AM EST
Buy the spikes M4LE as mentioned above. It is a excellant weapon.
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Link Posted: 11/30/2010 8:15:57 AM EST
I have RRA ar15 and put a lower kit from DPMS. All parts fit and function with no faults. HOWEVER I am not satisfied with the trigger that came with the kit. (see my post) I would not put their trigger in another of my shooters. Works fine but is really rough. Spen some dough and get a premium trigger group.
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Link Posted: 11/30/2010 8:31:10 AM EST
[Last Edit: 11/30/2010 8:36:58 AM EST by OlCrow]

Originally Posted By Paul59:
Originally Posted By jerz_subbie:
Originally Posted By Paul59:
Originally Posted By jerz_subbie:
Originally Posted By Paul59:
There's nothing wrong with DPMS. They've been around a long time and still going strong. They produce good rifles at a fair price.


BLUE: correct

RED: That's debatable. This is the reason the question of "should I buy this DPMS" even comes up. Sure they make a decent rifle that will function but they are not priced as to give you the best bang for your buck. Just because it's cheaper does not mean it's a fair price for the given product. As I stated you can build a better AR for the same price, and it's very simple to do so.



You know what they say about opinions, right?

I wonder what would be said if he had asked about a Noveske for $2500? No, nevermind... I know what would be said here.


Opinions? Yes... Exactly my point! The majority, if not all, rational people here would agree that DPMS is overpriced for what it is in the current market. On the flip side, as you proposed, a Noveske for $2500 is probably not the best bang for the buck(read: value), which is why I don't own one. If I did want a Noveske I'd take advantage of their free blem lower deal and build the exact rifle for roughly $350 less (this was discussed in another thread a few weeks back).

Maybe you should go back and re-read my post. I never said there was anything wrong with DPMS as far as quality. There are simply better options for the money (that is not opinion).



A lot of people here would agree. If it isn't a Noveske, LaRue, BCM or even a Spikes, it is doomed to be dumped on.


So...you are a butt hurt DPMS owner, get over it.

You keep saying here as if only this forum has people that don't cheer for DPMS. Here's a suggestion for you, find a forum that's full of love for the lesser brands and sign up. You can all pat eachother on the back and tell eachother how good those DPMS AR's are, much better than those more expensive POS Colt, BCM, DD, Noveske, LMT and LaRue.


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Link Posted: 11/30/2010 8:37:17 AM EST
The prices currenlty offered by top tier manufacturers (Colt, BCM, DD, etc.) are too attractive to settle for something less. If all you have is $500 or $600 right now, I would recommend that you save up a bit more and wait until you can buy something better.
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Link Posted: 11/30/2010 8:45:27 AM EST
Just to fan the flames. Our Dept has numerous DPMS rifles on the SWAT team as well as in use on patrol.
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Link Posted: 11/30/2010 8:53:56 AM EST
It is what it is

Whether you are buying your first AR rifle, or need an affordable yet accurate plinking gun, the Panther Oracle™ is for you. Built to bridge the gap between the Sporting and Tactical markets, this introductory level carbine features a 16” light contour barrel, an A3 Upper receiver with Picatinny Rail, heat dissipating GlacierGuards™ and a collapsible, six-position Pardus™ buttstock. Altogether, it weighs in at only 6.6 lbs.
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Link Posted: 11/30/2010 8:56:08 AM EST
Originally Posted By OlCrow:

Originally Posted By Paul59:
Originally Posted By jerz_subbie:
Originally Posted By Paul59:
Originally Posted By jerz_subbie:
Originally Posted By Paul59:
There's nothing wrong with DPMS. They've been around a long time and still going strong. They produce good rifles at a fair price.


BLUE: correct

RED: That's debatable. This is the reason the question of "should I buy this DPMS" even comes up. Sure they make a decent rifle that will function but they are not priced as to give you the best bang for your buck. Just because it's cheaper does not mean it's a fair price for the given product. As I stated you can build a better AR for the same price, and it's very simple to do so.



You know what they say about opinions, right?

I wonder what would be said if he had asked about a Noveske for $2500? No, nevermind... I know what would be said here.


Opinions? Yes... Exactly my point! The majority, if not all, rational people here would agree that DPMS is overpriced for what it is in the current market. On the flip side, as you proposed, a Noveske for $2500 is probably not the best bang for the buck(read: value), which is why I don't own one. If I did want a Noveske I'd take advantage of their free blem lower deal and build the exact rifle for roughly $350 less (this was discussed in another thread a few weeks back).

Maybe you should go back and re-read my post. I never said there was anything wrong with DPMS as far as quality. There are simply better options for the money (that is not opinion).



A lot of people here would agree. If it isn't a Noveske, LaRue, BCM or even a Spikes, it is doomed to be dumped on.


So...you are a butt hurt DPMS owner, get over it.

You keep saying here as if only this forum has people that don't cheer for DPMS. Here's a suggestion for you, find a forum that's full of love for the lesser brands and sign up. You can all pat eachother on the back and tell eachother how good those DPMS AR's are, much better than those more expensive POS Colt, BCM, DD, Noveske, LMT and LaRue.




Thanks for proving my point.


FYI, I prefer BCM. I just don't dump on others.
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Link Posted: 11/30/2010 9:16:24 AM EST
Originally Posted By Paul59:
Originally Posted By OlCrow:

Originally Posted By Paul59:
Originally Posted By jerz_subbie:
Originally Posted By Paul59:
Originally Posted By jerz_subbie:
Originally Posted By Paul59:
There's nothing wrong with DPMS. They've been around a long time and still going strong. They produce good rifles at a fair price.


BLUE: correct

RED: That's debatable. This is the reason the question of "should I buy this DPMS" even comes up. Sure they make a decent rifle that will function but they are not priced as to give you the best bang for your buck. Just because it's cheaper does not mean it's a fair price for the given product. As I stated you can build a better AR for the same price, and it's very simple to do so.



You know what they say about opinions, right?

I wonder what would be said if he had asked about a Noveske for $2500? No, nevermind... I know what would be said here.


Opinions? Yes... Exactly my point! The majority, if not all, rational people here would agree that DPMS is overpriced for what it is in the current market. On the flip side, as you proposed, a Noveske for $2500 is probably not the best bang for the buck(read: value), which is why I don't own one. If I did want a Noveske I'd take advantage of their free blem lower deal and build the exact rifle for roughly $350 less (this was discussed in another thread a few weeks back).

Maybe you should go back and re-read my post. I never said there was anything wrong with DPMS as far as quality. There are simply better options for the money (that is not opinion).



A lot of people here would agree. If it isn't a Noveske, LaRue, BCM or even a Spikes, it is doomed to be dumped on.


So...you are a butt hurt DPMS owner, get over it.

You keep saying here as if only this forum has people that don't cheer for DPMS. Here's a suggestion for you, find a forum that's full of love for the lesser brands and sign up. You can all pat eachother on the back and tell eachother how good those DPMS AR's are, much better than those more expensive POS Colt, BCM, DD, Noveske, LMT and LaRue.




Thanks for proving my point.


FYI, I prefer BCM. I just don't dump on others.


It's not about "dumping" on other brands, it's about giving relevant, useful, feedback to someone who is relatively new to the AR world. When someone asks whether the DPMS Oracle is "good," he should be told the truth. It may be good compared to a sharpened stick, but it is not good compared to more quality AR mfgs. The shortcomings of DMPS are well documented and are nothing new. If you feel that someone is out of line when he states that DPMS is not a quality choice, then simply tell us why it is a quality rifle. Tell us why it should be held in the same regard as Colt, BCM, DD, Noveske, etc., etc. If it is your opinion that poorly staked carrier keys, lesser quality barrel steel, batch tested parts, etc. make for a good rifle then simply say so. Myself, I will continue to recommend that folks spend a bit more and go with a rifle from a mfg that does things right. There are no guarantees that any rifle will never fail, but I want to do what I can to make sure to reduce the liklihood of failures - especially if I ever need to call upon the rifle to defend my life or the lives of my loved ones.
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Link Posted: 11/30/2010 10:01:13 AM EST
[Last Edit: 11/30/2010 10:08:20 AM EST by Paul59]
Originally Posted By wolverine05:
Originally Posted By Paul59:
Originally Posted By OlCrow:

Originally Posted By Paul59:
Originally Posted By jerz_subbie:
Originally Posted By Paul59:
Originally Posted By jerz_subbie:
Originally Posted By Paul59:
There's nothing wrong with DPMS. They've been around a long time and still going strong. They produce good rifles at a fair price.


BLUE: correct

RED: That's debatable. This is the reason the question of "should I buy this DPMS" even comes up. Sure they make a decent rifle that will function but they are not priced as to give you the best bang for your buck. Just because it's cheaper does not mean it's a fair price for the given product. As I stated you can build a better AR for the same price, and it's very simple to do so.



You know what they say about opinions, right?

I wonder what would be said if he had asked about a Noveske for $2500? No, nevermind... I know what would be said here.


Opinions? Yes... Exactly my point! The majority, if not all, rational people here would agree that DPMS is overpriced for what it is in the current market. On the flip side, as you proposed, a Noveske for $2500 is probably not the best bang for the buck(read: value), which is why I don't own one. If I did want a Noveske I'd take advantage of their free blem lower deal and build the exact rifle for roughly $350 less (this was discussed in another thread a few weeks back).

Maybe you should go back and re-read my post. I never said there was anything wrong with DPMS as far as quality. There are simply better options for the money (that is not opinion).



A lot of people here would agree. If it isn't a Noveske, LaRue, BCM or even a Spikes, it is doomed to be dumped on.


So...you are a butt hurt DPMS owner, get over it.

You keep saying here as if only this forum has people that don't cheer for DPMS. Here's a suggestion for you, find a forum that's full of love for the lesser brands and sign up. You can all pat eachother on the back and tell eachother how good those DPMS AR's are, much better than those more expensive POS Colt, BCM, DD, Noveske, LMT and LaRue.




Thanks for proving my point.


FYI, I prefer BCM. I just don't dump on others.


It's not about "dumping" on other brands, it's about giving relevant, useful, feedback to someone who is relatively new to the AR world. When someone asks whether the DPMS Oracle is "good," he should be told the truth. It may be good compared to a sharpened stick, but it is not good compared to more quality AR mfgs. The shortcomings of DMPS are well documented and are nothing new. If you feel that someone is out of line when he states that DPMS is not a quality choice, then simply tell us why it is a quality rifle. Tell us why it should be held in the same regard as Colt, BCM, DD, Noveske, etc., etc. If it is your opinion that poorly staked carrier keys, lesser quality barrel steel, batch tested parts, etc. make for a good rifle then simply say so. Myself, I will continue to recommend that folks spend a bit more and go with a rifle from a mfg that does things right. There are no guarantees that any rifle will never fail, but I want to do what I can to make sure to reduce the liklihood of failures - especially if I ever need to call upon the rifle to defend my life or the lives of my loved ones.


Jeez! Read the thread before you attempt to put words in my mouth.

YES!!! There are better and then there is best. The OP is asking "good or no" for a NIB DPMS AR for $500. I wouldn't say no. He may not have more money or the facilities and tools to build one.

"...compared to a sharpened stick"? That's a little harsh.
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Link Posted: 11/30/2010 10:12:14 AM EST
Originally Posted By Rhoades:
Just to fan the flames. Our Dept has numerous DPMS rifles on the SWAT team as well as in use on patrol.


What does that mean? As a retired Tactical officer, we shot our MP's and AR's in the line of duty rarely if ever...they were range queens for the most part. Just because your Dept. cheaped out does not mean they are adequate service rifles. They very well may be but for the price points seen today, unless the OP was getting this weapon for 300.00, he'd be silly not to go with a better gun for likely less than a 100.00 or 200.00 more for what the DPMS is going for. As far as I know, Spikes is a Mil Spec weapon and the price is very good as well.

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Link Posted: 11/30/2010 10:33:27 AM EST
Originally Posted By Paul59:
Originally Posted By wolverine05:
Originally Posted By Paul59:
Originally Posted By OlCrow:

Originally Posted By Paul59:
Originally Posted By jerz_subbie:
Originally Posted By Paul59:
Originally Posted By jerz_subbie:
Originally Posted By Paul59:
There's nothing wrong with DPMS. They've been around a long time and still going strong. They produce good rifles at a fair price.


BLUE: correct

RED: That's debatable. This is the reason the question of "should I buy this DPMS" even comes up. Sure they make a decent rifle that will function but they are not priced as to give you the best bang for your buck. Just because it's cheaper does not mean it's a fair price for the given product. As I stated you can build a better AR for the same price, and it's very simple to do so.



You know what they say about opinions, right?

I wonder what would be said if he had asked about a Noveske for $2500? No, nevermind... I know what would be said here.


Opinions? Yes... Exactly my point! The majority, if not all, rational people here would agree that DPMS is overpriced for what it is in the current market. On the flip side, as you proposed, a Noveske for $2500 is probably not the best bang for the buck(read: value), which is why I don't own one. If I did want a Noveske I'd take advantage of their free blem lower deal and build the exact rifle for roughly $350 less (this was discussed in another thread a few weeks back).

Maybe you should go back and re-read my post. I never said there was anything wrong with DPMS as far as quality. There are simply better options for the money (that is not opinion).



A lot of people here would agree. If it isn't a Noveske, LaRue, BCM or even a Spikes, it is doomed to be dumped on.


So...you are a butt hurt DPMS owner, get over it.

You keep saying here as if only this forum has people that don't cheer for DPMS. Here's a suggestion for you, find a forum that's full of love for the lesser brands and sign up. You can all pat eachother on the back and tell eachother how good those DPMS AR's are, much better than those more expensive POS Colt, BCM, DD, Noveske, LMT and LaRue.




Thanks for proving my point.


FYI, I prefer BCM. I just don't dump on others.


It's not about "dumping" on other brands, it's about giving relevant, useful, feedback to someone who is relatively new to the AR world. When someone asks whether the DPMS Oracle is "good," he should be told the truth. It may be good compared to a sharpened stick, but it is not good compared to more quality AR mfgs. The shortcomings of DMPS are well documented and are nothing new. If you feel that someone is out of line when he states that DPMS is not a quality choice, then simply tell us why it is a quality rifle. Tell us why it should be held in the same regard as Colt, BCM, DD, Noveske, etc., etc. If it is your opinion that poorly staked carrier keys, lesser quality barrel steel, batch tested parts, etc. make for a good rifle then simply say so. Myself, I will continue to recommend that folks spend a bit more and go with a rifle from a mfg that does things right. There are no guarantees that any rifle will never fail, but I want to do what I can to make sure to reduce the liklihood of failures - especially if I ever need to call upon the rifle to defend my life or the lives of my loved ones.


Jeez! Read the thread before you attempt to put words in my mouth.

YES!!! There are better and then there is best. The OP is asking "good or no" for a NIB DPMS AR for $500. I wouldn't say no. He may not have more money or the facilities and tools to build one.

"...compared to a sharpened stick"? That's a little harsh.


I did read your initial post - "There's nothing wrong with DPMS. They've been around a long time and still going strong. They produce good rifles at a fair price." With all due respect, your post does not include any support for your conclusion. Further, I would disagree with the assertion that "there is nothing wrong with DPMS." I think there are a few things "wrong" with DPMS, and those things are rather well known. You are correct that my "sharpened stick" comment may be a bit harsh, but I still strongly recommend that that the OP pass on the DPMS and save up for something better. The price difference just is not that large.
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Link Posted: 11/30/2010 10:34:39 AM EST
Originally Posted By Rhoades:
Just to fan the flames. Our Dept has numerous DPMS rifles on the SWAT team as well as in use on patrol.


I know some FL Pd's that also issue them.
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Link Posted: 11/30/2010 10:43:52 AM EST
Some of you guys talk like they will crumble into a pile of worthless crap as soon as you take them out of the box. Hilarious!
Personally, I wouldn't buy a DPMS. But, to call them junk is elitist BS.

It would be interesting to know how many have actually had a failure or are simply repeating what they have read.
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Link Posted: 11/30/2010 10:57:56 AM EST
If you are looking for a sporting rifle, for $500 that rifle is a steal.
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Link Posted: 11/30/2010 11:02:33 AM EST
Originally Posted By Paul59:
Some of you guys talk like they will crumble into a pile of worthless crap as soon as you take them out of the box. Hilarious!
Personally, I wouldn't buy a DPMS. But, to call them junk is elitist BS.

It would be interesting to know how many have actually had a failure or are simply repeating what they have read.


It's not elitist BS. Listen to yourself. You say that you would never buy a DPMS, but you tell the OP that there is nothing wrong with them, they have a great track record, and that they are a good gun at a great price? If you really believe that, I would expect you to own a truckload of them. Elitist BS suggests that guys who choose to pay for a quality rifle are just paying more for a brand name or buy into marketing hype. That is just not true. I'm not an elitist. I drive an old truck and my wife cuts coupons. We eat generic brand maccaroni and cheese. But, there are certain things that I do not go bargain basement shopping for. Firearms are one of those things. I rely on them to keep me and my family safe. I can't justify pinching pennies when it comes to a defense weapon. Plus, as I mentioned previously, you are not saving that many pennies by going with a lesser quality mfg. DPMS is not junk, and its likely that it will serve the needs of most folks. I just don't see the value in them. I would rather spend a little more on a mfg that employs the processes and procedures to increase the quality and reliability of my weapon. How does that make me an elitist?
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Link Posted: 11/30/2010 11:13:59 AM EST

Originally Posted By fuzzy03cls:
Originally Posted By Rhoades:
Just to fan the flames. Our Dept has numerous DPMS rifles on the SWAT team as well as in use on patrol.


I know some FL Pd's that also issue them.

I must of missed that memo...when was it that PD's have become experts on the AR?

They have a budget and base their AR purchases on cost more than anything else.



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Link Posted: 11/30/2010 11:24:56 AM EST
Two DPMS rifles, both were junk and had multiple problems. DPMS would not stand behind their product and make them right. Will never buy anything DPMS again.
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Link Posted: 11/30/2010 11:34:54 AM EST
Originally Posted By ch139:
Two DPMS rifles, both were junk and had multiple problems. DPMS would not stand behind their product and make them right. Will never buy anything DPMS again.


Timeframe? What models?
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Link Posted: 11/30/2010 12:19:31 PM EST
well according to the dpms website, its $750 and no sights youd be much better off getting this spikes M4LE which is a much better deal at 800, i love mine and its all mil-spec(only issue with mine is the frost sight base is a little off looking but the post is perfectly in center), thats just my opinion but why settle for less when for $50 more you can get much better
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Link Posted: 11/30/2010 6:18:55 PM EST
Originally Posted By OlCrow:

Originally Posted By fuzzy03cls:
Originally Posted By Rhoades:
Just to fan the flames. Our Dept has numerous DPMS rifles on the SWAT team as well as in use on patrol.


I know some FL Pd's that also issue them.

I must of missed that memo...when was it that PD's have become experts on the AR?

They have a budget and base their AR purchases on cost more than anything else.





100% correct

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Link Posted: 11/30/2010 6:42:34 PM EST
[Last Edit: 11/30/2010 6:47:36 PM EST by Dep805]
Thanks for all of the input and discussion ref. my question. I think that I'll skip the DPMS products. It looks like that they only warranty their weapons for 3 years. That tells me alot when you compare it to Armalite's,Stag's,Spike's (to name a few) lifetime waranties. I have a tendency to think that if your product is as good as the other guy's , ''WHY ISN'T THE WARRANTY AS GOOD?"
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Link Posted: 12/3/2010 3:40:51 PM EST
[Last Edit: 12/3/2010 3:44:44 PM EST by FourMoCajuns]
...
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Link Posted: 12/3/2010 3:47:50 PM EST

Originally Posted By FourMoCajuns:
...

Don't be shy.


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Link Posted: 12/18/2010 5:54:52 AM EST
I've read through every post so far and it seems like DPMS is getting a bad rap for some reason. There's even one post calling for "support" to back up a claim that their rifles are quality; all the while not one person who has downed them has offered any such support for their claims. If the OP is still interested here is a quick comparison of the DPMS Oracle and the Spikes Tactical ST- 15. All the information can be found on the respective websites. I've tried to stick to the pertinent stuff and filter out as much fluff as I can. Here we go.

Upper Receiver
DPMS- Forged flat top, 7075-T6 Aluminum Alloy, Mil-Spec anodized and teflon coated, shell deflector, forward assist, dust cover
Spikes- Forged flat top, 7075-T6 Aluminum Alloy, Mil-Spec anodized, Dryfilm lubed inside, forward assist, dust cover

Barrel
DPMS- 16" Chrome-Moly steel, 6 grooves, 1x9RH twist, A2 flash hider
Spikes16" Chrome-Moly, 1x7RH twist, A2 flash hider

Bolt Carrier Group
DPMS- 8620 steel carrier/bolt, heat treated, Mil-Spec plating
Spikes- 8620 steel carrier/bolt, Mil-Spec phosphate finish

Lower Receiver
DPMS- Forged 7075-T6 aluminum alloy, aluminum trigger guard/mag release, Mil-Spec anodized
Spikes- Forged 7075-T6 aluminum alloy, Mil-Spec anodized

As you can see both rifles a very similar. The only difference between the two is the warranty; DPMS only runs for 3yrs from DOP where as Spikes is for life.
HOWEVER, it should be noted that all the parts required to assemble a rifle from one of the other manufacturers (DD) can be purchase for about $750 on Midwayusa.com and you could probably find a gunsmith(the place you have the parts shipped perhaps) that would be willing to put it all together for you for a small fee.
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Link Posted: 12/18/2010 6:10:34 AM EST
[Last Edit: 12/18/2010 6:11:19 AM EST by OlCrow]
Ticker,

Most cars are made of the same materials but they aren't all built equally.

Most rifle scopes are made of the same materials but they aren't the same quality.

My wife owns a DPMS, it may be made of the same materials as my Colt or LMT but they aren't equal in quality.



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Link Posted: 12/19/2010 4:22:16 AM EST
[Last Edit: 12/19/2010 5:06:26 AM EST by ticker]
Point taken but as anyone who has been around... well really anything which requires maintenance to perform properly would say- proper and regular maintenance is key. I've used some pretty beat up M4's in the last 10yrs but I've never had any problems with them. Why? maintenance; and we all know that military equipment is made by the lowest bidder(i.e. "Mil-Spec"). My point is that regardless of what the receiver is made out of its the parts and the care of them on the inside that ultimately determines the reliability of the weapon. Example- issue 30rd mags are garbage and the cause of most stoppages but a simple follower upgrade solves it and makes them as reliable as PMAGs. Any stock component should be changed out eventually, and the bolt carrier group SHOULD be one of the first. I would recommend installing a short stroke piston upgrade to make the operation cooler, cleaner, and improve the overall performance of the platform.

If the DPMS Oracle is all the OP can afford at the moment I say get it, better parts can be purchased later.
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Link Posted: 12/19/2010 5:17:19 AM EST
Op if you are satisfied with your AR10 I would recomend sticking with Armalite. I prefer Colt and Armalite myself. I have never had a problem from either in over 20 years using Colt and 15 using Armalite's. I take care of them but they get shot often and ride on the ATV's and in the truck on a daily basis. My 2- M15 SPR's were purchased simply because Armalite was making what I wanted. Good luck.
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Link Posted: 12/19/2010 5:20:46 AM EST
Originally Posted By ticker:
Point taken but as anyone who has been around... well really anything which requires maintenance to perform properly would say- proper and regular maintenance is key. I've used some pretty beat up M4's in the last 10yrs but I've never had any problems with them. Why? maintenance; and we all know that military equipment is made by the lowest bidder(i.e. "Mil-Spec"). My point is that regardless of what the receiver is made out of its the parts and the care of them on the inside that ultimately determines the reliability of the weapon. Example- issue 30rd mags are garbage and the cause of most stoppages but a simple follower upgrade solves it and makes them as reliable as PMAGs. Any stock component should be changed out eventually, and the bolt carrier group SHOULD be one of the first. I would recommend installing a short stroke piston upgrade to make the operation cooler, cleaner, and improve the overall performance of the platform.If the DPMS Oracle is all the OP can afford at the moment I say get it, better parts can be purchased later.


I'm not sure I'd consider the piston an "upgrade," and I further submit that is debatable whether it improves the overall performance of the platform (unless you are running a supressor).
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Link Posted: 12/19/2010 6:19:59 AM EST
wow this thread has become 'laughable' . I am still smiling as I write this. Hey OP you wanted opinions bro and I guess you got them. I will say this cause now it's my turn. I have an old school Bushmaster: only problem I had to send it back for front sight post alignment––mine wasnt the only one I consider it a good rifle cause I have shot the piss out of it and it aint broke yet. I have a DPMS rifle I assembled––not built, with a DPMS lower and an upper built to my requests from CMMG years ago––from DPMS parts here again. This rifle is tight, and has most of the M4 specs. No happy switch or short barrel for me But it shoots damned good, accurate, and not the first failure. I had to slam-rack it once––I don't shoot wolf anymore––problem solved Spikes tactical––going into its first rebuild...no problems with it either. Still up for grabs on the rebuild, but with all the Spike's, BCM, and LaRue parts I am getting together I have high hopes for it. Pics will be up after Christmas. Last but not least, Armalite AR-10. It's kinda simple looking, it's kinda thick, but man it sure is fun It makes you hold on tightand you like doing it! It's devastating downrange and really accurate. Here again I have had no problems with it either.

Would I go out and buy a brand new DPMS rifle right now? Probably not. There are lots of great sales to be had bro. Lots of fine rifles. I dont think the DPMS is gonna shit on you but it seems like their factory options have fallen short especially of as late. You can buy something a little mo better and a little more likeable for just a tad more or even the same price if you search far and wide.

Good luck with it man...I will add before I leave DPMS lower parts kits...dont buy dude...run like hell LOL
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Link Posted: 12/19/2010 6:40:59 AM EST


I know some FL Pd's that also issue them.
I must of missed that memo...when was it that PD's have become experts on the AR?

They have a budget and base their AR purchases on cost more than anything else.

Yeah, they have to stay with-in a budget but they aren't going to put people in danger of using a faulty product either. There are enough lawsuits from outside the department to not have to worry about one from with in.
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Link Posted: 12/19/2010 6:42:20 AM EST

Originally Posted By bowslngr:
Originally Posted By ch139:
Two DPMS rifles, both were junk and had multiple problems. DPMS would not stand behind their product and make them right. Will never buy anything DPMS again.


Timeframe? What models?
What problems?

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Link Posted: 12/19/2010 6:46:31 AM EST
A lot of people here would agree. If it isn't a Noveske, LaRue, BCM or even a Spikes, it is doomed to be dumped on.




Yeah, isn't that the truth.
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