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Basic
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Posted: 9/12/2009 1:30:25 PM EST
Hi all,

I have been torn between getting an AR and an AK for the past couple of months. Every time I think I have made up my mind on one, I talk to someone or read something and it gets me leaning back towards the other. I believe I have decided that my next firearm will be an AR and I am pretty sure I will stick to this. I have a SKS which is close to the AK and should give me most of what an AK can just without the capacity. So on to my question.

What is a good entry level AR? I have though about building my own but would feel more comfortable purchasing a complete rifle. I would prefer to spend less than say $800 or $900 if there is such a thing out that. I also understand that you get what you pay for so if there is not a good entry level AR for this price, please tell me and I will just save up for something like a Colt or equivalent. As for what I would be using it for; home defense, target shooting at around 100 yards or less, and 2 gun IPSC or USPSA matches.

Thanks so much for any advice. I look forward to reading all of your responses.

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Link Posted: 9/12/2009 1:37:15 PM EST
Double Star (J&T), Stag, and Del-Ton are all good entry level guns. I have a Stag upper that gobbles up any ammo you want to feed it.

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Link Posted: 9/12/2009 1:38:17 PM EST
You already know you get what you pay for. Save up a little longer and get a BCM, Colt or Daniel Defense. All can be had for under $1200 right now. Buy once cry once.

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Link Posted: 9/12/2009 1:39:57 PM EST
Many, including myself, believe that a Stag is the best and most you can get in an AR for the money. I have several different AR's, as well as self built so called "Frankenrifles". AR's are like erector sets or legos for adults. If you want to build a reliable a AR for your price point or under, read a lot here, ask questions if unsure about something, and then go for it. If you want to buy one, I highly suggest a Stag, the best bang for your buck....<><....:)

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Link Posted: 9/12/2009 1:40:55 PM EST
Go to gun-deals.com I believe I saw double star arms 16 in. Carbines complete for $850 they are a pretty good company from what I hear and that's a damn good deal imo.

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"It say's on your chart your fucked up, you talk like a fag and your shit's all retarded." Dr. Lexus.
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Link Posted: 9/12/2009 1:45:37 PM EST
For something close to that price that's fairly decent, I would suggest the S&W AR15s. They make many models and some are closer to the TDP than other models. AIM sells Daniel Defense M4 rifles that are under $1200 shipped which are also top quality rifles. BCM is another one that's about the same price.

Drinking the koolaid one glass at a time...
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Link Posted: 9/12/2009 1:46:23 PM EST
You cant beat a Stag they are good rifles but im giving a big +1 for saving just a little longer and getting a BCM, LMT, or Daniel Defense. Just my .02
"To disarm the people (is) the best and most effectual way to enslave them."- George Mason
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Link Posted: 9/12/2009 1:55:56 PM EST

Basic
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Link Posted: 9/12/2009 2:01:37 PM EST


+1 for CMMG for a good entry level AR.

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Link Posted: 9/12/2009 2:05:46 PM EST
Originally Posted By CTbuilder1:
You already know you get what you pay for. Save up a little longer and get a BCM, Colt or Daniel Defense. All can be had for under $1200 right now. Buy once cry once.


This.

Save up some more money if you can, you won't be sorry you did.

If you really want to get to know the platform, buy a stripped lower and build it; then buy a complete QUALITY upper and slap it on.

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Link Posted: 9/12/2009 2:21:35 PM EST
In that price range I'd go with Stag or RRA. RRA isn't liked as much on this forum like it used to be, but truth is, they are excellent and accurate as hell rifles. If you want to spend a little more, look at getting a Colt or BCM.

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Link Posted: 9/12/2009 2:21:44 PM EST
< $900, I would go build it yourself.

Here you go, entry level good shooter that you can upgrade slowly 1 part per month and end up with a profession grade AR15...

http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=7&f=21&t=712538

or

$160 stripped lower
$70 LPK
$125 RRA BCG
$70 RRA stock kit
$350 A2 upper with 16" gov barrel

160+70+125+70+350 = $775. and you are started.
In a couple weeks save $100 to swap the A2 upper for a A3 upper, sell your A2 upper for $85. Use the $85 to buy a nice BUIS. save a couple more weeks and get a good off brand optic, like a PA or Vortex, or C-more, then upgrade the stock to mil-spec and the BCG to LMT or BCM

You are part of the largest AR15 website in the world..use your connections...

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Link Posted: 9/12/2009 2:23:47 PM EST
With a $900 budget I'd buy a Spikes CHF upper and a good quality assembled lower...

But remember, you'll need magazines and ammo too.

You can buy it a piece at a time, if you want.
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Link Posted: 9/12/2009 2:41:20 PM EST
I say first look at your environment.if you live in an area that has alot of rain,mud,trees and thick brush get an ak-47.reliable and hard hitting,even a wasr-10 CAN be a good rifle if you put the work into it.however if you are in a flat open area that requires longer range shots(out to 5-600 meters) get an ar.

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Link Posted: 9/12/2009 2:47:35 PM EST
+1 on the Stag...i got a 2T recently and i'm very impressed w/ it

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Link Posted: 9/12/2009 2:48:08 PM EST
you could buy a dpms sportical, with 2 mags, hard case sling, and a warrwanty for 700 -800$, spend another 100$ or so for sights, in either 16 or 20 inch. then have a base to build on. not what i'd do, but its a option

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Link Posted: 9/12/2009 3:00:58 PM EST
Originally Posted By hotdog250j:
you could buy a dpms sportical, with 2 mags, hard case sling, and a warrwanty for 700 -800$, spend another 100$ or so for sights, in either 16 or 20 inch. then have a base to build on. not what i'd do, but its a option


you can get an AP4 for that. The AP4 despite what some folks around here say, is a very solid rifle.

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Link Posted: 9/12/2009 4:09:30 PM EST
I'd go with a Stag or CMMG. Stag's should be able to be bought for $850 and are supposed to be great rifles for the money. I just bought a CMMG M4LE a couple of weeks ago and like it so much I have another one coming. I bought both of them on gun broker and paid $780 shipped+ $10 transfer fee, but I don't think they usually go that cheap, I just got lucky and nobody else bid on them.

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Link Posted: 9/12/2009 4:16:18 PM EST
Originally Posted By 87GN:
With a $900 budget I'd buy a Spikes CHF upper and a good quality assembled lower...

But remember, you'll need magazines and ammo too.

You can buy it a piece at a time, if you want.


The Spike's ST-15 complete rifle is just $950. Could be the best deal for a top quality AR right now.

Nothing wrong with Double Star, Del-Ton and others if you don't plan on running it hard. They just tend to "weaken" under hard use/abuse. They're great for range guns.

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Link Posted: 9/12/2009 4:22:02 PM EST
[Last Edit: 9/12/2009 4:22:32 PM EST by 87GN]
Originally Posted By WorstCaseScenario:
Originally Posted By 87GN:
With a $900 budget I'd buy a Spikes CHF upper and a good quality assembled lower...

But remember, you'll need magazines and ammo too.

You can buy it a piece at a time, if you want.


The Spike's ST-15 complete rifle is just $950. Could be the best deal for a top quality AR right now.

Nothing wrong with Double Star, Del-Ton and others if you don't plan on running it hard. They just tend to "weaken" under hard use/abuse. They're great for range guns.


Yeah, I always recommend buying upper/lower separately to avoid 11% FET. But $950 for that is a screamin' deal. IMO.

Then again, I may be slightly biased...lol...
http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=3&f=118&t=459626
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Link Posted: 9/12/2009 4:32:41 PM EST
I'm also a believer in assembling it yourself. Opens up a ot more options and if you build teh lower up yourself it is chepaer and gives you a solid understanding of teh FCG and the various detents and springs. As your first AR I woudl recommend you buld the lower yourself and buy a complete upper in whatever you like.

I'm partila to the Mid length myself.

I built my stag like a kit. I bought the Stag lower and all the parts to that. Then bought a Stag upper and threw it togther. Great shooting rifle and came in under budget.

Basic
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Link Posted: 9/12/2009 6:49:56 PM EST
After you get that entry level AR - still get an AK.

It's ok to have two addictions...

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Link Posted: 9/14/2009 10:26:14 AM EST
Thanks for all of the great advice.

Time to start saving up.

To KanTex, I am sure I will be adding an AK to the fold along with anything else I can get hold of.

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Link Posted: 9/14/2009 10:32:51 AM EST
i would suggest stag, keeps the price down and the quality high. if i am not mistaken, the guy who runs Stag is the son of the guy from Colt. Correct me if I am wrong...but thats what I recently heard.

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Link Posted: 9/14/2009 10:47:59 AM EST
I bought an Olympic Arms Plinker plus model for $700

Just finished a 2 day 500 round carbine course with it and shot the highest score in the class with iron sights, wolf ammo and had no failures.

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Link Posted: 9/14/2009 10:57:23 AM EST
Originally Posted By ajtayl03:


+1 for CMMG for a good entry level AR.


+2 what a awesome deal!

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Link Posted: 9/14/2009 10:58:20 AM EST
Originally Posted By Slasher91:
Hi all,

I have been torn between getting an AR and an AK for the past couple of months. Every time I think I have made up my mind on one, I talk to someone or read something and it gets me leaning back towards the other.


Get both.(Standard ARFcom answer)
I recommend saving your pennies for a Colt plus accessories and ammo. Then save some more pennies and get yourself a Polytech Legend or Arsenal Classic to satisfy your AK desire. Quality ain't cheap. Then you'll have the best of each IMO.

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Link Posted: 9/14/2009 11:54:27 AM EST
Originally Posted By sHockz:
i would suggest stag, keeps the price down and the quality high. if i am not mistaken, the guy who runs Stag is the son of the guy from Colt. Correct me if I am wrong...but thats what I recently heard.


I'll correct you. The guy who runs Stag is the son of the owner of CMT.

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Link Posted: 9/14/2009 11:57:17 AM EST
Originally Posted By Slasher91:
Hi all,

I have been torn between getting an AR and an AK for the past couple of months. Every time I think I have made up my mind on one, I talk to someone or read something and it gets me leaning back towards the other. I believe I have decided that my next firearm will be an AR and I am pretty sure I will stick to this. I have a SKS which is close to the AK and should give me most of what an AK can just without the capacity. So on to my question.

What is a good entry level AR? I have though about building my own but would feel more comfortable purchasing a complete rifle. I would prefer to spend less than say $800 or $900 if there is such a thing out that. I also understand that you get what you pay for so if there is not a good entry level AR for this price, please tell me and I will just save up for something like a Colt or equivalent. As for what I would be using it for; home defense, target shooting at around 100 yards or less, and 2 gun IPSC or USPSA matches.

Thanks so much for any advice. I look forward to reading all of your responses.

I'm with the other members here that are saying save a little more and get a good one, I would recommend getting the BCM midlength gas system carbine.

You can't get them complete from Bravo Company but they're available from their dealers like Denny's Guns-GTS and others, I would suggest getting them separately to save on the FET tax which are included in complete rifles.

If you want to do it a little at a time get the lower half first from Denny's Guns, then later on when you have enough money get the upper half either from Denny or Bravo Company or any of their other dealers that have them in stock, these uppers are in high demand and doesn't stay in stock too long, so sometimes you might have to wait for their next production run.


YMMV

AR3
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Link Posted: 9/14/2009 12:11:06 PM EST
Spikes Tactical ST-15 I have to say is the best for the money. You are getting many of the features that are on a Colt at a Stag price.

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Link Posted: 9/14/2009 12:16:12 PM EST
Originally Posted By Alpha-Romeo3:
Originally Posted By Slasher91:
Hi all,

I have been torn between getting an AR and an AK for the past couple of months. Every time I think I have made up my mind on one, I talk to someone or read something and it gets me leaning back towards the other. I believe I have decided that my next firearm will be an AR and I am pretty sure I will stick to this. I have a SKS which is close to the AK and should give me most of what an AK can just without the capacity. So on to my question.

What is a good entry level AR? I have though about building my own but would feel more comfortable purchasing a complete rifle. I would prefer to spend less than say $800 or $900 if there is such a thing out that. I also understand that you get what you pay for so if there is not a good entry level AR for this price, please tell me and I will just save up for something like a Colt or equivalent. As for what I would be using it for; home defense, target shooting at around 100 yards or less, and 2 gun IPSC or USPSA matches.

Thanks so much for any advice. I look forward to reading all of your responses.

I'm with the other members here that are saying save a little more and get a good one, I would recommend getting the BCM midlength gas system carbine.

You can't get them complete from Bravo Company but they're available from their dealers like Denny's Guns-GTS and others, I would suggest getting them separately to save on the FET tax which are included in complete rifles.

If you want to do it a little at a time get the lower half first from Denny's Guns, then later on when you have enough money get the upper half either from Denny or Bravo Company or any of their other dealers that have them in stock, these uppers are in high demand and doesn't stay in stock too long, so sometimes you might have to wait for their next production run.




Pardon the NOOB questions but I am still learning. I did a Google search and it looks like FET is the Federal Excise Tax and it appears to be put on all complete guns sold. I would think it makes more sense to buy the upper and lower at separate times to avoid this. My question is do I basically buy a complete lower and then a complete upper and put them together. Is there anything else I would need if I get quality components from a good dealer?

One other question, is there some type of AR-15's for dummies? I have looked at schematics and layouts of the internals of these guns but I don't have a clue on how to separate a lower and upper and probably other basic things like this.

Thanks again for all the help, this place is great.

Basic
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Link Posted: 9/14/2009 12:27:12 PM EST
Originally Posted By JonLSU:
In that price range I'd go with Stag or RRA. RRA isn't liked as much on this forum like it used to be, but truth is, they are excellent and accurate as hell rifles. If you want to spend a little more, look at getting a Colt or BCM.


+1 on the RRA. Own 4 of them and they are all tack drivers that run flawlessly with perfect fits and finishes

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Link Posted: 9/14/2009 2:42:20 PM EST
You can find a new bushmaster M4 for around $850 new.


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Link Posted: 9/14/2009 6:21:17 PM EST
Originally Posted By Slasher91:
Originally Posted By Alpha-Romeo3:
Originally Posted By Slasher91:
Hi all,

I have been torn between getting an AR and an AK for the past couple of months. Every time I think I have made up my mind on one, I talk to someone or read something and it gets me leaning back towards the other. I believe I have decided that my next firearm will be an AR and I am pretty sure I will stick to this. I have a SKS which is close to the AK and should give me most of what an AK can just without the capacity. So on to my question.

What is a good entry level AR? I have though about building my own but would feel more comfortable purchasing a complete rifle. I would prefer to spend less than say $800 or $900 if there is such a thing out that. I also understand that you get what you pay for so if there is not a good entry level AR for this price, please tell me and I will just save up for something like a Colt or equivalent. As for what I would be using it for; home defense, target shooting at around 100 yards or less, and 2 gun IPSC or USPSA matches.

Thanks so much for any advice. I look forward to reading all of your responses.

I'm with the other members here that are saying save a little more and get a good one, I would recommend getting the BCM midlength gas system carbine.

You can't get them complete from Bravo Company but they're available from their dealers like Denny's Guns-GTS and others, I would suggest getting them separately to save on the FET tax which are included in complete rifles.

If you want to do it a little at a time get the lower half first from Denny's Guns, then later on when you have enough money get the upper half either from Denny or Bravo Company or any of their other dealers that have them in stock, these uppers are in high demand and doesn't stay in stock too long, so sometimes you might have to wait for their next production run.




Pardon the NOOB questions but I am still learning. I did a Google search and it looks like FET is the Federal Excise Tax and it appears to be put on all complete guns sold. I would think it makes more sense to buy the upper and lower at separate times to avoid this. My question is do I basically buy a complete lower and then a complete upper and put them together. Is there anything else I would need if I get quality components from a good dealer?

One other question, is there some type of AR-15's for dummies? I have looked at schematics and layouts of the internals of these guns but I don't have a clue on how to separate a lower and upper and probably other basic things like this.

Thanks again for all the help, this place is great.

When I built my 4 ARs in 2005 and 2006, in order to have a lower cost I actually just bought my lowers and uppers separately that way I avoid paying the FET taxes.

When you get a complete lower half and a complete upper half all you need to do is pull out the pivot/ takedown front pin, also pull out the rear takedown pin, then align the front pivot pin with the front lug of the upper half, then push the pin in.

Then align the rear takedown pin by closing the upper to the lower half, then push in the rear takedown pin, very easy.

Here's a good do it yourself assembly instructions, even if you won't be doing it at first at least you'll know how it's properly done.


Assemble Your Own AR-15 Rifle from Parts ... For Dummies - tacked thread link


YMMV

AR3
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Link Posted: 9/17/2009 6:01:27 PM EST
I bought a DPMS 16" Sportical for $699 a couple weeks ago. My first AR that's all mine, (my dad bought me an Olympic Arms AR before I went to Army BCT and then sold it) and I love it. I threw on an NcStar Mark III Tactical 4x scope for $85 and have no complaints about it. Tomorrow I'm gonna throw on an Midwest Industries rail system and a VFG and I will be good until next paycheck.

If the truth hurts......maybe it should.
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Link Posted: 9/17/2009 10:47:57 PM EST
Olympic Plinker Plus. Super happy with mine. 1/2" groups with match load. Gobbles Wolf/Bear ammo like there's no tomorrow.



Small minds are easily preoccupied by petty matters.

PhD = BFD

Not a ballistics expert, didn't go to general dentistry school.
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Link Posted: 9/17/2009 11:41:53 PM EST
If I were you, I'd save up a few hundred more and buy a Colt LE6920, as it is definitely the cream of the crop. As another guy said earlier, "buy once, cry once"

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