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Basic
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Posted: 2/27/2009 7:37:53 AM EST
Hi Guys, Thanks in advance for the help. Brand new to the Black Rifles & have been doing allot of homework & I am ready for my first purchase. I am truly torn between two rifles that my local guy has in stock.

One is the Rock River Arms Tactical CAR A4 and the other is a Smith & Wesson M&P15. Money not being a factor (the S&W is a little bit more) which would you choose?

In general, which is considered to be the better brand? I know it ends up being a personal preference, but which do you like better? Resale value? I know both are very good high end AR's, just need to make a choice this weekend & was hoping for some opinions.

Thank you.
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Posted: 2/27/2009 7:43:15 AM EST
I have both, like both, smith may use better parts. I would still go with rra as my 5.45 smith has had several issues, keyholing being one of the issues.
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Posted: 2/27/2009 7:46:18 AM EST
Originally Posted By cptx123:
I have both, like both, smith may use better parts. I would still go with rra as my 5.45 smith has had several issues, keyholing being one of the issues.


cptx123,

Thank you for the responce. I handled both last night at the store, both seem really solid. I just feel the RRA is the more popular choice which I would assume would keep a higher resale value. It's so hard to choose your 1st one!

Anyone else? please!
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Posted: 2/27/2009 8:18:27 AM EST
I wouldn't say RRA is more "popular" around here anyway. Since Pat Rogers made good mention of the S&Ws, you'll not get much negative info and they garnering a pretty good following.
Given that, don't let resale be the sole factor of your purchase. What is your primary use of the weapon? Which one catches your fancy? Neither is junk and both have a good track record.
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Posted: 2/27/2009 8:21:45 AM EST
S&W, but I'm bias.
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Posted: 2/27/2009 8:26:48 AM EST
I own 2 Smith & Wesson AR's. Both have been FLAWLESS from day one. Tight and accurate and no issues. I have been very impressed.
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Posted: 2/27/2009 8:28:40 AM EST
I'm an RRA fan, but not for any particular reason other than that is what I have. I agree with the above post, don't choose based on resale value. Too many unknown factors.

Did you check the barrel specs? If the RRA is standard, it's probably not chrome lined which may be the reason the S&W is slightly higher.
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Posted: 2/27/2009 8:31:44 AM EST
I bought an RRA Tac Entry in October and am still in love. No experience with the S&W. I've put 1K rounds through it without a burp. You are in a tough spot - both are very good choices. Can't go wrong.
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Posted: 2/27/2009 8:33:54 AM EST
Buy a RRA lower, best if you can get 2 stage trigger, then look for either BCM or LMT upper
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Posted: 2/27/2009 8:35:28 AM EST
Originally Posted By RLR350:
I'm an RRA fan, but not for any particular reason other than that is what I have. I agree with the above post, don't choose based on resale value. Too many unknown factors.

Did you check the barrel specs? If the RRA is standard, it's probably not chrome lined which may be the reason the S&W is slightly higher.


Thanks for the responces guys. The Barrel on the RRA is Chrome Moly. The S&W is more because it already has the Troy Handguards already installed. Which is not an issue because I want the DD Omega rails anyways.

The other thing I like that is making me lean towards the RRA is the 2 stage trigger it has. Another thing I like is that I would assume that RRA is going to be allot easier to deal with and contact for parts & upgrades & any mechanical issues. Sounds like I cant loose with either gun, wish I could afford both!
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Posted: 2/27/2009 8:42:09 AM EST
Run Fast...Bite Hard!
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Posted: 2/27/2009 9:44:32 AM EST
M&P15 owner with not 1 issue
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Posted: 2/27/2009 9:48:23 AM EST
just bought my first AR and it was the S&W M&P...

Happier than pig in sh*t
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Posted: 2/27/2009 10:01:12 AM EST
man in the old days there would be no question !!

but nowadays who knows?

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Posted: 2/27/2009 10:04:17 AM EST

Buy Both.

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Posted: 2/27/2009 10:16:57 AM EST
Originally Posted By jeepinva:

Buy Both.



Man, trust me I would if I could! I dont know how you guys do it. I haven't even bought one yet & I am already hooked!!!!! I known I cant go wrong with either one, I just want to buy the best one being my 1st "Black Rifle". So thank you to everyone that is giving out your opinions.
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Posted: 2/27/2009 10:38:27 AM EST
[Last Edit: 2/27/2009 10:41:05 AM EST by jeepinva]
Originally Posted By Houdini1911:
Originally Posted By jeepinva:

Buy Both.



Man, trust me I would if I could! I dont know how you guys do it. I haven't even bought one yet & I am already hooked!!!!! I known I cant go wrong with either one, I just want to buy the best one being my 1st "Black Rifle". So thank you to everyone that is giving out your opinions.


Remember, I never said simultaneously.

Just get the one you think will come in the quickest. Therefore I'll go with S&W, unless you said you're getting them locally.

eta: Yeah, get the S&W.



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Posted: 2/27/2009 10:57:54 AM EST
I'd go with the S&W for the chrome-lined barrel. RRA offers it as an option, but you said the one in stock is only chrome moly.

BTW, the reported "keyholing" from S&W M&P-15R owners is usually attributed to the use of 70gr bullets, when the rifle twist rate is designed for the 53gr surplus ammo.

You're looking at 5.56 rifles, so that complaint is not relevant.
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Posted: 2/27/2009 11:14:14 AM EST
[Last Edit: 2/27/2009 11:15:52 AM EST by Jeep297]
Originally Posted By Houdini1911:
Originally Posted By RLR350:
I'm an RRA fan, but not for any particular reason other than that is what I have. I agree with the above post, don't choose based on resale value. Too many unknown factors.

Did you check the barrel specs? If the RRA is standard, it's probably not chrome lined which may be the reason the S&W is slightly higher.


Thanks for the responces guys. The Barrel on the RRA is Chrome Moly. The S&W is more because it already has the Troy Handguards already installed. Which is not an issue because I want the DD Omega rails anyways.

The other thing I like that is making me lean towards the RRA is the 2 stage trigger it has. Another thing I like is that I would assume that RRA is going to be allot easier to deal with and contact for parts & upgrades & any mechanical issues. Sounds like I cant loose with either gun, wish I could afford both!


Both are good guns but if the RRA has a chrome moly barrel then I would go with the Smith for sure. It also seems like you're talking about the S&W tactical model since you mentioned Troy rails

which makes the S&W an even better choice.
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Posted: 2/27/2009 11:16:15 AM EST
I've owned several RRA ARs and I've never had a problem ... But from everything I've seem the S&Ws are a quality product ...

Hard to go wrong either way ...
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Posted: 2/27/2009 6:00:07 PM EST
Does the S&W use all spec parts? In other words, can I build unto the S&W like I could with RRA or does it use proprietary parts? Thanks again.
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Posted: 2/27/2009 6:28:24 PM EST
Originally Posted By Houdini1911:
Does the S&W use all spec parts? In other words, can I build unto the S&W like I could with RRA or does it use proprietary parts? Thanks again.


All standard parts.
I don't own either but I would go with the S&W.
I've heard they are higher quality.
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Posted: 2/27/2009 8:35:33 PM EST
[Last Edit: 2/27/2009 8:37:02 PM EST by cptx123]
Originally Posted By docmcb:
I'd go with the S&W for the chrome-lined barrel. RRA offers it as an option, but you said the one in stock is only chrome moly.

BTW, the reported "keyholing" from S&W M&P-15R owners is usually attributed to the use of 70gr bullets, when the rifle twist rate is designed for the 53gr surplus ammo.

You're looking at 5.56 rifles, so that complaint is not relevant.




Actually mine keyholes 60 grain every round, and 53 grain every 30 to 40 rounds, and 70 not so much. Also the falshider was improperly indexed and came loose, also FSB pins were not all the way in. But that being said I would get the rifle with the chrome bore first.

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Posted: 2/27/2009 8:50:12 PM EST
I went through the same exact prob. when the S&W first came out... I know this is retarded but I really liked the roll mark!!!! Anyway I ended going with the RRA because I had heard sooo much about their Lifetime warranty. My RRA came w/ Chrome lined bbl and it has operated outstanding. Tough decision being that the s.w has rails that you dont want and would add to the overall price.......... VERY TOUGH CHOICE...
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Posted: 2/27/2009 9:11:36 PM EST
Funny you ask since I have both. S&W all the way.

They are about the same in terms of utility. The S&W will cost more but is a better finished product. It's also more milspec than RRA.

Take at look at the pictures I took of the collapsible stock.


S&W(Nice & Smooth Finish):

Outside


Inside


Top View



RRA(Very Rough Finish):

Outside


Inside


Top View


That's just the Stock that came with the Rifles. I replaced them so this is just to illustrated a point if you are going to be picky. The S&W cost more but you get what you paid for.
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Posted: 2/28/2009 7:29:21 AM EST
You guys are awesome! Thanks for all the opinions, it still didn't make up my mind, but thanks!!!

I am going today to my local shop that has the two in stock & making a final choice today, I will let you guys know the end result!

Thanks again & cant wait to be part of the "club".
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Posted: 2/28/2009 7:58:24 AM EST
I vote for the Smith, but I'm biased as well. Love my M&P 15T!

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Posted: 2/28/2009 8:41:01 AM EST
Read this comparison chart. I would go with the smith. I also have one in my collection and it has been flawless.

http://spreadsheets.google.com/ccc?key=pwswheghNQsEuEhjFwPrgTA&hl=en
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