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ric9977
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Posted: 12/20/2004 6:21:30 PM
I was wondering what does HBAR mean?
ric9977
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Posted: 12/20/2004 6:22:40 PM
nevermind I know now...thanks for looking
redfisher

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Posted: 12/20/2004 7:25:16 PM
Shorthand for Heavy Barrel
DarkStar
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Posted: 12/20/2004 7:30:13 PM

Originally Posted By redfisher:
Shorthand for Heavy Barrel



Shorthand for 'cheaper for the manufacturer to produce'...

Fixed it for ya...

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Troy
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Posted: 12/20/2004 8:15:26 PM
aka "needlessly heavy" (unless you'll be firing *sustained* full-auto frequently)

-Troy
Ammo FAQ: www.ammo-oracle.com
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_DR
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Posted: 12/20/2004 8:49:27 PM

Also shorthand for "we didn't want to fire up the lathe"
redfisher

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Posted: 12/21/2004 7:36:38 AM

Originally Posted By _DR:
Also shorthand for "we didn't want to fire up the lathe"



I have read that before and understood it to mean a corner-cutting, or cost saving method.

If this is so, why wouldn't these makers simply make 'pencil' barrels and save on the materials as well?
jmz5
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Posted: 12/21/2004 8:01:40 AM

Originally Posted By redfisher:

Originally Posted By _DR:
Also shorthand for "we didn't want to fire up the lathe"



I have read that before and understood it to mean a corner-cutting, or cost saving method.

If this is so, why wouldn't these makers simply make 'pencil' barrels and save on the materials as well?

+1
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DarkStar
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Posted: 12/21/2004 8:59:39 AM

The HBAR is cheaper for the manufacturer as they don't have the same amount of labor/time/tooling invested as they would to produce for example, a Gov't profile barrel. The barrel blanks all start out the same so in theory should all cost the same but time on the lathe would equal less productivity and increased tooling costs and labor costs along with increased overhead expenses. It will always be cheaper to do less...

When Colt marketing convinced the buying public the HBAR was the hot ticket their accountants must have been thrilled, and the fact the rest of the AR manufacturers followed Colt's lead only made the problem worse... Unless you're playing with F/A, the HBAR is completely pointless for the end-user...

The more the light shines through me
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The more the Dark consumes me
I pretend I'm burning bright...


DallmannTodd
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Posted: 12/21/2004 11:25:41 AM
Thats why I like the fluted the H-Bar. Superior cooling to a normal Hbar or Light barrel, as light as an m4 barrel (within 2 ounces, anyway), and the the durability of an H-Bar.

By the way be weary of those who say 'H-Bar is pointless unless you have full auto', then run out and buy an M4 barrel with no M203!
"AIM!...THEN Shoot!" - Det. Del Spooner, 'I, Robot'

Blaming Guns for Crime is like Blaming Spoons for Rosie O'Donnel being fat.
Gregory_K
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Posted: 12/21/2004 12:24:23 PM
How true.
DarkStar
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Posted: 12/21/2004 12:50:14 PM

Originally Posted By DarkStar:
Unless you're playing with F/A, the HBAR is completely pointless for the end-user...




Originally Posted By DallmannTodd:
By the way be weary of those who say 'H-Bar is pointless unless you have full auto', then run out and buy an M4 barrel with no M203!



You are exactly right. I don't own any HBARs nor do I own any 'M4' profiled barrels...

The more the light shines through me
I pretend to close my eyes
The more the Dark consumes me
I pretend I'm burning bright...


metroplex
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Posted: 12/21/2004 12:57:43 PM
[Last Edit: 12/21/2004 12:58:01 PM by metroplex]

Originally Posted By ric9977:
I was wondering what does HBAR mean?



It means a manly barrel that is the right size for the AR-15 owner that doesn't want to blend in with the folks who want to play out their "High Speed Operator" fantasies by loading up on $3000 worth of accessories and a pencil barrel that a field mouse could twist like a pretzel.



Train heavy, play light.
_DR
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Posted: 12/21/2004 1:13:26 PM
[Last Edit: 12/21/2004 1:13:43 PM by _DR]
No. we just don't like lugging around a weapon that feels like a length of PIG IRON.

I had enough of that humping the "Pig" (M60 machinegun) around for miles and miles.

If you like carrying extra weight for no good reason, you go with your bad self.
I spent too much time carrying too much BS like a damn pack mule for 8 years in the Army, I sure as HELL am not going to do it now of my own free will.

You might force me to carry an HBAR at gunpoint, but that's the only way I'll ever do it.
DallmannTodd
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Posted: 12/21/2004 1:30:58 PM
Don't non Heavy barrels taper to allow for the mounting area and sight post/gas block? I know that an AR15 isnt the most dead on accurate rifle, but I also know that having a uniform barrel increases accuracy. It may not be noticable to the average user with an out of the box AR, but it is still an example of increased functionality from an H-Bar without full auto.
"AIM!...THEN Shoot!" - Det. Del Spooner, 'I, Robot'

Blaming Guns for Crime is like Blaming Spoons for Rosie O'Donnel being fat.
Hoplophile
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Posted: 12/21/2004 3:53:45 PM

Originally Posted By redfisher:
If this is so, why wouldn't these makers simply make 'pencil' barrels and save on the materials as well?

Because manufacturing doesn't work that way. You have to start with a piece of stock that is atleast as large in diameter as the largest part of the finished piece and on a rifle barrel that is always going to be the 1" or so area at the rear over the chamber.
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EOTeched
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Posted: 12/21/2004 4:02:48 PM
[Last Edit: 12/21/2004 4:04:09 PM by EOTeched]

Originally Posted By DarkStar:
Unless you're playing with F/A, the HBAR is completely pointless for the end-user...


What about less barrel whip? Less chances to torq the barrel in different situations (sling pull, dropping, etc.)? Less need to free float the barrel?
Forest
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Posted: 12/21/2004 4:03:40 PM

Originally Posted By redfisher:

Originally Posted By _DR:
Also shorthand for "we didn't want to fire up the lathe"



I have read that before and understood it to mean a corner-cutting, or cost saving method.

If this is so, why wouldn't these makers simply make 'pencil' barrels and save on the materials as well?



Probaly has to do with trying to bore then rifle a thin barrel. It's easier to bore the thicker barrel blank - then turn it down to make sure the bore is centered.
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Hokie
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Posted: 12/21/2004 4:06:36 PM
[Last Edit: 12/21/2004 4:07:07 PM by Hokie]
Have a Big Ass Rifle
Five years ago I started with a 20" Gov't Profile A2. After thousands of dollars and hundreds of configurations, I now own a 20" Gov't Profile A2.
Hoplophile
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Posted: 12/21/2004 4:07:34 PM

Originally Posted By DallmannTodd:
I know that an AR15 isnt the most dead on accurate rifle,

Compared to the big rail gusn they use at some benchrest competitions they may not be 'the msot accurate' but for a semi-auto service rifle they are very accurate.


but I also know that having a uniform barrel increases accuracy. It may not be noticable to the average user with an out of the box AR, but it is still an example of increased functionality from an H-Bar without full auto.
While profile can have an impact on the accuracy of a barrel, the quality of the bore and chamber are much more important. A barrel from Kreiger or Douglas with a lightweight profile will be more accurate than the HBAR you find in parts kits from Model 1 or J&T.

In terms of accuracy, an ordinary barrel with an HBAR profile is like a ricer Honda with all the fins and spoilers but with a completely stock engine and drivetrain. Sure the fins and spoilers will work if it gets going fast enough, but the odds of it ever going that fast without the proper internals are very slim.
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DallmannTodd
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Posted: 12/21/2004 4:34:59 PM


Originally Posted By DarkStar:
...the HBAR is completely pointless for the end-user...




This is what I always get yelled at for saying about the M4 barrel!
"AIM!...THEN Shoot!" - Det. Del Spooner, 'I, Robot'

Blaming Guns for Crime is like Blaming Spoons for Rosie O'Donnel being fat.
Forest
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Posted: 12/21/2004 4:46:46 PM

Originally Posted By Hoplophile:
...In terms of accuracy, an ordinary barrel with an HBAR profile is like a ricer Honda with all the fins and spoilers but with a completely stock engine and drivetrain. Sure the fins and spoilers will work if it gets going fast enough, but the odds of it ever going that fast without the proper internals are very slim.



That is the best descriptions of the practicality of rack grade HBARS.

LOL

HBARS = Ricers with all show and no go.
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Hoplophile
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Posted: 12/21/2004 4:51:20 PM

Originally Posted By DallmannTodd:

Originally Posted By DarkStar:
...the HBAR is completely pointless for the end-user...




This is what I always get yelled at for saying about the M4 barrel!


The difference is that while the cutout for the grenade launcher is useless for most people, a lightweight barre is useful. For a long time the M4 profile was the only lightweight carbine barrel that could be found and even today there are a lot more M4 profiles available than true lightweight profiles.
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TeuffelHunden1775
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Posted: 12/21/2004 4:58:17 PM

Originally Posted By Hoplophile:

In terms of accuracy, an ordinary barrel with an HBAR profile is like a ricer Honda with all the fins and spoilers but with a completely stock engine and drivetrain. Sure the fins and spoilers will work if it gets going fast enough, but the odds of it ever going that fast without the proper internals are very slim.



Say again? Am I to gather that you are saying a heavy profile barrel has nothing to do with accuracy? I've read this many times on here and I just want to get it straight.
"Our Country won't go on forever, if we stay as soft as we are now. There won't be any America - because some foriegn soldiery will invade us and take our women and breed a hardier race." LtGen. Lewis B. "Chesty" Puller USMC
10mmPhil
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Posted: 12/21/2004 5:08:18 PM
I am a huge fan of Colt HBAR rifles and carbines.
(however, i do not bash others if they prefer other brands or barrel profiles.)
Hokie
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Posted: 12/21/2004 5:12:08 PM

Originally Posted By 10mmPhil:
I am a huge fan of Colt HBAR rifles and carbines.
(however, i do not bash others if they prefer other brands or barrel profiles.)



whew!.....for a minute there I thought Arfcom was gonna get a good lashin'!
Five years ago I started with a 20" Gov't Profile A2. After thousands of dollars and hundreds of configurations, I now own a 20" Gov't Profile A2.
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