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Boom
Have you hugged your AR today?
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Posted: 7/5/2004 12:19:21 PM EST
[Last Edit: 7/5/2004 12:20:18 PM EST by Boom]
I don't own AR-15 rifles to go bench shooting! If thats all you do then get a bolt gun, it will serve you better and then you can leave the more advanced rifles to guys who know how to use them.
Don't walk quietly into the night! If you kick some ass for freedom in the end everything will be alright!
WizardOfAhs
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Posted: 7/5/2004 12:31:09 PM EST
[Last Edit: 7/5/2004 12:41:51 PM EST by WizardOfAhs]

Originally Posted By Msokol13:
IMHO bushmaster and dpms would be like comparing a Lexus and a Toyota. They will both run great for years and years but we all know that you will get more looks with the lexus and defenitly pay for it. Seriously like the last post said, make sure you get chrome lining in the barrel if you go dpms.






Comparing bushmaster to DPMS would be like comparing a Lexus to a Toyota? Oh boy... Get more looks with a lexus? The Lexus is UGLY!

Sorry troop, but that statement is less than accurate. The math breaks down like this:

Bushmaster: Great quality, OVER priced (You pay for the NAME)
DPMS: Great quality, attractive price (You pay for the product)

It's funny to watch all the Bushmaster cheerleaders pipe in with "Get a Bushmaster, I've never had a problem". And, you shouldn't have a problem, it should perform as intented and Of course it does, it's "near" milspec! (Near because unless it's select fire, it's NOT "really" milspec) Bushmaster is a "popular name", so it's "the cool guy" thing to get. Of course the Bushmaster cheerleaders will tout Bushmaster, most have never owned a DPMS rifle, thus, they really can't compare. The fact is, a DPMS rifle will perform just as well, and without a chrome lined barrel, IMHO, it will perform better. Am I saying DMPS is BETTER? Nope, I'm saying that Bushmaster isn't BETTER. The fact is, the Bushymaster cheerleaders paid more of their rifles and they want you to think their rifle is better. It's pretty much the "Mine's better than yours" mentality. Everyone wants something "better" than the next guy.

As far as the "Go chrome or go home" line of thought, that too is total bullshit. Worried about so called "corosive" 5.56mm ammo? No problem, clean your rifle! If you're NOT good at it, learn. IMHO, anyone that doesn't know how to clean their rifle or is unwilling to learn, doesn't deserve to have it, owning any rifle requires a degree of responcibility, cleaning it properly is a integral part of the responcibility required of rifle ownership. I especially laughed at the comment where the guy doesn't care if he loses a half inch of accuracy for having gone chrome. The misinformation on this thread is staggering. Do I care if I lose a half inch accuracy at 300 yards? I most certainly DO care. I'd rather make the shot, A button cut chrome moly (not chrome lined) barreled rifle in the hands of a rifleman who knows his weapon well, maintains it well will make the shot at 300 yards. End of story. If you're THAT worried about corrosion and you REALLY want what is IMHO top of the line, spend some BIG BUCKS on a stainless barrel. The chrome hype is just that, hype. As I mentioned, clean your rifle, provide for it the level of care it deserves, and, no problem. If you really want a chrome lined barrel for whatever your personal reason, hey, no problem, get a chrome lined barrel. Both companies offer chrome lined barrels; AND, you will STILL need to clean and maintain your rifle.

Bottom line: If you WANT the Bushmaster name and are willing to pay out the money Bushmaster commands for it's rifle, then, own a bushmaster. If money is not an issue, you will be very satisfied with it. You too can put on the bushmaster skirt, pick up the Bushmaster pom poms and dance the Bushmaster cheerleader jig and "support the site" (The latter being a weak argument for buying a rifle). If you want another brand that is "near" milspec, just like the Bushy, want to pay LESS money and don't mind not having the cute lil bushy snake on the lower, DPMS, RRA, and so many others will provide you with plenty of bang for your buck. What do I personally think about Bushy rifles? Am I anti Bushmaster? Not at all, I like them very much, and, I also like DPMS, Rock River and LMT, I even like American Spirit lowers (Notice I said lowers?).

The author of the thread wants to get a first AR and asked an honest question, he deserves honest answers and assessments of both products. Here of all places I would have expected to see him provided with just that without a Bushmaster parade complete with floats and cheerleaders.

So, for our soon to be latest addition to AR owners, I leave him with this advice: Call Bushy, DPMS, and, while your at it, Rock River, ask for some catalogs, look at the pictures (this in and of it's self is fun) and prices, pay a visit to this site's "INDUSTRY" section, read the skinny of who's got what for how much, what features they advertise. You will also be served well in going to the HOMETOWN section of the site, find your state and see who lives near you, ask to go shooting with them, actually touch, shoot a few ARs, get nuts and obcessed with a rifle maker that tickles your pickle, then, charge forward. That is unless you must have instant satisfaction right this very minute, in which case, charge forward to your local trusty AR dealer! Money, wife, kids, and family dog be dammed, DPMS or Bushy, spend the money and go shoot that thing! Don't forget pix of the new rifle, gun porn is a MUST.


Edited to say this: Ugg, I just read my own reply. I ramble way too much.

"We can't be so fixated on our desire to preserve the rights of ordinary Americans ..."
-Bill Clinton, Assclown.
M11293
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Posted: 7/5/2004 3:39:00 PM EST
[Last Edit: 7/5/2004 3:50:09 PM EST by M11293]

Originally Posted By WizardOfAhs:

Originally Posted By Msokol13:
IMHO bushmaster and dpms would be like comparing a Lexus and a Toyota. They will both run great for years and years but we all know that you will get more looks with the lexus and defenitly pay for it. Seriously like the last post said, make sure you get chrome lining in the barrel if you go dpms.






Comparing bushmaster to DPMS would be like comparing a Lexus to a Toyota? Oh boy... Get more looks with a lexus? The Lexus is UGLY!

Sorry troop, but that statement is less than accurate. The math breaks down like this:

Bushmaster: Great quality, OVER priced (You pay for the NAME)
DPMS: Great quality, attractive price (You pay for the product)

It's funny to watch all the Bushmaster cheerleaders pipe in with "Get a Bushmaster, I've never had a problem". And, you shouldn't have a problem, it should perform as intented and Of course it does, it's "near" milspec! (Near because unless it's select fire, it's NOT "really" milspec) Bushmaster is a "popular name", so it's "the cool guy" thing to get. Of course the Bushmaster cheerleaders will tout Bushmaster, most have never owned a DPMS rifle, thus, they really can't compare. The fact is, a DPMS rifle will perform just as well, and without a chrome lined barrel, IMHO, it will perform better. Am I saying DMPS is BETTER? Nope, I'm saying that Bushmaster isn't BETTER. The fact is, the Bushymaster cheerleaders paid more of their rifles and they want you to think their rifle is better. It's pretty much the "Mine's better than yours" mentality. Everyone wants something "better" than the next guy.

As far as the "Go chrome or go home" line of thought, that too is total bullshit. Worried about so called "corosive" 5.56mm ammo? No problem, clean your rifle! If you're NOT good at it, learn. IMHO, anyone that doesn't know how to clean their rifle or is unwilling to learn, doesn't deserve to have it, owning any rifle requires a degree of responcibility, cleaning it properly is a integral part of the responcibility required of rifle ownership. I especially laughed at the comment where the guy doesn't care if he loses a half inch of accuracy for having gone chrome. The misinformation on this thread is staggering. Do I care if I lose a half inch accuracy at 300 yards? I most certainly DO care. I'd rather make the shot, A button cut chrome moly (not chrome lined) barreled rifle in the hands of a rifleman who knows his weapon well, maintains it well will make the shot at 300 yards. End of story. If you're THAT worried about corrosion and you REALLY want what is IMHO top of the line, spend some BIG BUCKS on a stainless barrel. The chrome hype is just that, hype. As I mentioned, clean your rifle, provide for it the level of care it deserves, and, no problem. If you really want a chrome lined barrel for whatever your personal reason, hey, no problem, get a chrome lined barrel. Both companies offer chrome lined barrels; AND, you will STILL need to clean and maintain your rifle.

Bottom line: If you WANT the Bushmaster name and are willing to pay out the money Bushmaster commands for it's rifle, then, own a bushmaster. If money is not an issue, you will be very satisfied with it. You too can put on the bushmaster skirt, pick up the Bushmaster pom poms and dance the Bushmaster cheerleader jig and "support the site" (The latter being a weak argument for buying a rifle). If you want another brand that is "near" milspec, just like the Bushy, want to pay LESS money and don't mind not having the cute lil bushy snake on the lower, DPMS, RRA, and so many others will provide you with plenty of bang for your buck. What do I personally think about Bushy rifles? Am I anti Bushmaster? Not at all, I like them very much, and, I also like DPMS, Rock River and LMT, I even like American Spirit lowers (Notice I said lowers?).

The author of the thread wants to get a first AR and asked an honest question, he deserves honest answers and assessments of both products. Here of all places I would have expected to see him provided with just that without a Bushmaster parade complete with floats and cheerleaders.

So, for our soon to be latest addition to AR owners, I leave him with this advice: Call Bushy, DPMS, and, while your at it, Rock River, ask for some catalogs, look at the pictures (this in and of it's self is fun) and prices, pay a visit to this site's "INDUSTRY" section, read the skinny of who's got what for how much, what features they advertise. You will also be served well in going to the HOMETOWN section of the site, find your state and see who lives near you, ask to go shooting with them, actually touch, shoot a few ARs, get nuts and obcessed with a rifle maker that tickles your pickle, then, charge forward. That is unless you must have instant satisfaction right this very minute, in which case, charge forward to your local trusty AR dealer! Money, wife, kids, and family dog be dammed, DPMS or Bushy, spend the money and go shoot that thing! Don't forget pix of the new rifle, gun porn is a MUST.


Edited to say this: Ugg, I just read my own reply. I ramble way too much.



Nice post, so much truth in it.

Sunburn, I wouldn't listen to many more people in this forum including myself. Listen to WizrdofAhs and what he had to say about testing them and learning more about the rifles before you decide. He had much better things to say then the rest of us. Like he said many here are cheering for their company. I tried to give you a little bit of both of the rifles but do what Wizard said before you do anything else.
Mordak
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Posted: 7/5/2004 3:41:16 PM EST

Originally Posted By sunburn:
I am looking at getting my first AR. i am looking at bushmaster and dpms. which do you prefer and why.

s.


Bushmaster. I love the quality and the fit and finish. I also love Colt.
Mordak
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M11293
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Posted: 7/5/2004 3:42:51 PM EST
[Last Edit: 7/5/2004 3:48:23 PM EST by M11293]

Originally Posted By Boom:
I don't own AR-15 rifles to go bench shooting! If thats all you do then get a bolt gun, it will serve you better and then you can leave the more advanced rifles to guys who know how to use them.



I do take it off the bench and shoot it from scrub and other more Tactical shooting situations, but that rifle weighs about 10.5 lbs so, I don't carry it that much. I also do longer range speed accuracy and I don't think you can do that with a bolt gun. I do carry around my M4 and do more moving shooting.
Boom
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Posted: 7/5/2004 3:45:16 PM EST
[Last Edit: 7/5/2004 3:46:04 PM EST by Boom]
Sunburn sorry this thread has gone off topic, Bushmaster & DPMS both make good rifles, I would buy the BM for many reasons. I own both rifles and find that BM has far faster turn around time on parts and repairs then DPMS. This is your first rifle, it's your choice. Stainless is a very soft metal compared to 4150 which BM uses for it's barrels. They also provide you with a chrome lined barrel. Chromed barrels will last far longer then then non chromed barrels or a stainless barrel. They both shoot great, non chromed will give you a very slight edge if you are doing target work. If you just want to have a good reliable rifle for having fun that doubles for a defense gun then go ahead and get a Bushmaster. The only cool guy guns are Colt not Bushmaster.

Either way good luck and have fun.
Don't walk quietly into the night! If you kick some ass for freedom in the end everything will be alright!
MJFRacing
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Posted: 7/5/2004 3:47:51 PM EST

Bushmaster!

Not because DPMS is bad, just that overall (reliability, quality, finish, resale etc.) Bushy is better!

Welcome to AR15.com and enjoy!


2Manchu
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Posted: 7/5/2004 3:50:31 PM EST

Originally Posted By WizardOfAhs:


Comparing bushmaster to DPMS would be like comparing a Lexus to a Toyota? Oh boy... Get more looks with a lexus? The Lexus is UGLY!

Sorry troop, but that statement is less than accurate. The math breaks down like this:

Bushmaster: Great quality, OVER priced (You pay for the NAME)
DPMS: Great quality, attractive price (You pay for the product)

It's funny to watch all the Bushmaster cheerleaders pipe in with "Get a Bushmaster, I've never had a problem". And, you shouldn't have a problem, it should perform as intented and Of course it does, it's "near" milspec! (Near because unless it's select fire, it's NOT "really" milspec) Bushmaster is a "popular name", so it's "the cool guy" thing to get. Of course the Bushmaster cheerleaders will tout Bushmaster, most have never owned a DPMS rifle, thus, they really can't compare. The fact is, a DPMS rifle will perform just as well, and without a chrome lined barrel, IMHO, it will perform better. Am I saying DMPS is BETTER? Nope, I'm saying that Bushmaster isn't BETTER. The fact is, the Bushymaster cheerleaders paid more of their rifles and they want you to think their rifle is better. It's pretty much the "Mine's better than yours" mentality. Everyone wants something "better" than the next guy.

As far as the "Go chrome or go home" line of thought, that too is total bullshit. Worried about so called "corosive" 5.56mm ammo? No problem, clean your rifle! If you're NOT good at it, learn. IMHO, anyone that doesn't know how to clean their rifle or is unwilling to learn, doesn't deserve to have it, owning any rifle requires a degree of responcibility, cleaning it properly is a integral part of the responcibility required of rifle ownership. I especially laughed at the comment where the guy doesn't care if he loses a half inch of accuracy for having gone chrome. The misinformation on this thread is staggering. Do I care if I lose a half inch accuracy at 300 yards? I most certainly DO care. I'd rather make the shot, A button cut chrome moly (not chrome lined) barreled rifle in the hands of a rifleman who knows his weapon well, maintains it well will make the shot at 300 yards. End of story. If you're THAT worried about corrosion and you REALLY want what is IMHO top of the line, spend some BIG BUCKS on a stainless barrel. The chrome hype is just that, hype. As I mentioned, clean your rifle, provide for it the level of care it deserves, and, no problem. If you really want a chrome lined barrel for whatever your personal reason, hey, no problem, get a chrome lined barrel. Both companies offer chrome lined barrels; AND, you will STILL need to clean and maintain your rifle.

Bottom line: If you WANT the Bushmaster name and are willing to pay out the money Bushmaster commands for it's rifle, then, own a bushmaster. If money is not an issue, you will be very satisfied with it. You too can put on the bushmaster skirt, pick up the Bushmaster pom poms and dance the Bushmaster cheerleader jig and "support the site" (The latter being a weak argument for buying a rifle). If you want another brand that is "near" milspec, just like the Bushy, want to pay LESS money and don't mind not having the cute lil bushy snake on the lower, DPMS, RRA, and so many others will provide you with plenty of bang for your buck. What do I personally think about Bushy rifles? Am I anti Bushmaster? Not at all, I like them very much, and, I also like DPMS, Rock River and LMT, I even like American Spirit lowers (Notice I said lowers?).

The author of the thread wants to get a first AR and asked an honest question, he deserves honest answers and assessments of both products. Here of all places I would have expected to see him provided with just that without a Bushmaster parade complete with floats and cheerleaders.

So, for our soon to be latest addition to AR owners, I leave him with this advice: Call Bushy, DPMS, and, while your at it, Rock River, ask for some catalogs, look at the pictures (this in and of it's self is fun) and prices, pay a visit to this site's "INDUSTRY" section, read the skinny of who's got what for how much, what features they advertise. You will also be served well in going to the HOMETOWN section of the site, find your state and see who lives near you, ask to go shooting with them, actually touch, shoot a few ARs, get nuts and obcessed with a rifle maker that tickles your pickle, then, charge forward. That is unless you must have instant satisfaction right this very minute, in which case, charge forward to your local trusty AR dealer! Money, wife, kids, and family dog be dammed, DPMS or Bushy, spend the money and go shoot that thing! Don't forget pix of the new rifle, gun porn is a MUST.


Edited to say this: Ugg, I just read my own reply. I ramble way too much.




All very good points, Wizard.

As for my dos centavos, I say there's a lot going for building up one's own AR, piece by piece. That way you'd have a finished product exactly the way YOU want it. If you want a rail handguard instead of the standard one's, get the rail handguard -- you're won't end up with left over parts from switching out to the parts you wanted in the first place. In addition, most of these different companies seem to be nothing more than middle men. In a lot of cases, they don't make sh*t; they have the parts made for them by an actual manufacturer, put their name and logo on them, and then assemble them for sale.
Keep Up The Fire!!
WizardOfAhs
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Posted: 7/5/2004 4:21:43 PM EST
2Manchu,

*Temporary thread hijack* I'm glad you mentioned another very good point. Building one up yourself is not only alot of fun, it's not nearly as difficult as some would think, even for someone who's never owned an AR before. There's much pride in owning a fine shooting AR, IMHO, even more-so in owning a fine shooting AR that you've built. To steer "somewhat" in the intended direction of the thread, both Bushmaster, DPMS, RRA and others make their parts readily available for the "do-it-yourself" (of which I am one) types. Should the author of this thread be so inclined, this site contains a wealth of "Build-it-yourself" information that can make a first own/first build relatively painless, dare I say almost easy. In addition to the wealth of information available by not only the parts manufacturing companies, there are listed many businesses that offer these parts at a great savings, that coupled with a boat-load of experienced "build-it-yourselfers" that make themselves available to answer first build questions, slapping together a fine shooting AR at home becomes a realistic (And I do dare say so again, EASY) option. But... that is another story... *Slapping fingers so that I do not ramble on yet again lest I overwhealm the poor guy*

"We can't be so fixated on our desire to preserve the rights of ordinary Americans ..."
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brasspile
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Posted: 7/5/2004 5:31:40 PM EST
By the time you get done swapping stuff out, you won't really know what brand to call it anyway.

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_DR
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Posted: 7/5/2004 6:16:00 PM EST
Armalite, Colt, Bushmaster, DPMS, RRA all good.
M11293
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Posted: 7/5/2004 6:16:39 PM EST

Originally Posted By _DR:
Armalite, Colt, Bushmaster, DPMS, RRA all good.



SPR-Mk12-Mod0
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Posted: 7/5/2004 6:30:09 PM EST
+1 vote for Bushmaster.
meateater
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Posted: 7/7/2004 1:11:08 PM EST
if you are going dpms, get from cmmg. dpms makes uppers especially for cmmg. chrome lined bbl and chamber. m4 feed ramps, 1:7 twist 4150 steel. only thing is the front sight is cast.
i got one from jeff and couldn't be happier with it. great customer service too from cmmg.


meat
very interesting....very,very, interesting...........
norman74
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Posted: 7/7/2004 2:14:58 PM EST
I would chose (and continue to do so) Bushmaster simply because I have never heard of their bolts/carriers shearing.

And I can't believe people 'round here are still on about green followers, forward assists and dust covers. I really gotta get my next build done....
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Boom
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Posted: 7/7/2004 2:27:27 PM EST

Originally Posted By M11293:

Originally Posted By Boom:

Originally Posted By _DR:
When did DPMS start chroming their barrels as an option? Seems to me they didn't offer this when I bought my DPMS shorty upper a couple of years ago.



DPMS started offering it after the 2003 Shot show as an opinion, I forgot how much they charge extra, I think it's 40 bucks. If you do not know how to clean your barrel properly you should buy chrome for the simple reason that you may miss something. Do you really care about a 1/2" at 300 yds, I dont.


Originally Posted By M11293:

DPMS doesn't chrome their barrels without request because the original ARs didn't have chrome, this is what a dealer told me so who knows, here is the non-chrome theory, why would be put something in a barrel that could vary in size and thickness even with good machining? This can decrease the accuracy slightly. But it does give you longer barrel life and works better if you are going to run through the jungles of Columbia and hunt drug lords.



I just want my gun to run a little better, if you don't care then replace your green followers with black followers there cheaper get rid of your forwad assist and dust cover save yourself some money you dont really need those either.



I can't tell if you are serious or joking on your last part about the forward assist and dust cover. I have heard that dust covers and forwards assists don't really do anythig but I don't know if you are joking.



Don't know how I missed this but I did, I was joking.
Don't walk quietly into the night! If you kick some ass for freedom in the end everything will be alright!
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