User Panel
[#1]
Quoted:
I like how majority of folks sticking up for this decision are from out of state and are not effected by it. View Quote I noticed something similar. Seems like all the complaints are coming from TX residents. I said it in the big thread and I'll say it here. Manufacturers will not allow wholesalers to sell retail. Period. As in never. So push come to shove- If Silencer Shop did reverse their decision they would lose 100% of all their retail business across the country and step back to being retail only. Try to put your personal feelings aside for 1 minute. They are doing what is best for their business. Period. |
|
[#2]
Quoted:
Hope the out of staters made it worth the healthy chunk of Texas residents that you just lost as customers. I have bought 5 cans this year alone, guess I will have to find a new dealer. View Quote Only if you choose to, you can still purchase from us the only difference is that you can pick it up closer to you. |
|
[#3]
Quoted:
I noticed something similar. Seems like all the complaints are coming from TX residents. I said it in the big thread and I'll say it here. Manufacturers will not allow wholesalers to sell retail. Period. As in never. So push come to shove- If Silencer Shop did reverse their decision they would lose 100% of all their retail business across the country and step back to being retail only. Try to put your personal feelings aside for 1 minute. They are doing what is best for their business. Period. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted:
Quoted:
I like how majority of folks sticking up for this decision are from out of state and are not effected by it. I noticed something similar. Seems like all the complaints are coming from TX residents. I said it in the big thread and I'll say it here. Manufacturers will not allow wholesalers to sell retail. Period. As in never. So push come to shove- If Silencer Shop did reverse their decision they would lose 100% of all their retail business across the country and step back to being retail only. Try to put your personal feelings aside for 1 minute. They are doing what is best for their business. Period. True, we cannot sell retail so it is all or nothing. Texas customers can still purchase from us and we will still help them. They just pick it up from a dealer closer to them. I understand that some people like the drive but based on the amount of silencers that we were mailing out most don't want the drive. So picking it up local makes the most sense for the majority of our Texas customers. Seeing that it doesn't change the timeline (if you include shipping) most customers should have a more convenient experience. |
|
[#4]
Quoted:
I noticed something similar. Seems like all the complaints are coming from TX residents. I said it in the big thread and I'll say it here. Manufacturers will not allow wholesalers to sell retail. Period. As in never. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted:
Quoted:
I like how majority of folks sticking up for this decision are from out of state and are not effected by it. I noticed something similar. Seems like all the complaints are coming from TX residents. I said it in the big thread and I'll say it here. Manufacturers will not allow wholesalers to sell retail. Period. As in never. I doubt the out -of-state folks are going to be sticking up for it once they realize sales tax will need to be collected, since SS is now a wholesaler/distributor selling to the local dealer, and not a dealer selling to the end-user. So give it time, and the out-of-staters will start complaining too. |
|
[#5]
Quoted:
I doubt the out -of-state folks are going to be sticking up for it once they realize sales tax will need to be collected, since SS is now a wholesaler/distributor selling to the local dealer, and not a dealer selling to the end-user. So give it time, and the out-of-staters will start complaining too. View Quote The customer is paying SS directly in full, unlike Gun Genie, where the customer pays the dealer when they pickup. Therefore, for Virginia, sales tax does not need to be collected. Virginia customers, however, are supposed to claim out-of-state purchases on their VA income tax return. Texas residents will have to pay sales tax, either to Silencer Shop or their local dealer. |
|
[#6]
Quoted:
The customer is paying SS directly in full, unlike Gun Genie, where the customer pays the dealer when they pickup. Therefore, for Virginia, sales tax does not need to be collected. Virginia customers, however, are supposed to claim out-of-state purchases on their VA income tax return. Texas residents will have to pay sales tax, either to Silencer Shop or their local dealer. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted:
Quoted:
I doubt the out -of-state folks are going to be sticking up for it once they realize sales tax will need to be collected, since SS is now a wholesaler/distributor selling to the local dealer, and not a dealer selling to the end-user. So give it time, and the out-of-staters will start complaining too. The customer is paying SS directly in full, unlike Gun Genie, where the customer pays the dealer when they pickup. Therefore, for Virginia, sales tax does not need to be collected. Virginia customers, however, are supposed to claim out-of-state purchases on their VA income tax return. Texas residents will have to pay sales tax, either to Silencer Shop or their local dealer. Excellent point. |
|
[#7]
Quoted:
For Virginia, the customer is paying SS directly in full, unlike Gun Genie, where the customer pays the dealer when they pickup. Therefore, sales tax does not need to be collected. Virginia customers, however, are supposed to claim out-of-state purchases on their VA income tax return. Texas residents will have to pay sales tax, either to Silencer Shop or their local dealer. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted:
Quoted:
I doubt the out -of-state folks are going to be sticking up for it once they realize sales tax will need to be collected, since SS is now a wholesaler/distributor selling to the local dealer, and not a dealer selling to the end-user. So give it time, and the out-of-staters will start complaining too. For Virginia, the customer is paying SS directly in full, unlike Gun Genie, where the customer pays the dealer when they pickup. Therefore, sales tax does not need to be collected. Virginia customers, however, are supposed to claim out-of-state purchases on their VA income tax return. Texas residents will have to pay sales tax, either to Silencer Shop or their local dealer. That is the old model when SilencerShop was a dealer/retailer and sold direct to customers. Under the new model, SilencerShop is a distributor, they do not sell retail anymore. Thus the local shop is now the retailer. They have also stated the dealers in the PBSS program are affiliates, so that also triggers an in-state business presence. That the details of all this are obscured in fine print or that the silencer is not in inventory at the dealer or Who/How processes payment fulfillment is irrelevant. |
|
[#8]
Quoted:
That is the old model when SilencerShop was a dealer/retailer and sold direct to customers. Under the new model, SilencerShop is a distributor, they do not sell retail anymore. Thus the local shop is now the retailer. They have also stated the dealers in the PBSS program are affiliates, so that also triggers an in-state business presence. That the details of all this are obscured in fine print or that the silencer is not in inventory at the dealer or Who/How processes payment fulfillment is irrelevant. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
I doubt the out -of-state folks are going to be sticking up for it once they realize sales tax will need to be collected, since SS is now a wholesaler/distributor selling to the local dealer, and not a dealer selling to the end-user. So give it time, and the out-of-staters will start complaining too. For Virginia, the customer is paying SS directly in full, unlike Gun Genie, where the customer pays the dealer when they pickup. Therefore, sales tax does not need to be collected. Virginia customers, however, are supposed to claim out-of-state purchases on their VA income tax return. Texas residents will have to pay sales tax, either to Silencer Shop or their local dealer. That is the old model when SilencerShop was a dealer/retailer and sold direct to customers. Under the new model, SilencerShop is a distributor, they do not sell retail anymore. Thus the local shop is now the retailer. They have also stated the dealers in the PBSS program are affiliates, so that also triggers an in-state business presence. That the details of all this are obscured in fine print or that the silencer is not in inventory at the dealer or Who/How processes payment fulfillment is irrelevant. Sorry but you are wrong on that. Since they are affiliates then they do not have to collect tax except in the states that were collecting tax before. We consulted our tax attorney on this. So if you used SSD before and the FFL didn't charge you tax then nothing changes. |
|
[#9]
Quoted:
Sorry but you are wrong on that. Since they are affiliates then they do not have to collect tax except in the states that were collecting tax before. We consulted our tax attorney on this. So if you used SSD before and the FFL didn't charge you tax then nothing changes. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
I doubt the out -of-state folks are going to be sticking up for it once they realize sales tax will need to be collected, since SS is now a wholesaler/distributor selling to the local dealer, and not a dealer selling to the end-user. So give it time, and the out-of-staters will start complaining too. For Virginia, the customer is paying SS directly in full, unlike Gun Genie, where the customer pays the dealer when they pickup. Therefore, sales tax does not need to be collected. Virginia customers, however, are supposed to claim out-of-state purchases on their VA income tax return. Texas residents will have to pay sales tax, either to Silencer Shop or their local dealer. That is the old model when SilencerShop was a dealer/retailer and sold direct to customers. Under the new model, SilencerShop is a distributor, they do not sell retail anymore. Thus the local shop is now the retailer. They have also stated the dealers in the PBSS program are affiliates, so that also triggers an in-state business presence. That the details of all this are obscured in fine print or that the silencer is not in inventory at the dealer or Who/How processes payment fulfillment is irrelevant. Sorry but you are wrong on that. Since they are affiliates then they do not have to collect tax except in the states that were collecting tax before. We consulted our tax attorney on this. So if you used SSD before and the FFL didn't charge you tax then nothing changes. Sorry, but you did not even know there is a Use Tax in Texas and you have been doing business here for years. It is obvious neither you or your attorney has even looked at the Texas Comptroller web page - as it clearly discusses Sales & Use Tax. Either you or your tax attorney needs some serious training. I am not wrong, you do not understand the law or Case Law behind the consequences of the decision you made. If the folks in PBSS are affiliates, SS needs to collect Sales Tax. This is not my opinion, this is the opinion of SCOTUS, and has been the law of the land for decades. Perhaps you should backtrack from the SCOTUS meaning of "affiliates" and acknowledge they are dealers, which is what they are regardless of you calling them affiliates, and this is in-line with your new distributor model. That solves the problem of SS collecting sales tax. Thus as dealers re-selling your products, THEY are required to collect sales tax, not SS. Again, not my opinion, the opinion, of dozens of state Supreme Courts around the nation for decades. Once you SS, decided not to be a retail dealer, but to be a distributor and sell only to other dealers, YOU triggered those other dealers to be required to collect sales tax. My guess, based on everything you have said, is you really are still retail dealers, and this whole claim of distributor only is nonsense. From a marketing perspective you can [incorrectly] claim that, but from a when the books get audited it will show you are still a retail dealer doing transfers. |
|
[#10]
Quoted:
Sorry, but you did not even know there is a Use Tax in Texas and you have been doing business here for years. It is obvious neither you or your attorney has even looked at the Texas Comptroller web page - as it clearly discusses Sales & Use Tax. Either you or your tax attorney needs some serious training. I am not wrong, you do not understand the law or Case Law behind the consequences of the decision you made. If the folks in PBSS are affiliates, SS needs to collect Sales Tax. This is not my opinion, this is the opinion of SCOTUS, and has been the law of the land for decades. Perhaps you should backtrack from the SCOTUS meaning of "affiliates" and acknowledge they are dealers, which is what they are regardless of you calling them affiliates, and this is in-line with your new distributor model. That solves the problem of SS collecting sales tax. Thus as dealers re-selling your products, THEY are required to collect sales tax, not SS. Again, not my opinion, the opinion, of dozens of state Supreme Courts around the nation for decades. Once you SS, decided not to be a retail dealer, but to be a distributor and sell only to other dealers, YOU triggered those other dealers to be required to collect sales tax. My guess, based on everything you have said, is you really are still retail dealers, and this whole claim of distributor only is nonsense. From a marketing perspective you can [incorrectly] claim that, but from a when the books get audited it will show you are still a retail dealer doing transfers. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
I doubt the out -of-state folks are going to be sticking up for it once they realize sales tax will need to be collected, since SS is now a wholesaler/distributor selling to the local dealer, and not a dealer selling to the end-user. So give it time, and the out-of-staters will start complaining too. For Virginia, the customer is paying SS directly in full, unlike Gun Genie, where the customer pays the dealer when they pickup. Therefore, sales tax does not need to be collected. Virginia customers, however, are supposed to claim out-of-state purchases on their VA income tax return. Texas residents will have to pay sales tax, either to Silencer Shop or their local dealer. That is the old model when SilencerShop was a dealer/retailer and sold direct to customers. Under the new model, SilencerShop is a distributor, they do not sell retail anymore. Thus the local shop is now the retailer. They have also stated the dealers in the PBSS program are affiliates, so that also triggers an in-state business presence. That the details of all this are obscured in fine print or that the silencer is not in inventory at the dealer or Who/How processes payment fulfillment is irrelevant. Sorry but you are wrong on that. Since they are affiliates then they do not have to collect tax except in the states that were collecting tax before. We consulted our tax attorney on this. So if you used SSD before and the FFL didn't charge you tax then nothing changes. Sorry, but you did not even know there is a Use Tax in Texas and you have been doing business here for years. It is obvious neither you or your attorney has even looked at the Texas Comptroller web page - as it clearly discusses Sales & Use Tax. Either you or your tax attorney needs some serious training. I am not wrong, you do not understand the law or Case Law behind the consequences of the decision you made. If the folks in PBSS are affiliates, SS needs to collect Sales Tax. This is not my opinion, this is the opinion of SCOTUS, and has been the law of the land for decades. Perhaps you should backtrack from the SCOTUS meaning of "affiliates" and acknowledge they are dealers, which is what they are regardless of you calling them affiliates, and this is in-line with your new distributor model. That solves the problem of SS collecting sales tax. Thus as dealers re-selling your products, THEY are required to collect sales tax, not SS. Again, not my opinion, the opinion, of dozens of state Supreme Courts around the nation for decades. Once you SS, decided not to be a retail dealer, but to be a distributor and sell only to other dealers, YOU triggered those other dealers to be required to collect sales tax. My guess, based on everything you have said, is you really are still retail dealers, and this whole claim of distributor only is nonsense. From a marketing perspective you can [incorrectly] claim that, but from a when the books get audited it will show you are still a retail dealer doing transfers. Time will tell. You clearly have some animosity toward us so my guess is that you have some interest in discrediting us. |
|
[#11]
Quoted:
You clearly have some animosity toward us so my guess is that you have some interest in discrediting us. View Quote Ah, the Donald Trump strategy, disagree with the message, so attack the messenger. Perhaps you should re-read the message: My guess, based on everything you have said, is you really are still retail dealers, and this whole claim of distributor only is nonsense. From a marketing perspective you can [incorrectly] claim that, but from a when the books get audited it will show you are still a retail dealer doing transfers. This is not animosity, this is not discrediting you. You should be agreeing with me, as it defends you from the tax consequences of a distributor/dealer relationship. Other than changing words, dealer/distributor, affiliate/dealer, Powered by Silencer Shop/SS Direct, nothing has changed legally in your model. This is good news for out-of-state consumers. ETA Of the dozens of Texas folks stating in this and other threads they will no longer buy from you, I am NOT one them. How ironic that one the few customers who has chosen not to dump you, you think is trying to discredit you.... |
|
[#12]
Quoted:
Ah, the Donald Trump strategy, disagree with the message, so attack the messenger. Perhaps you should re-read the message: My guess, based on everything you have said, is you really are still retail dealers, and this whole claim of distributor only is nonsense. From a marketing perspective you can [incorrectly] claim that, but from a when the books get audited it will show you are still a retail dealer doing transfers. This is not animosity, this is not discrediting you. You should be agreeing with me, as it defends you from the tax consequences of a distributor/dealer relationship. Other than changing words, dealer/distributor, affiliate/dealer, Powered by Silencer Shop/SS Direct, nothing has changed legally in your model. This is good news for out-of-state consumers. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted:
Quoted:
You clearly have some animosity toward us so my guess is that you have some interest in discrediting us. Ah, the Donald Trump strategy, disagree with the message, so attack the messenger. Perhaps you should re-read the message: My guess, based on everything you have said, is you really are still retail dealers, and this whole claim of distributor only is nonsense. From a marketing perspective you can [incorrectly] claim that, but from a when the books get audited it will show you are still a retail dealer doing transfers. This is not animosity, this is not discrediting you. You should be agreeing with me, as it defends you from the tax consequences of a distributor/dealer relationship. Other than changing words, dealer/distributor, affiliate/dealer, Powered by Silencer Shop/SS Direct, nothing has changed legally in your model. This is good news for out-of-state consumers. If we were still selling retail then we could not sell as distributors as was stated earlier. Also if we were still selling retail then all of this would be pointless. |
|
[#13]
Quoted:
If we were still selling retail... View Quote Words have meaning, you are still selling retail: re·tail 're?tal noun 1. the sale of goods to the public in relatively small quantities for use or consumption rather than for resale. "the product's retail price" whole·sale 'hol?sal noun 1. the selling of goods in large quantities to be retailed by others. When I (public) order One Omega [small quantity] later this week (because I am not one of the people who said they would no longer buy from you) for consumption and not resale, that makes it a retail sale. Get over it. |
|
[#14]
Quoted:
Words have meaning, you are still selling retail: re·tail 're?tal noun 1. the sale of goods to the public in relatively small quantities for use or consumption rather than for resale. "the product's retail price" whole·sale 'hol?sal noun 1. the selling of goods in large quantities to be retailed by others. When I (public) order One Omega [small quantity] later this week (because I am not one of the people who said they would no longer buy from you) for consumption and not resale, that makes it a retail sale. Get over it. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted:
Quoted:
If we were still selling retail... Words have meaning, you are still selling retail: re·tail 're?tal noun 1. the sale of goods to the public in relatively small quantities for use or consumption rather than for resale. "the product's retail price" whole·sale 'hol?sal noun 1. the selling of goods in large quantities to be retailed by others. When I (public) order One Omega [small quantity] later this week (because I am not one of the people who said they would no longer buy from you) for consumption and not resale, that makes it a retail sale. Get over it. Is Davidson's a wholesaler or a retailer? By your definition they are a retailer but no one would say that they are. |
|
[#15]
Quoted:
Is Davidson's a wholesaler or a retailer? By your definition they are a retailer but no one would say that they are. View Quote Yeah, you probably did not want to go there. They are a wholesaler, and as such their dealers collect tax as I outlined above. From FAQ: http://www11.davidsonsinc.com/PublicPages/default.aspx?pg=faq Why do I have need to submit a state sales tax form? Davidson’s, Inc. is a “Wholesale” firearms company, selling only to true firearms dealers. Davidson’s is not set up to collect or remit state sales taxes. Each Dealer needs to provide a state sales tax form confirming they will be charging appropriate sales tax at the point of sale Like I said, you may want to get a tax attorney who knows tax law. |
|
[#16]
Quoted:
Yeah, you probably did not want to go there. From FAQ: http://www11.davidsonsinc.com/PublicPages/default.aspx?pg=faq Why do I have need to submit a state sales tax form? Davidson’s, Inc. is a “Wholesale” firearms company, selling only to true firearms dealers. Davidson’s is not set up to collect or remit state sales taxes. Each Dealer needs to provide a state sales tax form confirming they will be charging appropriate sales tax at the point of sale Like I said, you may want to get a tax attorney who knows tax law. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted:
Quoted:
Is Davidson's a wholesaler or a retailer? By your definition they are a retailer but no one would say that they are. Yeah, you probably did not want to go there. From FAQ: http://www11.davidsonsinc.com/PublicPages/default.aspx?pg=faq Why do I have need to submit a state sales tax form? Davidson’s, Inc. is a “Wholesale” firearms company, selling only to true firearms dealers. Davidson’s is not set up to collect or remit state sales taxes. Each Dealer needs to provide a state sales tax form confirming they will be charging appropriate sales tax at the point of sale Like I said, you may want to get a tax attorney who knows tax law. Difference is that the FFL is collecting money at the time of pick up in Davidson's model. It even says that "at the point of sale" since you are only putting a deposit down to have it shipped. They are still a wholesaler/distributor. If we are wrong on the tax then we will say so and move on, but this is how it stands now. |
|
[#17]
Quoted:
Difference is that the FFL is collecting money at the time of pick up in Davidson's model. It even says that "at the point of sale" since you are only putting a deposit down to have it shipped. They are still a wholesaler/distributor. If we are wrong on the tax then we will stay so but this is how it stands now. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Is Davidson's a wholesaler or a retailer? By your definition they are a retailer but no one would say that they are. Yeah, you probably did not want to go there. From FAQ: http://www11.davidsonsinc.com/PublicPages/default.aspx?pg=faq Why do I have need to submit a state sales tax form? Davidson’s, Inc. is a “Wholesale” firearms company, selling only to true firearms dealers. Davidson’s is not set up to collect or remit state sales taxes. Each Dealer needs to provide a state sales tax form confirming they will be charging appropriate sales tax at the point of sale Like I said, you may want to get a tax attorney who knows tax law. Difference is that the FFL is collecting money at the time of pick up in Davidson's model. It even says that "at the point of sale" since you are only putting a deposit down to have it shipped. They are still a wholesaler/distributor. If we are wrong on the tax then we will stay so but this is how it stands now. As I stated, I do not think you are wrong on tax. You are wrong on calling yourself a distributor. You are still a dealer selling silencers using FFL to xfer. Davidson's is a distributor selling to dealers. The differences in your model and theirs is obvious I think. If you want to be a distributor like Davidsons, go for it but you see the consequences of that. |
|
[#19]
Quoted:
I understand what you are saying but I think we are looking at it from two different angles. In our eyes, the eyes of the FFL's, the manufacturers eyes we are a distributor. You are saying that we are retail because customers can use our website to purchase silencers from other FFL's instead of purchasing from their site. Please correct me if I am wrong in that. View Quote Yes, I am looking at it through the eyes of a Tax Comptroller/IRS and what reporting is legally required. The silencer industry is very new to wholesaling, no surprise they are loose with terms; it was only a few years ago dealers bought direct from MFG. Clever ones pooled resources to get volume pricing, then distributed among themselves later. Most dealers remembers the 10+ pricing models, few knew about the 50/100 + pricing models, or the "buy the entire run" models. I was shocked when RSR finally got an SOT. Things got real. Based on what I know, your sales model is the same as it was prior to 8/3. Nothing has changed, except presentation to customer, and streamling some business practices (no offense intended, these are good things). You take orders from end-users (not resellers), who buy direct from you in small quantities. So when ARFCOM John buys an SDN-6 from you, pays with his personal credit card, to use said silencer on his personal gun, with no Comptroller/IRS reporting on his part, this is retail sales regardless of what you want to call it. ARFCOM John is the buyer, SS is the seller. Now you could also be a distributor, if you take orders from resellers who may also buy from you, So when ARFCOM Dealer buys X SDN-6 from you, funds eventually coming from a business account, to use said silencer for resale to others, with Comptroller/IRS reporting, this is wholesale. ARFCOM Dealer is seller, SS is wholesaler. You do both, but what is at issue here is the name of first one. |
|
[#20]
Quoted:
Yes, I am looking at it through the eyes of a Tax Comptroller/IRS and what reporting is legally required. The silencer industry is very new to wholesaling, no surprise they are loose with terms; it was only a few years ago dealers bought direct from MFG. Clever ones pooled resources to get volume pricing, then distributed among themselves later. Most dealers remembers the 10+ pricing models, few knew about the 50/100 + pricing models, or the "buy the entire run" models. I was shocked when RSR finally got an SOT. Things got real. Based on what I know, your sales model is the same as it was prior to 8/3. Nothing has changed, except presentation to customer, and streamling some business practices (no offense intended, these are good things). You take orders from end-users (not resellers), who buy direct from you in small quantities. So when ARFCOM John buys an SDN-6 from you, pays with his personal credit card, to use said silencer on his personal gun, with no Comptroller/IRS reporting on his part, this is retail sales regardless of what you want to call it. ARFCOM John is the buyer, SS is the seller. Now you could also be a distributor, if you take orders from resellers who may also buy from you, So when ARFCOM Dealer buys X SDN-6 from you, funds eventually coming from a business account, to use said silencer for resale to others, with Comptroller/IRS reporting, this is wholesale. ARFCOM Dealer is seller, SS is wholesaler. You do both, but what is at issue here is the name of first one. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted:
Quoted:
I understand what you are saying but I think we are looking at it from two different angles. In our eyes, the eyes of the FFL's, the manufacturers eyes we are a distributor. You are saying that we are retail because customers can use our website to purchase silencers from other FFL's instead of purchasing from their site. Please correct me if I am wrong in that. Yes, I am looking at it through the eyes of a Tax Comptroller/IRS and what reporting is legally required. The silencer industry is very new to wholesaling, no surprise they are loose with terms; it was only a few years ago dealers bought direct from MFG. Clever ones pooled resources to get volume pricing, then distributed among themselves later. Most dealers remembers the 10+ pricing models, few knew about the 50/100 + pricing models, or the "buy the entire run" models. I was shocked when RSR finally got an SOT. Things got real. Based on what I know, your sales model is the same as it was prior to 8/3. Nothing has changed, except presentation to customer, and streamling some business practices (no offense intended, these are good things). You take orders from end-users (not resellers), who buy direct from you in small quantities. So when ARFCOM John buys an SDN-6 from you, pays with his personal credit card, to use said silencer on his personal gun, with no Comptroller/IRS reporting on his part, this is retail sales regardless of what you want to call it. ARFCOM John is the buyer, SS is the seller. Now you could also be a distributor, if you take orders from resellers who may also buy from you, So when ARFCOM Dealer buys X SDN-6 from you, funds eventually coming from a business account, to use said silencer for resale to others, with Comptroller/IRS reporting, this is wholesale. ARFCOM Dealer is seller, SS is wholesaler. You do both, but what is at issue here is the name of first one. We are on the same page just calling it different wording. Good talking to you and you are going to enjoy that Omega. |
|
[#21]
Quoted:
We are on the same page just calling it different wording. Good talking to you and you are going to enjoy that Omega. View Quote Yes after this discussion I see you are not truly following the Davidson's wholesale model, which has dealers collecting tax. I see it is down to 105 here in DFW now, time to shoot the MIST-22 you sold me! Omega coming soon! |
|
[#22]
Well how about that. Just 2 days after I talked up, what used to be, a great company I find out about this horse shit! Hey good on y'all for your companies success! I am all for capitalism! On another note you guys suck! The closest power dealer is 56 fucking miles away from me! Guess I'll just have to suck it up and deal with the 2 over priced POS dealers in my area instead.
|
|
[#23]
Also, I always thought it was pretty fucked up that y'all were in Austin. Now it seems to be a very fitting place for y'all.
|
|
[#24]
Quoted:
Well how about that. Just 2 days after I talked up, what used to be, a great company I find out about this horse shit! Hey good on y'all for your companies success! I am all for capitalism! On another note you guys suck! The closest power dealer is 56 fucking miles away from me! Guess I'll just have to suck it up and deal with the 2 over priced POS dealers in my area instead. View Quote Ever stop and wonder why SS got out of retail? Look in the mirror. |
|
[#25]
Just made my first purchase from them and it was easy and they were extremely helpful. I don't have any previous purchases to compare it to, only thing that sucks for me is I have no NFA dealers in my area so will be having to make a 150 mile trip to a powered dealer. So I missed out on the ability to get it mailed to me(have been saving for a while now). The round trip could be used for more goodies. However i'm still satisfied with the purchase. In the long run i'm hoping it brings down prices(it just went up 40$) and makes availability a little better.
If no one else has done it yet: Made purchase online, chose powered dealer. Paid for purchase. Got an email to upload trust. Got an email saying they got documents and would call and email when its approved. (the documents showed where it was being transfered to) I did go ahead and email the dealer and they also said they would contact me as soon as its approved and would just need to come and fill out paperwork like buying a firearm when it comes in. All in all I see where people are coming from, but I understand SS too. After putting this much effort into a business model change i don't think they will be reverting back. So lets focus on bringing down prices, i'm gonna need a 7.62 can eventually. |
|
[#26]
Quoted:
...only thing that sucks for me is I have no NFA dealers in my area so will be having to make a 150 mile trip to a powered dealer. So I missed out on the ability to get it mailed to me(have been saving for a while now). The round trip could be used for more goodies. View Quote Why are you missing out? That's not an exclusive Silencer Shop deal...any dealer in your state can do the same thing. It's a federal law. I've had dealers here in NC (that I bought directly from, no SS involvement) that have mailed them to me. Yes, some dealers are clueless, as I had another dealer here (that was actually an SS Direct dealer) tell me he couldn't do it because I wasn't a Class 3 dealer. (I simply told him couldn't and wouldn't are two completely different things). |
|
[#27]
Quoted:
Why are you missing out? That's not an exclusive Silencer Shop deal...any dealer in your state can do the same thing. It's a federal law. I've had dealers here in NC (that I bought directly from, no SS involvement) that have mailed them to me. Yes, some dealers are clueless, as I had another dealer here (that was actually an SS Direct dealer) tell me he couldn't do it because I wasn't a Class 3 dealer. (I simply told him couldn't and wouldn't are two completely different things). View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted:
Quoted:
...only thing that sucks for me is I have no NFA dealers in my area so will be having to make a 150 mile trip to a powered dealer. So I missed out on the ability to get it mailed to me(have been saving for a while now). The round trip could be used for more goodies. Why are you missing out? That's not an exclusive Silencer Shop deal...any dealer in your state can do the same thing. It's a federal law. I've had dealers here in NC (that I bought directly from, no SS involvement) that have mailed them to me. Yes, some dealers are clueless, as I had another dealer here (that was actually an SS Direct dealer) tell me he couldn't do it because I wasn't a Class 3 dealer. (I simply told him couldn't and wouldn't are two completely different things). You have to have a letter from the ATF but other than that you are correct any FFL can ship silencers. We are working with some FFL's to have that ability. |
|
[#28]
Quoted:
But what I haven't said is that we actually send a check to the FFL that is closest to the customer that bought that accessory. So we are not competing against them, we are sending them the difference in their cost and what it sold for. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Oh I believe Silencer Shop has made it perfectly clear on their stance with dealing with in state customers now Again, I hope there's enough customer outcry to change this bad decision Sure they are. SS has already stated they will take continue to take orders and drop ship direct to end users (bypassing dealers) accessories such as muzzle brakes, flash hiders, pistons, and everything else, except silencers. This is what folks cannot understand, if they can continue to do it for everything else, why not continue to do it for silencers? But what I haven't said is that we actually send a check to the FFL that is closest to the customer that bought that accessory. So we are not competing against them, we are sending them the difference in their cost and what it sold for. Really? Why? Maybe there is a reason we didn't go to that FFL down the street. There are a few FFLs with a few blocks of me that I refuse to do business with, yet you will be cutting them a check. If we are willing to do business with a company 2-8 hours away instead of supporting our local douche-bag FFL then let us. But don't cut a check the d-bag we decided not to do business with. Hell donate it to charity but why send it to an FFL that is close to me? The concept makes absolutely no sense to me. |
|
[#29]
Found this on another thread but it sums up how I feel pretty accurately. For example, I already had the option to deal with the companies in and around Houston back when I purchased my last can, yet decided against it and was more than happy to drive all the way to Austin. I was actually planning out my next purchase when I noticed the change. I looked through the list of shops in my area and have only heard of a couple of them, yet have had little to no reason to visit them. Frankly, I would like to keep it that way but now it looks like I am being forced to find a class III dealer that I want to do business with.
The reason I chose SS in the past was because I was told they had the best customer service around. Hence why I was willing to travel to Austin with my wife and 5 month old son just to pick up a can and have some BBQ. Now I have to pick a dealer off your list, research them, see if anyone I know has shopped there, and then see if they are worth doing business with. However, if they met that criteria the first time I would have purchased from them long ago. My search continues I guess. Great day to be a Texan Quoted:
VERY DISAPPOINTING! You guys were my local dealer because the ones in my area are not as sophisticated, efficient, or effective. It is much easier and less aggravating to drive to Austin to deal with you directly. If I wanted to deal with someone locally I would already be dealing with them. I hope this works out for you like you plan, but I have my doubts based on what I have experienced. View Quote |
|
[#30]
Quoted:
The reason I chose SS in the past was because I was told they had the best customer service around. Hence why I was willing to travel to Austin with my wife and 5 month old son just to pick up a can and have some BBQ. Now I have to pick a dealer off your list, research them, see if anyone I know has shopped there, and then see if they are worth doing business with. However, if they met that criteria the first time I would have purchased from them long ago. View Quote There are still ways to do the exact thing you describe. Same quality service, same trip to Austin, same BBQ. One of them it to use the new program and choose Capital Armory...as they're ~4 miles apart. So it takes an extra 2 weeks? Does that really matter in the big picture? Maybe the 2nd week has better weather anyway. (and since this is SS's Industry Forum, I won't list the second way) |
|
[#31]
Quoted:
You have to have a letter from the ATF but other than that you are correct any FFL can ship silencers. We are working with some FFL's to have that ability. View Quote A letter from ATF isn't required. See ATF Procedure 2013-2. Individual state laws may vary of course. Virginia doesn't care either way. |
|
[#32]
Quoted:
There are still ways to do the exact thing you describe. Same quality service, same trip to Austin, same BBQ. One of them it to use the new program and choose Capital Armory...as they're ~4 miles apart. So it takes an extra 2 weeks? Does that really matter in the big picture? Maybe the 2nd week has better weather anyway. (and since this is SS's Industry Forum, I won't list the second way) View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted:
Quoted:
The reason I chose SS in the past was because I was told they had the best customer service around. Hence why I was willing to travel to Austin with my wife and 5 month old son just to pick up a can and have some BBQ. Now I have to pick a dealer off your list, research them, see if anyone I know has shopped there, and then see if they are worth doing business with. However, if they met that criteria the first time I would have purchased from them long ago. There are still ways to do the exact thing you describe. Same quality service, same trip to Austin, same BBQ. One of them it to use the new program and choose Capital Armory...as they're ~4 miles apart. So it takes an extra 2 weeks? Does that really matter in the big picture? Maybe the 2nd week has better weather anyway. (and since this is SS's Industry Forum, I won't list the second way) I'll look them up if I can't find a dealer on their list that I trust. I know two of them, that are close to me, are run by idiots that overcharge for all kinds of crap (idiots around here have more money than brains it seems). I think my main concern is the fact that I could have paid less from a couple of other shops last time, yet went with SS due to their reputation. However, now I have to find a shop oj their list that has an outstanding reputation. Also, I find it odd that they send a check to the closest FFL when I buy an accessory from them. That doesn't even make sense to me due to the fact that I may hate the closest shop next to me, yet they still get some of my cash. |
|
[#33]
Quoted:
I'll look them up if I can't find a dealer on their list that I trust. I know two of them, that are close to me, are run by idiots that overcharge for all kinds of crap (idiots around here have more money than brains it seems). I think my main concern is the fact that I could have paid less from a couple of other shops last time, yet went with SS due to their reputation. However, now I have to find a shop oj their list that has an outstanding reputation. Also, I find it odd that they send a check to the closest FFL when I buy an accessory from them. That doesn't even make sense to me due to the fact that I may hate the closest shop next to me, yet they still get some of my cash. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
The reason I chose SS in the past was because I was told they had the best customer service around. Hence why I was willing to travel to Austin with my wife and 5 month old son just to pick up a can and have some BBQ. Now I have to pick a dealer off your list, research them, see if anyone I know has shopped there, and then see if they are worth doing business with. However, if they met that criteria the first time I would have purchased from them long ago. There are still ways to do the exact thing you describe. Same quality service, same trip to Austin, same BBQ. One of them it to use the new program and choose Capital Armory...as they're ~4 miles apart. So it takes an extra 2 weeks? Does that really matter in the big picture? Maybe the 2nd week has better weather anyway. (and since this is SS's Industry Forum, I won't list the second way) I'll look them up if I can't find a dealer on their list that I trust. I know two of them, that are close to me, are run by idiots that overcharge for all kinds of crap (idiots around here have more money than brains it seems). I think my main concern is the fact that I could have paid less from a couple of other shops last time, yet went with SS due to their reputation. However, now I have to find a shop oj their list that has an outstanding reputation. Also, I find it odd that they send a check to the closest FFL when I buy an accessory from them. That doesn't even make sense to me due to the fact that I may hate the closest shop next to me, yet they still get some of my cash. We still do the paperwork and there is no transfer fee. So all you are doing is picking it up from the other FFL. |
|
[#34]
Quoted:
We still do the paperwork and there is no transfer fee. So all you are doing is picking it up from the other FFL. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
The reason I chose SS in the past was because I was told they had the best customer service around. Hence why I was willing to travel to Austin with my wife and 5 month old son just to pick up a can and have some BBQ. Now I have to pick a dealer off your list, research them, see if anyone I know has shopped there, and then see if they are worth doing business with. However, if they met that criteria the first time I would have purchased from them long ago. There are still ways to do the exact thing you describe. Same quality service, same trip to Austin, same BBQ. One of them it to use the new program and choose Capital Armory...as they're ~4 miles apart. So it takes an extra 2 weeks? Does that really matter in the big picture? Maybe the 2nd week has better weather anyway. (and since this is SS's Industry Forum, I won't list the second way) I'll look them up if I can't find a dealer on their list that I trust. I know two of them, that are close to me, are run by idiots that overcharge for all kinds of crap (idiots around here have more money than brains it seems). I think my main concern is the fact that I could have paid less from a couple of other shops last time, yet went with SS due to their reputation. However, now I have to find a shop oj their list that has an outstanding reputation. Also, I find it odd that they send a check to the closest FFL when I buy an accessory from them. That doesn't even make sense to me due to the fact that I may hate the closest shop next to me, yet they still get some of my cash. We still do the paperwork and there is no transfer fee. So all you are doing is picking it up from the other FFL. I understand the benefits. Just got to find someone on your list that i like. However, why does the closest shop to me get a cut of the sale when i purchase an accessory? Is that a deal you have worked out with them? Why the closest dealer? Why not a dealer of my choosing? 90% of the "dealers" in my area sell over priced products. Hence why i typically order things off of the internet. If i am inadvertently supporting a business that i could care less about then that isn't very beneficial to me. EDIT: I see that your website has a price and the dealers have their set price. Maybe i missed this so i am sorry in advance. Am i buying the silencer for your price or their price? I only have two options that are within 30 miles. One of them doesn't even have a website and a bit of investigating leads me to believe he is dealing out of his house. Nothing against him but I'm not in the mood to jump through hoops and his personal life in order to pick up a suppressor. The other is a dealer that I'm not very fond of, yet are at least run out of an actual store-front. So yea i save money in gas but I am now supporting businesses that I wanted nothing to do with in the first place. |
|
[#35]
Quoted:
EDIT: I see that your website has a price and the dealers have their set price. Maybe i missed this so i am sorry in advance. Am i buying the silencer for your price or their price? View Quote The price SS has listed is the "from" price...which is simply the cheapest. As I understand it, you're paying the cost that's listed by your dealer. It could be the suggested SS price, or anything that dealer feels like changing it to. |
|
[#36]
Quoted:
I understand the benefits. Just got to find someone on your list that i like. However, why does the closest shop to me get a cut of the sale when i purchase an accessory? Is that a deal you have worked out with them? Why the closest dealer? Why not a dealer of my choosing? 90% of the "dealers" in my area sell over priced products. Hence why i typically order things off of the internet. If i am inadvertently supporting a business that i could care less about then that isn't very beneficial to me. EDIT: I see that your website has a price and the dealers have their set price. Maybe i missed this so i am sorry in advance. Am i buying the silencer for your price or their price? I only have two options that are within 30 miles. One of them doesn't even have a website and a bit of investigating leads me to believe he is dealing out of his house. Nothing against him but I'm not in the mood to jump through hoops and his personal life in order to pick up a suppressor. The other is a dealer that I'm not very fond of, yet are at least run out of an actual store-front. So yea i save money in gas but I am now supporting businesses that I wanted nothing to do with in the first place. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
The reason I chose SS in the past was because I was told they had the best customer service around. Hence why I was willing to travel to Austin with my wife and 5 month old son just to pick up a can and have some BBQ. Now I have to pick a dealer off your list, research them, see if anyone I know has shopped there, and then see if they are worth doing business with. However, if they met that criteria the first time I would have purchased from them long ago. There are still ways to do the exact thing you describe. Same quality service, same trip to Austin, same BBQ. One of them it to use the new program and choose Capital Armory...as they're ~4 miles apart. So it takes an extra 2 weeks? Does that really matter in the big picture? Maybe the 2nd week has better weather anyway. (and since this is SS's Industry Forum, I won't list the second way) I'll look them up if I can't find a dealer on their list that I trust. I know two of them, that are close to me, are run by idiots that overcharge for all kinds of crap (idiots around here have more money than brains it seems). I think my main concern is the fact that I could have paid less from a couple of other shops last time, yet went with SS due to their reputation. However, now I have to find a shop oj their list that has an outstanding reputation. Also, I find it odd that they send a check to the closest FFL when I buy an accessory from them. That doesn't even make sense to me due to the fact that I may hate the closest shop next to me, yet they still get some of my cash. We still do the paperwork and there is no transfer fee. So all you are doing is picking it up from the other FFL. I understand the benefits. Just got to find someone on your list that i like. However, why does the closest shop to me get a cut of the sale when i purchase an accessory? Is that a deal you have worked out with them? Why the closest dealer? Why not a dealer of my choosing? 90% of the "dealers" in my area sell over priced products. Hence why i typically order things off of the internet. If i am inadvertently supporting a business that i could care less about then that isn't very beneficial to me. EDIT: I see that your website has a price and the dealers have their set price. Maybe i missed this so i am sorry in advance. Am i buying the silencer for your price or their price? I only have two options that are within 30 miles. One of them doesn't even have a website and a bit of investigating leads me to believe he is dealing out of his house. Nothing against him but I'm not in the mood to jump through hoops and his personal life in order to pick up a suppressor. The other is a dealer that I'm not very fond of, yet are at least run out of an actual store-front. So yea i save money in gas but I am now supporting businesses that I wanted nothing to do with in the first place. The only way to be fair with the accessory orders is to send it to the closest FFL. However if you purchase a silencer and an accessory it will go to that FFL. |
|
Sign up for the ARFCOM weekly newsletter and be entered to win a free ARFCOM membership. One new winner* is announced every week!
You will receive an email every Friday morning featuring the latest chatter from the hottest topics, breaking news surrounding legislation, as well as exclusive deals only available to ARFCOM email subscribers.
AR15.COM is the world's largest firearm community and is a gathering place for firearm enthusiasts of all types.
From hunters and military members, to competition shooters and general firearm enthusiasts, we welcome anyone who values and respects the way of the firearm.
Subscribe to our monthly Newsletter to receive firearm news, product discounts from your favorite Industry Partners, and more.
Copyright © 1996-2024 AR15.COM LLC. All Rights Reserved.
Any use of this content without express written consent is prohibited.
AR15.Com reserves the right to overwrite or replace any affiliate, commercial, or monetizable links, posted by users, with our own.