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Posted: 1/14/2017 1:40:22 PM EDT
For $140 - $200 beans (depending on your choice), I may need to order a "middy" up
16" Carbine with A2/sight CARBINE 16" Middy no front sight MIDDY 20" no front sight No A2 sight 20" with A2 sight/gas block With A2 sight |
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I'm curious as to why so cheap for CHF. Not complaining, just simply curious
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For $140 - $200 beans (depending on your choice), I may need to order "middy" up and play with it a little 16" Carbine with A2/sight CARBINE 16" Middy no front sight MIDDY 20" no front sight No A2 sight 20" with A2 sight/gas block With A2 sight View Quote You missed the two 14.7" PSA HF Nitrides! 14.7" Middy with A2/sight 14.7" with FSB 14.7" Barrel only (http: Link says 20 inch but links to the 14.7" barrel - Item #516444712) 14.7” Middy Barrel This is the previous thread from September 2016 where they were talking about the PSA HF Kits. Here (Archived) (ETA: Dodge1 beat me to it! ETA2: fixed link) PSA makes some of their own barrels... Is PSA making the HF ones? Hammer Forges are rather expensive. As long as they're good shooters... I don't care. I asked if they were going to come out with 14.7" Middies back in September as I didn't see them back then. But I ordered one the other day Then went to get one of their Stealth Upper Receivers, but they were OOS I have a 16" A2 Premium Middy upper that doesn't get much use. Going to break it down and put an A2 upper receiver on it for a PSA A2 Middy KISS build |
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Yep, sure did. I didn't go looking for anything shorter (shame on me! ). I'm thinking of getting that 16" middy, to re-barrel one of my completed builds .
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You missed the two 14.7" PSA HF Nitrides! 14.7" Middy with A2/sight 14.7" with FSB 14.7" Barrel only (http: Link says 20 inch but links to the 14.7" barrel - Item #516444712) 14.7” Middy Barrel This is the previous thread from September 2016 where they were talking about the PSA HF Kits. Here (Archived) (ETA: Dodge1 beat me to it! ETA2: fixed link) PSA makes some of their own barrels... Is PSA making the HF ones? Hammer Forges are rather expensive. As long as they're good shooters... I don't care. I asked if they were going to come out with 14.7" Middies back in September as I didn't see them back then. But I ordered one the other day Then went to get one of their Stealth Upper Receivers, but they were OOS I have a 16" A2 Premium Middy upper that doesn't get much use. Going to break it down and put an A2 upper receiver on it for a PSA A2 Middy KISS build View Quote ya theyre expensive. but PSA is just one part of the machine mentioned in another thread. so there's that too. i do have to admit, that 14.7 is calling my name. hard core. |
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I just wish they weren't nitrided. I am looking for a 20" A2 barrel but the shiny finish makes it a no go for the build I want. I'm guessing that they can get their barrels nitrided for cheaper than chrome lining and thats why these are very fairly priced.
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I just wish they weren't nitrided. I am looking for a 20" A2 barrel but the shiny finish makes it a no go for the build I want. I'm guessing that they can get their barrels nitrided for cheaper than chrome lining and thats why these are very fairly priced. View Quote barrels usually are produced in batches, thus right now im sure with the nitride finish being all the rage, the nitride batches are hot n heavy. that said, PSA will produce parked barells again, they always do.. just gotta be patient. |
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I'm curious as to why so cheap for CHF. Not complaining, just simply curious View Quote Not sure? But up until recently, PSA used to state that all their CHF barrels, even the stainless ones, were manufactured by FN. They'd also say that if the description doesn't specifically state that it''s an FN barrel, then it's not. These Freedom CHF barrels may not be made by FN and the price could reflect that. Also, for what it's worth, Nutnfancy does a review on a complete PSA rifle which appears to have the new CHF Freedom barrel. -> https://youtu.be/_S54H0iSo_c |
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I'm curious as to why so cheap for CHF. Not complaining, just simply curious View Quote It's one of the cheapest and easiest (and coincidentally, least accurate) ways to make a barrel. It started back in one of the world wars when barrel manufacturing couldn't meet demand, so a method was developed that could. Marketing alone is responsible for the higher price. |
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Not sure? But up until recently, PSA used to state that all their CHF barrels, even the stainless ones, were manufactured by FN. They'd also say that if the description doesn't specifically state that it''s an FN barrel, then it's not. These Freedom CHF barrels may not be made by FN and the price could reflect that. Also, for what it's worth, Nutnfancy does a review on a complete PSA rifle which appears to have the new CHF Freedom barrel. -> https://youtu.be/_S54H0iSo_c View Quote How can you tell it's the new CHF nitrided barrel ? I don't think it is . |
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How can you tell it's the new CHF nitrided barrel ? I don't think it is . View Quote Well Nutn doesn't specify a sku number for this review, but at (9:07) he says CHF and then at (9:20) he says Melonite. Then of course the title of the review is "Palmetto State Armory "Freedom" AR-15". |
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Did a little more digging and answered my own question. That is, the PSA Freedom CHF barrels are not made by FN, rather, they are made by PSA.
I haven't been up on recent AR news lately so this probably isn't a news flash to many of you... Cited Link: http://www.ar15.com/forums/t_2_301/278944_-ARCHIVED-THREAD----Hammer-Forged-Nitride-Freedom--.html&page=1 |
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Well Nutn doesn't specify a sku number for this review, but at (9:07) he says CHF and then at (9:20) he says Melonite. Then of course the title of the review is "Palmetto State Armory "Freedom" AR-15". View Quote I couldn't find the Freedom complete rifle with the CHF nitrided barrels on the site and I knew this is a fairly new offering as being CHF nitrided. Was it a kit or whole rifle? Translation, I have seen the kits but not whole rifles with the CHF nitrided offerings. But I would also not look for the complete rifle as I prefer to build and may have overlooked the rifle with Nitrided CHF option. |
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I couldn't find the Freedom complete rifle with the CHF nitrided barrels on the site and I knew this is a fairly new offering as being CHF nitrided. Was it a kit or whole rifle? Translation, I have seen the kits but not whole rifles with the CHF nitrided offerings. But I would also not look for the complete rifle as I prefer to build and may have overlooked the rifle with Nitrided CHF option. View Quote Nutn speaks as though he purchased a complete rifle from PSA and not a rifle kit. Note at (13:52) he shows a zip-lock bag with a PSA Owners Manual, a PSA branded firearm safety lock and a PMAG. This would seem consistent with a compete firearm and not an upper or rifle kit. Exactly four months ago on 9/16/2016, PSA announced a " Freedom Hammer Forged Nitride M4 Rifle kit". PSA's link is now dead -> LINK Yes, that is a rifle "kit" in the link above but at some point over the last four months PSA could have manufactured and sold a complete rifle with the same or similar barrel. Just because an item isn't currently shown on their website doesn't mean it never existed. In fact, this seems consistent with previous botched or problematic roll-outs from PSA, namely, the 1911, AK47 and AR-10. This CHF Freedom barrel could be the same. Now they are trying to unload the barrels as stand alone items and not in an upper assembly or rifle kit. |
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Nutn speaks as though he purchased a complete rifle from PSA and not a rifle kit. Note at (13:52) he shows a zip-lock bag with a PSA Owners Manual, a PSA branded firearm safety lock and a PMAG. This would seem consistent with a compete firearm and not an upper or rifle kit. Exactly four months ago on 9/16/2016, PSA announced a " Freedom Hammer Forged Nitride M4 Rifle kit". PSA's link is now dead -> LINK Yes, that is a rifle "kit" in the link above but at some point over the last four months PSA could have manufactured and sold a complete rifle with the same or similar barrel. Just because an item isn't currently shown on their website doesn't mean it never existed. In fact, this seems consistent with previous botched or problematic roll-outs from PSA, namely, the 1911, AK47 and AR-10. This CHF Freedom barrel could be the same. Now they are trying to unload the barrels as stand alone items and not in an upper assembly or rifle kit. View Quote I don't think this is happening the way you think it is. I am buying one of these barrels as it's new and seems logically to have the best of both worlds. If i am right, it's a hell of a bargain. If I am wrong, its $140 bucks I would have spent on strippers and booze anyway. |
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I don't think this is happening the way you think it is. I am buying one of these barrels as it's new and seems logically to have the best of both worlds. If i am right, it's a hell of a bargain. If I am wrong, its $140 bucks I would have spent on strippers and booze anyway. View Quote |
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Not sure? But up until recently, PSA used to state that all their CHF barrels, even the stainless ones, were manufactured by FN. They'd also say that if the description doesn't specifically state that it''s an FN barrel, then it's not. These Freedom CHF barrels may not be made by FN and the price could reflect that. Also, for what it's worth, Nutnfancy does a review on a complete PSA rifle which appears to have the new CHF Freedom barrel. -> https://youtu.be/_S54H0iSo_c View Quote I like how he complains that the barrel only shoots 2MOA, but he's shooting M855 |
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Well Nutn doesn't specify a sku number for this review, but at (9:07) he says CHF and then at (9:20) he says Melonite. Then of course the title of the review is "Palmetto State Armory "Freedom" AR-15". View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted:
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How can you tell it's the new CHF nitrided barrel ? I don't think it is . Well Nutn doesn't specify a sku number for this review, but at (9:07) he says CHF and then at (9:20) he says Melonite. Then of course the title of the review is "Palmetto State Armory "Freedom" AR-15". Nutnfancy didn't even know what he was shooting. Poor excuse for a Video Review and says it's a rush review, still no excuse. Just misinformation. He keeps saying it's an FN barrel, which it's not. Said it was a M4 barrel but says it's also mid length? Guy shooting gets bad groups, but then he shoots PMC and gets an almost a MOA goup. Keeps harping on doesn't shoot steel well and dependability... Well, if your depending or defending your life on steel ammo you're already probably pretty close to death anyway. |
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Nutn speaks as though he purchased a complete rifle from PSA and not a rifle kit. Note at (13:52) he shows a zip-lock bag with a PSA Owners Manual, a PSA branded firearm safety lock and a PMAG. This would seem consistent with a compete firearm and not an upper or rifle kit. Exactly four months ago on 9/16/2016, PSA announced a " Freedom Hammer Forged Nitride M4 Rifle kit". PSA's link is now dead -> LINK Yes, that is a rifle "kit" in the link above but at some point over the last four months PSA could have manufactured and sold a complete rifle with the same or similar barrel. Just because an item isn't currently shown on their website doesn't mean it never existed. In fact, this seems consistent with previous botched or problematic roll-outs from PSA, namely, the 1911, AK47 and AR-10. This CHF Freedom barrel could be the same. Now they are trying to unload the barrels as stand alone items and not in an upper assembly or rifle kit. View Quote Or they are just selling the new barrels they have made |
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Nutn comes off like a friggin douche but I actually took his videos as more real world and unbiased as if he wasn't getting paid to give good reviews. His PSA video came off as if someone paid him to give a bad review.
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Or they are just selling the new barrels they have made View Quote Again, four months ago PSA offered a rifle kit with their unveiling this new PSA manufactured CHF barrel. The link for the rifle kit has since gone dead. Seems fishy to me they go from offering complete rifle kits to barrels only over a the four month time span. If this barrel is the latest and greatest,where has it been? I would have thought there'd be more rifle kits, more complete uppers available to purchase, and lots of customers who can attest to buying one. |
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Who knows? I'd say these have only shown up within the last month (didn't catch any stand alone CHF barrels a month ago beyond FN CHF barrels). Maybe they ramp-up up production? Maybe they have other projects on the burner so instead of complete kits, they're selling the barrels? Who knows except PSA? Maybe they'll chime in? Regardless, they're here now. for $150 beans, it's not like I'll break the bank trying one.
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Nutn comes off like a friggin douche but I actually took his videos as more real world and unbiased as if he wasn't getting paid to give good reviews. His PSA video came off as if someone paid him to give a bad review. View Quote I don't think he's paid to review anything. I think like most of us, he has preferences and biases towards guns and gear. For some reason it seems like he was never all that impressed with PSA stuff. Don't know why, just an impression I've gotten from watching his vids over the years. |
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Again, four months ago PSA offered a rifle kit with their unveiling this new PSA manufactured CHF barrel. The link for the rifle kit has since gone dead. Seems fishy to me they go from offering complete rifle kits to barrels only over a the four month time span. If this barrel is the latest and greatest,where has it been? I would have thought there'd be more rifle kits, more complete uppers available to purchase, and lots of customers who can attest to buying one. View Quote You sure are doing plenty of ASSuming |
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I don't think he's paid to review anything. I think like most of us, he has preferences and biases towards guns and gear. For some reason it seems like he was never all that impressed with PSA stuff. Don't know why, just an impression I've gotten from watching his vids over the years. View Quote Or care enough to correctly identify what he was reviewing by taking the painstaking task of looking on the top of the barrel to properly identify what he reviewed. Misinformation is worse than no information. I review his gun review and give it a one owl on the barn for effort. |
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Again, four months ago PSA offered a rifle kit with their unveiling this new PSA manufactured CHF barrel. The link for the rifle kit has since gone dead. Seems fishy to me they go from offering complete rifle kits to barrels only over a the four month time span. If this barrel is the latest and greatest,where has it been? I would have thought there'd be more rifle kits, more complete uppers available to purchase, and lots of customers who can attest to buying one. View Quote I'm not sure what's fishy about a first run 4 months ago and then introducing 4 more additional profiles recently. You can't just pick barrels off the barrel tree. They are made. What exactly seems fishy to you about a new product release? |
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regarding the 4 months going from kits to just barrels statement.
lets see.. what happened in the last 4 months.... oh wait i know, an election of a "gun friendly" president instead of a nazidemocratsocialist regime... PSA routinely removes links when things are out of stock with seemingly no rhyme or reason which i assume means they have their reasons. im sure psa has a lot of things going on, from the DDI move, and integration, to other issues with vendors/manufacturers to demand drops.. lets face it the ar market now went from we may have it all taken away to a form of relaxation and supersaturation because of no panic. i mean look we got 49.00 lowers again finally!!! perhaps you should give the barrel a shot, perhaps not, i know for me, i prefer CHF stuff, although there is NOT a single thing wrong with the others, hell we won world wars on non CHF stuff. |
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regarding the 4 months going from kits to just barrels statement. lets see.. what happened in the last 4 months.... oh wait i know, an election of a "gun friendly" president instead of a nazidemocratsocialist regime... PSA routinely removes links when things are out of stock with seemingly no rhyme or reason which i assume means they have their reasons. im sure psa has a lot of things going on, from the DDI move, and integration, to other issues with vendors/manufacturers to demand drops.. lets face it the ar market now went from we may have it all taken away to a form of relaxation and supersaturation because of no panic. i mean look we got 49.00 lowers again finally!!! perhaps you should give the barrel a shot, perhaps not, i know for me, i prefer CHF stuff, although there is NOT a single thing wrong with the others, hell we won world wars on non CHF stuff. View Quote Good points. I prefer CHF too and have purchased many FN barred uppers from PSA. I also appreciate the time tested battle proven pedigree that FN brings to the table. Yes, the new Nitride barrels are interesting and promising but I'm personally not prepared to give up the FN pedigree and roll the dice on an unknown value especially when the price differential between the two are so nill. I think choice is a good thing but it can also be overdone. All over this board when asked about the PSA brand, many respond with, they're great if you get their Premium or Hammer Forged FN barrels. I think that's one big thing PSA is known for; their FN offerings. Who knows, with the potential for market softening, perhaps they'll have a more steady supply of FN stuff moving forward? |
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I guess you could roll the dice or wait for a review. Everything is new before it's proven.
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I guess you could roll the dice or wait for a review. Everything is new before it's proven. View Quote That's a good idea. FN Manufacturing LLC, Columbia, South Carolina, was founded in 1980. "Produces more than 20,000 barrels each month for a variety of military and commercial products sold in the U.S., including the FN 15™, M4/M4A1 carbines, M16 rifles, M249 SAWs, MK 48, MK 46, M240, M240C, M240E1, M240B and M240L machine guns". And has drawn upon the rich firearm history of it's parent subsidiary, FN Herstal, S.A., dating back to 1889 with the manufacture of the Mauser Model 89 rifle. By contrast, Palmetto State Armory opened it's doors in 2008 and started manufacturing it's own barrels at some point after that. If they're still alive and kicking in the year 2136, or even 2045, which I sincerely hope they are, I'll check back and see how their barrels have "proved" out. |
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I get it. You don't trust the new product or PSA's (fishiness). And you aren't going to buy one. Cool. Get what you want. Why post in this thread at all?
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Good points. I prefer CHF too and have purchased many FN barred uppers from PSA. I also appreciate the time tested battle proven pedigree that FN brings to the table. Yes, the new Nitride barrels are interesting and promising but I'm personally not prepared to give up the FN pedigree and roll the dice on an unknown value especially when the price differential between the two are so nill. I think choice is a good thing but it can also be overdone. All over this board when asked about the PSA brand, many respond with, they're great if you get their Premium or Hammer Forged FN barrels. I think that's one big thing PSA is known for; their FN offerings. Who knows, with the potential for market softening, perhaps they'll have a more steady supply of FN stuff moving forward? View Quote I get the deal between pricing, i truly do. is 40-70 bux worth the name? perhaps so to us, but maybe not the first timer who wants teh best he can buy at the least cash because he's buying one part ever 2-3 months after saving his hard dollar just for that one part. (yes i've been that guy) What i think folks fail to realize is that FN is a seperate entity, who is not beholden to PSA, in any way shape or form, to produce ANYTHING for them. What happens if say, FN is too Busy to produce for PSA because theyre fulfilling contracts for the government or others? Who says that the spells between supply to PSA havent been due to that? There is any number of reasons why they could not supply PSA with product, thus PSA, and the JJE Capital group, having multiple manufactuers under their belt, (perhaps more than one barrel manufacturer than is publically known about) to make CHF offerings. Spikes sells FN CHF barrels from what i recall what happens to thier supply if FN stops selling to the public/private sector(which has happened before) Daniel Defense makes their own in house CHF barrels, so why cant PSA? Nitride/Melonite/tennifer has been proven to be a great finish, and protectant. They are trade names for firearm finishing processes that involve salt bath nitriding. Salt bath nitriding is a case hardening process that leaves a fairly thick, corrosion resistant, hard surface. This is much thicker than black oxided finished parts, which do not offer as much of a protection as the salt bath nitriding process. I'd run a PSA Ptac, Freedom, Premium, or CHF against anything out there, and bet it would hold up just as well (semi-auto to semi-auto) and be just as accurate. I've seen alot of PSA products, I've seen a lot done wrong, and a lot done right, and in the end, one thing PSA has pretty much always done right is sell some of the highest quality items for the lowest price EVER seen or heard of. For that, i trust their offerings in this new CHF hands down. |
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what i want to know why some are glossy black and others look almost parkerized
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what i want to know why some are glossy black and others look almost parkerized View Quote The CHF FN uppers chrome-lined and parkerized (phosphate) on the exterior of the barrel. The PSA produced CHF barrels are nitrided on both the interior and exterior. This nitride is the shiny black. |
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i havent bought one yet, but when i do ill try to do one if one hasnt been done yet.
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That's a good idea. FN Manufacturing LLC, Columbia, South Carolina, was founded in 1980. "Produces more than 20,000 barrels each month for a variety of military and commercial products sold in the U.S., including the FN 15™, M4/M4A1 carbines, M16 rifles, M249 SAWs, MK 48, MK 46, M240, M240C, M240E1, M240B and M240L machine guns". And has drawn upon the rich firearm history of it's parent subsidiary, FN Herstal, S.A., dating back to 1889 with the manufacture of the Mauser Model 89 rifle. By contrast, Palmetto State Armory opened it's doors in 2008 and started manufacturing it's own barrels at some point after that. If they're still alive and kicking in the year 2136, or even 2045, which I sincerely hope they are, I'll check back and see how their barrels have "proved" out. View Quote If you're going on longevity shouldn't you thus be buying nothing but Beretta? |
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I suspect the good price on these barrels is due to the fact that they don't chrome line them which adds significant expense to do it well (nice and even).
I really like what I'm seeing in this line. Cold Hammer Forged, and Nitriding, at a great price. Think I may just have to pick one of these up. ...and bump for any reviews... |
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I have one FN CHF/CL middy upper, and ALL of my others are nitride middies of various manufacturers (some PSA one's too). I LOVE nitride, and think CHF/nitride would be the absolute best of both worlds (well, maybe a tad less on accuracy, but definitely best for durability/corrosion resistance).
I'm just waiting for a 16" middy PENCIL CHF/nitride with FSB to come out. C'mon PSA... let's get to it! |
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