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Posted: 8/27/2014 7:40:24 AM EDT
[#1]
Quoted:
Ok i know this has been done in the past but answers change, so I'm doing it again. I'm going to be putting together a package for the command in my PD to try to test out new pistol ammo to determine if what we have is the best. We've been using Speer Gold Dot 124 +Ps out of G17/G19s for over a decade, and there's been quite a bit of research in the last few years and new loads coming out. I also want to look into rifle ammo. If y'all could, could you use this format: - Pistol/SMG = 124gr Speer Gold Dot +P - Carbine = 55gr Federal Tactical Rifle Urban HP Pistol=180gr Gold Dot 40cal. Rifles= 55gr Federal Tactical Bonded Soft Points. Both have proven to work well in real world situations. J- |
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Posted: 8/27/2014 8:43:54 PM EDT
[#2]
To be honest, the 124 GDHP's and both the rifle load you have and the Soft Point Bonded round that jjc listed are great rounds to have. I wouldn't change anything unless you're having performance issues from the rounds in terms of weapon malfunctions.
One thing I will say about the soft point rounds is that some rifles do not like them. When they're feeding into the chamber, the soft point can deform if the rifles don't have properly cut M4 feed ramps. That would really be my only concern about the SP rounds. |
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Posted: 8/27/2014 11:10:47 PM EDT
[#3]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
To be honest, the 124 GDHP's and both the rifle load you have and the Soft Point Bonded round that jjc listed are great rounds to have. I wouldn't change anything unless you're having performance issues from the rounds in terms of weapon malfunctions. One thing I will say about the soft point rounds is that some rifles do not like them. When they're feeding into the chamber, the soft point can deform if the rifles don't have properly cut M4 feed ramps. That would really be my only concern about the SP rounds. I've looked up the FBI testing that has been published on most of the big defensive rounds and it looks like the 124 +P gold dots are still on point even these days. The rifle ammo though, I wonder if we couldn't be doing the same or better with a more available /cheaper round. Hornady TAP Urban and GD 55gr SP come to mind. |
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Posted: 8/28/2014 12:20:19 AM EDT
[#4]
In my opinion you already have the best pistol ammo. Did some weight retention testing and Gold Dot was awesome. It is what we switched to for our 9mm, 40, and .223.
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Posted: 8/29/2014 3:53:57 PM EDT
[#5]
Anyone still use Federal Hyda-Shocks ?
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Posted: 8/29/2014 11:35:08 PM EDT
[#6]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Anyone still use Federal Hyda-Shocks ? In my testing the Hydra Shocks separated the jacket from the core. Definitely want a bonded core round for duty use in my opinion. |
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Posted: 8/30/2014 1:15:16 AM EDT
[#7]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
In my testing the Hydra Shocks separated the jacket from the core. Definitely want a bonded core round for duty use in my opinion. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Anyone still use Federal Hyda-Shocks ? In my testing the Hydra Shocks separated the jacket from the core. Definitely want a bonded core round for duty use in my opinion. I buy cheap Hyrda-Shoks (124 +P+) for my SHTF ammo from an LGS that has them for $26 a box of 50, but personally all I've been carrying are GDs, HSTs and Critical Duty. I'd take hydra Shoks over those bulk generic HPs from like UMC or whathave you, but not if I had a choice. |
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Posted: 8/31/2014 5:48:15 PM EDT
[#8]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
In my testing the Hydra Shocks separated the jacket from the core. Definitely want a bonded core round for duty use in my opinion. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Anyone still use Federal Hyda-Shocks ? In my testing the Hydra Shocks separated the jacket from the core. Definitely want a bonded core round for duty use in my opinion. That's why we went away from hydra shocks about 7 years ago. They separate in three OIS that we had in a couple years. All three guys were DRT so they "worked" but the autopsy exrays looked like buckshot. J- |
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Posted: 8/31/2014 6:15:24 PM EDT
[#9]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
In my testing the Hydra Shocks separated the jacket from the core. Definitely want a bonded core round for duty use in my opinion. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Anyone still use Federal Hyda-Shocks ? In my testing the Hydra Shocks separated the jacket from the core. Definitely want a bonded core round for duty use in my opinion. The hydra shock was a good round years ago. However, it is far outclassed by the newer rounds like HST, Ranger T, and Gold Dot. I can tell you that going through barriers like windows and car doors, it sheds the jacket and tears apart. I recovered multiple .40 Hydra shocks 165 and 180 grain bullets from inside the doors of a car several years ago after a shooting incident. I had been telling upper echelon we needed to up grade ammo and that finally caused a change to bonded rounds. |
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Posted: 8/31/2014 6:40:19 PM EDT
[#10]
If your agency is willing to consider ammo by effect over bottom line cheap cost, then you're already ahead of the curve.
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Posted: 9/2/2014 10:45:07 PM EDT
[#11]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
If your agency is willing to consider ammo by effect over bottom line cheap cost, then you're already ahead of the curve. Effectiveness is sorta neccesary on occasion around here. |
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Posted: 9/3/2014 11:43:57 PM EDT
[#12]
What twist to you have in your rifles?
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Posted: 9/3/2014 11:44:41 PM EDT
[#13]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
What twist to you have in your rifles? Some 1/7, some 1/9 so we sorta have to stick to lighter stuff. |
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Posted: 9/4/2014 2:28:19 AM EDT
[#14]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Some 1/7, some 1/9 so we sorta have to stick to lighter stuff. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
What twist to you have in your rifles? Some 1/7, some 1/9 so we sorta have to stick to lighter stuff. FWIW, we have a mix of several 1/7 and several 1/9 rifles and we've had uniformly good accuracy with the Federal LE223T3 load (62 gr bonded softpoint). |
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Posted: 9/4/2014 8:27:40 PM EDT
[#15]
What about the 147 grain 9mm bullets ?
On Edit: I have not heard anything but good about Gold Dot ammo. Are people preferring the 124 to the 147's? |
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Posted: 9/5/2014 10:19:34 PM EDT
[#16]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Pistol=180gr Gold Dot 40cal. Rifles= 55gr Federal Tactical Bonded Soft Points. Both have proven to work well in real world situations. J- Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Ok i know this has been done in the past but answers change, so I'm doing it again. I'm going to be putting together a package for the command in my PD to try to test out new pistol ammo to determine if what we have is the best. We've been using Speer Gold Dot 124 +Ps out of G17/G19s for over a decade, and there's been quite a bit of research in the last few years and new loads coming out. I also want to look into rifle ammo. If y'all could, could you use this format: - Pistol/SMG = 124gr Speer Gold Dot +P - Carbine = 55gr Federal Tactical Rifle Urban HP Pistol=180gr Gold Dot 40cal. Rifles= 55gr Federal Tactical Bonded Soft Points. Both have proven to work well in real world situations. J- Same here minus the real world with us, no OIS for many years. |
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Posted: 9/6/2014 5:42:32 PM EDT
[#17]
Quoted:
Ok i know this has been done in the past but answers change, so I'm doing it again. I'm going to be putting together a package for the command in my PD to try to test out new pistol ammo to determine if what we have is the best. We've been using Speer Gold Dot 124 +Ps out of G17/G19s for over a decade, and there's been quite a bit of research in the last few years and new loads coming out. I also want to look into rifle ammo. If y'all could, could you use this format: - Pistol/SMG = 124gr Speer Gold Dot +P - Carbine = 55gr Federal Tactical Rifle Urban HP Same as you. We also do the GD in .40 and .45 though. |
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Posted: 9/9/2014 3:58:22 AM EDT
[#18]
We run the following
Pistol = 165grain Speer Gold Dot - .40 S&W / 230grain Speer Gold Dot - .45acp Rifle = 75grain Hornady TAP - .223 Remington / 62grain American Eagle XM855 - 5.56 NATO We are issued 1 box of pistol ammo, whichever caliber you carry and 1 box each of the Hornady and American Eagle. The ammo used in the rifle depends on the situation but the Hornady is the primary ammo carried in the weapon. |
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Posted: 9/13/2014 9:39:04 PM EDT
[#19]
Pistol= .45 acp 230gr +p federal tactical bonded
Rifle= 55 gr federal tactical bonded SP I'm extremely happy with the pistol round, and the rifle ammo has done the job, but it's performance is similar to a pistol round; cuts a straight path and expands to roughly .45 inches. I'd prefer a fragmenting load such as the Winchester ballistic silvertip or Hornady A-max |
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Posted: 9/17/2014 1:22:00 PM EDT
[#20]
Before the transition to fo'tay(Sig 226/229Rs) my dept(I'm a medic) ran Speer GDHP 124+p. There's a regret there. .40 cost more. There's three less rounds in every mag. The Sigs are having numerous issues, tiger pins mostly. But a few guns have been taken back from recruits immediately after issue. One recruit's front sight fell off the gun on day 2.
I was told yesterday that the FBI is looking into maybe switching back to 9mm. The interwebz is thick with discussion. Read up on the TAP. Didn't work as expected....(NSFW/Autopsy/GSW photos) http://info.publicintelligence.net/FBIAAROfficerShooting.pdf |
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