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Posted: 4/12/2017 11:15:50 PM EDT
Backstory
I purchased a firearm from a private seller on armslist back in July.  Since I live in CA (yes im aware it sucks...) we met at a local FFL, did the DROS paperwork, exchanged firearm for money, and then 10 days later I picked up my new to me firearm.  I have since had zero contact with the seller, taken the firearm to the range several times and enjoyed it thouroughly.  Also for what it's worth, the firearm i purchased was an off roster handgun in CA, and the individual i purchased it from stated he was a federal agent with some kind of DoD police agency, and would be moving from CA to TX soon with his wife.

Call from ATF today...
Come today, while im at home I get a call from an ATF agent.  He is stating he is from the Pheonix, AZ branch and investing the individual that i purchased the firearm from back in july.  This was all quite alarming, but after confirming that this was an actual ATF agent, he told me that the individual i purchased the firearm from, has been buying off roster/other hard to find (by CA standards) firearms in AZ and reselling them in CA.  The agent also said that in some cases the individual i purchased the firearm from was transfering up to 6 firearms all bought in AZ to individuals in CA, and likely going to AZ to purchase specifically sought after firearms by CA residence.  To me, this seems like a clear violation of straw purchase laws for those other indiciduals, but im assuming i should be ok.  The ATF agent was curious how i knew/met the seller, how much the gun was listed for on armslist and how much i ended up purchasing it for, and a couple other questions regarding what was said at the time of the transaction/transfer.  After speaking with thr ATF agent some more he stated that i am not in trouble, thanked me for being helpful, gave me several ways to contact him if i had any further questions, and let me know that i would likely be able to keep my firearm, but ultimately that is up to the US district atorney.

Now:
What should i do from here?  Worth talking to a lawyer?  Just hope not to hear back from the ATF at all?  Run for da woods?
Link Posted: 4/12/2017 11:22:31 PM EDT
[#1]
Edit: nevermind. Legal section. Not GD. Sorry.
Link Posted: 4/12/2017 11:34:16 PM EDT
[#2]
Edit: nevermind. Legal section. Not GD. Sorry


OOOPs didn't see legal section I clicked active topics.
Link Posted: 4/12/2017 11:37:52 PM EDT
[#3]
My guess is they want the seller for Federal charges of being an unlicensed dealer. CA on/off list silliness is State level, and a Fed agency should not care about State level things. 
Link Posted: 4/12/2017 11:40:38 PM EDT
[#4]
I know they dont care about state level things, but that stil leaves the question of what should i do?
Link Posted: 4/12/2017 11:44:53 PM EDT
[#5]
Link Posted: 4/12/2017 11:46:24 PM EDT
[#6]
I'd say there is nothing to do. All you'd tell a lawyer is what you just said above and they'd probably just say, well if they arrest you give me a call.

i'd just shrug, think to myself "that dudes effed" and go on with my life. They'll build a case, that guy will plead out, and you'll probably never have any more involvement. Maybe if he fights you'll have to give a deposition.
Link Posted: 4/12/2017 11:50:32 PM EDT
[#7]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Anonymously call the guy from a remote phone.  Let him know he is being investigated.
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Anyone i know who might be prosecuted under unjust or unconstitutional laws would get as much assistance as i could offer.
Link Posted: 4/13/2017 9:11:44 AM EDT
[#8]
Have a Coke and smile.  You are a witness and nothing more.  I would not be surprised if the ATF seeks your firearm as evidence.
Link Posted: 4/13/2017 9:38:31 AM EDT
[#9]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Have a Coke and smile.  You are a witness and nothing more.  I would not be surprised if the ATF seeks your firearm as evidence.
View Quote
Sell it.
Link Posted: 4/13/2017 9:42:15 AM EDT
[#10]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:


Sell it.
View Quote
Quickly
Link Posted: 4/13/2017 12:07:10 PM EDT
[#11]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Anonymously call the guy from a remote phone.  Let him know he is being investigated.
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Quoted:
Anonymously call the guy from a remote phone.  Let him know he is being investigated.
are you serious?

THAT seems like a VERY good way to get charged with "accessory after the fact".


accessory before (or after) the fact
   1.    (Law) A person who incites or assists someone to commit a crime (or knowingly aids someone who has committed a crime).
Link Posted: 4/13/2017 12:19:40 PM EDT
[#12]
Move to Texas
Link Posted: 4/13/2017 12:26:31 PM EDT
[#13]
Sounds like they are going to nail the guy for dealing without a license. I don't think you really have anything to worry about.
Link Posted: 4/13/2017 6:44:14 PM EDT
[#14]
Link Posted: 4/13/2017 6:45:28 PM EDT
[#15]
Link Posted: 4/13/2017 7:52:08 PM EDT
[#16]
Likely related..

SOCAL POLICE DEPARTMENTS WARNED ABOUT POSSIBLE ILLEGAL FIREARMS SALES

"LOS ANGELES (KABC) -- The Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives sent out a letter to Southern California police departments informing them that officers are buying and reselling guns, which could be a violation of federal firearms laws.

In the March 31 letter, the ATF said there was concern that officers may be buying and selling guns in possible violations of federal law. In order for officers to sell guns, they must have a Federal Firearms License, according to the ATF.

"It is our goal to educate, not investigate, to ensure law enforcement officials comply with federal law in order to avoid unnecessary public embarrassment to themselves and your Department/Agency," the letter said.

The agency said it discovered law enforcement officers who did not have the license were buying firearms and reselling them to non-law enforcement entities for money. The firearms that are being sold are "off roster," which means they are not on an approved list of weapons that can be sold to the public.

The ATF said it discovered officers purchased more than 100 of the "off roster" guns that were then transferred to the possession of people not in law enforcement.

Those transactions could potentially violate federal laws, including dealing firearms without the FFL and lying on a federal firearms form when buying the gun, which is also known as straw purchasing. If these violations continued, the ATF would have to conduct a criminal investigation.

Selling firearms without a license can carry a maximum sentence of five years in state prison. Lying on the federal form can mean a 10-year prison sentence.

The letter stressed that it was informing the agencies about the sales, urging department heads to educate their officers so that the transactions no longer happen."
Link Posted: 4/14/2017 12:53:04 PM EDT
[#17]
I wish we could do that.  My friends in CA always ask me if I can buy something for them.  There is no way it couldn't be traced to me unless I bought on backpage.  Even then, they couldn't legally get it transferred to them so it would be properly registered, unless it was still traceable to me.  

CA laws really fucked up their freedom.  It is a cost they pay by living there.  There is no way I would skirt around their laws.  

I have another CA friend who said recently that he got a license in AZ with his brother's Phoenix address and was buying guns in AZ.  I told him of a couple cases where both individuals involved lost their businesses and got prison time for exactly that.  This guy has a lot to lose, so he would definitely be a target for ATF asset seizure.  He sure seemed proud of what he was doing and had no clue how the ATF would make a project out of him if they got wind.  

Stupid hurts. 
Link Posted: 4/14/2017 1:25:23 PM EDT
[#18]
Unless there's more to the story. The guy will probably just get a nasty gram telling him to stop. The second time around they'll fry his ass.
Link Posted: 4/14/2017 1:53:49 PM EDT
[#19]
... All this because CA had to find the most convoluted way possible to keep 'affordable' Jennings and Lorcin products out of the state.

I like how the ATF is sending that letter to CA LE so they can make the problem stop instead of pursuing prosecution on what you have to assume are documented crimes.

On another topic, just what are these in-demand off-list handguns that people are paying a premium for? I assume they're not just talking about blue label Glocks...??
Link Posted: 4/14/2017 6:24:29 PM EDT
[#20]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
On another topic, just what are these in-demand off-list handguns that people are paying a premium for? I assume they're not just talking about blue label Glocks...??
View Quote
The CA handgun roster is pretty limiting... can be anything from gen4 Glocks, certain model 1911s, Ruger .22lr pistols, etc...  In my case it was a Sig Sauer MPX pistol.
Link Posted: 4/21/2017 12:43:29 PM EDT
[#21]
Quoted:

What should i do from here?
View Quote


Nothing. Sounds like the making of another John Shipley type case.
Link Posted: 4/26/2017 10:10:59 PM EDT
[#22]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Anyone i know who might be prosecuted under unjust or unconstitutional laws would get as much assistance as i could offer.
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Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Quoted:
Anonymously call the guy from a remote phone.  Let him know he is being investigated.
Anyone i know who might be prosecuted under unjust or unconstitutional laws would get as much assistance as i could offer.

You think the ATF is not tapping HIS phone lines?
Now your voice is on tape telling him of whats going on? Burner phone or not, that's a special kind of stupid.

You think ATF does not work with and INFORM KalDOJ of persons of interest violating state law ?
Do you really want to be on KalDOJ radar, and give them a reason to search your home and seize EVERYTHING? That's what they do!

I hate gun laws as much as the rest, but the az gun seller is a dirt bag and a dumb one, who will roll over on you in court to save his own ass.
But go ahead, and stick your nose in a federal investigation, make that call and do more time than the gun seller.


I think the OP has nothing to worry about, everything is legal on his end, he is a victim of fraud, and im betting he keeps his gun, even if it gets pulled for evidence.
If the ATF wants to pull you into court, or the KalDOJ starts harassing you then lawyer up.
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