Warning

 

Close

Confirm Action

Are you sure you wish to do this?

Confirm Cancel

Log In

A valid email is required.
Password is required.
Site Notices
Basic
  • Joined Mar 2009
  • Posts 83
  • Location USA MO, USA
Offline
Basic
  • Joined Mar 2009
  • Posts 83
  • Location USA MO, USA
Offline
Posted: 1/15/2010 3:27:47 AM EST
I can understand how full auto works - hold the trigger and the gun keep firing. But, what is going on mechanically, in guns that allow for a 3 round burst? What is enabling the 3 round count and cut off when it gets to that point even though the trigger may still be depressed? Just asking out of curiosity. Seems like some interesting engineering.
Basic
  • Joined Oct 2007
  • Posts 1202
  • Location USA TX, USA
Offline
Basic
  • Joined Oct 2007
  • Posts 1202
  • Location USA TX, USA
Offline
Link Posted: 1/15/2010 3:34:53 AM EST
There are other websites that explain this. Would be suspicious with BATFE if they saw us explaining this here.
I am McLovin
Avatar
Bronze
  • Joined Sep 2006
  • Posts 3275
  • Location USA FL, USA
Offline
Bronze
  • Joined Sep 2006
  • Posts 3275
  • Location USA FL, USA
Offline
Link Posted: 1/15/2010 3:35:43 AM EST
Originally Posted By atxjax:
There are other websites that explain this. Would be suspicious with BATFE if they saw us explaining this here.


your tin foil is too tight
I like things that go rat-a-tat-tat
Member
Avatar
Bronze
  • Joined Nov 2000
  • Posts 14865
  • Location USA CA, USA
Offline
Bronze
  • Joined Nov 2000
  • Posts 14865
  • Location USA CA, USA
Offline
Link Posted: 1/15/2010 3:36:04 AM EST
There's a ratchet with three notches in it for the burst. After the third ratchet, it stops. The trouble is that if you set it to burst and don't fire off a full three-shot burst before you release the trigger, you next "burst" may only be one shot.
http://www.sharpshooterpress.com for the best book on sharpshooting.
Lost all my boats in a tragic gun accident
Avatar
Bronze
  • Joined Mar 2008
  • Posts 6497
  • Location USA WA, USA
Offline
Bronze
  • Joined Mar 2008
  • Posts 6497
  • Location USA WA, USA
Offline
Link Posted: 1/15/2010 3:37:05 AM EST

Originally Posted By atxjax:
There are other websites that explain this. Would be suspicious with BATFE if they saw us explaining this here.


The number of rounds fired in a burst is almost universally determined by a cam mechanism that trips the trigger mechanism for each shot in the burst. Some designs will terminate the burst if the trigger is released before the burst is complete, while others will reset the cam position, so the next burst will fire a full number of rounds. Other designs, like that on the M16A2 rifle, will fire the remaining rounds in the interrupted burst and then stop.



"Violent video games are the assault rifle of the First Amendment"
TAP
Doing What I Can With What I Got
Avatar
Bronze
  • Joined Jan 2008
  • Posts 1323
  • Location IRQ IRQ
Offline
Bronze
  • Joined Jan 2008
  • Posts 1323
  • Location IRQ IRQ
Offline
Link Posted: 1/15/2010 3:37:07 AM EST
[Last Edit: 1/15/2010 3:37:59 AM EST by TAP]
Yep, easy enough to find on other sources.

What a lot of people don't know, and maybe is worth mentioning, is that 3-rd burst is NOT a 3-rd burst in most of our weapons. It is a burst of up to 3 rds, depending on where the cam is. Time and time again I have to go over that with soldiers who don't understandthe limitations of their burst feature on their issued weapons.

ETA: Man, I type too slow and was beat to my point
NRA life member
Avatar
Bronze
  • Joined Feb 2009
  • Posts 4383
  • Location USA TN, USA
Offline
Bronze
  • Joined Feb 2009
  • Posts 4383
  • Location USA TN, USA
Offline
Link Posted: 1/15/2010 3:37:08 AM EST
A wise old sear once told me.
" I've come here to chew bubblegum and kick ass.......and I'm all out of bubblegum."
Elite Delta Tactical Special Operator
Avatar
Bronze
  • Joined Jan 2009
  • Posts 1447
  • Location USA PA, USA
Offline
Bronze
  • Joined Jan 2009
  • Posts 1447
  • Location USA PA, USA
Offline
Link Posted: 1/15/2010 3:38:51 AM EST
Originally Posted By atxjax:
There are other websites that explain this. Would be suspicious with BATFE if they saw us explaining this here.


There's a 6 toothed gear set up to only rotate backwards with the hammer. Two of the teeth, equally spaced, are deeper than the others. Once the hammer rotates three times, a disconnector with a corresponding tooth will sink into the deeper tooth of the 6 toothed gear, meaning the disconnector rotates forward more, and catches the hammer instead of letting it fall. Then, you release the trigger just like with a semi-auto, the disconnector lets go and the trigger holds the hammer, ready to be fired again.
U.S. Army 91F small arms/artillery repairer
"Personally I wouldn't go anywhere that I couldn't sit on a stash of food and ammo with an AR15. I'm a right wing extremist though" -Currahee
Member
Avatar
Bronze
  • Joined Oct 2008
  • Posts 1492
  • Location USA SC, USA
Online
Bronze
  • Joined Oct 2008
  • Posts 1492
  • Location USA SC, USA
Online
Link Posted: 1/15/2010 3:40:44 AM EST
See the extra doodads?

PostCount++;
Avatar
Bronze
  • Joined May 2001
  • Posts 14449
  • Location USA TX, USA
Offline
Bronze
  • Joined May 2001
  • Posts 14449
  • Location USA TX, USA
Offline
Link Posted: 1/15/2010 3:46:05 AM EST

Originally Posted By Harvster:
A wise old sear once told me.


There are, however, rules against addressing someone as "fuckface". - John_Wayne777

My first ARFCOM award!
For service above and beyond, I hereby grant to peekay the Grammar Iron Cross. - PAEBR332
Member
Avatar
Bronze
  • Joined May 2003
  • Posts 1934
  • Location USA IN, USA
Offline
Bronze
  • Joined May 2003
  • Posts 1934
  • Location USA IN, USA
Offline
Link Posted: 1/15/2010 3:50:19 AM EST
Number 2 in the above pic is a cam that rotates one notch every shot. after the third shot it rotates to a notch that has larger and it stops the action by engaging the disconnector.
Member
Avatar
Bronze
  • Joined May 2003
  • Posts 1935
  • Location USA IN, USA
Offline
Bronze
  • Joined May 2003
  • Posts 1935
  • Location USA IN, USA
Offline
Link Posted: 1/15/2010 3:51:58 AM EST
This should answer your question.

http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=12&f=2&t=79
Member
Avatar
Gold
  • Joined Mar 2001
  • Posts 20332
  • Location USA USA
Offline
Gold
  • Joined Mar 2001
  • Posts 20332
  • Location USA USA
Offline
Link Posted: 1/15/2010 3:56:41 AM EST
Originally Posted By atxjax:
There are other websites that explain this. Would be suspicious with BATFE if they saw us explaining this here.


might as well fire off some other keywords for the BATF Google search machine....

SUPPRESSORS, How to?

Gun Show Loophole - I'll meet you in the parking lot with cash yo!

Cop Killer Bullets - which one is right for my Lorcin?




Huge Member
Avatar
Bronze
  • Joined Jan 2009
  • Posts 2418
  • Location USA TN, USA
Offline
Bronze
  • Joined Jan 2009
  • Posts 2418
  • Location USA TN, USA
Offline
Link Posted: 1/15/2010 4:01:08 AM EST

Originally Posted By atxjax:
There are other websites that explain this. Would be suspicious with BATFE if they saw us explaining this here.

Yes, because all machine guns and their related parts are definitely illegal. No one on ARFCOM owns a pre 1986 machine gun, never has and never will.

[/sarcasm]
We must all fear evil men. But there is another kind of evil which we must fear most, and that is the indifference of good men.
Member
Avatar
Bronze
  • Joined May 2003
  • Posts 1936
  • Location USA IN, USA
Offline
Bronze
  • Joined May 2003
  • Posts 1936
  • Location USA IN, USA
Offline
Link Posted: 1/15/2010 4:04:03 AM EST
Now my question is how does the clutch spring work?

Also there is no law makeing it illeagle to learn how something works. The knowledge isn't illegal the act of converting illegaly is where the problem come in.
COME AND TAKE IT YOU SOCIALIST FUCKS
Avatar
Bronze
  • Joined Mar 2006
  • Posts 14665
  • Location USA TX, USA
Offline
Bronze
  • Joined Mar 2006
  • Posts 14665
  • Location USA TX, USA
Offline
Link Posted: 1/15/2010 4:08:54 AM EST

Originally Posted By StewartTR:
This should answer your question.

http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=12&f=2&t=79

That is the clearest explanation I have ever read. Thanks for it.
"The first lesson of economics is scarcity: There is never enough of anything to satisfy all those who want it. The first lesson of politics is to disregard the first lesson of economics." -- Thomas Sowell


كافر
I love it when a plan comes together
Avatar
Bronze
  • Joined Feb 2001
  • Posts 8033
  • Location USA VA, USA
Offline
Bronze
  • Joined Feb 2001
  • Posts 8033
  • Location USA VA, USA
Offline
Link Posted: 1/15/2010 4:12:05 AM EST
Originally Posted By Wave:
Originally Posted By atxjax:
There are other websites that explain this. Would be suspicious with BATFE if they saw us explaining this here.


might as well fire off some other keywords for the BATF Google search machine....

SUPPRESSORS, How to?

Gun Show Loophole - I'll meet you in the parking lot with cash yo!

Cop Killer Bullets - which one is right for my Lorcin?






How do I convert my suppressor to full-auto , make it armor piercing and undetectable to airport scanners ?
Sic semper evello mortem Tyrannis
You know what might look better on your nose?
Avatar
Bronze
  • Joined Mar 2006
  • Posts 8843
  • Location USA FL, USA
Offline
Bronze
  • Joined Mar 2006
  • Posts 8843
  • Location USA FL, USA
Offline
Link Posted: 1/15/2010 4:16:23 AM EST
Originally Posted By 4v50:
There's a ratchet with three notches in it for the burst. After the third ratchet, it stops. The trouble is that if you set it to burst and don't fire off a full three-shot burst before you release the trigger, you next "burst" may only be one shot.


i did not know that

Warning: Do not play in or around dumpster. Do not kick dumpster. Do not sleep in dumpster. Usage of this container for disposal of human remains may be in violation of local health ordinances.
Basic
  • Joined Dec 2007
  • Posts 4351
  • Location USA TX, USA
Offline
Basic
  • Joined Dec 2007
  • Posts 4351
  • Location USA TX, USA
Offline
Link Posted: 1/15/2010 4:26:51 AM EST
[Last Edit: 1/15/2010 4:35:54 AM EST by Texkaw]
Burst is a big POS, in my opinion.

We had no problem firing short bursts from our M16A1s when needed, it doesn't take a rocket scientist to fire a burst from full auto mode.
With a clip-on bipod, you could do a reasonable amount of auto if needed in a pinch, for an FPL of fire for example, if your squad belt fed weapon was down, or more were needed.

With the M16A2 "Burst" mode sometimes you would get 3 rounds, sometime 2. I found it a bit ridiculous.


The Army needd to go back to safe-semi-auto, or do like the Germans and do safe-semi-burst-auto.
Either that or go back to semi only. Burst is useless in my opinion.

But then I am a heretic anyway because I thought that with the exception of the heavier barrel and 1-7 ratio, square FSP, and improved furniture, the M16A1 was better than the A2 in all other respects. The sights were more suited to combat, the stock length was better and the firing modes were common sense.

Call me Old School.
Basic
  • Joined Sep 2008
  • Posts 885
  • Location USA VA, USA
Offline
Basic
  • Joined Sep 2008
  • Posts 885
  • Location USA VA, USA
Offline
Link Posted: 1/15/2010 4:32:25 AM EST
Originally Posted By ANGST:
Originally Posted By Wave:
Originally Posted By atxjax:
There are other websites that explain this. Would be suspicious with BATFE if they saw us explaining this here.


might as well fire off some other keywords for the BATF Google search machine....

SUPPRESSORS, How to?

Gun Show Loophole - I'll meet you in the parking lot with cash yo!

Cop Killer Bullets - which one is right for my Lorcin?






How do I convert my suppressor to full-auto , make it armor piercing and undetectable to airport scanners ?



File down the firing pin. Place in Jello mold to fool airport scanners.

I love it when a plan comes together
Avatar
Bronze
  • Joined Feb 2001
  • Posts 8034
  • Location USA VA, USA
Offline
Bronze
  • Joined Feb 2001
  • Posts 8034
  • Location USA VA, USA
Offline
Link Posted: 1/15/2010 4:54:43 AM EST
Originally Posted By Texkaw:
Burst is a big POS, in my opinion.

We had no problem firing short bursts from our M16A1s when needed, it doesn't take a rocket scientist to fire a burst from full auto mode.
With a clip-on bipod, you could do a reasonable amount of auto if needed in a pinch, for an FPL of fire for example, if your squad belt fed weapon was down, or more were needed.

With the M16A2 "Burst" mode sometimes you would get 3 rounds, sometime 2. I found it a bit ridiculous.


The Army needd to go back to safe-semi-auto, or do like the Germans and do safe-semi-burst-auto.
Either that or go back to semi only. Burst is useless in my opinion.

But then I am a heretic anyway because I thought that with the exception of the heavier barrel and 1-7 ratio, square FSP, and improved furniture, the M16A1 was better than the A2 in all other respects. The sights were more suited to combat, the stock length was better and the firing modes were common sense.

Call me Old School.


A2 was designed for camp perry ...
Sic semper evello mortem Tyrannis
You know what might look better on your nose?
Avatar
Bronze
  • Joined Mar 2006
  • Posts 8844
  • Location USA FL, USA
Offline
Bronze
  • Joined Mar 2006
  • Posts 8844
  • Location USA FL, USA
Offline
Link Posted: 1/15/2010 5:02:05 AM EST
now should we discuss why 3 rnd burst is even an option? why add extra potential points of failure? Why cant people just remove their booger hook off the trigger when they want to stop firing?
Warning: Do not play in or around dumpster. Do not kick dumpster. Do not sleep in dumpster. Usage of this container for disposal of human remains may be in violation of local health ordinances.
TAP
Doing What I Can With What I Got
Avatar
Bronze
  • Joined Jan 2008
  • Posts 1324
  • Location IRQ IRQ
Offline
Bronze
  • Joined Jan 2008
  • Posts 1324
  • Location IRQ IRQ
Offline
Link Posted: 1/15/2010 5:15:39 AM EST
Originally Posted By HommieDaKlown:
now should we discuss why 3 rnd burst is even an option? why add extra potential points of failure? Why cant people just remove their booger hook off the trigger when they want to stop firing?


Because most of the mil doesn't train to a high enough standard.

Most Americans try to solve most problems, from IEDs to speeding to high cholesterol to ANYTHING, with gizmos and machines and new stuff rather than people and their actions.
Member
Avatar
Bronze
  • Joined May 2003
  • Posts 1937
  • Location USA IN, USA
Offline
Bronze
  • Joined May 2003
  • Posts 1937
  • Location USA IN, USA
Offline
Link Posted: 1/15/2010 5:17:21 AM EST
Originally Posted By HommieDaKlown:
now should we discuss why 3 rnd burst is even an option? why add extra potential points of failure? Why cant people just remove their booger hook off the trigger when they want to stop firing?


I read somewhere it was an attempt to keep Soldiers from wasting ammo.

Top