I am in the market for some high quality raingear.  I am considering the military ECWCS gore-tex system as well as any other worthy civilian contenders.  Does anyone have product that they would recommend?  I would also love to hear from ex-military users of the ECWCS.  Thanks in advance. tim

U.S. Military issue, standard woodland camo 1 each rain poncho!!! dry, comfortable and dare I say ...fashonable.

[:)>]

I bought a set of 2nd generation ECWCS (black) and I've hunted in the rain and snow with it, plus I've snowboarded all day in it.  I wear the military green thermals under the pants, and I use a fleece liner under the jacket.  I stay warm and have never gotten wet.  

I found a good deal on the stuff.  $150 for the jacket, and $100 for the pants.  I bought two pair for my wife and I.  

Go to [url]www.cabelas.com[/url] and search for Helly-Hansen. They make the raingear that commercial fishermen and open sea racing sailors wear. Tough stuff and well designed, and not as rapaciously expensive as the ECWCS stuff.

goretex, goretex, goretex.
that's all you need to remember! the ECWCS system is awsome, but so is the price. if you can get a good deal, and want cammo (or black) then pick up a set. avoid fabrics with a "water proof" or "water resistant" coating, it will wear off eventually. any brand that uses goretex is superior and expensive, but like anything else, you get what you pay for. HTH!

Here in the rainy Northwest, i have tried gortex, rubber, and oil skin. For my line of work (busting through brush while collecting vegetation data for research) I have found that the gortex wears out too fast and I get wet. I have relied upon my Filson tin cloth for many years now and have remained happy with the extreme durability and water repelency. The downside to Filson tin cloth is that it is heavy and does not breath. You also need to treat the fabric every once in a while with the parafin to keep the water out. But, Filson is very distincitve and has a rugged out-doors look that reminds a lot of the old-timers out here of the logging days that are long gone. When it comes to hunting, If i am going to be doing a lot of stalking, I will wear a simple wool outfit. Wool does not become water logged. If I will doing a lot of sitting, then I will wear the tin cloth. Somewear in between the tin cloth goes in a backpack so that I don't drown in my own sweat. I also own a complete Helly Hansen commercial fishing out-fit that I like when it is really muddy (easier to clean). The bottom line for me is that I hate the synthetic fabrics and have better luck with good old rubber and wax treated cotton.

Karl

if you get the ecwcs system I have the "bear suit" for under it I would sell you cheap depending on your size.
john

hey karl, seems like you 'da man when it comes to rain gear, but i am wondering why you don't use goretex. it is not the goretex fabric that wears out, its the water-proofing sprayed on the outer shell that wears off. it is a necessary part or of the system ~ for instance, heavy use or multiple washings with detergent will wear out the coating sooner. this allows water to permeate through the outer shell (usually nylon) and this inturn, allows water to "push" through the goretex, which IIRC, is waterproof to 8000m per inch sqaured, and breathable to 2000 microns per square inch.

Revivex is made by Gore ind., and used to re-apply the water proof coating. wool, IMHO, is great, but heavy and not even close to windproof. i have found that sweat cannot escape rubber or waxed gear, and it is impractical to change gear in the wet-wilds, when already wet from persperation. any thoughts?

I have considered trying the newer generations of goretex. Especially as i get into backpacking and need the lighter weight jacket. My problem with goretex has been mainly with its toughness when crashing through brush. That is mostly why I currently wear tin cloth while at work. My other concern with goretex is that it might be a little too noisy when hunting. Tree limbs and brush make a lot of noise when they scrap up against the goretex jackets of my peers.

Karl

yep! noise is a serious draw-back, when i stalk game, i have to go so slow, that my legs get stiff! but as far as toughness, i have tried to kill my ECWCS parka, and i can't. it is VERY tough nylon. (and they sell handy patch-kits incase i do!)
just a side-note, if you're considering goretex, make sure to try the "three-layer" cloth that is out now.