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3crowns
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Posted: 4/5/2009 12:41:40 PM
Rush discussed the fact that hybrid electric cars were not selling at the rate they used to, but he did not go into WHY this is. Oh sure people are not buying them because gas is not $4 gallon anymore, but gas still costs money. So, what other reasons are there for people to not want them? There used to be a six-month waiting list for the Prius (even before ($4 gas); now they are stacking up on the dealer's lots.
woodsie
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Posted: 4/5/2009 12:44:05 PM
Do a cost benefit analysis on it and see how long it would take at $2 gas to pay back the additional investment in the hybrid system.

That will probably answer your question for the most part. If results aren't conclusive, then I have no clue.

jasonfin1128
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Posted: 4/5/2009 12:45:10 PM
the green bubble has burst too.
RegisteredVoter
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Posted: 4/5/2009 12:46:22 PM
People aren't buying cars in general.
DzlBenz
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Posted: 4/5/2009 12:46:39 PM
There's no more global warming under the Obama administration.
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numberofthebeast
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Posted: 4/5/2009 12:47:19 PM
This economy is kind of shitty.
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Rosenrot
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Posted: 4/5/2009 12:49:27 PM
Because we Americans like our cars big,powerful and fast.
Win_88
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Posted: 4/5/2009 12:52:33 PM
Thats because Goverment Motors will give them away to the public...
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3crowns
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Posted: 4/5/2009 12:53:01 PM
Is a hybrid power train currenly more expensive than a conventional one? Any chance of costs going down?

The Hybrid propulsion systen in the Army's new FCS MGVs is a technological wonder.
Duffy
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Posted: 4/5/2009 12:53:52 PM
People are incredibly short-sighted. When gas was expensive, there was a rush that's for many a knee jerk reaction to buy fuel efficient cars, when gas is cheap like it has been recently, the incentive isn't there for them. I believe we should rid ourselves of the gas dependency regardless how much gas costs, THAT should be the real reason. Imagine we as a nation didn't have to cater to those oil producers in Middle East, and didn't pour all this money into THEIR pockets, our foreign policy would be different, and our enemies over there would be starved for money and resources, thus making them weaker.
new_RRA_user
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Posted: 4/5/2009 12:54:29 PM
Well, people like me who MIGHT buy one (have been looking at the Ford Fusion/Mercury Milan hybrid) see a high price, and then say, "With the right incentive, I might be an early adopter..." only to see no incentives, and the tax credit (that declines every quarter in 2009) is probably not available to us who pay the AMT.

Also, though I like the idea of "buying American", I see that the Ford/Mercury hybrids (and the non-hybrid models I am interested in) are made in Mexico. Ola!

On the other hand, the Honda Accord is made in Marysville, Ohio.

Probably an Accord for me, sorry!
DarkCharisma
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Posted: 4/5/2009 12:54:39 PM
Because they're not viewed as hip and cool anymore, and cost more then some other car with a few less MPG, better looks, more horsepower and nicer features.
junkdog
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Posted: 4/5/2009 12:54:46 PM
Originally Posted By woodsie:
Do a cost benefit analysis on it and see how long it would take at $2 gas to pay back the additional investment in the hybrid system.

That will probably answer your question for the most part. If results aren't conclusive, then I have no clue.




This is your answer
Mattl
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Posted: 4/5/2009 12:55:26 PM
$1.80 per gallon here.
shootemup
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Posted: 4/5/2009 12:55:53 PM
Simple:

The additional cost doesn't offset the fuel savings. At least not within a reasonable amount of years.
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thorm001
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Posted: 4/5/2009 1:02:12 PM
Hybrid is just for cool greenies. But seriously, when gas was expensive, folks were panic buying hybrid cars. Now that gas is more reasonable, it would take many years to recoup the cost of the hybrid engine versus a efficient standard motor.
Prius 22,700
Yaris 17,000
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AFARR
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Posted: 4/5/2009 1:06:34 PM
Originally Posted By woodsie:
Do a cost benefit analysis on it and see how long it would take at $2 gas to pay back the additional investment in the hybrid system.

That will probably answer your question for the most part. If results aren't conclusive, then I have no clue.



This.....

Prius Basic/Auto trans hatchback....$22,000 MSRP. Mileage (48 city/45 highway).

Yaris Basic/Auto trans hatchback...$14,000 MSRP. Mileage (29/35).

Call it a $8000 price difference (call it 4000 gallons of gas)

Average Mileage for the Prius is 46.5
Average Mileage for the Yaris is 32

14.5 MPG difference.

To keep things simple....you can Buy the Yaris for $14,000 and pay for gas for 128,000 MILES before you can pay for just the Prius.



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Qweevox
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Posted: 4/5/2009 1:09:05 PM
Originally Posted By Rosenrot:
Because we Americans like our cars big,powerful and fast.


THIS


Hybrid cars, economy cars......just aren't sexy and cool. Americans aren't going to buy them unless there is overwhelming economic motivation to do so.

I swear, I can't believe one car company in the world hasn't been able to come up with a "sexy and cool" looking two seat roadster type car that gets 50+ mpg. I think it would sell to those of us that spend most of the time commuting ALONE to work. I know I'd be interested in a hybrid that screamed off the line 0-60 mph (electric motors are better at this then gasoline motors) and still maintained some "scoot" at the higher speads. I'd keep my "gas, air, spark, fire" guzzlers for the weekend or fun.

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Tomtbo
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Posted: 4/5/2009 1:12:21 PM
The more complicated a vehicle is, the more hours it takes to fix when it goes down, and it will break down. A hybrid car is like a pre-nuke era submarine
woodsie
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Posted: 4/5/2009 1:13:08 PM
Originally Posted By thorm001:
Hybrid is just for cool greenies. But seriously, when gas was expensive, folks were panic buying hybrid cars. Now that gas is more reasonable, it would take many years to recoup the cost of the hybrid engine versus a efficient standard motor.
Prius 22,700
Yaris 17,000


So you'd have to save about 2,850 gallons of gas at $2 per gallon.

Prius: 48mpg
Yaris: 29mpg
Difference: 19mpg

Doing some rough math it appear that you would need to drive 208,800 miles before you actually saved money.

Math check:
208,800 / 48 mpg = 4350 gallons
208,800 / 29 mpg = 7200 gallons
Difference = 2850 gallons

Yep, so basically hybrid cars make zero financial sense. I haven't even thrown in additional factors like cost of money which would increase the mileage required to break even. Even at $4 per gallon gas the benefit is dubious.






the_naked_prophet
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Posted: 4/5/2009 1:13:36 PM
Originally Posted By AFARR:
Originally Posted By woodsie:
Do a cost benefit analysis on it and see how long it would take at $2 gas to pay back the additional investment in the hybrid system.

That will probably answer your question for the most part. If results aren't conclusive, then I have no clue.



This.....

Prius Basic/Auto trans hatchback....$22,000 MSRP. Mileage (48 city/45 highway).

Yaris Basic/Auto trans hatchback...$14,000 MSRP. Mileage (29/35).

Call it a $8000 price difference (call it 4000 gallons of gas)

Average Mileage for the Prius is 46.5
Average Mileage for the Yaris is 32

14.5 MPG difference.

To keep things simple....you can Buy the Yaris for $14,000 and pay for gas for 128,000 MILES before you can pay for just the Prius.






Or I can keep my 94 Nissan Sentra, which gets 35 city/45 highway and...


woodsie
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Posted: 4/5/2009 1:16:31 PM
Originally Posted By AFARR:
Originally Posted By woodsie:
Do a cost benefit analysis on it and see how long it would take at $2 gas to pay back the additional investment in the hybrid system.

That will probably answer your question for the most part. If results aren't conclusive, then I have no clue.



This.....

Prius Basic/Auto trans hatchback....$22,000 MSRP. Mileage (48 city/45 highway).

Yaris Basic/Auto trans hatchback...$14,000 MSRP. Mileage (29/35).

Call it a $8000 price difference (call it 4000 gallons of gas)

Average Mileage for the Prius is 46.5
Average Mileage for the Yaris is 32

14.5 MPG difference.

To keep things simple....you can Buy the Yaris for $14,000 and pay for gas for 128,000 MILES before you can pay for just the Prius.



Check your math again. It's ALOT more than 128,000 miles using your assumptions

After 128,000 miles you've only saved about 1250 gallons of gas, not 4000.

Math check:
128,000 / 46.5 = 2753 gallons
128,000 / 32 = 4000 gallons
Gas saved over 128,000 miles = 1247 gallons or $2494

Either way, your point stands. I'm just helping you make it even stronger.





KS_Physicist
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Posted: 4/5/2009 1:16:48 PM

Do the Prius and Yaris sell to identical demographics?

They certainly don't seem to around here.
woodsie
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Posted: 4/5/2009 1:17:24 PM
Originally Posted By the_naked_prophet:
Originally Posted By AFARR:
Originally Posted By woodsie:
Do a cost benefit analysis on it and see how long it would take at $2 gas to pay back the additional investment in the hybrid system.

That will probably answer your question for the most part. If results aren't conclusive, then I have no clue.



This.....

Prius Basic/Auto trans hatchback....$22,000 MSRP. Mileage (48 city/45 highway).

Yaris Basic/Auto trans hatchback...$14,000 MSRP. Mileage (29/35).

Call it a $8000 price difference (call it 4000 gallons of gas)

Average Mileage for the Prius is 46.5
Average Mileage for the Yaris is 32

14.5 MPG difference.

To keep things simple....you can Buy the Yaris for $14,000 and pay for gas for 128,000 MILES before you can pay for just the Prius.






Or I can keep my 94 Nissan Sentra, which gets 35 city/45 highway and...





...explodes on impact due to 15 year old safety standards?









Haha, just messing. The setup was there and I had to take it.
DragoMuseveni
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Posted: 4/5/2009 1:18:01 PM
It is more than a $2000 premium to buy a hybrid and the FED cut off the tax credit.

Looks like Toyota has reasons to ask for a bailout now.
ED_P
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Posted: 4/5/2009 1:28:00 PM
What's more shameful is GM and Ford are many years behind Toyota in this technology. I know several Prius owners that are near 200K miles with no major issues. I doubt a US Hybrid will be able to claim this level of efficiency and reliability for many years to come.

AJFB004
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Posted: 4/5/2009 1:35:29 PM
Why dont we just all buy Harleys and then we will decrease our dependence on foreign oil by the increase in fuel economy. Hybrids just don't look cool and do nothing for the fun factor. Or we could transition do diesel where there is no octane threshold for horsepower. Just think of a 900 hp turbo diesel Mustang screaming down a curvy road ...followed by a picture of the owner standing in his driveway next to his car and Harley. Keeping America Green and fuel efficient .
wgjhsafT
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Posted: 4/5/2009 1:37:24 PM
Heard that on Rush's program.

Economy is fluctuating and everyone is nervous so not that many cars are being bought.

Hybrids, at least the ones that get really good gas mileage, have tended to be smaller vehicles which many Americans that don't live in large cities do not want.

They are typically more expensive than their non hybrid counterparts.

Tax credits on said vehicles have faded or significantly diminished.

None at this time...
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Posted: 4/5/2009 1:37:47 PM
[Last Edit: 4/5/2009 1:39:15 PM by taelil]
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Posted: 4/5/2009 1:38:21 PM
I'm just waiting for the government to wake up and allow some of the European diesel cars to be imported.
Venkman
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Posted: 4/5/2009 1:39:23 PM
People are realizing that these get cars get better MPG and you don't have to look like a fag.

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kevinb120
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Posted: 4/5/2009 1:49:47 PM
[Last Edit: 4/5/2009 1:50:50 PM by kevinb120]
They still sell huge numbers of them in NoVa, but a lot more of them are because of the commute distance and HOV access then the 'green' part, and most that have them also have a sports car and a full-size SUV. They also drive them at 70+mph and often have military or otherwise 'conservative' stickers/plates on them. They are the family beater. In some of the outlaying neighborhoods you can see 6/10 households have one out front in the driveway.

However, if you have an obama or apple sticker on the back and are 'driving by looking at the meter' rather then traffic in the wrong lane, other drivers all but run them off the road to get them the fuck out of the lane.

Unfortunately diesel cars are not that easy to get in the US, in Europe, most compact cars with diesel options get far better gas mileage(like a 60+mpg Focus)
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AFARR
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Posted: 4/5/2009 10:03:55 PM
Originally Posted By woodsie:

Check your math again. It's ALOT more than 128,000 miles using your assumptions

After 128,000 miles you've only saved about 1250 gallons of gas, not 4000.

Math check:
128,000 / 46.5 = 2753 gallons
128,000 / 32 = 4000 gallons
Gas saved over 128,000 miles = 1247 gallons or $2494

Either way, your point stands. I'm just helping you make it even stronger.




Actually, I wasn't trying to figure the gas savings......higher math gives me headaches.....

I was trying to simplify to:

You have $22,000 to buy a car and the gas it needs. You pay $22k for the Prius and it can sit in your driveway because you don't have any money left over for gas. Or, you can buy the Yaris and have enough money left over to buy enough gas for 10 years of driving (at 12k a year).

I think when I roughed it out, the Prius only starts to 'save' money after 280k to 300k miles.......

AFARR

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zeekh
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Posted: 4/5/2009 10:24:47 PM
My wifes Chevy (Toyota) Prism (Corolla) gets 40mpg on the highway. No need for a hybrid. Its quite peppy also
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Posted: 4/5/2009 10:40:18 PM
Top reasons:

1. Because 50% of the population (including all eco-liberals) are idiots who think Obama has saved them.

2. Because those idiots think that Israel will just sit around and let Iran nuke them.

3. Because people who are idiots think gas prices will never go up again.

4. Or to sum it all up: because half the population ARE IDIOTS.

So Prius buying should drop by 50%. Until the Prophet Joseph Biden's predictions come true.
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Posted: 4/5/2009 11:10:32 PM
Who the fuck would want to drive one of those ugly fag cars ?
3crowns
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Posted: 4/5/2009 11:42:46 PM
I'm waiting for the Chevy Volt.