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4/25/2017 7:42:44 PM
Posted: 1/8/2002 6:59:19 PM EDT
Ok. Took the last advise, and put it to good use. Here is my 72 hr BOB bag/setup, with some prices for some to gleam off of. Also to see what I spent so far. Z after something means its in a zip lock bag or such. All in all, a good time, and a way to have some fun. Getting stuff together, and finding it around was the fun part. I must of emptied this bag, and put it together 5 times already. Ok In alice bag, medium (~$40) 5 pairs of wool/thermal/outdoor type socks(Z) 2 pairs of long johns (10) 1 long shirt/Nylon/poly(5) 1 pair of blue jeans (25) 2 cans of spam (2) 2 cans of chunky soup (2) 1 can of chilli w/beans (1) (Can food has to go, adds too much weight for the amount of food it gives)(right now, better than nothing, till I find some MRE's or such) 1 pair of Thinsulate gloves, with the fingers open, with mitts connected) (6) 1 winterhat(4) 1 roll of TP, soft kind, so I dont chaff 60 rd roll of duck tape, (4) this needs to be broken down. 100 ft of paracord (5.50) 1 wool long scarf. one S & W 22A pistol, wit 2 10rd mags, one reddot scope. 2 42 gallon, 3mil thickness, garbage bags one pair of tennis shoes, old ones (Z soon, when I can get some big bags) Now, onto the pouches off of the bag 2 hand warmers (1) 1 toothbrush (2) 25 yrds of floss (1)(Z) small bottle of tooth paste(1)(Z) Bar of dial soap (Z) 2 sets of ear plugs (Z) 1 16 oz bottle of wintergreen Alcohol (1) 1 10 oz bottle of gold bond (3) 1 can of carmex (1)(Z) 4 5pks of gum 1 1oz bottle of vaseline (.50)(Z) 4 small packs of lubricating jelly(Z) 2 condoms(Z) 3 red lightsticks (3.50) 1 pk of hot cocoa In pouch 2 1 rain poncho, generic (2) 7.5 yds of waterproof tape (2)(Z) 1 big peice of tinfoil(Z) 10 gauze pads (Z) bunch of band-aids, of different types burn creme in ind packs, anti-itch cremes, 3 in 1 antibiotic ointment, burn gel. (priceless, got this from the first aid kit at work, dont worry, we make them up and sell them to you all) (Z)_ (Small doses for free, with the exp on them, figure they work) Indiv pack of tynol(12) antiacids(2), pepto-bismol pills(20), advil cold and sinus (20),Admodim A-D (2), ricola cough drops (20). (Z) 30 days supply of my asmtha meds (Z) 1 mini mag lite, no extra batteries (10) Onto pouch three one NIW space blanket (5) 200 rds of .22 (6) 2 boxes of waterproof matches (Z) 2 6hr candles with holders (2)(z) 4 rubber-bands 1 leatherman PSTII tool (40) 1 pair of leather work gloves 24 safe-lite fire starters (2) 50 rd box of P+ .38 hollow points, different grains, diffent brands for the S & W model 36, (20) Man, that stuff can add up, I am not even going to try too! I did some each week, for a couple of months. Got stuff here, then there, etc. It was fun setting up. Still have to list my LBE, and such, but will save that for tomarrow. Ok, what am I missing? What could I use. My BOB is setup for the next couple of months, at least clothing wise. Winter is here, and this area can get cold. Once march rolls around, time to switch it around a bit. I know I need a compass, and I got someone to teach me it, just got to get out there for a day to learn. c-rock
Link Posted: 1/8/2002 7:06:09 PM EDT
How much weight? I need to work on mine. I am going to use an internal frame pack and use your list as a starting point.
Link Posted: 1/8/2002 7:09:36 PM EDT
I say between 20-30 lbs. No scale handy. c-rock
Link Posted: 1/8/2002 7:28:45 PM EDT
That's a pretty comprehesive list. I'm going to use your list as a guide. One thing that I will add to mine, is a 7" Ka-bar knife in a ballistic nylon sheath, and a GI canteen/ss cup to heat water with.
Link Posted: 1/8/2002 7:41:25 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/8/2002 7:45:51 PM EDT by SF]
General guidelines for field/survival items, off the top of my head (admittedly, a dangerous place): Shelter and Construction Clothing and environment items Firemaking Water, containers, and treatment Cooking equip and food Signaling and commo gear Light sources Health and first aid Navigational gear Tactical gear You also need to state the environment, season, length of stay, mission (hiding?, hunting?, surviving?), and budget. My initial reaction would be that you have little if any shelter, except the very minimalist. Are you prepared to build a poncho shelter and sleep in a space blanket? You have no axe, large knife, saw, or e-tool. Insect protection (headnet, mosquito net, jungle hammock)? Too much clothing for 72 hours or less and depending on your environment, the wrong kind. Sleeping bag? Rain gear? A poncho is not a very good piece of rain gear. Are you trying to hide in the woods or an urban environment? Limited fire making gear. Lighters are cheap, and light. Matches? Water, containers (other than condoms), and purification or gathering equip? Wrong kind of food and not enough. No cooking items (stove, cup, mess kit, pot, pan, utensils). Do you plan to hunt or fish (snares, traps, hooks line, training)? No signal gear beyond flashlight (Signal mirror, strobe, flares, whistle, smokes, radio, scanner)? Light source beyond one white light flashlight, no spare bulbs or batts and a few candles? You seem to have a LOT of first aid gear for a three day op. Do you have any training or references (SF Med Handbook, 1st aid manual, etc.)? Too much of some things, not enough of others. No nav gear beyond needing a compass, which you identified (topo map, protractor, GPS, binos, sextant, training)? Tactical gear? Again, what are you trying to do? (Camo, weapons, commo gear, camera, etc.) Again, not sniping at your choices. Just trying to clarify your mission/intent and point out a few areas you may want to look at. Also, look at [url]www.equipped.com[/url] for some great advice and reviews. Hope this helps!
Link Posted: 1/8/2002 7:48:04 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/8/2002 8:00:25 PM EDT by AR15fan]
Some suggestions: Canned food is heavy. Keep one large canned item, eat it first, then use that can as your cook pot. For a 72 hour kit you can get by on meal replacement bars alone. But for variety throw in some ramon noodles and instant oatmeal. Things I think you need: LED flashlight $15.00 Iodine tabs $3.00 Bic lighter .99cents Nalgene water bottle $8.00 Wool GI watch cap $6.00 Polypropolene GI glove liners $3.00 Replace the blue jeans with a pair of surplus wool or wool blend pants. Wet cotton kills. I found this gear list interesting: [url]http://www.us-rsog.org/USRSOG-Equipment.htm [/url]
Link Posted: 1/8/2002 8:02:31 PM EDT
Ok I would go for a Magnesium block or a Strike force because you might have to light something that is wet and you can use them more then matches. Next I'd get some kind of water purifier or tablets. If you want to cut down on the weight of the food buy your self a dehydrator make your self some beef jerky and fruit rolls and soup mixes. For strike force[url]www.majorsurplusnsurvival.com/cgi/webc.cgi/store/st_prod.html?p_prodid=140580&sid=8NxGfR0VQK1uANG[/url] Magnesium block [url]www.majorsurplusnsurvival.com/cgi/webc.cgi/store/st_prod.html?p_prodid=1404991&sid=8NxGfR0VQK1uANG[/url] Water purafier[url]www.majorsurplusnsurvival.com/cgi/webc.cgi/store/st_main.html?catid=11&sid=8NxGfR0VQK1uANG[/url] And a lot of what SF said
Link Posted: 1/8/2002 8:09:39 PM EDT
dump the canned food, get rid of some of the clothes, get some noodle ramen, need a water purifier (Pur makes good filters) i wouldnt travel anywhere without a GI poncho liner (grunts very best friend)and id definetly agree on the magnesium block. and an etrex gps at the very least for land nav.
Link Posted: 1/8/2002 8:20:17 PM EDT
You might also think about getting a long gun just in case you have to hunt or defend yourself. I'd get something like a good shotgun then you have a good all around rifle.
Link Posted: 1/8/2002 8:49:49 PM EDT
Get about 6 more Loperamide (Imodium)--diarrhea can kill you. Talk to your doctor about the possibility of going camping in a remote location for over a week (hiking out/back) see if he would prescribe a broad spectrum antibiotic in case anything happens (if he's a shooter, you can tell him what it is for). Get a couple of Ace bandages, some braided fishing line, some fish hooks and a few lead sinkers. Get a couple of Hemostats, some Suture material and needles (I may be able to dig up some if you need). Some Surgical Tape and Steri-Strips. Some Silk or Polypro long john's will take up less space and be more efficient than the honeycomb cotton type. Your Ziplocks will do as field expedient water carriers if necessary. AFARR
Link Posted: 1/9/2002 5:53:21 AM EDT
Wow, thanks guys for your imput. Its my first bag, so I been working on it. I live in a burb/urban enviroment. Same county as the city of Chicago, and about 15 mins outside of it. So, I guess my Area is kinda urban, with some forest preserves mixed in. The bag is for the next couple of months, Jan and Feb, and March. I have a LBE vest, and a AR15, still, walking around in these parts is going to be a problem. On the vest, I got some more bandages, my USGI canteen, and a cup, and some water purfiying pills. 7 30 rd mags of IMI green tip. Also some matches too. 1 20- rd mag of IMI greentip in rifle. Cleaning kit and oil bottle in stock. Not many folks load up and start walking around the forest preserve [;)] I need a saw, I got a bayo for a knife. I guess the space blanket is enough and the poncho too. Havent thought about insect protection yet, its freezing out here. Keep on forgeting about the bic lighters! I figure the stove would add some wieght, and could just build a small campfire. Fishing, I will grab something for that. I figure for the clothes, I would want 1 extra set of stuff. What I was wearing, and the spare set. If it got wet, could get out of it into dry stuff. Also, since I am in a urban area, some regular looking clothes could help out. Camo has been in style around here this year, but that could change. Thanks AFARR on the idea on how to get a anti-botic from my doc, I was wondering what and how to ask for it. So the A-D pills are better than the pepto ones? Also, if you can dig that up, I appreacite it. Thanks all c-rock
Link Posted: 1/9/2002 6:13:37 AM EDT
Maybe wrist watch, compass, magnesium fire starter, trade canned food for something lighter, a few maps, small radio?
Link Posted: 1/9/2002 6:32:22 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/9/2002 6:39:16 AM EDT by Tinker]
More suggestions: Food - I bought a couple cases of "civilian MREs" a while back, and found the main course packaged in a flat plastic tray you can microwave or boil. Eat them cold if you must, but it sounds like you are expecting cold weather, and a hot meal is very comforting. There are main dishes sold in your local grocery like this (beef stew, salisbury steak with potatoes, ham and cheese with potatoes, etc. They have a commercial sell by date a year or two out, and they are not bad. Water filtration unit, canteen, collapsible water storage containers (the GI-style 5 quart bags come to mind). Gun - May I suggest a light inexpensive rifle is a better choice than the .22 pistol? I would suggest as a possible choice the NEF Handi-Rifle (in a zillion chamberings) or the Rossi Matched Pair (in .22 with a .410 or 20 ga barrel) for around $100-120. These are single shots, which makes them shorter and lighter, and there are less items to lose or damage. The .22LR/20 ga. combo is appealing, if you carry a 5 count box of slugs and or buckshot for large game. Might add this barrel and shells to a longer period add-on. Both of these break down into two pieces, and will fit bigger packs. If you want to spend a few more bucks, try the Taurus model 62/72 pump rifle, also a take down model. B-Square makes a scope mount for these. Soap, cleaning products medical gear - Get some real aspirin, which relieves pain, treats fevers, helps prevent heart attack and stroke. Might add Aleve, as it is particularly good for muscle pain and strain. If you are on foot, it may be a real help to keep you going. For soap, I suggest Dr. Bronners Liquid Castile soap. I prefer the eucalyptus oil product, and usually add an ounce or two of tea-tree oil to a gallon of soap. You may prefer the peppermint, or almond oil. Whatever. You can use it to clean cuts, blisters, treat athlete's foot, brush your teeth, shave, wash your hair, etc., etc., etc. Comes in an 8 ounce plastic bottle, and larger sizes up to a gallon. Excellent to treat exposure to poison ivy and poison oak, as it washes the oils away very, very well. Yes, the package label is weird, but it has a bunch of suggestions on how to use it. This stuff lathers in hard or salt water, which most commercial detergent based "soaps" will not do. Clothing - needs to be tailored to the environment, of course. Around here, 90% of what you mention is too heavy for use most of the time. Did I miss a good solid working knife? A small diamond whetstone is a good addition as well. A camp or hand axe, is also a good choice. If you have a good axe, you may be able to get by with a lighter knife. Good start, all in all.
Link Posted: 1/9/2002 6:51:24 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Tinker: There are main dishes sold in your local grocery like this (beef stew, salisbury steak with potatoes, ham and cheese with potatoes, etc. They have a commercial sell by date a year or two out, and they are not bad.
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I personally think the MREs are kind of expensive. I find in the local grocery store individual servings of this stuff in pop-top cans. A heck of a lot cheaper even though in steel cans. I called Nestle, Glendale Calif concerning the expiration date, and they said it is for taste only. Canned food beyond the date will just not taste quite as good, but quite edible, and will not become toxic unless bulged or damaged.
Link Posted: 1/9/2002 6:55:16 AM EDT
FINGERNAIL CLIPPERS !!!!
Link Posted: 1/9/2002 6:58:57 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/9/2002 6:59:25 AM EDT by Royal_Lancer]
I wonder how I survived in Nam for 3 years without all that gear?
Link Posted: 1/9/2002 7:17:21 AM EDT
definitely loose the Blue Jeans. They're horrible if you get them wet. No insulation, they stretch and fall, just downright uncomfortable. If not BDU's then look into a camping/outdoors place for synthetic campers pants. They dry fast, rip resistant etc.
Link Posted: 1/9/2002 7:26:27 AM EDT
Originally Posted By EX11B: id definetly agree on the magnesium block.
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Really, have you ever used one? First of all trying to "shave" off some of the block as tinder is difficult and a good way to dull your knife. Stainless knife grade steel doesnt spark well with the flint, to smooth. So you need to attach something like a section of hacksaw blade to use as a striker. I prefer a wood handled flint that comes with a good striker. Buckshots trapping supply sells some good ones.
Link Posted: 1/9/2002 7:31:21 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Royal_Lancer: I wonder how I survived in Nam for 3 years without all that gear?
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You had a supply line streaching all the way back to the US. The combined logistical efforts of the US taxpayers and thousands of support troops. That's how.
Link Posted: 1/9/2002 7:45:07 AM EDT
I did like the large Can tip AR15Fan. Cooking pot, and food storage.
Link Posted: 1/9/2002 12:03:05 PM EDT
Originally Posted By AR15fan: I prefer a wood handled flint that comes with a good striker. Buckshots trapping supply sells some good ones.
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If a simple spark maker is what you are looking for, wander down to the local welding supply. They have a simple wire gizmo with a screw on flint and make a good big spark (designed for lighting gas torches, etc.). Buy some extra flints. The new gas lighters that put out a big super hot jet of flame are super (and sort of pricy). At high altitude they can be hard to light. Or buy the Scripto piezo-electric lighter for lighting barbecue grills. Very convenient for lighting campfires, too.
Link Posted: 1/9/2002 5:32:34 PM EDT
Link Posted: 1/9/2002 6:24:11 PM EDT
So, I see you aren't a backpacker. That's cool, though. Wondering if you have the right stuff for a few days of "camping"? Then just go camping with it. Blow a few weekends trying it. Experience is the great teacher. Remember to bring a small notepad and pencil so you can make durable notes on what worked and what didn't. Deficiencies will be obvious. On this diahreah (sp?) thing, do not "play doctor," unless you are one. I suffered from what later turned out to be salmonella 16 miles from civilization. Immodium AD in minimal dosage was totally ineffective. In the maximum dosage, Immodium kicked MY a$$, instead of helping me. That is why whatever else I camp with, I take one or two MRE's with me. They have the ability to slow down your digestive tract radically, if you get the trotts. Upon reaching civilization, I visited my doc. "Hey doc, would antibiotics have helped me on my trip with the diahrrhea?" His answer was that 'rhea is often self limiting, and that blindly taking an antibiotic can actually extend it and make it worse. You should discover freezedried and Tobasco.
Link Posted: 1/9/2002 6:53:25 PM EDT
instead of a lighter, just use your ammo. Remove the bullet and get a pin, strike the primer and point into the wood.
Link Posted: 1/9/2002 6:59:30 PM EDT
Tobasco?
Link Posted: 1/9/2002 7:05:37 PM EDT
Originally Posted By c-rock: I say between 20-30 lbs. No scale handy. c-rock
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... I'd say you're off by 15# or so. ... Go jump on a bathroom scale with and w/o and see. You'll be dumping the fingernail clippers and Tabasco. ... Good job though!
Link Posted: 1/10/2002 4:45:28 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Winston_Wolf:
Originally Posted By c-rock: I say between 20-30 lbs. No scale handy. c-rock
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... I'd say you're off by 15# or so. ... Go jump on a bathroom scale with and w/o and see. You'll be dumping the fingernail clippers and Tabasco. ... Good job though!
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your right, it is getting heavy. More like 30-40 lbs. I am looking on ways to get it a little lighter. c-rock
Link Posted: 1/10/2002 5:17:26 AM EDT
Hmm... has anybody suggested the US Army survival manual? Very valuable info in there. Also, carry a pad and pencil (ink runs when wet). Bandanna is useful for a lot of things. A tiny backpacker's stove should weigh almost nothing, and you really do need something to cook on. Ever tried cooking over a fire with nothing to balance your pot/cup on ? Instead of firestarters pack some trioxane tablets. They can be used for cooking and firestarting. Also maybe some sunglasses or tinted goggles? And that paracord is OK for small stuff but I can tell you that at least 50' of rope that will support your weight will be more valuable than an extra pair of pants. Others have said good strong fixed-blade knife, water purification tablets. Lose the canned food and get some freeze-dried meals from a sporting goods store.
Link Posted: 1/10/2002 6:14:15 AM EDT
Link Posted: 1/10/2002 7:16:10 AM EDT
Seriously think about cutting that weight in half, or more. Just as an experiment, try walking around for an hour with that on, even in your house. Forget about the weapons, for a minute. Load up on the usual, day-to-day supplies, including water, and try it on. I'd get rid of *anything* that is not vital for your 72 hrs., such as the handwarmers, extra clothes, extra shoes, the .38 and ammo, and such. Think about what can do double duty (i.e., TP can help start a fire). Remember, this is 72 hours, not a month. You can be uncomfortable, wear the same underwear for three days, and still survive. Wear glasses? Got extras? Good idea to have *lots* of extra prescription meds on hand- make sure and keep them fresh. A scenario where your BOB will be needed will be more like E&E and wait for order to be restored, not "Red Dawn". Also, you'll look like a possible threat in need of detention to the local Le/mil. forces in the area, and food/warmth/weapon supply to the hungry/cold great unwashed masses around you. I think it's great to be prepared, and if you think you'll actually have to use it, you'll need to try it out. Good luck!
Link Posted: 1/10/2002 7:17:16 AM EDT
Link Posted: 1/10/2002 7:52:05 AM EDT
I agree with what most have said. If it's a 72 hr kit drop all but one change of clothes. Drop the canned food. You need several different ways to start a fire, Shelter from the elements (and ways to make shelter), Signaling devices (Mirror, whistle, etc), first aid kit (look at Outdoor Research), water collection and treatment, and don't forget a compass! I've been working on mine and will post it once I feel it is up to par. I've set up a BOB, car kit, etc., that is more comprehensive (and will weigh a lot more), but that is what I'm working on.
Link Posted: 1/10/2002 9:51:15 AM EDT
I'd get rid of *anything* that is not vital for your 72 hrs., such as the handwarmers, extra clothes, extra shoes, the .38 and ammo, and such. Think about what can do double duty (i.e., TP can help start a fire). Remember, this is 72 hours, not a month. You can be uncomfortable, wear the same underwear for three days, and still survive. Wear glasses? Got extras? Good idea to have *lots* of extra prescription meds on hand- make sure and keep them fresh. A scenario where your BOB will be needed will be more like E&E and wait for order to be restored, not "Red Dawn". Also, you'll look like a possible threat in need of detention to the local Le/mil. forces in the area, and food/warmth/weapon supply to the hungry/cold great unwashed masses around you. Good luck!
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I thought about those also, and in better climate, sure. I am out north, and it gets cold! We dont have it as good as you all in Cali. [;)]
Link Posted: 1/10/2002 12:22:39 PM EDT
Understood! It gets a little chilly here at times, too, but nothing like what you deal with. We still need to be prepared to spend the night out in the open, though in urban areas there are a million nooks and crannies that could shelter you safely. My planning also includes "how do I get home from wherever I am?". Home has all the best stuff, the car carries the basics to get me there. Part of my planning is also to be asking myself, "How would I survive *here* for a day or two?" If you can, it's always better to stay put, IMO. You have much more available to keep you warm, dry and safe. If you just HAVE to bug-out, you should be able to move fairly fast- either on foot or in your car, or whatever. This is a great topic- thanks for letting us in on what you're doing. I think we all learn from it...
Link Posted: 1/10/2002 12:46:52 PM EDT
I have been thinking about planning also. Having a spare set of gear is a must. Lots of rivers, lakes, streams to cross around these parts. Plus the snow. Getting out of wet clothes is a must. I have fallen in a ice covered lake as a kid. Its not fun to walk home wet. Wasnt far, but it still sucked! My guess is finding a abandoned house, or factory. Take over some fortune 500 office. The small biz/single owner place could more likley have someone. Mos roads would suck around these parts, there would be a log jam. c-rock
Link Posted: 1/10/2002 3:55:21 PM EDT
Agreed on change of clothes, and the recs that you look at synthetics (avoid cotton- miserable when wet). Just curious, are you carrying this in your car, and what situations do you expect that would actually require you to leave home? In my area, it could include fire, total destruction due to earthquake, or serious *social problems* requiring evacuation. Anything else I can think of would allow me to stay at home...
Link Posted: 1/10/2002 3:59:22 PM EDT
Well, lets see. Not big on quakes. civil unrest that could come from Chicago. Flooding of the river by my house. Live close to O'hare, a good target. c-rock
Link Posted: 1/10/2002 4:20:43 PM EDT
I didn't see (may have missed it) anyone mention taking any table salt along. Aside from seasoning food, I use it for a salt water gargle trick in case of a sore throat, which could lead to worse things. Kind of knock out a sickness before it starts, as it were. 1 or 2 35mm film canisters filled with table salt don't weigh much, and it can be used for preserving a snakeskin until you have a chance to tan it properly...
Link Posted: 1/10/2002 4:30:08 PM EDT
Just for grins and giggles, you should take a survival course (or dare I say... go out and camp with your gear). That'll probably give you the best insight as to what you need and what is just wasted weight. Personally, I never go anywhere without a big can of corned beef hash [:D].
Link Posted: 1/10/2002 7:56:10 PM EDT
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