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Posted: 12/26/2001 6:32:07 AM EDT
The media seems afraid - yes afraid to have the Saudi's mentioned in a negative context. Fox, yep even Fox over the weekend had a military analyst on and asked him where he thought Usama/Osama might be. He replied something to the effect "Where would you go ?" "I would go to a place where I had family, friends and access to money - Saudi Arabia." The Fox newswoman cut him off at about "Ara" and the topic was never mentioned again. I know the easy answer is oil but since when has the media been practical ?? Any ideas ?? [?]
Link Posted: 12/26/2001 7:56:24 AM EDT
They don't want the rest of the Arab world to attack our "petroldump"?
Link Posted: 12/26/2001 8:43:48 AM EDT
Saudi Arabia is and has been supporting Islamic fundamentalist movements for years. I don't think they really care if the money they give out is used to kill Christians or Jews. I say make them accountable for their actions and to hell with what the world thinks. Its time for America to stand up and make a bold statement. If you mess with us we will hunt you down and destroy you and your followers without mercy!!
Link Posted: 12/26/2001 9:21:57 AM EDT
ok, they think (rightly so) thaty war in soudi arabia will raise the cost of gas astronomically... but think about it, once we colonize it we will have all the cheap oil we can ask for.
Link Posted: 12/26/2001 2:59:51 PM EDT
The Bush Administration continually touts Saudi Arabia as an ally, but I think their song is sounding hollow with every passing day. The sheeple in this country are catching on. Slowly, but they are catching on. The fact is we are at the mercy of the Saudi's. Bush knows it, the Saudi's know it, and as a result, they will have their way with us. Either we have to find a new source of oil, or take their oil, just like the British used to do. Some nations, as well as our own Libertarian Party, already accuse us of being an empire, so why not act like one?
Link Posted: 12/26/2001 4:23:20 PM EDT
I keep hearing of the "Saudi Connection" of donations for "terrorism"! Some keep pointing out that the Saudi Royal Family is donating to Wahibist religious organizations. "Proof" that the Saudi ruling family is supporting terrorism (ie. Usama bin Laden)! While supporters of the Jewish Defense League plot to assasinate our own US congressmen! But that's OK!???? Who are the terrorists? DaMan
Link Posted: 12/26/2001 6:04:14 PM EDT
Originally Posted By the_survivalist: ok, they think (rightly so) thaty war in soudi arabia will raise the cost of gas astronomically... but think about it, once we colonize it we will have all the cheap oil we can ask for.
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Brilliant idea! Simply, brilliant! [:p] DaMan
Link Posted: 12/26/2001 6:20:17 PM EDT
Link Posted: 12/26/2001 6:25:17 PM EDT
Hey, that's voting from the rooftops. The problem is that the JDL has only recently been accused of attempting terrorist acts. Wahibist, or whatever, have been linked to terrorism for a long time. Besides, there is a difference between a congresscritter who doesn't do what his/her/it constituency wants his/her/it to do and innocent uninvolved civilians.
Link Posted: 12/26/2001 7:43:18 PM EDT
Originally Posted By thebeekeeper1: Uh, which ones? That might be "okay."
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Darrell Issa....R-CA. Third generation Lebanese CHRISTIAN. DaMan
Link Posted: 12/26/2001 7:58:39 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/26/2001 8:00:26 PM EDT by DaMan]
Originally Posted By Redmanfms: Hey, that's voting from the rooftops. The problem is that the JDL has only recently been accused of attempting terrorist acts. Wahibist, or whatever, have been linked to terrorism for a long time. Besides, there is a difference between a congresscritter who doesn't do what his/her/it constituency wants his/her/it to do and innocent uninvolved civilians.
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Do you realize how bizarre and deranged you sound, Redmanfms? Thought not! Reread your previous post and think of what you're saying! DaMan
Link Posted: 12/26/2001 8:14:57 PM EDT
Originally Posted By thebeekeeper1: .... plot to assasinate our own US congressmen! Uh, which ones? That might be "okay."
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Priceless.
Link Posted: 12/26/2001 8:21:39 PM EDT
Originally Posted By 5subslr5:
Originally Posted By thebeekeeper1: .... plot to assasinate our own US congressmen! Uh, which ones? That might be "okay."
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Priceless.
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So you're advocating assasination of US Congressmen, 5subslr5???! What does that make YOU? Think about it! DaMan
Link Posted: 12/26/2001 9:45:00 PM EDT
The Saudi's have lots of money to buy lots of American Lawyers to sue their asses that is why. But you know what? I would like to know just how many barrels of oil we used in the last 6 mo came from Saudi- and how many came from Russia? Saudi had better start being a little less sensitive if they know what is good for them.
Link Posted: 12/26/2001 11:06:15 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/26/2001 11:28:36 PM EDT by Redmanfms]
Originally Posted By DaMan:
Originally Posted By Redmanfms: Hey, that's voting from the rooftops. The problem is that the JDL has only recently been accused of attempting terrorist acts. Wahibist, or whatever, have been linked to terrorism for a long time. Besides, there is a difference between a congresscritter who doesn't do what his/her/it constituency wants his/her/it to do and innocent uninvolved civilians.
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Do you realize how bizarre and deranged you sound, Redmanfms? Thought not! Reread your previous post and think of what you're saying! DaMan
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I know exactly how I sound. Would you have said the same thing to Thomas Paine, Patrick Henry, or George Washington? I am a patriot and an extremist one at that. How do you think Vermonters feel about having one of their Senators change affiliation to hand Senate over to the socialists? I don't think most of them are real happy about it, especially since they voted for a Republican and got a turncoat liberal. If our benevolent protectors were afraid of what we would do to them if they fucked up they wouldn't fuck up so frequently, but they aren't afraid of us because we are meek sheep who are willing to buy whatever bullshit spin they feed us. A representative who doesn't represent is called a despot. Assassination in the name of freedom is not out of the question in cases of despotism, it has been done many, many, many times in history. If our representatives feared more than just not being re-elected they might make more of an effort to do what we tell them to do. However, I don't advocate assasination. Assassins are too easily marginalized and their message is lost in the violence of the act, whether the majority of people agree with what they did or not. Like the Kennedy assassination. Most people didn't like Kennedy (facts be known most people didn't vote for his ass either), people even cheered his death. He was an egomaniacal dictator who drove America and the world to the brink of nuclear war. His death was an absolute godsend. But he is deified by the modern media and held up by liberals [i]and[/i] conservatives of what a real patriot is; in death he became a martyr Anyway the JDL has not been linked to any acts of terrorism ever. This is the first time they have been [b]accused[/b] of any crime. So comparing them to an Arabian group that has been linked to terrorist groups many times is disingenuous.
Link Posted: 12/27/2001 12:56:08 AM EDT
I think the simple answer to this post is: what's up with the media? They are kind of Jekel and Hyde. Sometimes extremly liberal or ultraconservative. Usually asking really stupid questions, then answering them in thier own childish way. I've seen school newspapers and cable access shows with more professionalism. I can understand the need to have the media "play along" with war time spin control. But our news has been an offensive joke long before 9-11. This can't just be bad journalism or mass marketing-lowest common denominator-B.S.. All of the news orginizations march in lock step stupidity. We are being denied acess to what is really going on in the world and here at home. This has nothing to do with national security, only with keeping the masses ignorant and asleep. I think this is even more dangerous to our country than all the terroists put together. We need a tin hat smile. I'm folding mine right now, shinny side out right?
Link Posted: 12/27/2001 1:19:50 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Redmanfms: I know exactly how I sound. Would you have said the same thing to Thomas Paine, Patrick Henry, or George Washington? I am a patriot and an extremist one at that. How do you think Vermonters feel about having one of their Senators change affiliation to hand Senate over to the socialists? I don't think most of them are real happy about it, especially since they voted for a Republican and got a turncoat liberal. If our benevolent protectors were afraid of what we would do to them if they fucked up they wouldn't fuck up so frequently, but they aren't afraid of us because we are meek sheep who are willing to buy whatever bullshit spin they feed us. A representative who doesn't represent is called a despot. Assassination in the name of freedom is not out of the question in cases of despotism, it has been done many, many, many times in history. If our representatives feared more than just not being re-elected they might make more of an effort to do what we tell them to do. However, I don't advocate assasination. Assassins are too easily marginalized and their message is lost in the violence of the act, whether the majority of people agree with what they did or not. Like the Kennedy assassination. Most people didn't like Kennedy (facts be known most people didn't vote for his ass either), people even cheered his death. He was an egomaniacal dictator who drove America and the world to the brink of nuclear war. His death was an absolute godsend. But he is deified by the modern media and held up by liberals [i]and[/i] conservatives of what a real patriot is; in death he became a martyr Anyway the JDL has not been linked to any acts of terrorism ever. This is the first time they have been [b]accused[/b] of any crime. So comparing them to an Arabian group that has been linked to terrorist groups many times is disingenuous.
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So who do you think YOU are, Mr. Redmanfms? Are YOU Thomas Paine, Patrick Henry, George Washington..... or just some dilusional nut??!! As for the JDL being involved in criminal (and what would NOW be considered terrorist activity), check the FBI records! These guys are "Loony Tunes"! DaMan
Link Posted: 12/27/2001 1:48:35 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Redmanfms: Anyway the JDL has not been linked to any acts of terrorism ever. This is the first time they have been [b]accused[/b] of any crime. So comparing them to an Arabian group that has been linked to terrorist groups many times is disingenuous.
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Uh, they've been accused of several crimes, including the murder of some guy from the American Arab Anti-Discrimination Committee, back in '85, but that is different than being convicted. I remember a fire-bombing in Canada in which they were somewhat smug about, without actually taking credit. But they've also been convicted of some bombings in NY in the 70s... and members were convicted in '94 and '95 (with the government having to go through a lengthy extradition with Israel) of a mail-bomb murder, in which some poor secretary was the victim and not the intended target.
Link Posted: 12/27/2001 1:53:03 PM EDT
Originally Posted By DaMan:
Originally Posted By thebeekeeper1: Uh, which ones? That might be "okay."
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Darrell Issa....R-CA. Third generation Lebanese CHRISTIAN. DaMan
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Yeah, the FBI informed him of the plot. I think similarly the Bureau also warned some US Senator that he was in danger from them, a while back.
Originally Posted By DaMan: While supporters of the Jewish Defense League plot to assasinate our own US congressmen! But that's OK!????
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Anyway, this is a topic on the Saudis, and I don't see any connection between the two, or that anyone mentioned leading you to bring up the JDL...
Link Posted: 12/27/2001 2:06:05 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/27/2001 2:15:19 PM EDT by DaMan]
Originally Posted By shooter69: Anyway, this is a topic on the Saudis, and I don't see any connection between the two, or that anyone mentioned leading you to bring up the JDL...
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Actually, shooter69, this topic was about a perceived pro-Saudi bias in the media! This is patently ridiculous! [:P] Actually the exact opposite is true! DaMan
Link Posted: 12/27/2001 3:43:26 PM EDT
Originally Posted By DaMan: So who do you think YOU are, Mr. Redmanfms? Are YOU Thomas Paine, Patrick Henry, George Washington..... or just some dilusional nut??!! As for the JDL being involved in criminal (and what would NOW be considered terrorist activity), check the FBI records! These guys are "Loony Tunes"! DaMan
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I love the insult slinging. I'm not the least bit delusional. Do you believe in what Paine, Henry, and Washington stood for, or are you a fairweather patriot like all the other peaceniks and psuedo-patriots who run away screaming when they are called to task? I don't presume to compare myself to them, but my beliefs on freedom are in line with their beliefs. They were extremists, they started a very costly war at the risk losing their very lives for liberty. Are you willing to stand up for what is right, or will you just cower and wet yourself like a kicked dog? I am willing to stand up for my rights and kill anybody who attempts to steal them from me. The only difference between a representative who doesn't do what the constituency wishes and a criminal bent on stealing your right to life is that representative is payed more. Our country was [b]not[/b] founded on the ideal of democracy, it was founded on the ideal of individual rights. A simple majority, or even a well-financed and motivated minority, can steal those rights from everybody by voting. That is exactly why the Constitution and the Bill of Rights exist, so that the rights of the few cannot be abrogated by the many. Representatives who usurp the power of the people are stealing your rights, what are you going to do about it? Are you going to insist that they do what the Constitution and Bill of Rights dictate? Are you going to vote for people who truly believe in the Constitution and what it stands for? When voting fails are you prepared to kill to defend your rights? Or are you going to whine and piss yourself like a gutless cur? Make no mistake, we've been going down the road of federal socialist tyranny for a long time. It is happening right now. What do you think gun laws are? Do you really think they are about safety? The assholes in Congress who vote in favor of more regulation have quite clearly stated that they don't really believe that the gun laws make a difference on crime. If they don't believe the laws they inflicted on you and me are going to accomplish the stated goals, why on Earth did they vote for them? The sad thing is that people like you talk a fine game about RKBA and civil rights, but when you are called on it and shown where we are headed you label the messenger a "delusional nut....." Wake up man. If you aren't prepared to kill for freedom than you are just one of the sheeple.
Link Posted: 12/27/2001 3:51:55 PM EDT
Originally Posted By DaMan: Actually, shooter69, this topic was about a perceived pro-Saudi bias in the media! This is patently ridiculous! [:P] Actually the exact opposite is true! DaMan
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That's true. So far the media has been amazingly supportive of the "War on Terror." They've frequently come out criticizing the Bush Administration for not doing [b]more[/b] to destroy Constitutionally-guaranteed rights. There is much less time spent on the Arab point of view. They want to appear "objective" because they have an international audience, but they don't want to be mistaken for taking a "pro-Islam" stance. Far less articles focusing on the "peace and love" basis of the Muslim religion have been aired than I expected. They have also made an attempt to marginalize Muslims by showing where their true loyalties lie. The article on Dateline where they talk to the Arab and Pakistani college students studying in the US is a good example. The media is playing ball.
Link Posted: 12/28/2001 3:13:48 AM EDT
Originally Posted By DaMan:
Originally Posted By shooter69: Anyway, this is a topic on the Saudis, and I don't see any connection between the two, or that anyone mentioned leading you to bring up the JDL...
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Actually, shooter69, this topic was about a perceived pro-Saudi bias in the media! This is patently ridiculous! [:P] Actually the exact opposite is true!
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Hmm. Guess I disagree with both of you that there is a BIAS one way or the other. I think that we are simply learning things that we didn't know (or want to know) about our "good friends" - especially in the context of an on going investigation - which keeps the story fresh, and not some ad nauseam re-hash simply for the sake of bias.
Link Posted: 12/28/2001 4:13:47 AM EDT
Its time for America to stand up and make a bold statement. If you mess with us we will hunt you down and destroy you and your followers without mercy!!
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Ditto here!
Link Posted: 12/29/2001 11:31:20 AM EDT
The solution is spelled ANWR. Drill and use our own oil. End begging the Saudis. John
Link Posted: 12/29/2001 12:11:13 PM EDT
Even on this board I'll bet most would agree that based on our Afghan experience that we've proven that Arabs/Muslims respect a "Winner." (When's the last time our(?) media has been able to start a big enough street demonstration worthy of being put on the air ?) Let's say for once we Americans didn't get in a hurry but worked a plan ...say over five years. Expand our military in both size and continued improvement in technology to (X) whatever that is and 'shape' the military to fight the battles necessary to accomplish the plan. During the next five or so years continue to fight the battles that must be fought. But one fine day announce the existence of the new and only "Oil Cartel" and the U.S. has the permanent 'chair' and 51% of the vote. We set production by country and the price. The oil producing countries have absolutely no choice but go along. No choice. Politically I can't think of one democracy that would be affected ?
Link Posted: 12/29/2001 1:16:58 PM EDT
Hey man, take another toke and pass it on.
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