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CRC
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Posted: 12/19/2008 4:50:54 PM EST
Anybody know?
"Therer are many things I admire about America but one thing I do not is their gun culture." Prime Minister John Howard of Australia
my65pan
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Posted: 12/19/2008 4:52:08 PM EST
[Last Edit: 12/19/2008 4:56:02 PM EST by my65pan]
They were, but they were all killed off years ago. Now we have black bears.
JAMES77257
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Posted: 12/19/2008 4:52:13 PM EST
You know how to skin Griz?
Barack Hussein Obama is not my president. I will not abide by his unconstitutional policies.

Have a great gun carrying kenpo day!
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Posted: 12/19/2008 4:52:27 PM EST
I can't see a bear living in teh desert.
Pangea
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Posted: 12/19/2008 4:52:35 PM EST
Probably if you go back far enough in history. Just like Bison and Elk were native to the south east.
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Tactical_Jew
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Posted: 12/19/2008 4:53:37 PM EST
Originally Posted By marksman121:
I can't see a bear living in teh desert.



Az has mtns and pines and snow too
MTUSA
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Posted: 12/19/2008 4:54:00 PM EST
Originally Posted By marksman121:
I can't see a bear living in teh desert.




Black bears are spotted on Four Peaks just east of Fountain Hills, AZ.
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Posted: 12/19/2008 4:56:47 PM EST
Originally Posted By Tactical_Jew:
Originally Posted By marksman121:
I can't see a bear living in teh desert.



Az has mtns and pines and snow too


Sssshhhhhhh.........!!!!!!!!!!!!
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my65pan
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Posted: 12/19/2008 4:57:19 PM EST
Originally Posted By Tactical_Jew:
Originally Posted By marksman121:
I can't see a bear living in teh desert.



Az has mtns and pines and snow too


Arizona has everything but a beach.
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Posted: 12/19/2008 4:57:35 PM EST
Originally Posted By Pangea:
Probably if you go back far enough in history. Just like Bison and Elk were native to the south east.


This, there is a town not far from here called Elk Creek, Virginia for a reason
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Posted: 12/19/2008 4:57:50 PM EST
Originally Posted By my65pan:
They were, but they were all killed off years ago. Now we have black bears.


IIRC the last AZ Grizzly was killed in 1935.

Life is a lemon and I want my money back!!!
CRC
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Posted: 12/19/2008 5:01:45 PM EST
[Last Edit: 12/19/2008 5:02:01 PM EST by CRC]
So lets reintroduce them to southern Arizona and Northern Mexico
"Therer are many things I admire about America but one thing I do not is their gun culture." Prime Minister John Howard of Australia
my65pan
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Posted: 12/19/2008 5:05:57 PM EST
Originally Posted By CRC:
So lets reintroduce them to southern Arizona and Northern Mexico


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Posted: 12/19/2008 5:06:49 PM EST
Saw something on Discovery or Science Channel some time back about Grizzly bears. They said in the early days there was a "plains grizzly." It was reputed to be a bit leaner and longer legged than mountain grizz, plus more aggressive. The show said they were even in Texas and there were supposed to have been a few Grizzly vs Longhorn battles.
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Posted: 12/19/2008 5:07:54 PM EST
Originally Posted By CRC:
So lets reintroduce them to southern Arizona and Northern Mexico



LOL.....I have a hard time seeing a Grizz survive without ample water....

of course there are those "illegal alien watering stations" that assholes put out for them...

hmmmmmm

this may NOT be such a bad idea......
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CRC
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Posted: 12/19/2008 5:09:01 PM EST
Originally Posted By desertmoon:
Originally Posted By CRC:
So lets reintroduce them to southern Arizona and Northern Mexico



LOL.....I have a hard time seeing a Grizz survive without ample water....

of course there are those "illegal alien watering stations" that assholes put out for them...

hmmmmmm

this may NOT be such a bad idea......



My thoughts exactly
"Therer are many things I admire about America but one thing I do not is their gun culture." Prime Minister John Howard of Australia
my65pan
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Posted: 12/19/2008 5:15:57 PM EST
Originally Posted By Uhwarrie:
Originally Posted By Pangea:
Probably if you go back far enough in history. Just like Bison and Elk were native to the south east.


This, there is a town not far from here called Elk Creek, Virginia for a reason


We have Elk in AZ, but not from the original population. They re-introduced them in 1913 from the herd in Yellowstone.
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Posted: 12/19/2008 5:17:33 PM EST
Originally Posted By my65pan:
Originally Posted By Tactical_Jew:
Originally Posted By marksman121:
I can't see a bear living in teh desert.



Az has mtns and pines and snow too


Arizona has everything but a beach.



They have the sand just not the water.
genesis
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Posted: 12/19/2008 5:17:48 PM EST
Let me check but I think the last one was killed in '47.
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Posted: 12/19/2008 5:19:13 PM EST
Yes there used to be. My dad did some reading up on it and there was some theories that it was a more nasty tempered than the usual grizzly usual subspecies too.
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my65pan
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Posted: 12/19/2008 5:21:17 PM EST
Originally Posted By ar15hookem:
Originally Posted By my65pan:
Originally Posted By Tactical_Jew:
Originally Posted By marksman121:
I can't see a bear living in teh desert.



Az has mtns and pines and snow too


Arizona has everything but a beach.



They have the sand just not the water.


We don't have a whole lot of sand, the dunes are over the border in Kalifornistan.
jagchaser
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Posted: 12/19/2008 5:23:01 PM EST
[Last Edit: 12/19/2008 5:27:57 PM EST by jagchaser]
Used to be grizzlies in AZ NM TX and even old MX....

Read up on

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ben_Lilly

The ultimate bear hunter

I have a friend who worked as a helper for a guide in MX in the 70s.........they shot a griz and brought the hide back, called it a blonde black bear, when questioned by the BP.

I have hunted bears and the big cats all thru that country but I have not seen any grizzly tracks down there, (past 10 yrs)

This Ben Lilly was the MAN!!!
Some peoples kids!!!!
samsi
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Posted: 12/19/2008 5:23:20 PM EST
Elmer Keith had pics in one of his books of Grizz trapped in Mexico. Leg hold traps. Elmer would take their picture, then headshoot 'em with a .44 or .45.
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Posted: 12/19/2008 5:23:42 PM EST
Originally Posted By genesis:
Let me check but I think the last one was killed in '47.
BRB


DAMN!!! THAT LATE?

Life is a lemon and I want my money back!!!
MTNmyMag
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Posted: 12/19/2008 5:24:17 PM EST
Yes there were Grizzlies through out a large portion of the western united states. Plains Grizzlies, Elk and Wolves.
11/4/08 ----Damn, that hurt.
superdav
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Posted: 12/19/2008 5:25:36 PM EST
[Last Edit: 12/19/2008 5:27:23 PM EST by superdav]
They were native from around the Miss. river to the west coast, the Elk species native in the south is now extinct
jagchaser
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Posted: 12/19/2008 5:30:17 PM EST
Hell Ben Lilly tracked a single grizzly one season, from NM down into MX. When in MX it traveled to another MX state and then up into AZ and was headed to its home country around silver city when he finally caught and killed it.

Read the book!!!
Some peoples kids!!!!
samsi
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Posted: 12/19/2008 5:39:39 PM EST
Originally Posted By jagchaser:
Hell Ben Lilly tracked a single grizzly one season, from NM down into MX. When in MX it traveled to another MX state and then up into AZ and was headed to its home country around silver city when he finally caught and killed it.

Read the book!!!


Why? You just told us how it ends.

Keith_J
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Posted: 12/19/2008 5:40:57 PM EST
Originally Posted By my65pan:
Originally Posted By Tactical_Jew:
Originally Posted By marksman121:
I can't see a bear living in teh desert.



Az has mtns and pines and snow too


Arizona has everything but a beach.



Lake Havasu City has a beach. Just no ocean-front property.
Peak oil happened shortly after Drake sunk his first well in Titusville PA...in 1858.
Hubbert was a Luddite geologist...or he had no concept of Moore's Law and how it applies to exploration and production.

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SS109
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Posted: 12/19/2008 5:44:09 PM EST
Some believe there are still Grizzley in Mexico, maybe a pair will migrate north to Arizona.

A bow hunter killed a Griz in Colorado only about a decade ago.
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GarandM1
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Posted: 12/19/2008 5:44:16 PM EST
Originally Posted By marksman121:
I can't see a bear living in teh desert.


Mongollon rim. Google it.

"Oooooookayyyyyyy. So you need to get to know a woman before you sleep with her. Gotcha. I didn't know men like you even existed." -- ftwm
Keith_J
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Posted: 12/19/2008 5:44:36 PM EST
Originally Posted By desertmoon:
Originally Posted By genesis:
Let me check but I think the last one was killed in '47.
BRB


DAMN!!! THAT LATE?



Yep. Last Griz killed in Texas was in the Davis Mountains in 1890. But the Black Bear is coming back. Saw one in 1999 west of Mt. Locke.
Peak oil happened shortly after Drake sunk his first well in Titusville PA...in 1858.
Hubbert was a Luddite geologist...or he had no concept of Moore's Law and how it applies to exploration and production.

ars sine scientia nihil est
CRC
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Posted: 12/19/2008 5:47:19 PM EST
Originally Posted By SS109:
Some believe there are still Grizzley in Mexico, maybe a pair will migrate north to Arizona.

A bow hunter killed a Griz in Colorado only about a decade ago.


1979

"Therer are many things I admire about America but one thing I do not is their gun culture." Prime Minister John Howard of Australia
Darrellbear
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Posted: 12/19/2008 5:50:50 PM EST
Originally Posted By SS109:
Some believe there are still Grizzley in Mexico, maybe a pair will migrate north to Arizona.

A bow hunter killed a Griz in Colorado only about a decade ago.


That was in '79, IIRC. Caused a big stink, too. The guy's name was Ed Wiseman, he was attacked by an old sow grizz, he wound up stabbing it to death with an arrow. Some say there are still grizzly down in the wilderness areas of the southern Colorado mountains, maybe ranging down into New Mexico.

GarandM1
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Posted: 12/19/2008 5:54:03 PM EST
Originally Posted By Darrellbear:
Originally Posted By SS109:
Some believe there are still Grizzley in Mexico, maybe a pair will migrate north to Arizona.

A bow hunter killed a Griz in Colorado only about a decade ago.


That was in '79, IIRC. Caused a big stink, too. The guy's name was Ed Wiseman, he was attacked by an old sow grizz, he wound up stabbing it to death with an arrow. Some say there are still grizzly down in the wilderness areas of the southern Colorado mountains, maybe ranging down into New Mexico.



They've also had credible sightings of grizzlies in the Cascades of Washington, and in the central areas of Idaho.

I suspect the state game agencies downplay them because if there were a viable population of grizzlies in their state they'd inherit all sorts of unwanted federal attention in the form of the Endangered Species Act.

Kinda what some eastern game managers have done with the cougar.
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Posted: 12/19/2008 5:55:15 PM EST
Originally Posted By GarandM1:
Originally Posted By marksman121:
I can't see a bear living in teh desert.


Mongollon rim. Google it.



This.......... Black Bears live all over down there. They even go out on the FLAT ASS NO WATER DESERT and eat the prickly pear cactus when the fruit is ripe.

Some peoples kids!!!!
CRC
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Posted: 12/19/2008 5:55:36 PM EST
Washington and Idaho do have documented populations of grizzlies

Colorado, Arizona and New Mexico do not

"Therer are many things I admire about America but one thing I do not is their gun culture." Prime Minister John Howard of Australia
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Posted: 12/19/2008 5:56:53 PM EST
Originally Posted By my65pan:
Originally Posted By Tactical_Jew:
Originally Posted By marksman121:
I can't see a bear living in teh desert.



Az has mtns and pines and snow too


Arizona has everything but a beach.


Are you kidding me??? We got miles of beaches........all the way to the nearest ocean at Rocky Point!!!

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Posted: 12/19/2008 6:00:10 PM EST
Originally Posted By CRC:
Washington and Idaho do have documented populations of grizzlies

Colorado, Arizona and New Mexico do not



Not in the past 30 yrs that is, but 60 yrs ago or more it was almost common

Some peoples kids!!!!
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Posted: 12/19/2008 6:00:15 PM EST
Originally Posted By genesis:
Let me check but I think the last one was killed in '47.
BRB


Pretty sure you are correct - there was a little story in Arizona Highways about it last year I think. Unfortunately I cannot find the article now, I just remember thinking how awesome that would have been to see.

There have also been two unconfirmed but credible grizzly sightings in Arizona in the past 10 years from what I recall in that article - one near Cochise Stronghold and one up in the Apache reservation. I have my doubts, but it sure would be cool if there are still a few around here.
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CRC
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Posted: 12/19/2008 6:02:13 PM EST
Hence a reintroduction attempt like with the wolves

Just release 4-5 females first and see how they do

Bears can come from Yellowstone area
"Therer are many things I admire about America but one thing I do not is their gun culture." Prime Minister John Howard of Australia
GarandM1
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Posted: 12/19/2008 6:05:09 PM EST
Originally Posted By jagchaser:
Originally Posted By CRC:
Washington and Idaho do have documented populations of grizzlies

Colorado, Arizona and New Mexico do not



Not in the past 30 yrs that is, but 60 yrs ago or more it was almost common



Washington has small populations that come over the border from Canada. But they don't have any evidence they have arrived the populated areas around Mount Rainer/Mount St. Helens. They had a sighting in that area a few years ago and all the hikers and campers sh*t a brick.

Idaho's populations are up in the panhandle and over by Yellowstone. They had a credible sighting in the Clearwater area a few years ago not too far from my cabin that caused quite a stir.

Because grizzlies are still a threatened species –– the Bush Administration has started the delisting process –– any grizzly population in the 48 states means extra work and headaches for the local game managers.
"Oooooookayyyyyyy. So you need to get to know a woman before you sleep with her. Gotcha. I didn't know men like you even existed." -- ftwm
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Posted: 12/19/2008 6:06:56 PM EST
Originally Posted By GarandM1:
Originally Posted By jagchaser:
Originally Posted By CRC:
Washington and Idaho do have documented populations of grizzlies

Colorado, Arizona and New Mexico do not



Not in the past 30 yrs that is, but 60 yrs ago or more it was almost common



Washington has small populations that come over the border from Canada. But they don't have any evidence they have arrived the populated areas around Mount Rainer/Mount St. Helens. They had a sighting in that area a few years ago and all the hikers and campers sh*t a brick.

Idaho's populations are up in the panhandle and over by Yellowstone. They had a credible sighting in the Clearwater area a few years ago not too far from my cabin that caused quite a stir.

Because grizzlies are still a threatened species –– the Bush Administration has started the delisting process –– any grizzly population in the 48 states means extra work and headaches for the local game managers.


Sorry I was only referring to the CO, NM, AZ part

Some peoples kids!!!!
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Posted: 12/19/2008 6:09:14 PM EST
I saw a black bear in 37B during my javalina hunt in AZ in 2007. I had heard that there have been some seen there but this was the first time I have seen one there. This area has some large rocks and mountains but is about as close to a "desert" as you will find. I couldnt believe my eyes when I spotted it, neither could my 2 hunting buddies until they saw it either!!!
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Posted: 12/19/2008 6:12:24 PM EST
Originally Posted By CRC:
Originally Posted By desertmoon:
Originally Posted By CRC:
So lets reintroduce them to southern Arizona and Northern Mexico



LOL.....I have a hard time seeing a Grizz survive without ample water....

of course there are those "illegal alien watering stations" that assholes put out for them...

hmmmmmm

this may NOT be such a bad idea......



My thoughts exactly


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Posted: 12/19/2008 6:15:01 PM EST
Originally Posted By GarandM1:
Originally Posted By marksman121:
I can't see a bear living in teh desert.


Mongollon rim. Google it.



Shh! I used to camp on the Rim all the time.

It used to be a nice place until the Payson Heber Highway bypassed Christopher Creek. The year after that happened the amount of idiots up there exponentially increased. Idiots in sedans on the dirt roads, Mexicans splashing around Knoll Lake playing their ranchero music, kids on quads, etc.

I've seen everything from elk, deer, black bears, and even a mountain lion up there. Have yet to be drawn for any game up there either.
-Matt
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Posted: 12/19/2008 6:18:49 PM EST
Originally Posted By jagchaser:
Originally Posted By GarandM1:
Originally Posted By jagchaser:
Originally Posted By CRC:
Washington and Idaho do have documented populations of grizzlies

Colorado, Arizona and New Mexico do not



Not in the past 30 yrs that is, but 60 yrs ago or more it was almost common



Washington has small populations that come over the border from Canada. But they don't have any evidence they have arrived the populated areas around Mount Rainer/Mount St. Helens. They had a sighting in that area a few years ago and all the hikers and campers sh*t a brick.

Idaho's populations are up in the panhandle and over by Yellowstone. They had a credible sighting in the Clearwater area a few years ago not too far from my cabin that caused quite a stir.

Because grizzlies are still a threatened species –– the Bush Administration has started the delisting process –– any grizzly population in the 48 states means extra work and headaches for the local game managers.


Sorry I was only referring to the CO, NM, AZ part



Gotcha.
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Posted: 12/19/2008 6:21:56 PM EST
Originally Posted By JAMES77257:
You know how to skin Griz?


I can skin' em as fast as you can catch' em


Keith_J
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Posted: 12/19/2008 6:23:45 PM EST
Originally Posted By Tim_the_enchanter:
Originally Posted By JAMES77257:
You know how to skin Griz?


I can skin' em as fast as you can catch' em




You might want to kill it first. Grizzly Bear are kind of attached to their skins.
Peak oil happened shortly after Drake sunk his first well in Titusville PA...in 1858.
Hubbert was a Luddite geologist...or he had no concept of Moore's Law and how it applies to exploration and production.

ars sine scientia nihil est
Tim_the_enchanter
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Posted: 12/19/2008 6:32:39 PM EST
Originally Posted By Keith_J:
Originally Posted By Tim_the_enchanter:
Originally Posted By JAMES77257:
You know how to skin Griz?


I can skin' em as fast as you can catch' em




You might want to kill it first. Grizzly Bear are kind of attached to their skins.



Name the film.
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Posted: 12/19/2008 6:38:18 PM EST
They were native to pretty much all western states. Only a few still have them.
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